How many other DI coaches could go 7-6?

[HOGSWEAT]

At Arkansas, for half the pay, how many other coaches could field a .500 career record at Arkansas? I don't mind letting you know that I am indeed ready to move on from CBB, but trying to point out a bigger problem.

Whoever wrote these contracts is an interesting person. We gave a guy top 15 money to be a top 50 coach (maybe). Why is that exactly? If we're going to spend that kind of money it NEEDS to be on a game changer. Otherwise paying an up and comer half that salary and try to build something from the ground up.

There are plenty of other coaches that could do what CBB is currently doing here.

[ricepig]

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/

http://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/price-per-win-college-footballs-best-and-worst-coaching-bargains-in-2016/

[Atlhogfan1]

At Arkansas, for half the pay, how many other coaches could field a .500 career record at Arkansas? I don't mind letting you know that I am indeed ready to move on from CBB, but trying to point out a bigger problem.

Whoever wrote these contracts is an interesting person. We gave a guy top 15 money to be a top 50 coach (maybe). Why is that exactly? If we're going to spend that kind of money it NEEDS to be on a game changer. Otherwise paying an up and comer half that salary and try to build something from the ground up.

There are plenty of other coaches that could do what CBB is currently doing here.

How many would have been 7-6 in season 4 having gone to a 3rd straight bowl after inheriting the situation inherited with the state offering very little in terms of help especially difference makers?  Some could have.  A few would have been better.  For half the pay, you limited the pool to some real inexperienced and underwhelming coaches.  Our situation may be much worse than what we think it is right now with one of those coaches. 

Going fwd, sure some coaches could build on this and do better.

[(notOM)Rebel123]

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/

http://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/price-per-win-college-footballs-best-and-worst-coaching-bargains-in-2016/

At that price, no wonder the games are being moved from WMS.

[RME]

It is an interesting question, and one really does have to wonder. It also makes one question whether Bret really, truly is anything more than an average to slightly above-average coach.

I was thrilled by his hire when it happened. After hearing the names thrown around for coaches back in 2012, I was fired up to have landed a guy doing what he was doing in college football at the time.

Now, I'm wondering if he's anything but average, maybe slightly above it. Now, I'm thinking Wisconsin needs only a decent, competent coach to upkeep a pretty solid winning culture there, and I was just starstruck when he came here.

Since Bielema's final 8-5 season at Wisconsin (they lost the bowl, but Alvarez coached it):
Andersen: 9-4 (38th in recruiting), 10-3 (33rd in recruiting); left for Oregon State (2-10, 4-8)
Chryst: 10-3 (40 in recruiting), 11-3 (32 in recruiting)

Maybe Bret isn't that great after all. Maybe Andersen and Chryst aren't either (jury still out on what Andersen can do at Oregon State). The point is that maybe Wisconsin makes average to slightly above-average coaches look pretty good.

Yes, the SEC is an entirely different animal than the Big 10. But those still saying that Bret needs time, or that we should be happy with him...when does that come to an end? Maybe he's just a very average coach. And that's okay, it's okay to miss on a coach every now and then.

But to answer the OP: I'm willing to bet there are worse coaches than Bielema out there who could win 7 games here year in and year out.

I'm okay with a fiery up-and-comer. If he works out, great. It was a genius, home-run hire. If not, okay, he was unproven big deal. But again, I'm not sure an up-and-comer still couldn't come here and win 7 games a year.

[elksnort]

Perhaps I don't know how things work, but in sports paying huge salaries before proven success if not smart business.
Yes, CBB had proven himself, but the buyout given was/is absurd.
And do not even get me started about Mike Anderson.
So yes, Jeff Long is a problem. I have been careful to express this,  but he is the common denominator.

[Atlhogfan1]

But those still saying that Bret needs time, or that we should be happy with him...when does that come to an end? Maybe he's just a very average coach. And that's okay, it's okay to miss on a coach every now and then.

But to answer the OP: I'm willing to bet there are worse coaches than Bielema out there who could win 7 games here year in and year out.

I'm okay with a fiery up-and-comer. If he works out, great. It was a genius, home-run hire. If not, okay, he was unproven big deal. But again, I'm not sure an up-and-comer still couldn't come here and win 7 games a year.

Few are saying he needs much more time or we should be happy.

7 wins in season 4.  How many could have gotten us to here with where Bret started?  This could be better but it could also be much worse.  We saw with our bask program when we gave two inexperienced, unqualified coaches a chance to rebuild.  This could be worse. 

Now, an up and comer may could win 7.  Some would. Had they taken over in 2013? 

[hview]

Let's see what adjustments are made before this next season. As much as some may hate it, we had better get behind coach BB, and support him. Let's see if he learns from this past season and pray that progress will be made and reflected on the field both on defense and offense. Maybe given the opportunity, he can do what Coach Beamer did at Virginia Tech.

[NuttinItUp]

Based on where we were left with John L., I think Bret has done a good job.

Is he the right person moving forward? Who knows. Let's see what he does next year. With a returning QB and basically everyone on the O-line being a year older (plus Frank Ragnow coming back when he could have gone to the NFL), we could be sitting on 10 wins next year; who knows.

[elksnort]

My "getting behind CBB" and prayer wiil not have anything to do with the Razorbacks' success next season.

[elksnort]

Based on where we were left with John L., I think Bret has done a good job.

Is he the right person moving forward? Who knows. Let's see what he does next year. With a returning QB and basically everyone on the O-line being a year older (plus Frank Ragnow coming back when he could have gone to the NFL), we could be sitting on 10 wins next year; who knows.

He was left Trey Flowers, Spaight, Philon, Hunter Henry, some good RBs, TRavis Swanson and others. Just because JLS was a joke doesnt mean CBB wasnt left anything.

[HOGINTENNESSEE]

It is an interesting question, and one really does have to wonder. It also makes one question whether Bret really, truly is anything more than an average to slightly above-average coach.

I was thrilled by his hire when it happened. After hearing the names thrown around for coaches back in 2012, I was fired up to have landed a guy doing what he was doing in college football at the time.

Now, I'm wondering if he's anything but average, maybe slightly above it. Now, I'm thinking Wisconsin needs only a decent, competent coach to upkeep a pretty solid winning culture there, and I was just starstruck when he came here.

Since Bielema's final 7-6 season at Wisconsin (they won the bowl, but Alvarez coached it):
Andersen: 9-4 (38th in recruiting), 10-3 (33rd in recruiting); left for Oregon State (2-10, 4-8)
Chryst: 10-3 (40 in recruiting), 11-3 (32 in recruiting)

Maybe Bret isn't that great after all. Maybe Andersen and Chryst aren't either, but that's not the point (jury still out on what Andersen can do at Oregon State). The point is that maybe Wisconsin makes average to slightly above-average coaches look pretty good.

Yes, the SEC is an entirely different animal than the Big 10. But those still saying that Bret needs time, or that we should be happy with him...when does that come to an end? Maybe he's just a very average coach. And that's okay, it's okay to miss on a coach every now and then.

But to answer the OP: I'm willing to bet there are worse coaches than Bielema out there who could win 7 games here year in and year out.

I'm okay with a fiery up-and-comer. If he works out, great. It was a genius, home-run hire. If not, okay, he was unproven big deal. But again, I'm not sure an up-and-comer still couldn't come here and win 7 games a year.

His last season Wisconsin was 8-5. Alvarez did not win the Rose Bowl after CBB left and Wisconsin finished 8-6

[RME]

Few are saying he needs much more time or we should be happy.

7 wins in season 4.  How many could have gotten us to here with where Bret started?  This could be better but it could also be much worse.  We saw with our bask program when we gave two inexperienced, unqualified coaches a chance to rebuild.  This could be worse. 

Now, an up and comer may could win 7.  Some would. Had they taken over in 2013?

You do have a very valid point about where another coach would have us at this point in time. We really don't know. It could be worse, exactly the same, or better, just depending on the guy. We just really don't know where someone else would have us.

That being said though, now that a, well, "seemingly" better culture (it has, yes, in every aspect besides W's and L's) has been established heading into year 5, you also have to wonder what an up-and-comer would do stepping in in say 2018. It won't happen, but now that we're finally past the debacles of 2012, it is a curious thought as to what a PJ Fleck/Matt Rhule type could step in and do. I think they'd win 6-7 games a year but...who knows.

It's just all hypotheticals at this point.

[Razorbackers]

Based on where we were left with John L., I think Bret has done a good job.

Is he the right person moving forward? Who knows. Let's see what he does next year. With a returning QB and basically everyone on the O-line being a year older (plus Frank Ragnow coming back when he could have gone to the NFL), we could be sitting on 10 wins next year; who knows.

JLS and BP. This was a dumpster fire.

[RME]

His last season Wisconsin was 8-5. Alvarez did not win the Rose Bowl after CBB left and Wisconsin finished 8-6

Thank you, you are correct. My mistake.

Still, the point remains. That one game doesn't change my argument.

[HiggiePiggy]

Since Bielema's final 7-6 season at Wisconsin (they won the bowl, but Alvarez coached it):
Andersen: 9-4 (38th in recruiting), 10-3 (33rd in recruiting); left for Oregon State (2-10, 4-8)
Chryst: 10-3 (40 in recruiting), 11-3 (32 in recruiting)

Just an FYI. They lost the bowl that alverez coached.

[26.2Hog]

He was left Trey Flowers, Spaight, Philon, Hunter Henry, some good RBs, TRavis Swanson and others. Just because JLS was a joke doesnt mean CBB wasnt left anything.

I agree, and I'm no fan of BP.    What he was left was a lot better than his fanbois like to let on.  I know that over half the 2014 defensive starters signed NFL contracts. 

[Razorbackers]

He was left Trey Flowers, Spaight, Philon, Hunter Henry, some good RBs, TRavis Swanson and others. Just because JLS was a joke doesnt mean CBB wasnt left anything.

Um.

Spaight, Henry, Collins were BB commits.

Arkansas had offered HH but CBB had to keep him.

[mckinneyhog5]

Maybe the Arkansas job is mediocre and no matter the coach we bring in will produce the same results?

And please don't throw the one above average season that we had as proof that we can.  If anything it's an outlier.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Maybe the Arkansas job is mediocre and no matter the coach we bring in will produce the same results?

I'd say it's a decent job.  Not a destination job for top coaches.

[NuttinItUp]

I'd say it's a decent job.  Not a destination job for top coaches.

It is about on par with Clemson, I'd say.

[HOGINTENNESSEE]

He was left Trey Flowers, Spaight, Philon, Hunter Henry, some good RBs, TRavis Swanson and others. Just because JLS was a joke doesnt mean CBB wasnt left anything.

You need to double check you post it is incorrect

[toxichog]

"At the time" an experienced head coach was truly necessary.  The program was a complete shambles, including the 2-deep roster.  A program builder was really more important than a philosophy or scheme.  In year one we couldn't beat ANYBODY.  In the last two years we have beaten Auburn, LSU, Ole Miss, Florida, Tennessee, TCU, Miss. State, and Kansas State.
While I have no idea what to think about this years TEAM, surely nobody could argue that the "Program " is in dramatically better shape than it was when Beilema arrived. 

[Atlhogfan1]

We have the #21 class in college football.  We have recruited close to what Washington and Penn St have.  Problem is 21 is 10th in the SEC.  It is why this is a tough job.  Nearly 0 in state talent.  This comes into play big time when trying to build defense in a conference where our competition - Bama, AU, LSU, A&M, OM, Miss St - can from in state and nearby.  Makes this job dangerous for any coach with options.

Otherwise, this is a very good job.  Great facilities, pay, assistants' pay, good tradition, can outrecruit 75-80% of college football. 

[ricepig]

Perhaps I don't know how things work, but in sports paying huge salaries before proven success if not smart business.
Yes, CBB had proven himself, but the buyout given was/is absurd.
And do not even get me started about Mike Anderson.
So yes, Jeff Long is a problem. I have been careful to express this,  but he is the common denominator.

If you had no intention of firing him for X amount of years, the buyout meant squat. I'm guessing he didn't/doesn't. I would imagine that if the PTB decide it's time for Bret to go, they'll let Long go, too.

[ricepig]

My "getting behind CBB" and prayer wiil not have anything to do with the Razorbacks' success next season.

Neither does our posting on HV, lol.

[ricepig]

Um.

Spaight, Henry, Collins were BB commits.

Arkansas had offered HH but CBB had to keep him.

Anybody we signed in February of 2013 is one of his players.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

"At the time" an experienced head coach was truly necessary.  The program was a complete shambles, including the 2-deep roster.  A program builder was really more important than a philosophy or scheme.  In year one we couldn't beat ANYBODY.  In the last two years we have beaten Auburn, LSU, Ole Miss, Florida, Tennessee, TCU, Miss. State, and Kansas State.
While I have no idea what to think about this years TEAM, surely nobody could argue that the "Program " is in dramatically better shape than it was when Beilema arrived. 

Agree.  BB was the obvious hire for us at the time...the buyout notwithstanding.  Program is improved, no doubt.  I think the concern is the level of the ceiling.  Legitimate reason to think that BB is quickly approaching his ceiling here.

[ricepig]

Agree.  BB was the obvious hire for us at the time...the buyout notwithstanding.  Program is improved, no doubt.  I think the concern is the level of the ceiling.  Legitimate reason to think that BB is quickly approaching his ceiling here.

And we will move on, but it isn't happening next week........

[Bubba's Bruisers]

And we will move on, but it isn't happening next week........

Not suggesting next week.  Or even moving on.

[Youngsta71701]

How many other DI coaches could go 7-6?
At least half the coaches in college football maybe more.

[HiggiePiggy]

I don't know why people are upset.  We have gone through this many times.  At Arkansas if you are a CEO type coach you need great coordinators and have to keep them on staff for a long time also you need to be hard on the players during the game instead of looking into space when things start to crumble.

Reason is because we will NEVER out recruit Texas A&M, Alabama, Auburn, and LSU. We will every now and then out recruit Ole Miss and mostly out recruit Mississippi state.  So in the SEC WEST. We will always recruit 5th to 7th in the SEC WEST. This means you either get an X's and O's type of coach that can out scheme other coaches or you get great coordinators that can coach up the players.

So far in the SEC we have seen what an X's and O's coach can do. We have also seen what a CEO coach has done. Mediocre is what we have gotten so far with CEO coaches.

[elksnort]

Um.

Spaight, Henry, Collins were BB commits.

Arkansas had offered HH but CBB had to keep him.

I figured I'd be wrong with one or two of those but my point still stands this dumpster fire thing from John L Smith excuse is getting old he's had for years

[elksnort]

Neither does our posting on HV, lol.

No, it certainly doesn't. It can be cathartic though.

Meanwhile, Hugo Bezdek just got a plug on the Rose Bowl telecast.

[Youngsta71701]

At Arkansas if you are a CEO type coach you need great coordinators and have to keep them on staff for a long time also you need to be hard on the players during the game instead of looking into space when things start to crumble.

This is the thing that pisses me off right here. When they make a mistake or something you hardly ever see him say something to them or get on to them. It's almost like he excepts it or expects is. If he accepts it they will too. He needs to get in their grill and make sure they know there is a price to pay for penalties, fumbles, and turnovers. When you mess up on Alabama Coach Saban nips it in the bud right then and there and it usually stops there. Not many more mistakes after that.

Make sure they get this message. "That you are better of not being born than to fumble or turnover my football"

[ricepig]

I'm going to let Ponderin do the math on how many D-I coaches can go 7-6, lots of variables and statistical analysis required to come up with the answer to that equation.