Is this embarrassing loss the wake-up call we needed?

[Tejano Jawg]

First, regarding Missouri, let's not add disclaimers. They are not a good team. No 3-8 team is. I don't care that they've won a couple East titles in the past. This team, in 2016, is not good. Today we made a bad team feel good about themselves.

Now for us. Everyone on Arkansas' staff, every network pre-game show, some fans (including me) may talk about how we have lost to good teams that have been in the Top 10. You could say we were competitive against Alabama and (kinda) against A&M. Unfortunately, you don't build a strong resume based on the highly-ranked teams you've lost to. Even with that twisted thinking, after today, we can't say that any longer.

We can also feel good about beating the SEC-East champion decisively. So, the question we're all asking is how do you lose to the worst team in the SEC-East?

Our lack of consistency—game to game, or, play to play—is the top head-scrather to me. Look, I know our D is bad (and I'm on board with saying it's the worst one I've seen), but sometimes they would take a stand. After the Ole Miss game, I wondered how close the Bama game would have been if that D had shown up. There are things that were genuine this year—how good our receivers were, how good our running backs were. After that, I wonder if any of the high points were a mirage.  But today was no freak cosmic occurrence. We had everything we needed to beat Missouri comfortably. But lost, going out with a last gasp, not in a blaze of glory. This loss erased many of the good feelings we had about the program. And that's too bad.

What size are the changes we need to make?

[grayhawg]

Maybe it will wake up Jeff Long and make him realize the football Razorbacks need a new leader and new direction.

Football coaches, fire them all

[Mo_Better_Hogs]

First, regarding Missouri, let's not add disclaimers. They are not a good team. No 3-8 team is. I don't care that they've won a couple East titles in the past. This team, in 2016, is not good. Today we made a bad team feel good about themselves.

Now for us. Everyone on Arkansas' staff, every network pre-game show, some fans (including me) may talk about how we have lost to good teams that have been in the Top 10. You could say we were competitive against Alabama and (kinda) against A&M. Unfortunately, you don't build a strong resume based on the highly-ranked teams you've lost to.[/b] Even with that twisted thinking, after today, we can't say that any longer.

We can also feel good about beating the SEC-East champion decisively. So, the question we're all asking is how do you lose to the worst team in the SEC-East?

Our lack of consistency—game to game, or, play to play—is the top head-scrather to me. Look, I know our D is bad (and I'm on board with saying it's the worst one I've seen), but sometimes they would take a stand. After the Ole Miss game, I wondered how close the Bama game would have been if that D had shown up. There are things that were genuine this year—how good our receivers were, how good our running backs were. After that, I wonder if any of the high points were a mirage.  But today was no freak cosmic occurrence. We had everything we needed to beat Missouri comfortably. But lost, going out with a last gasp, not in a blaze of glory. This loss erased many of the good feelings we had about the program. And that's too bad.

What size are the changes we need to make?

Agree with all points here. But this one is something that admittedly I was resting on too. What we should be asking is when are we going to UPSET one of those top 10 teams sometime?? Heck, I remember all through the years in 4 decades of following the Hogs, we would still beat a few teams that we shouldn't. And plenty of times it was with okay (not great) teams.

I also agree with the suggestion that this game is an all-time low in the Bielema era. This isn't a loss to a 6-6 team that's beaten a few people. So what changes need to be made? If there are none (coaching changes) then we should not expect anything different that what has happened the past 2-3 years. Win enough games to make a bowl game, but that's about it.

I'm not quite to the point I say clean house, starting with our head coach, but we have to shake things up. Our defensive staff is responsible for who is on the field. You can't tell me there aren't some players on the bench who would make more plays that our current starters. Fire the entire defensive staff, and consider no player a lock for their position next year. The new staff must find players who WANT TO PLAY DEFENSE.

[ChicoHog]

That was embarrassing.  Especially letting Lock keep throwing over our heads.  heck, they should have had a couple more deep balls but they were dropped.  Everyone on here complains about how our corners play too far off the ball.  Well that is why. Because if they don't they get burned deep, except maybe Pulley.  He's the only corner we have who could play on the better SEC teams.  And not even get me started on the safeties.  We need huge improvement on defense and huge improvement in the Oline before we can step up to the plate in this league.  Regardless of all that you cannot blow a 24-7 lead, not score at all in the second half and let a 3-8 Mizzou squad out muscle you in the trenches in the second half.  Completely embarrassing. 

Having vented all that I still hope we win our bowl game and finish 8-5. 

[Bubba's Bruisers]

How many wake up calls do we need before we wake up?

[online-with-swine]

So Auburn wasn't a wake up call?  LSU?

[buldozer]

I have a feeling the fans will have to force this issue much like they have in the past. I just don't see Jeff Long firing CBB because both long an CBB have cultivated "media darling" type personas they don't want tarnished. Therefore I think the fans will have to force CBB to leave or him and Long to leave.....

[98hogs]

Time to fire up the plane with the banners behind it?

[Mo_Better_Hogs]

So Auburn wasn't a wake up call?  LSU?

If anyone is putting this Missouri team in the same class as a trending-upward Auburn or LSU (or Bama or early-season Tex A&M), you're giving them WAAYYY too much credit.

[Youngsta71701]

First, regarding Missouri, let's not add disclaimers. They are not a good team. No 3-8 team is. I don't care that they've won a couple East titles in the past. This team, in 2016, is not good. Today we made a bad team feel good about themselves.

Now for us. Everyone on Arkansas' staff, every network pre-game show, some fans (including me) may talk about how we have lost to good teams that have been in the Top 10. You could say we were competitive against Alabama and (kinda) against A&M. Unfortunately, you don't build a strong resume based on the highly-ranked teams you've lost to. Even with that twisted thinking, after today, we can't say that any longer.

We can also feel good about beating the SEC-East champion decisively. So, the question we're all asking is how do you lose to the worst team in the SEC-East?

Our lack of consistency—game to game, or, play to play—is the top head-scrather to me. Look, I know our D is bad (and I'm on board with saying it's the worst one I've seen), but sometimes they would take a stand. After the Ole Miss game, I wondered how close the Bama game would have been if that D had shown up. There are things that were genuine this year—how good our receivers were, how good our running backs were. After that, I wonder if any of the high points were a mirage.  But today was no freak cosmic occurrence. We had everything we needed to beat Missouri comfortably. But lost, going out with a last gasp, not in a blaze of glory. This loss erased many of the good feelings we had about the program. And that's too bad.

What size are the changes we need to make?

Recruiting speed instead of size at linebacker, cornerback, and safety. That would be a good start for me. Even Alabama has come to the light. Their linebackers aren't nearly as big as they used to be but they are fast. Now if you can find fast and big that would be even better but at least find fast and put on strength not size.

[ICEman]

How many wake up calls do we need before we wake up?

I think we roll over and keep hitting the snooze button.

[Danny J]

Recruiting speed instead of size at linebacker, cornerback, and safety. That would be a good start for me. Even Alabama has come to the light. Their linebackers aren't nearly as big as they used to be but they are fast. Now if you can find fast and big that would be even better but at least find fast and put on strength not size.

I saw a piece on CBS where Saban said exactly that. He is changing the kind of players he has had in the past as far as linebackers especially. He is adapting. We need more speed all over the field...literally every position. We need quicker O lineman, D lineman, corners, etc...

Our lack of adjustments to what Mizzou was doing on defense is what cost us the game IMO. They were bring 5 on just about every play and sometimes 6 and sometimes 7. They were selling out to get to AA. We should have kept running screens and quick slants in the void behind the blitzers. Also...we have to change up our snap counts. Its too damn easy for opposing defenses to quickly learn our cadence. The way our O line lines up and tackles looking out wide is a dead give away to the pass. Just little things like that help bad defenses like Mizzou make adjustments.

Defense should have blitzed more than twice...I think we sent 5 guys 2 times and that's it.

[cosmodrum]

I think we roll over and keep hitting the snooze button.

[Mo_Better_Hogs]

I found this thread to give it a BUMP. And for a chuckle. Notice it was just after the Missouri game. (And, because there's another thread talking about the possible "upside" to losing the Belk Bowl, which I really don't buy.)

So, no, we did NOT learn anything from the Missouri loss. We did NOT wake up. If anything, based on the numbers, we went the other direction (giving up 35 second half pts, to our 0.) OHHH THE IRONY.

[12247]

About the time I think we have laid enough evidence on the line to cause at least a stern talking of the HC by the AD, a couple of sunshiners throw an illegal block and here we go again.

[grayhawg]

Mizzou was the wake up call and most hit the snooze button only to get disappointed again.

[LRrazorback]

Toledo and Tx tech should've been the wake up calls. CBB will have a wake up call every year (lose one he shouldn't).

[DoubleReedHawgCaller]

Our coach isn't asleep. He's in a damn coma.

[Hog N Bama]

No, it was Missouri. No, wait! It was Auburn. Geeze, I forgot Toledo. OMG, Texas Tech! 

[Biggus Piggus]

Two wake-up calls from this season.

One = getting shut out in the second half by Mizzou and VT AFTER playing very good football in the first half of both games.

Two = run defense that allowed (ex-sacks) 6.7 yards per carry and 39 touchdowns, numbers that had been inconceivable for not just Arkansas but for any SEC team, anytime.

***

I'm inclined to believe that the main problem on offense against Missouri and VT was rooted in Bielema's philosophy of getting a lead then trying to play ball control.

You can't tell much from counting runs vs. passes. That does not tell you anything about what the original call was, what the formation was, what possible adjustments the QB was given, whether the QB changed the call, how smartly he did it, and whether the defense baited one switch to make another, things like that.

My read is that Arkansas limited its first-down options via personnel and formation, so that with rare exceptions the offense was running plays with a low chance of success and modest proceeds if they did work at all.

Opponents were rewarded for their desperation. They loaded the box and gambled that they could handle run or pass. Our offense repeatedly ended up in long-odds situations, and then our QB magnified the problems by making unwise throws, or failing to respect the rush enough.

Our offense lacked the discipline to merely roll as much clock as it could and avoid fatal mistakes. Cut its own throat. And it did not help that we grew uncreative in how we used our variety of backs and receivers. It's funny that we limited the touches of T.J. Hammonds because of ball security, only to have our QB make crippling turnovers. Sometimes, just one great cutback run might have made a world of difference.

I'd bet that Arkansas could have avoided the second-half shutouts, had the offense not gone out there with base formation with the plan to throw only when forced/dared to throw. That is my guess - the problem is rooted in the intent to reduce risk and control possession, regardless of what actual plays were run.

The mere idea that this strategy is viable is outdated. Nobody can afford to put the offense in low gear, regardless of how big the lead might be. Mississippi State, that was the right approach. Use every dimension and try to score on every possession.

I hope the results against Mizzou and VT killed Bielema's fantasy about employing a Big Ten offensive strategy at Arkansas. You know, though, the guy still dreams about having a huge line, three stud backs, pounding opponents into submission.

***

Let's not pretend that Arkansas's defensive problems were solely against the rush.

Passers got only 12 touchdowns vs. 10 interceptions against the Razorbacks' defense. Question is how much was the run defense compromised to help the pass defense avoid big plays.

The defense allowed 51 touchdowns in 13 games. That's a hair under four per game. Does not matter, run vs. pass. Four touchdowns per game, that's awful.

Arkansas's defense also was unusually poor at third-down defense (allowing 45% conversion) and generating tackles for losses -- especially when excluding sacks. Other than sacks, the defense produced well under three lost-yardage plays per game. That's easily the worst since Arkansas joined the SEC.

Cannot entirely blame overcompensation, though. That 6.7 yards-per-carry number is inescapable. Robb Smith might never be a defensive coordinator again after that.

Had Arkansas's offense not shortened a lot of games with ball control, the numbers would have been even worse. Arkansas's opponents averaged 11 fewer plays per game, compared with the other nine worst run defenses in college football.

And the Razorbacks were the only team on that list that made it to a bowl game.

[Biggus Piggus]

I found this thread to give it a BUMP. And for a chuckle. Notice it was just after the Missouri game. (And, because there's another thread talking about the possible "upside" to losing the Belk Bowl, which I really don't buy.)

So, no, we did NOT learn anything from the Missouri loss. We did NOT wake up. If anything, based on the numbers, we went the other direction (giving up 35 second half pts, to our 0.) OHHH THE IRONY.

Learning might have been irrelevant - more like Arkansas was exposed.

[hawgon]

Considering that we practically lead the country in time of possession, our defense could well have been the worst in the history of major college football.  At least all the other really bad defensive teams of the last decade had the excuse that their offenses were running hurry up.

[acey33]

First, regarding Missouri, let's not add disclaimers. They are not a good team. No 3-8 team is. I don't care that they've won a couple East titles in the past. This team, in 2016, is not good. Today we made a bad team feel good about themselves.

Now for us. Everyone on Arkansas' staff, every network pre-game show, some fans (including me) may talk about how we have lost to good teams that have been in the Top 10. You could say we were competitive against Alabama and (kinda) against A&M. Unfortunately, you don't build a strong resume based on the highly-ranked teams you've lost to. Even with that twisted thinking, after today, we can't say that any longer.

We can also feel good about beating the SEC-East champion decisively. So, the question we're all asking is how do you lose to the worst team in the SEC-East?

Our lack of consistency—game to game, or, play to play—is the top head-scrather to me. Look, I know our D is bad (and I'm on board with saying it's the worst one I've seen), but sometimes they would take a stand. After the Ole Miss game, I wondered how close the Bama game would have been if that D had shown up. There are things that were genuine this year—how good our receivers were, how good our running backs were. After that, I wonder if any of the high points were a mirage.  But today was no freak cosmic occurrence. We had everything we needed to beat Missouri comfortably. But lost, going out with a last gasp, not in a blaze of glory. This loss erased many of the good feelings we had about the program. And that's too bad.

What size are the changes we need to make?

Which embarrassing loss are you talking about??? 

[Biggus Piggus]

Considering that we practically lead the country in time of possession, our defense could well have been the worst in the history of major college football.  At least all the other really bad defensive teams of the last decade had the excuse that their offenses were running hurry up.

Can't come anywhere close to that. Arkansas shortened games by 15%. The Hogs gave up 31 points per game.

If you want to adjust that for style, maybe they would have given up 36 ppg. Yes, that would be very poor. If you exclude the Alcorn and Texas State games, Arkansas was close to that.

The worst defenses are routinely >40 ppg. Kansas and SMU were at 46 ppg in 2015.

North Texas allowed almost 48 ppg in 2008.

Purdue and Rutgers gushed 38 ppg this season. Last year, Indiana was at that level of bad.

Arkansas has not descended to the level of the Big Ten bottom-feeders. Purdue gave up 40+ points in six games, including 62 to Penn State. Rutgers lost 78-0 to Michigan, 58-0 to Ohio State, 49-0 to Michigan State.

[riccoar]

Was defense terrible because lack of personnel OR do we need a new Def Coor?

And I think Allen finished the year the way people were dreading he may start.  Looking down receivers.  Definitely regressed.

[colbs]

Was defense terrible because lack of personnel OR do we need a new Def Coor?

And I think Allen finished the year the way people were dreading he may start.  Looking down receivers.  Definitely regressed.

IMO there needs to be changes on defense.  There is lack of personnel but other schools have the same problem and had better defenses. 

[rude1]

Was defense terrible because lack of personnel OR do we need a new Def Coor?

And I think Allen finished the year the way people were dreading he may start.  Looking down receivers.  Definitely regressed.

Austin was applauded for his toughness early on as he took those vicious shots and continued  to get up and play well. By seasons end I think he had gotten gun shy from all the hits he was taking because of the porous line. By seasons end I think the scouting report read "will crack if you get pressure", as teams begin to  bring pressure with the blitz to get to him and it worked.

[Biggus Piggus]

First time an Arkansas team allowed three touchdowns per game: 1951, the terrible Otis Douglas-coached team.

Second time: 1990 (3.6).

Other instances: 1996-97 (losing seasons), 2004-05 (losing seasons), 2007 (Nutt's last), 2008 (losing season), 2012-13 (losing seasons), 2015-16.

This year's 3.9 TDs allowed per game = worst in school history.

[BILLYBOB]

I believe CBB most enjoyable win at Arkansas was the 2014 victory over a Texas Tech. Our O-Line blew their D-Line back 3-4 yards on every play...even when everyone in the stadium knew it was coming. It was dominating old school football. CBB mistakenly thinks we can eventually get to the point where we can do that same thing to SEC-W teams. I do not believe this is correct and if he will change his approach, he might yet be a successful SEC coach. If he doesn't, he'll be gone soon enough.

[Biggus Piggus]

I believe CBB most enjoyable win at Arkansas was the 2014 victory over a Texas Tech. Our O-Line blew their D-Line back 3-4 yards on every play...even when everyone in the stadium knew it was coming. It was dominating old school football. CBB mistakenly thinks we can eventually get to the point where we can do that same thing to SEC-W teams. I do not believe this is correct and if he will change his approach, he might yet be a successful SEC coach. If he doesn't, he'll be gone soon enough.

Well, it was never going to happen this season with this offensive line. Now we move on to the next one.