The Biggest Problem With Our FB Program

[Ex-Trumpet]

Interesting.  Support our Troops is garbage?  The constitution is garbage?  After 29 years in the military and coming from a small AR town and not having a racist bone in my body, I find this post ridiculously offensive.

But you gotta admit, the camo hat is beyond offensive.

[Qui Gon Jinn]

But you gotta admit, the camo hat is beyond offensive.

Tinfoil hat was worse.  :-)

[3kgthog]

Really? Try again. I have a Japanese daughter in law, a cousin married to a black, black friends, etc. My wife's former business partner is a black immigrant from Nigeria.  A lot of people I do business with in the hotel industry which I serve are Indian. I even have some liberal friends I like. What I do NOT like is unabashed liberalism OR conservatism using views, stats, data or facts without thinking first.  I bet I'd even like you if I got to know you. That doesn't mean I wouldn't think some of your viewpoints are dumb. My best friend that died a couple of years ago has an older sister that we are still close friends with. She was the only one in her whole family that is liberal and actually worked for the Clintons when he was Governor. We love to see her when we go to NWA for visits and games.

Do you refer to your cousin's spouse as "the black"? Just curious.

[Ex-Trumpet]

Do you refer to your cousin's spouse as "the black"? Just curious.

Most of us in Arkansas refer to our cousin's spouse as "sis."

[BirmingHam]

img width=550 height=538]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/048/784/04d.jpg[/img]

If you drive down around south and central Arkansas you are going to see a ton of burnt out pickup trucks with confederate flags.

I see you've never been to Jasper or Locust Fork AL?  Or Como or Senatobia MS?  I lived in Como while commuting to Memphis to work.  This town in actually split by the railroad tracks, which I found it out after moving there, and it is with 40 miles of Oxford, Ol Miss campus. Yet...they have no problem recruiting AA players.  I lived outside of Locust Fork while working in Birmingham.  There were actual signs for the KKK.

You guys need to travel to small towns around these other campuses.  You'll see a whole lot more racism there than you do in NWA.  Small town NWA doesn't have AA because there's nothing there to draw them in (i.e., low economy, little employment opportunities; not racism)

[BirmingHam]

Do you refer to your cousin's spouse as "the black"? Just curious.

Call my daughter-in-law as "the black" or my other daughter-in-law (who is Vietnamese) as "the gook" and I'll kick your ass from dawn to sunset.  They are my family and will be treated as just that - family.

And I grew up in small town NWA -Ozark.

[Occams Razorback]

What are some things that your average African American wants from a cultural standpoint that don't exist in NWA?

[HiggiePiggy]

What are some things that your average African American wants from a cultural standpoint that don't exist in NWA?

It has nothing to do with that.  Most recruits will go close to places close to home. Arkansas is far away from home for many of the big time recruits out there. 

[RazorbacksFTW]

OP is a Libtard who has baited all of you into arguing about race to try and take the heat off his butt buddy Bert.

I bet OP still supports Obama because it's a personal thing for him like all liberals he doesn't care how bad the results are the only thing that matters to him is that his butt buddy stays in power so he doesn't have to admit he was wrong.
BTW OP admitted he was wrong in his first post as soon as a libtard changes the subject to race they have lost the argument.

Hey OP your butt buddy is getting fired get over it and one more thing..........Shillary for Prison!

[RazorbacksFTW]

This is the most try hard liberal thread I've ever seen on Hogville...

Shillary for Prison!

[elviscat]

Until we establish a connection in Texas with the high school coaches, we will have a hard time attracting the athletes we need. It might be great to hire some coaches from the high school rank from Texas. We have to be competitive in Texas for us to be able to build a solid program. We do not have enough life blood in AR, to support our program. When a 4 stare althlete sits on the bench at Alabama, who is from NW AR and only plays in mope up rolls. It pretty much tells the story.

[hawgbawb]

Im full on aware that NWA doesn't produce athletes and that Arkansas is racist state at times, especially up northwest around harrison. But man what makes you think Alabama and Georgia don't have those same political qualities? Look at Ole Miss. They ARE the prototypical confederate south and they were able to get talented AA there.

All that said, i don't think its the political issue so much as it is a Demographic issue. I think it's the ratio of AA this state compared to the others. Mississippi, Alabama, and Georgia are all fertile because they have an abundance of AA talent. The most talented and abundant area of AA in Arkansas is Little Rock, but sadly everyone is moving towards Basketball because the school districts suck completely. Pine Bluff still churns a few good players along with the southern Arkansas part.

Also understand it's all about winning. Alabama and UGA are able to get quality players because they are a quality school that wins more often than loses.

I agree and that's what I've been trying to say.

[hawgbawb]

"If you look at Hogville, where we have posters with rebel flags, a State flag with imagery that mimicks one, and avatars of confederate soldiers, you get the picture of the challenge we face."  This is a direct quote from your OP.  I don't see how its reactionary to claim you were blaming racism.

There's some towns in the Ozarks where there are more rebel flags than there are African Americans. That is not hyperbole. Now if I'm a coach or recruiter for Ole Miss LSU or Auburn that's a real good line to mention at a recruit.

[Kevin]

There's some towns in the Ozarks where there are more rebel flags than there are African Americans. That is not hyperbole. Now if I'm a coach or recruiter for Ole Miss LSU or Auburn that's a real good line to mention at a recruit.

have you ever been to south Carolina?
ole miss really?

[hawgbawb]

have you ever been to south Carolina?
ole miss really?

I've been there a bunch. Lived across the Savanna River in Augusta. There are tons of racists, but there are tons of African Americans. Most people have better sense than to wave Rebel flags. They keep it under cover.

[Kevin]

I've been there a bunch. Lived across the Savanna River in Augusta. There are tons of racists, but there are tons of African Americans. Most people have better sense than to wave Rebel flags. They keep it under cover.

you mean it flying on the state capital grounds till 2015

[Vantage 8 dude]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.seccountry.com/alabama/report-man-shot-tuscaloosa-strip-following-alabamas-win-arkansas/amp

People get shot after Bama victories.  We should use that as a recruiting tool.  If you go there and win, people die.  Come
Here and win, if you value human lives.

I agree, however, sad to say that we haven't won enough of late to ensure anyone's life. 

[razorbackfaninar]

This isn't rocket science.  We are going to consistently recruit somewhere between the high teens low 20's nationally, some years a little worse.  It has nothing to do with racism or the perception of the state or the program.  You don't have to look very far to see how to consistently field a good team under those circumstances.  You need a meticulous, system driven coach who understandshow to evaluate what talent he needs to run his system and then runs it to perfection with out deviation. A coach like a Gary Patterson, or Paul Johnson.

[JaketheSnake]

I agree, however, sad to say that we haven't won enough of late to ensure anyone's life. 

True.  Suicide rate and trucks on fire don't help

[RazorbacksFTW]

This isn't rocket science.  We are going to consistently recruit somewhere between the high teens low 20's nationally, some years a little worse.  It has nothing to do with racism or the perception of the state or the program.

I think our recruiting will improve a lot if we ever get to the point of winning 9 games a year.
We might hit top 15 recruiting class if we could win 9 to 9+ a few seasons in a row with the new coach.

This is definitely doable at least for now the SEC West is pretty awful right now it might be the worst I have ever seen it.

[HiggiePiggy]

I think our recruiting will improve a lot if we ever get to the point of winning 9 games a year.
We might hit top 15 recruiting class if we could win 9 to 9+ a few seasons in a row with the new coach.

This is definitely doable at least for now the SEC West is pretty awful right now it might be the worst I have ever seen it.

Wasn't that great in the 2000s.

[RazorbacksFTW]

Wasn't that great in the 2000s.

Mcfadden Jones and that awesome offensive line was really fun to watch.
Also had a pretty good defense that played hard and hit hard.

We may not have been the greatest but dmn did they play hard especially at home.
Those teams loved the fans and they never quit.

[HiggiePiggy]

Mcfadden Jones and that awesome offensive line was really fun to watch.
Also had a pretty good defense that played hard and hit hard.

We may not have been the greatest but dmn did they play hard especially at home.
Those teams loved the fans and they never quit.

I'm talking about the SEC. it wasn't great in the early 2000s

[SchrodingersHog]

Let's say Nick Saban got bored at Alabama and decided he wanted a challenge, so he came to Arkansas.  He would have five star HS kids lined up to sign here.  It's not necessarily the location as much as the coach.

[RazorbacksFTW]

I'm talking about the SEC. it wasn't great in the early 2000s

Yep and the Sec is weak again.
I wouldn't mind if the games started getting really competitive and tense again like a lot of the games in the early 2000's.
It would be really awful if we stayed a weak conference for a few years and the games stay boring like they are right now.

[JaketheSnake]

Let's say Nick Saban got bored at Alabama and decided he wanted a challenge, so he came to Arkansas.  He would have five star HS kids lined up to sign here.  It's not necessarily the location as much as the coach.

Saban is not the norm... he is the exception. Who else has that kind of pull?  Maybe Chip Kelly?  And even he doesn't have the same draw that Saban does.

And Kelly ain't coming here.

[HiggiePiggy]

Saban is not the norm... he is the exception. Who else has that kind of pull?  Maybe Chip Kelly?  And even he doesn't have the same draw that Saban does.

And Kelly ain't coming here.

Chip kelly wouldn't even have that kind of pull.  Saban would pull in some off of his name alone, but it wouldn't be as much as he is able to pull into Alabama because of location.  He still would recruit well here.

Saban might would be the only coach right now maybe Meyer to be able to put us in the top half of recruiting in the SEC instead of where we usually are. 

[BartIV]

The problem with Arkansas is we are used to being poor to average. It's all mental. Think about it. If Arkansas goes in to overtime, what is the first thing we say, "well we lost, its over before it's even started." We choose not to play A-State because we afraid they will take something from us, when we should be saying, "bring it on." We search for rivalries from every school we play, when we really just need to do our own thing because they are not interested. Should we leave the SEC because we are not good enough. No, we can win, but we have to hire someone who doesn't tolerate losing.
It's time we own up and demand our coaches to win. You don't win, hit the bricks. We are too good for losers to roam the halls. You run scared one time, you run scared the rest of your life.
Just WIN.

[Großer Kriegschwein]

Well good for you.  Maybe try doing it while black.  By the way, when you can show me heroism medals from the military in a time of war, then you can tell me to man up.  Until then, STFU!

I could show you a few. Just sayin.

[Kneph13]

Troll post and most everyone is feeding it.

The OP needs to take their leftist propaganda somewhere else.

[Großer Kriegschwein]

Troll post and most everyone is feeding it.

The OP needs to take their leftist propaganda somewhere else.

He will, when he skips his meds.

[Pork Twain]

We lost by a combined 47 points against two teams we out recruited (TCU & USCe), that isn't our biggest problem.

Cool story if true, but not true...at least not absolutely.

[porkrindjimmy]

Chip kelly wouldn't even have that kind of pull.  Saban would pull in some off of his name alone, but it wouldn't be as much as he is able to pull into Alabama because of location.  He still would recruit well here.

Saban might would be the only coach right now maybe Meyer to be able to put us in the top half of recruiting in the SEC instead of where we usually are. 

Well good for you.  Maybe try doing it while black.  By the way, when you can show me heroism medals from the military in a time of war, then you can tell me to man up.  Until then, STFU!

Hey Buddy...man up.

PRJ

Sorry Higgie, didn't mean to quote you

[Razorbackers]

Everyone keep in mind the OP 100% believes in man made global warming.

That's for showing that lunacy knows no political party.

[jkstock04]

That's for showing that lunacy knows no political party.

Why am I not surprised to see you chime in on this. If only Arkansas didn't have racists they could be the same caliber of team as Alabama. Excellent logic.

You are just as big of a loon as Hawgbawb, only with a better sense of humor.

[Razorbackers]

I will say, it's not like HB pulled the racism thing out of thin air. I just don't think it's as much of a factor anymore.

Nolan talked about it in the 40 Minutes of Hell doc, about not wanting to even come to arkansas after seeing the Little Rock 9 stuff.

Ole Miss changed their mascot because of the perception that it gave to out of state recruits. Fun Fact, Ole Miss hasn't won the conference since pre-integration. I've got a few good friends that played D1 football that are black, and none of them would even take a visit to Ole Miss because of the confederate thing.

If you don't think perception matters, then you're wrong. But I don't think that previous perception of Arkansas as some haven for racists really persists, not as long as South Carolina and Alabama keep making the news haha.

What we need is a coach who can recruit in the top 25 consistently, and get the right guys in the right places to compete. Every 2-3 years, with consistent recruiting and average turnover in players, we should be able to compete at a high level, and then reload. It's how the majority of teams play. We can't compare ourselves to Alabama or other states with deep in-state talent. We have to go elsewhere to find the beef in our roster.

I honestly thought on paper that CBB was doing a decent job of that, but his just unexplainable struggles to find 11 guys on offense is maddening.

[Großer Kriegschwein]

Willing to compare!  Willing to put up my entire career up against anyone on the site.  That's how confident I am no one on here would measure up.

I don't compare valor medals. They are all situationally dependent and honestly most only do what is required of them anyway, under poor circumstances.

I'm glad you are so confident that your sacrifices outweigh everyone else's.

[hogsanity]

What we need is a coach who can recruit in the top 25 consistently,

We pretty much do that now, but a top 25 class may still only be 8th-10th in the SEC. So 8 or 9 teams in our league are getting better players ( according to the recruiting rankings ) every year.

[Razorbackers]

We pretty much do that now, but a top 25 class may still only be 8th-10th in the SEC. So 8 or 9 teams in our league are getting better players ( according to the recruiting rankings ) every year.

For sure, that was step 1 haha. Next is to get the right guys in the right places to compete, which CBB has had a hard time doing, particularly this year.

[Piggfoot]

There is no single biggest problem, there are several.
1. Distant proximity to SEC quality athletes.
2. Few SEC quality athletes produced in Arkansas.
3. Racism perception. NWA known destination for White flight from the rest of the State.
4. 6% African American community and no surrounding African American commuinity. ie Tuscaloosa to Birmingham 58 miles, Baton Rouge to NO, Auburn to Columbus, Ga. Bryant to Houston. examples.
5. Poor coaching Staff.
6. Arkansas has a mediocre win % in the SEC.

[Razorbackers]

Well good for you.  Maybe try doing it while black.  By the way, when you can show me heroism medals from the military in a time of war, then you can tell me to man up.  Until then, STFU!

https://www.reddit.com/r/iamverybadass/ material right there. woof.

[riccoar]

And all this time I thought our team sucked because we had the wrong coach.  Who knew if we would all become Social Justice Warriors and were fluent in Political Correctness we would have played for multiple National Championships.  Holy Schit!  All along liberalism, participation trophies, and spare hugs were all that was needed.  Mind. Blown.

[snoblind]

Lol....this is the funniest lost I have read on here in a great while. You got spooked going down the pig trail. Why am I not surprised?

Man up dude and life will be more enjoyable. I have been up and down the pig trail a thousand times. Never have I been spooked....lol.

PRJ

Went right over your head.

[Razorbackers]

And all this time I thought our team sucked because we had the wrong coach.  Who knew if we would all become Social Justice Warriors and were fluent in Political Correctness we would have played for multiple National Championships.  Holy Schit!  All along liberalism, participation trophies, and spare hugs were all that was needed.  Mind. Blown.

wat

[riccoar]

wat

wat?  Glad you asked.  This perception that you progressives paint of Fayetteville or Central AR like they could make part 2 of Mississippi Burning is effing laughable.  Hell, I thought I'd seen it all when Nuttbag was complaining about seeing "Like It Is" columns on the coffee table when he'd go for recruiting visits.  Now we have rampant Rebel flags sticker sightings?  God Bless America magnets?  Maybe we need Lanny to carve out the Safe Spaces forum for some of you guys.

[hogsanity]

Arkansas     15% African American
Alabama      27%
Georgia       32%
Mississippi    37%
Louisiana     32%
Tennessee    17%
South Car     26%
Fla               15%

The only state in the sec with a lower % of the population that is AA is Missouri. Also, Ar has the lowest total population in the SEC.

[jst01]

Arkansas     15% African American
Alabama      27%
Georgia       32%
Mississippi    37%
Louisiana     32%
Tennessee    17%
South Car     26%
Fla               15%

The only state in the sec with a lower % of the population that is AA is Missouri. Also, Ar has the lowest total population in the SEC.

Been saying this for years.  Also, the AA population in the deep south states where those blue chips primarily come from are part of families (genetic history) that haven't migrated or moved from those regions in the last 150 years. The genetics keep reproducing and primarily stay in those same regions. God given athletic ability continues to reproduce in the same areas.

[Boss Hog in the Arkansas]

I haven't read this entire thread nor am I going to. I will however destroy the OP's argument within a couple sentences. Arkansas average recruiting class is around 25. You look at teams like Bama, Lsu, Auburn, etc and their ranking in the CFP poll usually directly reflects where they've recruited. Ours does not. That isn't on recruiting, its coaching 100%

[razortrack]

I know many former teammates that loved Fayetteville and some still reside there. I'd pick Fayetteville over Tuscaloosa, Oxford, and Starkville any day.

[hogsanity]

I haven't read this entire thread nor am I going to. I will however destroy the OP's argument within a couple sentences. Arkansas average recruiting class is around 25. You look at teams like Bama, Lsu, Auburn, etc and their ranking in the CFP poll usually directly reflects where they've recruited. Ours does not. That isn't on recruiting, its coaching 100%

Well, with a class average of around 25, which puts them 8th or lower in the sec every year, how is it coaching alone that is keeping them from being in the top 25? When you have to play 6-8 teams in your conference every year that are getting better players it is lunacy to think that you are going to out coach enough of them to get 8 or 9 wins, which is what it takes to be in the top 25.

Been saying this for years.  Also, the AA population in the deep south states where those blue chips primarily come from are part of families (genetic history) that haven't migrated or moved from those regions in the last 150 years. The genetics keep reproducing and primarily stay in those same regions. God given athletic ability continues to reproduce in the same areas.

Yet people here will tell you that the players just need to want it more, regardless of actual ability.