So, are Alabama and Texas overrated?

[olemissbydamn]

Bama played doormat FIU at home and was only leading by 6 at halftime. There was only 5 minutes left in the 3rd quarter before they extended their lead to 12 with a TD and failed 2pt conversion. It took 14 fourth quarter points to finally blowout FIU 40-14.

Texas struggled with Wyoming, leading 13-10 going into halftime. They pulled away in the second half winning 41-10.

Are these teams mediocre overrated teams?

[Cure]

Alabama is not a sure commodity.


Auburn is a dangerous team, believe it.

[dhornjr1]

I assume this is an attempt to compare Ole Miss' lackluster performance against Memphis to Alabama's and Texas' efforts and how one poor performance doesn't mean anything.

Forget Ole Miss' struggles in that first game. There are a multitude of other reasons for us to think that Ole Miss will not finish in the top five or top ten by the end of the year.

We have lived it. You will soon enough.

[want2be]

It is sometimes difficult to get charge up for those type opponents

I will reserve judgement for Bama until we play them in 2 weeks since they are playing N. Texas next week.

Texas season may be defined with the Oklahoma game when Bradford wll be back.

[camden5r]

Bama played doormat FIU at home and was only leading by 6 at halftime. There was only 5 minutes left in the 3rd quarter before they extended their lead to 12 with a TD and failed 2pt conversion. It took 14 fourth quarter points to finally blowout FIU 40-14.

Texas struggled with Wyoming, leading 13-10 going into halftime. They pulled away in the second half winning 41-10.

Are these teams mediocre overrated teams?

no

[MojaveJoe]

Possibly Texas, but Alabama is not.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Bama played doormat FIU at home and was only leading by 6 at halftime. There was only 5 minutes left in the 3rd quarter before they extended their lead to 12 with a TD and failed 2pt conversion. It took 14 fourth quarter points to finally blowout FIU 40-14.

Texas struggled with Wyoming, leading 13-10 going into halftime. They pulled away in the second half winning 41-10.

Are these teams mediocre overrated teams?

Compared to Ole Miss? No. 

[Ex-Trumpet]

After 2 weeks, the only top-10 team I've been impressed with is Florida.  Everyone else seems like a lower tier.  Some WAY lower!

[regi]

You are and will never be Bama or Texas. You should use similar programs when you try to compare Ole Miss. Like Ok State and Mumphis. How did your number 2 rival (Mumphis) do yesterday btw?

[Eddie Goodson]

This is not a big deal at all. Most of the teams in the SEC prepare a very vanilla offensive and defensive scheme for these rent-a-win games. That's the difference in the top of the SEC and Big Twelve schools like Oklahoma. OU will come out and throw everything they have at their rent-a-wins giving opponents a ton of tape to prepare with. Saban revealed as little as he had to about Alabama yesterday until his superior athletes took control of the game and blew it out. HDN still hasn't learned that lesson. He threw everything he had in his book at Memphis in order to beat them. There are no secrets about Ole Miss to anyone they will face.

[rzrbackrob]

Texass is always overrated till proven otherwise. Texass doesn't play anybody and will thus end up in top 10 by default.
Alabama's offense is going to cost them at least a couple of games this year. Still top 20
Old P*ss will end the season just outside the top 25.
So, does a team that starts out the season in the top 5 and ends up somewhere outside the top 25 overrated?

[farmhawg]

Only ole piss.

[rebelbruiser]

This is not a big deal at all. Most of the teams in the SEC prepare a very vanilla offensive and defensive scheme for these rent-a-win games. That's the difference in the top of the SEC and Big Twelve schools like Oklahoma. OU will come out and throw everything they have at their rent-a-wins giving opponents a ton of tape to prepare with. Saban revealed as little as he had to about Alabama yesterday until his superior athletes took control of the game and blew it out. HDN still hasn't learned that lesson. He threw everything he had in his book at Memphis in order to beat them. There are no secrets about Ole Miss to anyone they will face.

Did you even watch our game?  That was as vanilla of an offense as I've seen from us since Nutt was hired.  We had a couple things that were discussed in the offseason offensively that we didn't even see once in the Memphis game.  They definitely held back.

ombd's point, which I also tried to make yesterday, is that it's foolish to judge any team based on a poor half of football or even a poor game.

Bama did the exact same thing against FIU, an even weaker team than Memphis.  I think they'll still go on to have a very good season though.  It's pointless to make those snap judgements in games where the favorite has very little motivation and the underdog has a lot.

If you have paid any attention to our series with Memphis, you'd know that they always play us tougher than the rest of their opponents.  Usually you see them play a tougher game against us and follow that up by looking lackluster the next week.  That's a Tommy West trademark and has been for a while.  We're Memphis's biggest game of the year.  They rank way down the list for us, at best 9th.

[Hawg Balling]

Did you even watch our game?  That was as vanilla of an offense as I've seen from us since Nutt was hired.

You'd better get ready for a belly full of vanilla offense given who your head coach is. 

[Cajun Hog]

I don't know about Texas, but Bama is darn good.  I would take them at this time over the Gators.

In the west division Bama and the rest.......

[Eddie Goodson]

Did you even watch our game?  That was as vanilla of an offense as I've seen from us since Nutt was hired.  We had a couple things that were discussed in the offseason offensively that we didn't even see once in the Memphis game.  They definitely held back.

ombd's point, which I also tried to make yesterday, is that it's foolish to judge any team based on a poor half of football or even a poor game.

Bama did the exact same thing against FIU, an even weaker team than Memphis.  I think they'll still go on to have a very good season though.  It's pointless to make those snap judgements in games where the favorite has very little motivation and the underdog has a lot.

If you have paid any attention to our series with Memphis, you'd know that they always play us tougher than the rest of their opponents.  Usually you see them play a tougher game against us and follow that up by looking lackluster the next week.  That's a Tommy West trademark and has been for a while.  We're Memphis's biggest game of the year.  They rank way down the list for us, at best 9th.

Hate to break it to you, but that is all Nutt's got. He had to throw all he had at Memphis.

[bigdaddyhawg]

Bama did the exact same thing against FIU, an even weaker team than Memphis. 

Really? 

I doubt you've done enough study on those two teams (Memphis and FIU) to know both teams personnel, their backgrounds, etc. to be able to compare those two teams with such certainty.

To be able to make a true statement about that, you would have to study game films of all four games, and even then your comment would be conjecture, after only two games of both teams.

And, BTW, didn't Memphis get their doors blown off by Middle Tennessee State?

(OK, go ahead and tell me great MTSU is now, bruiser.)

[olemissbydamn]

Really? 

I doubt you've done enough study on those two teams (Memphis and FIU) to know both teams personnel, their backgrounds, etc. to be able to compare those two teams with such certainty.

To be able to make a true statement about that, you would have to study game films of all four games, and even then your comment would be conjecture, after only two games of both teams.

And, BTW, didn't Memphis get their doors blown off by Middle Tennessee State?

(OK, go ahead and tell me great MTSU is now, bruiser.)

Come on man, take off the red glasses and put down the kool-aid.

It isn't much of a stretch to call Florida International Univ. worse than Memphis.

They've won six games in 3 years.

This ranking puts them at #116 out of 120 in the last decade.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/11938037

Mario Cristobal (formerly of Miami fame) has them doing better, but they are still terrible.

And why does your statement about Memphis/MTSU matter..."I doubt you've done enough study on those two teams (Memphis and MTSU) to know both teams personnel, their backgrounds, etc. to be able to compare those two teams with such certainty.

To be able to make a true statement about that, you would have to study game films of all four games, and even then your comment would be conjecture, after only two games of both teams."

[bigdaddyhawg]

Come on man, take off the red glasses and put down the kool-aid.

It isn't much of a stretch to call Florida International Univ. worse than Memphis.

They've won six games in 3 years.

This ranking puts them at #116 out of 120 in the last decade.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/11938037

Mario Cristobal (formerly of Miami fame) has them doing better, but they are still terrible.

And why does your statement about Memphis/MTSU matter..."I doubt you've done enough study on those two teams (Memphis and MTSU) to know both teams personnel, their backgrounds, etc. to be able to compare those two teams with such certainty.

To be able to make a true statement about that, you would have to study game films of all four games, and even then your comment would be conjecture, after only two games of both teams."

My point had nothing to do with Kool-Aid or the Razorbacks, you idiot.

And I don't care what a team did last year or two years ago or three years ago -- that's irrelevant to the team they put on the field Sat..  If you are a follower of CFB you should know that, you clown.

I was making a point there is basically no way to support such a statement, that such a statement is complete BS conjecture, since it is basically impossible to have that factual knowledge this early in the season.

I wasn't addressing my comment to you anyway, friend.  I was addressing someone who I know has intelligence and understanding of CFB and with whom I have, from time to time, been able to have a logical, intelligent discussion of CFB issues.

So, from now on, if you don't have anything intelligent to add to the discussion, just please keep the he!! out of it.  Thank you very much.

[RickyRoma]

Did you even watch our game?  That was as vanilla of an offense as I've seen from us since Nutt was hired.  We had a couple things that were discussed in the offseason offensively that we didn't even see once in the Memphis game.  They definitely held back.

ombd's point, which I also tried to make yesterday, is that it's foolish to judge any team based on a poor half of football or even a poor game.

Bama did the exact same thing against FIU, an even weaker team than Memphis.  I think they'll still go on to have a very good season though.  It's pointless to make those snap judgements in games where the favorite has very little motivation and the underdog has a lot.

If you have paid any attention to our series with Memphis, you'd know that they always play us tougher than the rest of their opponents.  Usually you see them play a tougher game against us and follow that up by looking lackluster the next week.  That's a Tommy West trademark and has been for a while.  We're Memphis's biggest game of the year.  They rank way down the list for us, at best 9th.

Then you ain't seen nothing yet...

[donewithdale]

Bama played doormat FIU at home and was only leading by 6 at halftime. There was only 5 minutes left in the 3rd quarter before they extended their lead to 12 with a TD and failed 2pt conversion. It took 14 fourth quarter points to finally blowout FIU 40-14.

Texas struggled with Wyoming, leading 13-10 going into halftime. They pulled away in the second half winning 41-10.

Are these teams mediocre overrated teams?

No but Ole Miss is.

I see 'bruiser is already spinning the Nutt controlled conservative offense. 

[Pecos Hog]

Did you even watch our game?  That was as vanilla of an offense as I've seen from us since Nutt was hired.  We had a couple things that were discussed in the offseason offensively that we didn't even see once in the Memphis game.  They definitely held back.

Every fan of Arkansas knows better than this.    Happened to be discussed EVERY SINGLE YEAR he was coach here!   And, well, what you see is what you get with Nutt.    He's never had anything to "hold back".     He's as plain vanilla as you can get.     

[rebelbruiser]

My point had nothing to do with Kool-Aid or the Razorbacks, you idiot.

And I don't care what a team did last year or two years ago or three years ago -- that's irrelevant to the team they put on the field Sat..  If you are a follower of CFB you should know that, you clown.

I was making a point there is basically no way to support such a statement, that such a statement is complete BS conjecture, since it is basically impossible to have that factual knowledge this early in the season.

I wasn't addressing my comment to you anyway, friend.  I was addressing someone who I know has intelligence and understanding of CFB and with whom I have, from time to time, been able to have a logical, intelligent discussion of CFB issues.

So, from now on, if you don't have anything intelligent to add to the discussion, just please keep the he!! out of it.  Thank you very much.

Regardless of who is better (FIU or Memphis), by the discussions I heard last week, a team like Alabama should NEVER come out of the gates and struggle with a team like FIU.

Bottom line, you know it is bogus to pronounce a team dead based on one half of play, and when you get it thrown in your face that even the great Nick Saban's team might struggle with a vastly inferior opponent early in a game, you try to justify the comment some other way.

Whether FIU or Memphis is the better team really doesn't matter.  If you're a Top 5 team, you should be vastly superior to either team.  We let Memphis hang around for a while before putting them away, and Bama let FIU hang around before putting them away.  The two games were no different.

[rebelbruiser]

Well, you'll be playing Bama soon enough, won'tcha?    Then we'll know.  Can't comprehend all the arguing about how good Ole Miss is or isn't.   I say Miss will lose AT LEAST 4 games, and you think you're gonna win 10.    There's no need to argue about it, just watch and learn....

Believe it or not, that may be the most rational statement I've seen about our team on this board.  Right now, I have my opinion.  You have yours.  It will all play out on the field over the next 3 months.

[bigdaddyhawg]

Regardless of who is better (FIU or Memphis), by the discussions I heard last week, a team like Alabama should NEVER come out of the gates and struggle with a team like FIU.

Bottom line, you know it is bogus to pronounce a team dead based on one half of play, and when you get it thrown in your face that even the great Nick Saban's team might struggle with a vastly inferior opponent early in a game, you try to justify the comment some other way.

Whether FIU or Memphis is the better team really doesn't matter.  If you're a Top 5 team, you should be vastly superior to either team.  We let Memphis hang around for a while before putting them away, and Bama let FIU hang around before putting them away.  The two games were no different.

I actually agree with your point, but you just went a little overboard in making it.

The comparison of Bama's struggles vs. FIU and OM's vs. UM are valid.  And, as you say later, time will tell on both.

And I also understand your frustration dealing with OM haters on here, to a degree.  After all, YOU are the one who comes on here knowing what you're going to see before you log on.  At that point, your frustration is of your own creation.

I'm not criticizing you defending your team.  But as I told OMBD, you're smart enough and understand CFB well enough to make your arguments without any BS statements.

I will take exception to your first line there.  Why should a #3 or #4 ranked team not ever struggle against a team like FIU, when you had all kinds of justifications why OM, a #5 or #6 ranked team, could struggle against a team like UM?  Just be consistent.

[The Hogfather]

The comparison of Bama's struggles vs. FIU and OM's vs. UM are valid.  And, as you say later, time will tell on both.

Except for the fact that Bama just got done beating the crap out of VTECH, a top 10 team, on the road, in a game that wasn't as close as the score indicated.

Ole Miss hadn't played a game yet and really struggled against a pretty weak Conference USA team.

No comparison.

[bigdaddyhawg]

Except for the fact that Bama just got done beating the crap out of VTECH, a top 10 team, on the road, in a game that wasn't as close as the score indicated.

Ole Miss hadn't played a game yet and really struggled against a pretty weak Conference USA team.

No comparison.

You are right, it was a little different situation, but there is a comparison that can be made there.

I'm sure Bama did have a hangover from having won such a big game vs. VT, and that probably was the biggest factor in them playing so mediocre.

[Tripod1]

I give rebelbruiser credit.  He is a fan of Ole Miss and no doubt supports his team.  He discusses most topics with alot of knowledge of football.  His fault is he believes Ole Nutty will keep them in the promise land and I actually feel sorry for him when Hooty becomes exposed for the fraud he is.  Rebelbruiser catches alot of flack on this board but as pointed out by a poster above, this is a Hog board, he is a Rebel and he chooses to log on here so that does make him fair game.  But all in all I enjoy reading his posts.

[rebelbruiser]

I will take exception to your first line there.  Why should a #3 or #4 ranked team not ever struggle against a team like FIU, when you had all kinds of justifications why OM, a #5 or #6 ranked team, could struggle against a team like UM?  Just be consistent.

That was the point.  It was sarcasm to bring up Texas and Alabama to show that the arguments made last week about us were premature.

I don't think playing a weak half of football against a weak team means you're a bad team or overrated, especially when you still end up winning by 30.

My point is that if Arkansas fans are going to make that snap judgement about our team last week, then they better be ready to make the same snap judgement in relation to Alabama and Texas this week.

Alabama needed a blocked punt return and a punt return TD to hold off Tulane by 2 TDs last year.  Take that one small sample, and you'd think they were a mediocre team.  They obviously played a lot better at other times in the season and ended up 12-2.

[rebelbruiser]

Except for the fact that Bama just got done beating the crap out of VTECH, a top 10 team, on the road, in a game that wasn't as close as the score indicated.

Ole Miss hadn't played a game yet and really struggled against a pretty weak Conference USA team.

No comparison.

Alabama played Va. Tech on a neutral site, but that wasn't the point.  They played great one week and played weak the next week.  One week, or even worse, one half of play is not enough to judge a team by.

Do you honestly think we played our best against Memphis?  I don't, and I don't think anyone else does either, and that's the point.  We have better football ahead of us, just like Alabama has better football in them than what they showed against FIU.

If they bring that FIU performance against LSU, Ole Miss, Arkansas, Auburn, or most other SEC schools, they'll get beat.  My guess is they'll step it up and play better against those SEC opponents, just like we will likely step it up and play more complete football in our SEC games.

[The Hogfather]

Alabama played Va. Tech on a neutral site, but that wasn't the point.  They played great one week and played weak the next week.  One week, or even worse, one half of play is not enough to judge a team by.

Do you honestly think we played our best against Memphis?  I don't, and I don't think anyone else does either, and that's the point.  We have better football ahead of us, just like Alabama has better football in them than what they showed against FIU.

If they bring that FIU performance against LSU, Ole Miss, Arkansas, Auburn, or most other SEC schools, they'll get beat.  My guess is they'll step it up and play better against those SEC opponents, just like we will likely step it up and play more complete football in our SEC games.

Sorry, away from home....

[donewithdale]

That was the point.  It was sarcasm to bring up Texas and Alabama to show that the arguments made last week about us were premature.

I don't think playing a weak half of football against a weak team means you're a bad team or overrated, especially when you still end up winning by 30.

My point is that if Arkansas fans are going to make that snap judgement about our team last week, then they better be ready to make the same snap judgement in relation to Alabama and Texas this week.

Alabama needed a blocked punt return and a punt return TD to hold off Tulane by 2 TDs last year.  Take that one small sample, and you'd think they were a mediocre team.  They obviously played a lot better at other times in the season and ended up 12-2.

Ole Miss played a weak 3+ qtr's as Memphis was in the game in the 4th qtr.

Bama and Texas aren't Ole Miss and aren't coached by Nutt.  We've watched Saban's teams for years win a NC, conference championships and big games.  We've watched Mack Brown win a NC, conference championships, play entire seasons while being a targeted top 5-10 team and win BCS games.  We've seen Nutt for 11+ seasons and know what we saw vs Memphis is the Nuttball norm.  What we saw from Bama and Texas are rare and were extremely temporary (not 3+ qtrs) and not the norm. 

No snap judgements. 

[The Hogfather]

Do you honestly think we played our best against Memphis?  I don't, and I don't think anyone else does either, and that's the point.

No, but that's how Nutt run teams operate.  Spectacular against the #1 team in the nation, lose to Vandy, lose to South Carolina, play horrible against Memphis, beat #15 LSU, beat MSU 45-0, beat UAB by 20, lose to Auburn by 14.

If you can't acknowledge that maybe Alabama was in letdown mode after their first game of the season, it will prove even more that you are completely incapable of being objective.

Your game with Memphis was your first.  Your first of the season as a top 10 team.  Your first chance to prove yourself as worthy of that ranking and worthy of the hype.  Next thing you know, Memphis is rolling their Caddies up and down the field and your offense is sputtering.  You poop out a 30+ point win and make all kinds of excuses as to why your team didn't play well.  But, none of them have to do with coaching/preparation, in typical Nutt fan fashion.

Everyone else in the world can see the difference in dominating Virginia Tech in the first game of the season and then having a mini letdown against FIU the next and stuggling for 3 quarters in the first game of your season against a mid to bottom level Conference USA team.  Why can't you?

[donewithdale]

No, but that's how Nutt run teams operate.  Spectacular against the #1 team in the nation, lose to Vandy, lose to South Carolina, play horrible against Memphis, beat #15 LSU, beat MSU 45-0, beat UAB by 20, lose to Auburn by 14.

If you can't acknowledge that maybe Alabama was in letdown mode after their first game of the season, it will prove even more that you are completely incapable of being objective.

Your game with Memphis was your first.  Your first of the season as a top 10 team.  Your first chance to prove yourself as worthy of that ranking and worthy of the hype.  Next thing you know, Memphis is rolling their Caddies up and down the field and your offense is sputtering.  You poop out a 30+ point win and make all kinds of excuses as to why your team didn't play well.  But, none of them have to do with coaching/preparation, in typical Nutt fan fashion.

Everyone else in the world can see the difference in dominating Virginia Tech in the first game of the season and then having a mini letdown against FIU the next and stuggling for 3 quarters in the first game of your season against a mid to bottom level Conference USA team.  Why can't you?

He doesn't want to see it.  Would you?

bruiser and bydamn prefer to compare their situation to two programs led by coaches who have proven on multiple occassions that they are capable of coaching teams to championships and BCS bowl wins in the two toughest conferences.  They think we should judge Nutt and his team to Saban and Mack Brown's teams and give Nutt the same benefit of the doubt.  Delusional.

[rebelbruiser]

He doesn't want to see it.  Would you?

bruiser and bydamn prefer to compare their situation to two programs led by coaches who have proven on multiple occassions that they are capable of coaching teams to championships and BCS bowl wins in the two toughest conferences.  They think we should judge Nutt and his team to Saban and Mack Brown's teams and give Nutt the same benefit of the doubt.  Delusional.

That's really not a fair comparison.  Mack Brown never took a team to a BCS bowl until he got to Texas.  During a 10 year stint at North Carolina, he was 69-46-1 (40-35-1 ACC).  He took his teams to 6 bowl bids (took Texas job before coaching in the final bowl game).  Of those 6 bowl games, he had 3 Gator Bowls and 3 non-NYD bowls.  Even at Texas, he didn't get his first BCS bowl bid until his 7th season.

Nick Saban never took a team to a BCS bowl until he got to LSU.  He spent 5 years at Michigan State going 34-24-1 (23-16-1 Big 10).  His teams earned bowl bids in 4 of those 5 years, but his teams never won more than 7 games until his final season when the team went 9-2, earning a Citrus Bowl bid.  Saban didn't earn his first BCS bowl game bid until his 2nd season at LSU.

I'm not saying Nutt is in the same league with Saban and Brown, but I am saying that even those coaches didn't reach the pinnacle of their profession (BCS games) until they were able to land jobs at elite programs (Texas, LSU, Alabama).

Michigan State and North Carolina are more comparable to Arkansas, and even Mack Brown and Nick Saban couldn't earn a BCS bid at those two schools.

Point being, the reason you believe those coaches have proven they can get it done is because they've proven they could get it done at programs that have significant built in advantages over their competition.  Neither was able to get it done in large fashion at mid-level programs.

[donewithdale]

That's really not a fair comparison.  Mack Brown never took a team to a BCS bowl until he got to Texas.  During a 10 year stint at North Carolina, he was 69-46-1 (40-35-1 ACC).  He took his teams to 6 bowl bids (took Texas job before coaching in the final bowl game).  Of those 6 bowl games, he had 3 Gator Bowls and 3 non-NYD bowls.  Even at Texas, he didn't get his first BCS bowl bid until his 7th season.

Nick Saban never took a team to a BCS bowl until he got to LSU.  He spent 5 years at Michigan State going 34-24-1 (23-16-1 Big 10).  His teams earned bowl bids in 4 of those 5 years, but his teams never won more than 7 games until his final season when the team went 9-2, earning a Citrus Bowl bid.  Saban didn't earn his first BCS bowl game bid until his 2nd season at LSU.

I'm not saying Nutt is in the same league with Saban and Brown, but I am saying that even those coaches didn't reach the pinnacle of their profession (BCS games) until they were able to land jobs at elite programs (Texas, LSU, Alabama).

Michigan State and North Carolina are more comparable to Arkansas, and even Mack Brown and Nick Saban couldn't earn a BCS bid at those two schools.

Point being, the reason you believe those coaches have proven they can get it done is because they've proven they could get it done at programs that have significant built in advantages over their competition.  Neither was able to get it done in large fashion at mid-level programs.

??  Sorry, I'm dizzy from the spin. 

Your buddy brought up Texas and Bama.  You now want to say that isn't fair.  I think you are almost arguing with yourself.

Yes Mack Brown and Nick Saban have proven their worth at Texas and Bama and LSU.  That is why when their teams struggle for a half or less against inferior competition for one week, they get the benefit of the doubt as we know that it is the exception whereas, based on 11+ seasons of experience with Nutt, we know that the Ole Miss performance vs Memphis is the norm for your head coach.

[Hawg Balling]

Do you honestly think we played our best against Memphis?  I don't, and I don't think anyone else does either, and that's the point. 

You need to go ahead and get used to the Nutt's philosophy/tendency to play up or down to the level of competition.  Nutt lost to Kentucky and Vanderbilt in Fayetteville and almost lost to Tennessee Chattanooga in Little Rock, only to beat Texas in Austin, LSU in Baton Rouge, and Florida in Gainesville.  This is a trend, not a coincidence. 

[rebelbruiser]

??  Sorry, I'm dizzy from the spin. 

Your buddy brought up Texas and Bama.  You now want to say that isn't fair.  I think you are almost arguing with yourself.

Yes Mack Brown and Nick Saban have proven their worth at Texas and Bama and LSU.  That is why when their teams struggle for a half or less against inferior competition for one week, they get the benefit of the doubt as we know that it is the exception whereas, based on 11+ seasons of experience with Nutt, we know that the Ole Miss performance vs Memphis is the norm for your head coach.

My point was that the main difference between Brown and Saban's results and Nutt's results are the jobs they've had, not their ability to get a team ready.

Even at those big jobs, Brown and Saban still have games where their team doesn't show up or plays below it's ability for a half or a whole game.

See Tulane last year for Alabama, FIU this year, La.-Monroe 2 years ago, UAB while Saban was at LSU.

Whether or not you want to admit it, it's stupid to judge a coach or team based on one poor half of football.  If we don't finish in the Top 5 or Top 10, it'll be because we simply aren't that good of a team, not because we were unprepared.

In my opinion, we're a Top 15 team that will go 9-3, maybe 10-2 this fall.  I think we're slightly overrated at the moment, and I don't expect us to go 12-1 to maintain a Top 5 ranking.  It's not because of coaching though.  It's because we're not as deep as a team like Texas or Alabama, and that's where the program status comes in.

Mack Brown and Nick Saban never had great depth at UNC and Michigan State, at least not like they have at Texas and Alabama, and the main difference there for those two coaches is the program.  Brown and Saban are both good coaches, as evidenced by the fact that weaker coaches have held those positions and not had that kind of success, but the separation between just being a good coach and being considered a great coach with major accomplishments is the program.

[donewithdale]

My point was that the main difference between Brown and Saban's results and Nutt's results are the jobs they've had, not their ability to get a team ready.

Even at those big jobs, Brown and Saban still have games where their team doesn't show up or plays below it's ability for a half or a whole game.

See Tulane last year for Alabama, FIU this year, La.-Monroe 2 years ago, UAB while Saban was at LSU.

Whether or not you want to admit it, it's stupid to judge a coach or team based on one poor half of football.  If we don't finish in the Top 5 or Top 10, it'll be because we simply aren't that good of a team, not because we were unprepared.

In my opinion, we're a Top 15 team that will go 9-3, maybe 10-2 this fall.  I think we're slightly overrated at the moment, and I don't expect us to go 12-1 to maintain a Top 5 ranking.  It's not because of coaching though.  It's because we're not as deep as a team like Texas or Alabama, and that's where the program status comes in.

Mack Brown and Nick Saban never had great depth at UNC and Michigan State, at least not like they have at Texas and Alabama, and the main difference there for those two coaches is the program.  Brown and Saban are both good coaches, as evidenced by the fact that weaker coaches have held those positions and not had that kind of success, but the separation between just being a good coach and being considered a great coach with major accomplishments is the program.

I didn't judge Ole Miss on one poor half.  I judged them on over 3 poor qtr's.

I see you are still trying to change the discussion to UNC and Michigan St.  The comparison by your fellow fan was to Bama and Texas.  Saban and Brown haven't been at Mich St and UNC in many years.  Bama with Saban coaching them, and through Saban's accomplishments at another program with great resources LSU, and Texas with Brown coaching them have earned the respect and benefit of the doubt.  Watching Nutt for 11+ seasons has not earned that same respect for Nutt. 

Now I'm sure you will alter your theory to something else, like you do in most every discussion, and try and take this away from the fact your fellow Ole Miss fan missed badly with his attempt at making a point.  You have realized that after first trying to help him. 

[rebelbruiser]

I didn't judge Ole Miss on one poor half.  I judged them on over 3 poor qtr's.

I see you are still trying to change the discussion to UNC and Michigan St.  The comparison by your fellow fan was to Bama and Texas.  Saban and Brown haven't been at Mich St and UNC in many years.  Bama with Saban coaching them, and through Saban's accomplishments at another program with great resources LSU, and Texas with Brown coaching them have earned the respect and benefit of the doubt.  Watching Nutt for 11+ seasons has not earned that same respect for Nutt. 

Now I'm sure you will alter your theory to something else, like you do in most every discussion, and try and take this away from the fact your fellow Ole Miss fan missed badly with his attempt at making a point.  You have realized that after first trying to help him.

No, you judged us on one poor half.  In the first quarter, we scored on our only two possessions, and we held a 10-0 lead, outgaining Memphis 81-37.  The 2nd and 3rd quarter were weak (2 quarters = 1 half).  We outscored Memphis 38-7 in the 1st and 4th quarters combined.

We came out of the gates firing, then we hit a lull, and we closed with a bang.

And I don't disagree with your point about Texas and Alabama.  I just say that the argument would be better suited to say that they will get the benefit of the doubt because of the program and their depth, not the coach.

However, my point still stands that it's stupid to write off a team based off a poor half, 3 quarters, or even a poor game, especially if that team wins.

If you want to say that our recruiting hasn't been solid enough to give us the depth to be able to compete like Texas and Alabama over a 12 game season, then you'd have a more valid argument.  Using a poor start in a game we eventually won by 31 is not a good argument.

By the way, Alabama only led FIU 20-14 late in the 3rd quarter.  They outscored FIU 20-0 over the final 20 minutes of the game to make the score look more respectable, much like we outscored Memphis 28-7 over the final 15 minutes to make the score look more respectable.  Point being, Alabama had a weak 3 quarters before pulling away, not that it makes a difference.

[The Hogfather]

We outscored Memphis 38-7 in the 1st and 4th quarters combined.

So?

Excuses, excuses....

[The Hogfather]

Point being, Alabama had a weak 3 quarters before pulling away, not that it makes a difference.

And the week before, they dominated a top 10 team, at a neutral site.

Do something like that, struggle with Memphis for 3 quarters, MAYBE I'd let it slide (although, knowing Nutt's tendencies, it'd be hard to let it slide).

[rebelbruiser]

So?

Excuses, excuses....

He said 3 quarters of bad football.  I was showing him he was wrong.  No excuses.  It was 2 quarters of weak football, or one half.

[rebelbruiser]

And the week before, they dominated a top 10 team, at a neutral site.

Do something like that, struggle with Memphis for 3 quarters, MAYBE I'd let it slide (although, knowing Nutt's tendencies, it'd be hard to let it slide).

Which just goes to prove my point.  How one team plays one week (struggle with FIU for 3 quarters before putting it away), doesn't necessarily tell you how they will play or played another week (beating Va. Tech by 10).

Now, do you think what you saw from us against Memphis was the best football our team is capable of playing?  If you think that, then go ahead and write us off.

I know it wasn't our best football, which is why I'm not that concerned about it.  You don't have to bring your A game every week.  See Alabama-FIU.  You just have to bring it when you play better opponents, and you have to bring enough of a game to beat your lesser opponents.  See Alabama last year over Tulane by two special teams TDs 20-6.

[donewithdale]

Which just goes to prove my point.  How one team plays one week (struggle with FIU for 3 quarters before putting it away), doesn't necessarily tell you how they will play or played another week (beating Va. Tech by 10).

Now, do you think what you saw from us against Memphis was the best football our team is capable of playing?  If you think that, then go ahead and write us off.

I know it wasn't our best football, which is why I'm not that concerned about it.  You don't have to bring your A game every week.  See Alabama-FIU.  You just have to bring it when you play better opponents, and you have to bring enough of a game to beat your lesser opponents.  See Alabama last year over Tulane by two special teams TDs 20-6.

You can go back to 92 Bama if you want.  This is Bama's m o.  They have always been a program built on defense, field position and conservative physical offenses and have had numerous close games with their best teams vs lessor opponents.  But they are Bama and you are Ole Miss coached by Nutt.  This is the part you don't want to admit.  That absolutely was not the best Ole Miss is capable of playing vs Memphis.  But that was a typical coaching effort by Nutt and a gameplan that was 100% Nutt down to the offensive plays being called.

Again I am sure how you will tell us we are wrong even though you have barely more than a season with him.  And I'm not sure why you are still posting.  You have already agreed Ole Miss is overrated.  You just don't want to admit part of the reason is because of coaching. 

[The Hogfather]

I was showing him he was wrong.

No, you were showing him why YOU THINK he is wrong.  Also, your attitude is so Nutt, it is not even funny.

"We came out with a bang, hit a lull for 3 quarters and then finished with a bang."

Here is Memphis' 4th Q:

1st Possession:  They went for it on Ole Miss' 43 and didn't get it= turnover on downs

2nd Possession:  They drove 80 yards for a TD

3rd Possession:  They fumbled on their own 25 and Miss recovered on Memphis' 17 yardline.

4th Possession:  Back-up QB in for Memphis---Turnover on downs with a 15 yard penalty tacked on.  Miss starts at Memphis' 33.

So, basically, Memphis shot themselves in the foot over and over and over in the 4th, except for that one, solid drive.  It wasn't like Mississippi "turned it on" or anything.

You keep living in that dream world, bruiser.

[mckinneyhog5]

Which just goes to prove my point.  How one team plays one week (struggle with FIU for 3 quarters before putting it away), doesn't necessarily tell you how they will play or played another week (beating Va. Tech by 10).

Now, do you think what you saw from us against Memphis was the best football our team is capable of playing?  If you think that, then go ahead and write us off.

I know it wasn't our best football, which is why I'm not that concerned about it.  You don't have to bring your A game every week.  See Alabama-FIU.  You just have to bring it when you play better opponents, and you have to bring enough of a game to beat your lesser opponents.  See Alabama last year over Tulane by two special teams TDs 20-6.

IMHO the ONLY reason you are here is IF Ole Piss has a great season, you will be here to rub it in peoples face.  IF they FAIL miserably this year YOU disappear like a fart in the wind.  I'm banking on the latter happening.  Or you could have a so-so season and choose to come back here and provide the excuses that we heard from Nutt over the past ten years.  Bottom line whatever your over here selling, we aint buyin!  Been there done that!

[The Hogfather]

Or you could have a so-so season and choose to come back here and provide the excuses that we heard from Nutt over the past ten years. 

This is my guess.  He's alredy been doing it for months now.  He's getting almost as good as Nutt at making up BS excuses.  By the end of the year, he will probably be right up there with Nutt in that department.