Hawgon, EastexHawg, Jeff Anderson

[Redhogs]

I was waiting for one of Wilson's multi-personality posts.  And this one is right on the money.  For now.

So Until next week...







Juuuuuuuust kidding.

Spot on..Wilson can jump back and fourth as he has done the past few weeks, but seriously, I get it, this is a hard pill to swallow regarding our beloved football program. I love the school, have several family members who have graduated from it, but we just can't sit by anymore and watch a totally incompetent person continue to pile drive this once proud program into the ground. Words are words, results are results. When I watch the pride taken by other teams and fans on Sat. and then watch us, it literally makes me sick.

[PonderinHog]

A guy walks into a bar and angrily proclaims, "All darksiders are arseholes!"

A guy at the end of the bar shouts, "Hey, I resent that!"

First guy asks, "Why, are you a darksider?"

Second guy says,"No, I'm an arsehole!"

[Boss Hog in the Arkansas]

I gave him a fair chance until year three. I changed my mind after that year, in spite of the LSU and bowl win. I am of the theory that by year three one can tell if a coach is going to work or not, with some notable exceptions.

Hoenstly it doesn't even take that long. the progress from year 1 to year 2 (or lack thereof) tells you everything you need to know. the team should be much improved by week 6 of year 2, or at least show enough improvements that the positive trajectory of the program can easily be identified

[Ex-Trumpet]

A guy walks into a bar and angrily proclaims, "All darksiders are arseholes!"

A guy at the end of the bar shouts, "Hey, I resent that!"

First guy asks, "Why, are you a darksider?"

Second guy says,"No, I'm an arsehole!"

Bant.

[Mulberry Squeezins]

Someone saying Bielema was a bad hire five years ago is akin to taking a stab in the dark.  What was the basis for such a prediction?  His past record? He won a couple of Big 10 Championships and he had Wisconsin moving forward on the heels of a legendary head coach.  Not liking someones philosophy on x' s and o's doesn't make them a savant picking coaches. Up until last season, our program was progressing, so the first indication that something was wrong  would have been 2016.   I don't care who you are, there no way anyone can make a knowledgeable assessment until a coach has the players that he's recruited in place as upperclassmen filling up the two deep, which would have been 2016. So yeah, if you want to give some guys credit for being right when we made the hire, fine. But don't make it more than it was, a great guess.

[depressed_fan]

Well, I do know I moderated based on my own biases.

and would you agree, as we sit here today sir, that's not a very good way to moderate?

[HognotinMemphis]

I was waiting for one of Wilson's multi-personality posts.  And this one is right on the money.  For now.

So Until next week...







Juuuuuuuust kidding.

I was waiting on it as well. Thought we would get it yesterday.

[hawgon]

Someone saying Bielema was a bad hire five years ago is akin to taking a stab in the dark.  What was the basis for such a prediction?   He won a couple of Big 10 Championships and he had Wisconsin moving forward on the heels of a legendary head coach.  Not liking someones philosophy on x' s and o's doesn't make them a savant picking coaches. Up until last season, our program was progressing, so the first indication that something was wrong  would have been 2016.   I don't care who you are, there no way anyone can make a knowledgeable assessment until a coach has the players that he's recruited in place as upperclassmen filling up the two deep, which would have been 2016. So yeah, if you want to give some guys credit for being right when we made the hire, fine. But don't make it more than it was, a great guess.

Because he ran a system that was not only archaic already in college football but that one would be hard pressed to find A SINGLE significant high school program within 300 miles of campus running.  Further, it was easy to see that he had gotten the bulk of his wins against inferior competition and his questionable game decisions were well documented already.

The amount of cognitive dissonance required to believe that he was a good hire can only be explained by a fanbase that was hungry for anything positive after a year and a half of trauma.  I remember threads on this very board making fun on Big 10 football with Wisconsin being the main program mentioned where people were thanking their lucky stars that we didn't run that sort of offense.  Then a couple years later these very same people were on here screaming to the world that Bert was a great hire.

Unbelievable...

[HognotinMemphis]

It was a weird deal from the get go. Why does the head coach at Wisconsin, who just went to the Rose Bowl 3 years in a row, make a lateral move to take the Arkansas job, a proven tough place to coach? Especially knowing the state of high school football in Ark vs high school football in Wisconsin and fact that Wisconsin has much more population and Wisconsin is only P5 program in that state.

Weird, weird deal all the way around. Should have set off warning signs immediately.

[Mulberry Squeezins]

If you're suggesting that the offense has been the problem,  you might want to give that a re think.

[hawgon]

If you're suggesting that the offense has been the problem,  you might want to give that a re think.

Uh...in case you haven't noticed, pretty much no one in college football wins with defense anymore.  That is another big cog in Bielema's outdated thinking.  You have to keep the peddle to the metal and outscore people. Regardless of how productive our offense has been at times, we've never consistently even tried to do that because it is t the head guy's philosophy.

[Mulberry Squeezins]

It was a weird deal from the get go. Why does the head coach at Wisconsin, who just went to the Rose Bowl 3 years in a row, make a lateral move to take the Arkansas job, a proven tough place to coach? Especially knowing the state of high school football in Ark vs high school football in Wisconsin and fact that Wisconsin has much more population yes Wisconsin is only P5 program in that state.

Weird, weird deal all the way around. Should have set off warning signs immediately.

Possibly. But my ability to muddle through that is limited at best. It's easy to say now but my two guys were Gundy and Franklin. I have a pretty good memory and I know for a fact that one if the guys in Wilsons list up top wanted nothing to do with Franklin,  so take it for what that's worth.

[hogcard1964]

If the OP is really looking to set things straight, he'll start by kicking to the curb the losers who made it their mission to ostracize anyone clear-minded enough to see the fraud for what it has been long before now.

Like that'll happen.

I was banned twice.  One was justified.  But I've never had a problem with Wilson.  He's always been very nice.

But there was a pretty good number of us that knew what we were getting.  I was more pissed with the group that kept preaching to "give him two more years", "he's going to need 3 years", "he's going to need 4 years", "5 years", "as soon as he gets this coach, things will improve", "as soon as he has this foundation in place for stability" .. That shart was insane.

[hawgon]

Gundy would have come back then.

[Corkscrew Johnson]

I owe each of you an apology, an attaboy, an acknowledgement, whatever you want to call it. Likely a few other posters as well.

Five years ago you trashed the hiring of Bret Bielema, and I ridiculed you for it. Moderated your posts. Issued a few bans. I wanted the Bielema hire to work, and I purposely looked over the fact that the hire was misplaced; good resume, bad fit. Bielema's style of offense can work at places like Wisconsin, Iowa, and Nebraska - but not in the SEC, certainly not at Arkansas with him at the helm. I didn't want to admit it at the time, but it certainly looks like the spread concepts of Petrino, Leach, Briles, etc. gives us the better chance of success. We don't have the recruiting base or the national profile to sign enough athletes to make a more traditional approach work.

As for Jeff Long, I missed the boat on him as well. Great marketer. Very good bean counter. Lousy at negotiating coaching buyouts. I hope his next job is all that he wants it to be, I hope he gets it soon, and I hope his successor has Arkansas roots.

I'm tired of hearing Bielema's "style of offense" won't work here.  Any style of offense will work, if executed properly with the right personnel.  Bielema's problem has been one of recruiting, development, and execution. 

[hawgon]

I'm tired of hearing Bielema's "style of offense" won't work here.  Any style of offense will work, if executed properly with the right personnel.  Bielema's problem has been one of recruiting, development, and execution.

You're right to a degree.  The wins have been there for the taking but the margin for error is smaller, requiring a smarter and better coach.  And smart game management is not Bert's strong suit.

[Steef]

and would you agree, as we sit here today sir, that's not a very good way to moderate?

How many times does a person have to say 'sorry'?

Did you read the OP?

[Redhogs]

Gundy would have come back then.

Don't know if he would have been the answer, but yes, he openly wanted the job. Him and Pickens were having big problems....

[Mulberry Squeezins]

 
My ability to muddle through the why's a successful coach would make a lateral move is limited at best. It's easy to say now but my two guys were Gundy and Franklin. I have a pretty good memory and I know for a fact that one if the guys in Wilsons list up top wanted nothing to do with Franklin,  so take it for what that's worth.


Last year was the first inclination of regression, except for the D, and Bielema made what we all believed was the right move there.  The first red flag for me was seeing the OL REGRESS. The OL is suppose to be BB'S. forte. Then  blowing the Mizzou game, and the bowl game collapse. Finally,  seeing the OL regress for the 2nd straight year.  I'm just saying giving someone credit for being right on the hire, when everything on paper said it was a homerun?  Meh

[HognotinMemphis]

You're right to a degree.  The wins have been there for the taking but the margin for error is smaller, requiring a smarter and better coach.  And smart game management is not Bert's strong suit.

Yeah, how about 3 OT losses to same program in past 4 years for starters.

[HognotinMemphis]

Yes!  Welcome.  Cheers!

Yes!  Welcome.  Here's to you...

Miss me some Jerry Reed and some Glen. Glen looking pretty youthful there in jorts and 1970's tube socks. Both gone now. Jerry was so good in movies with Burt Reynolds...Gator and Smokey. Love his song, Amos Moses. Pardon my nostalgia episode. Getting older.

Ok, back to your regularly scheduled programming.

[Steef]

You seem defensive.

You're welcome to perceive it however you wish.

But I don't much care for people who pile on, to someone who's in the middle of an apology. It's like they're saying, "Apologize some more! That's not enough!"

Which is REALLY tacky.

I also don't completely agree with Wilson's apology. A lot of the bans/moderations he dispensed were VERY justified.

But he has to do what he has to do.

[HognotinMemphis]

Now you seem defensive AND upset.

See, here's what happens often around here... you're just itching to go down this familiar road again -

People get upset with what they see out of the program, and actually call it what it is.
Other people get upset with those people, and attack the people with the audacity to actually call a spade a spade.

Lol.

[Atlhogfan1]

I'm tired of hearing Bielema's "style of offense" won't work here.  Any style of offense will work, if executed properly with the right personnel.  Bielema's problem has been one of recruiting, development, and execution.

True.  Bielema has failed to implement the system he intended to at the start. It has badly gotten away from him to where we are lost. 

[TheEnemy]

I am trying to get away from "kicking people to the curb."

Well let's just start a new day in which all opinions, ideas, rants, and questions are welcomed as long as they are civil and M.H.G.A.

We don't need no moderation
We don't need no thought control
Hey moderator
Leave those posters alone!

[Steef]

Now you seem defensive AND upset.

See, here's what happens often around here... you're just itching to go down this familiar road again -

People get upset with what they see out of the program, and actually call it what it is.
Other people get upset with those people, and attack the people with the audacity to actually call a spade a spade.

You asked. I answered.

Again, perceive it as you wish.

[Atlhogfan1]

and there it is.



Don't worry... I doubt any Defender of the Bert will get put on vacation since this little episode of self-reflection is likely a facade.

There is no defense. Shouldn't be any defenders left. Just ignore any who pop up. 

[Steef]

If we banned everyone who called someone a name, there wouldn't be enough left to form a message board.

We do ban people who do it consistently.

We also often just delete those posts. Especially if they get reported to us.

But if you happen to QUOTE a post in which someone calls another a name, the original offending post gets deleted and the any post it's quoted in also gets deleted.

[TheEnemy]

If we banned everyone who called someone a name, there wouldn't be enough left to form a message board.

We do ban people who do it consistently.

We also often just delete those posts. Especially if they get reported to us.

But if you happen to QUOTE a post in which someone calls another a name, the original offending post gets deleted and the any post it's quoted in also gets deleted.

There were also alot of posts deleted because it simply disagreed with moderators opinions or were considered negative.  And when posters complained about being censored they were threatened with banning.

[jkstock04]

Sybil Wilson may be apologizing for some reason. I'm not.  You and others were and still are ass holes about Bielema and to other fans. For some reason you have been allowed to troll.

No blind faith has been given. An opportunity to build was given although I said back season 1 Bielema had made a bad career decision.  I chose not to be an ass to him and not romanticize and fantasize about Petrino. 

Romanticizing about past times is about all we have left. These past few weeks I've come to the realization I would gladly take the Houston Nutt days back. The Houston Nutt days were a permanent vacation compared to this.

What's mind boggling is the past 5 years plus the beginning of this year...there has been a loud push that "all is well" and things are better than ever based mainly on blind faith, plus fluff ball offseason stories about integrity, gpa, and "being Bret Bielema."

There has honestly been a sentiment that Razorback football will be back just because "that's the way it's always been." "Down years are a part of our cycle, we will be back." "Magically" just gonna happen. Things don't just happen magically...good coaches make it happen. There was an assumption that simply because we are in year 5 it was time to turn the corner....zero other reason. Blind faith is the only real reason people thought Bielema would succeed this year...no other real evidence.

[Atlhogfan1]

Romanticizing about past times is about all we have left. These past few weeks I've come to the realization I would gladly take the Houston Nutt days back. The Houston Nutt days were a permanent vacation compared to this.

What's mind boggling is the past 5 years plus the beginning of this year...there has been a loud push that "all is well" and things are better than ever based mainly on blind faith, plus fluff ball offseason stories about integrity, gpa, and "being Bret Bielema."

There has honestly been a sentiment that Razorback football will be back just because "that's the way it's always been." "Down years are a part of our cycle, we will be back." "Magically" just gonna happen. Things don't just happen magically...good coaches make it happen. There was an assumption that simply because we are in year 5 it was time to turn the corner....zero other reason. Blind faith is the only real reason people thought Bielema would succeed this year...no other real evidence.

No on Nutt. This is much different. Nutt was set for life in the program.  We were stuck for as long as he wanted to coach. We felt trapped.  Only the buyout could cause that affect now and it is temporary at worse.  We will have change and the hope that comes with it. Didn't have it with the Nutt circus.

I don't know where this loud push was. After our defensive play last season and the last two losses should have killed the faith. I read some of the win predictions and didn't get it especially if you consider how hard we have made it on ourselves by giving up a home SEC game in seasons like this.  Brutal schedule bad oline and new defense in a program that struggles on D. 

There was hope by year 5 it would come together.  That should have dwindled though by the end of last season.  Too far away on the oline and D. Not even going to get into STs.

[EastexHawg]

How many times does a person have to say 'sorry'?

Did you read the OP?

Once is enough for me.  I accept the apology.

The only part of this discussion that baffles me is people saying those of us who knew the program was headed for a self imposed death penalty should have been more open minded.  I don't think I understand the concept.  If you are sure something is not going to work should you try to pretend, maybe even try to make yourself believe, that what you are seeing is not happening...just so you can be part of the group and everyone will like you more?

[hehawg]

bipolar

[WilsonHog]

There were also alot of posts deleted because it simply disagreed with moderators opinions or were considered negative.  And when posters complained about being censored they were threatened with banning.

Agreed. I did that. Which is why I have pretty much stepped away from moderating. I have left several posts and posters in this thread alone that I would have moderated previously.

I am going to tend to the pick 'em each week and try to contribute to Razorback discussion where I can.

[12247]

You got me too, Wilson, about 3 years ago.  Still feel I didn't deserve it but Mama never promised me all would be fair.  I was pissed for a couple of days and then got over it.  I am glad you are on here and usually I agree with you, but, of course, not when you are wrong.  I have slowed down with the BB and QB jokes though.  You didn't see the humor.

[ballz2thewall]

I'm tired of hearing Bielema's "style of offense" won't work here.  Any style of offense will work, if executed properly with the right personnel.  Bielema's problem has been one of recruiting, development, and execution.

bielema's problem is that he's lazy and ineffective when delegating. it results in the recruiting, development and execution that you mention.

it also translates into awful game planning and virtually no in-game adjustment.

[Hogs-n-Roses]

 :)Everytime I've been moderated I prolly deserved it. ;)It was at times when I lost it like Lanny did Sat. Well I may have said a few things that were a tinge off color(Dice Clay)

[GoHogs1091]

the Cleveland Browns and their 1994 Non-Dominant Number One Defense in the NFL


they were Non Dominant

I think it's important to capitalize "Non Dominant Number One"

being Number One sucks

Just because a Defense was ranked #1 doesn't make it a dominant Defense.

Cleveland lost 5 games that season.

If their 1994 Defense had been dominant, then they would not have lost 5 games.

[Boardon Hamsay]

Nice post.  Takes a lot of guts and class to post this and to self evaluate and admit that your own biases may have affected decisions you made.  We all have our own biases and viewpoints.  We all have different ways of expressing ourselves. Some express themselves with anger, some with humor, and even a few with logic and common sense.  It would seem if anything sometimes hogville admins and mods have only allowed posts that directly reflect the current feelings of beliefs of those in charge here.  Some hardheads continue to fight authority and have paid the price with suspensions and being banned.  If anything I think hogville mods and admins underestimate the intelligence of its members.  There are some extremely intelligent posters whose frustration over the contradictions and perceived hypocrisy has caused them to revolt in any variety of ways resulting in various melt downs through the years.  And I think we all understand that your role is to keep some semblance of order here but at times overzealous enforcement of the rules has resulted in dust ups and lost membership. And there is blame on both sides.  Obviously managing this crowd is no easy task. But respecting other points of view and just as importantly respecting everyone's method of expressing themselves is the most important part of this.  Some of us mess around in here and try to keep things light hearted and add some humor to this place because it is better for some of us than spewing forth venom.  And at times that has been thrwarted as hogville decided it was time to draw a line in the sand on anything but serious discussion.  I will admit that there seems to be more tolerance for brevity than there has been in the past and that is a good thing for some of us. 

Wilson you are a smart guy.  You are thoughtful and your posts carry a lot of weight here. Your opinion matters to everyone whether we ageee with it or not. We also know you love the razorbacks and support the coaches, players and university as much as anyone.  I also have watched you waffle back and forth as you are essentially a company man who will give the coaches and administration every chance to be successful before you finally throw in the towel and say enough is enough.  It is obvious you have reached that point.  It has happened to all of us, some long before you did.  Your stuggle and change of heart from week to week here has been a cause of ridicule from some as your sense of logic conflicted with your sense of loyalty.

Being a mod or admin is a thankless job. Thanks for manning up and saying what you said.  I respect that.  Some of us including me owe you and apology, too.  So I'm sorry for being a smart a$$ more than a few times.

Hopefully this coaching thing will work out the way it needs to and hopefully we can all be patient and allow the process to take place (as if we have a choice).

Well said, Pillowhead.

Sincerely,

Darrell Royal's Floating Flaming Fulminating Spectral on behalf of Scarlett Johansson's Liberally and Amply Slathered Frito Pie in c/o Frank Broyles' Exsanguinous Diaphanous Squealing Scorching Supernatant Blazing Spectral Torso presented by Ghastly Shrunken Wraithly Phantom Head of Wear Schoonover, Purveyors of fine message board shenaniganry and occasional Alma Sonic fisticuffs.

[jmb1973]

Yes, but a little bit of no, too. I came over here about a month after we opened shop because I was looking for a board where I could talk about the Razorbacks without all the negativity surrounding HDN. One thing I remember distinctly is that the motto of the board I had been a member of was "wear a cup," because it was no holds barred. This was to be a place where that kind of stuff never happened. No need to "wear a cup;" just good, civil discussion about the Razorbacks.

So asking a board member if they "need a tampon" isn't the exact kind thing you are referring to?

I've until recently really admired your posting. Your apology is nice and well written, but I prefer actions as opposed to words.

[WilsonHog]

So asking a board member if they "need a tampon" isn't the exact kind thing you are referring to?

I've until recently really admired your posting. Your apology is nice and well written, but I prefer actions as opposed to words.

Yes, it is exactly the kind of thing I am referring to.

[hogcard1964]

when our pendulum swings, it's always either one extreme or the other - from Broyles to Long was/is a fricking roller coaster ride

it's not supposed to be that way

Bielema will take the fall this time. But the cancer is still among us.

Unless Long is sent packing along with him, you're correct.

[jmb1973]

Yes, it is exactly the kind of thing I am referring to.

I think I'm just disappointed. I don't dislike you. I'm sure my disappointment is close to meaningless to you, but I equate it to having a great coach in high school and then finding out he beats his dog.

[WilsonHog]

I think I'm just disappointed. I don't dislike you. I'm sure my disappointment is close to meaningless to you, but I equate it to having a great coach in high school and then finding out he beats his dog.

Can't do any more than try to be better today than I was yesterday.

[jmb1973]

Can't do any more than try to be better today than I was yesterday.

You could go on a three day drunk and ban Lanny. It would be the stuff of legends. (Just kidding, I get your point)

[The OTR]

Can't do any more than try to be better today than I was yesterday.

None of us can.  Good way to look at things.  Not sure why everyone wants to pile on at this point.  Everyone here has posted things they wish they could take back.

[depressed_fan]

Agreed. I did that. Which is why I have pretty much stepped away from moderating. I have left several posts and posters in this thread alone that I would have moderated previously.

I am going to tend to the pick 'em each week and try to contribute to Razorback discussion where I can.

I don't really blame you WilsonHog. This board revolves around Lanny's opinion. He seems to control the moderators. I don't have proof of this but I would guess he's cut off mod's b/c they didn't agree with him on key points. At this point, everyone seems to agree Bielema won't make us happy. Whatever "happy" is to the fans.  When he lost to Toledo in year 3 in Little Rock, that's when I knew he wasn't any good. 

[Porked Tongue]

I don't have proof of this but I would guess he's cut off mod's b/c they didn't agree with him on key points.

Total drivel.

Mods and Admins are not robots.

[PonderinHog]

For all you knuckleheads that Wilson bant, just remember a prophet is never respected in his hometown.

I hope this heps you people, 'cause I like heppin' people.

[Cinco de Hogo]

Someone saying Bielema was a bad hire five years ago is akin to taking a stab in the dark.  What was the basis for such a prediction?  His past record? He won a couple of Big 10 Championships and he had Wisconsin moving forward on the heels of a legendary head coach.  Not liking someones philosophy on x' s and o's doesn't make them a savant picking coaches. Up until last season, our program was progressing, so the first indication that something was wrong  would have been 2016.   I don't care who you are, there no way anyone can make a knowledgeable assessment until a coach has the players that he's recruited in place as upperclassmen filling up the two deep, which would have been 2016. So yeah, if you want to give some guys credit for being right when we made the hire, fine. But don't make it more than it was, a great guess.

You think after all my post and getting banned, not for breaking forum rules but for arguing too much, that I was taking a stab in the dark huh?   I stated my reasons and thoughts and opinions, me and Ricepig went round and round, funny lately he hasn't even responded to anything I've posted.  I would have been fine with being wrong, I've been a steady since I joined because no matter my opinion I'm a Hog fan.  Nobody owes me an apology I'm me and their them and the world turns.  In all this I only hold a grudge against one person and it's only because he is the face of the problem and that's Jeff Long.  If I knew exactly the ones behind the scenes that orchestrated Bobby Petrino's downfall I would simply recognize Long as a yes man.  Long may have some sense of integrity but he is still just a well paid yes man.  I've almost reduced my posting to comedy because I realize that firing a coach or AD(as bad as they are) will not solve the problems that exist within the PTB.   I've made some seemingly outlandish statements about a problem that started in Dallas but I can't explain it because I don't know "WHO" and even if I did it wouldn't matter.

Wilsonhog you don't owe me anything but one thing, I miss BiggusPiggus posting his football opinions.