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The Wildcat

Started by Wildhog, September 23, 2017, 04:13:54 pm

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Wildhog

I like what they had going with Hayden in the wildcat.

It worked in 2006, not so much in 2007.  The two things that seemed to really make it work:

A) Putting someone in motion that the defense has to respect, like Felix Jones in '06.  Nutt basically stopped doing this in '07 after Gus left.
B) You have to occasionally throw the ball. 

Do those things, and I think Hayden would be hell on wheels in the wildcat.
Arkansas Razorbacks Football National Championships:
1909/1964/1965/1977

sowmonella

Defenses kind of caught up with the wildcat. It's effective when you spring it on someone out of the blue like today.
Not trying to brag or make anyone jealous but I can still fit into the same pair of socks I wore in high school.
Proud member since August 2003

 

pa_rob424

Would like to see Jordan jones as the jet man with Williams/Whaley in the backfield with Hayden in that package.

Wildhog

Quote from: sowmonella on September 23, 2017, 04:19:47 pm
Defenses kind of caught up with the wildcat. It's effective when you spring it on someone out of the blue like today.

It was somewhat effective today, and it still can be very effective in certain situations.
Arkansas Razorbacks Football National Championships:
1909/1964/1965/1977

TebowHater

September 23, 2017, 04:23:38 pm #4 Last Edit: September 23, 2017, 05:13:02 pm by TebowHater
Did you watch the 2007 LSU game? It was extremely effective then too. DMac even threw a TD to Hillis.

Wildhog

Quote from: TebowHater on September 23, 2017, 04:23:38 pm
Did you watch the 2007 LSU game? It was extremely effective then too. DMac even through a TD to Hillis.

I didn't say he stopped completely, but it was much more effective in '06.
Arkansas Razorbacks Football National Championships:
1909/1964/1965/1977

sickboy

If you ran an RPO offense with Kelley and Hayden -- heck any of our three backs... that offense would be hard to stop.

Now, that's not the type of offense you just implement in week 3. But that looks to be our future next year.

12247

Any formation that forces the defense to cover more than one area is an upgrade for us.  History shows that we only trust one WR at a time no matter the overall talent level of all the WRs are.  We started today with #1 as the only WR who could do anything correctly, REMEMBER?  I know its a broken record.  So #1 gets hurt and before the game is over, wah lah, we find a WR that can get open and catch the ball.  Unbelievable. We usually just use one RB at a time so the point is key on that RB and on #1 and you got the Hogs covered 90 percent of the time.  The Wildcat, by its nature, sort of makes the defense have to watch 3 persons at one time.  And with a real passer like Kelly in the wildcat, you could throw deep off that formation sometimes just to keep the defense wondering.                                 
                   
The hard truth is this coaching staff has very little idea what they got in the way of players, what those players can or cannot do, when to utilize the talent they have, how to twist and turn the schemes and formations to take advantage of what talent they have.  BB knows almost nothing about what needs to be done.  The wildcat should have been in our inventory from day one.  Any coach with one WR who can sort of play is like having Barney Fife as deputy with only one bullet.  WE ARE TERRIBLE DUE TO POOR COACHING.

damgoodestuffyhog

I agree that the wildcat seemed to work well for us. I respect the coaches and players for coming up with a different game plan at times. Unfortunately, we are having a lot of trouble with pocket protection, receivers getting open quickly enough, and quick QB progressions. One thing we do have is a ton of lateral speed at our skill positions and some running backs that can find creases on the line. The long TD pass that Allen threw was great, but we don't have the setup to be a traditional pocket passing team right now.

pa_rob424

If Kelley is taking the snap then you're not running Wildcat

The_Iceman

If I were a DC and Hayden was lined up at QB, I'd blitz all 11 guys. No way he could get a throw off before the blitz got to him.

WizardofhOgZ

Was happy to see the debut of the "H2-O" in the game, using both Hayden and Hammonds in a wildcat package, as I had predicted that we would see after our first game.

http://www.hogville.net/yabbse/index.php?topic=636524.0

The name comes from Hayden + Hampton ("H2") Offense.

;)

I hope and expect to see this package used and possibly expanded a little bit as the season goes along.





Junkyard Hog

The wildcat was a nice touch.

I also liked Kelley in the short yardage situations.

Basically, the Hogs pulled out all the stops.

Still not good enough to win.


 

Pecos Hog

Yes, it was effective because the Aggies weren't expecting it.   This formation makes the most of the speed that we do have on our team.     But, you do need to be able to pass from it.    Can Haydon or Hammonds reliably and accurately throw the ball a short distance?    A quick 10 yard pass to a tight end or WR in the slot after a run fake that causes the LBs to commit could be highly effective.   

buldozer

When I see the wildcat work, I can't help but think what a mistake it was to snubb Gerry Bohanan at first. Now I'm sure he isn't seriously considering the razorbacks.

WizardofhOgZ

September 24, 2017, 11:05:17 am #15 Last Edit: September 24, 2017, 11:24:15 am by WizardofhOgZ
Quote from: Junkyard Hog on September 24, 2017, 10:01:17 am
The wildcat was a nice touch.

I also liked Kelley in the short yardage situations.

Oklahoma had the "Bell-dozer" a few years ago . . . I suggest we dub Kelly in the Wildcat the "Kell-vinator".  Or, maybe, the "Cole-vinator"?

I know - enough with the "cute" names.  Just trying to have some fun . . . Sundays after a loss are crap.  One finds amusement where one can . . .

;)

IronHog

Quote from: sowmonella on September 23, 2017, 04:19:47 pm
Defenses kind of caught up with the wildcat. It's effective when you spring it on someone out of the blue like today.



They didn't catch up......McFadden was just that good a QB
Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

Hawg414

the whole point of the wildcat back in the day, or at least what made it effective, was the man in motion.  usually felix running a jet sweep.  dmac had the option of handing to felix, going one direction, or keeping it himself and going the other direction.  the 7 defenders up front had to cover two different guys going two different directions.  throw in an occasional pass from mcfadden and it was a nightmare to defend effectively.

but this wildcat we are running now (and in the 2nd year with dmac after malzahn left) is nothing more than just a direct snap to the RB.  there is no misdirection, no uncertainty of where the ball is going.  all defenders can target the lone RB, bc he's getting the snap and going directly forward with it. 

and i realize they still call it the wildcat.  i guess bc thats just the name given to direct snaps now.  but this version of wildcat is hardly similar to the original.  and nowhere near as effective.  give me hayden or hammonds, whichever is better at throwing the ball, lined up at QB.. the other as a single back, and jones running the sweep.  every time. 

WizardofhOgZ

Quote from: Hawg414 on September 24, 2017, 12:32:49 pm
the whole point of the wildcat back in the day, or at least what made it effective, was the man in motion.  usually felix running a jet sweep.  dmac had the option of handing to felix, going one direction, or keeping it himself and going the other direction.  the 7 defenders up front had to cover two different guys going two different directions.  throw in an occasional pass from mcfadden and it was a nightmare to defend effectively.

but this wildcat we are running now (and in the 2nd year with dmac after malzahn left) is nothing more than just a direct snap to the RB.  there is no misdirection, no uncertainty of where the ball is going.  all defenders can target the lone RB, bc he's getting the snap and going directly forward with it. 

and i realize they still call it the wildcat.  i guess bc thats just the name given to direct snaps now.  but this version of wildcat is hardly similar to the original.  and nowhere near as effective.  give me hayden or hammonds, whichever is better at throwing the ball, lined up at QB.. the other as a single back, and jones running the sweep.  every time.

Give it some time.  I think, as the season progresses, you will see a few more wrinkles out of it. 

I don't think it will ever be as integral as it was during the DMac days.  But if we can get 3-5 snaps a game, and they are effective - why not?  it's a creative way to get more playmakers on the field.

thebignasty

The zone read out the shot gun fad that swept through college and NFL drew in no small bit off what we were doing in wildcat. Just adjusted for personnel that teams actually had.

RazorPiggie

Quote from: buldozer on September 24, 2017, 10:47:13 am
When I see the wildcat work, I can't help but think what a mistake it was to snubb Gerry Bohanan at first. Now I'm sure he isn't seriously considering the razorbacks.

We snubbed him? Last I checked he has a Hog offer.

IronHog

Quote from: WizardofhOgZ on September 24, 2017, 02:37:44 pm
Give it some time.  I think, as the season progresses, you will see a few more wrinkles out of it. 

I don't think it will ever be as integral as it was during the DMac days.  But if we can get 3-5 snaps a game, and they are effective - why not?  it's a creative way to get more playmakers on the field.


It's nice on short yardage because you get an extra blocker......


Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

IronHog

Quote from: TebowHater on September 23, 2017, 04:23:38 pm
Did you watch the 2007 LSU game? It was extremely effective then too. DMac even threw a TD to Hillis.


Typical Nutt saved that for his swan song.....
Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

Silver Hog

The Wild Hog, god I miss Gus.

 

ShadowTheHedgehog

We need to get a bit more creative with the wild hog - maybe have a speed and a power option in the back field. Add a speed player in motion once in a while.

I also liked the short yard packages for CK. I think we found a solution to the short yardage and goal line situations. I was surprised we did not try to run it instead of passing it in OT.


Uberanubis

Quote from: Junkyard Hog on September 24, 2017, 10:01:17 am
The wildcat was a nice touch.

I also liked Kelley in the short yardage situations.

Basically, the Hogs pulled out all the stops.

Still not good enough to win.



thats the most heart breaking thing about it. we put it all out there and it wasn't good enough. we don't have any more surprises for any one.
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Tarheelhawg

Quote from: ShadowTheHedgehog on September 24, 2017, 08:44:33 pm
We need to get a bit more creative with the wild hog - maybe have a speed and a power option in the back field. Add a speed player in motion once in a while.

I also liked the short yard packages for CK. I think we found a solution to the short yardage and goal line situations. I was surprised we did not try to run it instead of passing it in OT.


Yes! More of the Wildcat with Hayden ; also, CK  with a run/pass option in short yardage which led to the TD pass to David Williams. Pick your poison.

ShadowTheHedgehog

Quote from: Tarheelhawg on September 24, 2017, 09:08:09 pm
Yes! More of the Wildcat with Hayden ; also, CK  with a run/pass option in short yardage which led to the TD pass to David Williams. Pick your poison.

Maybe also put more focus on TE passes (Kind of New Orleans when Graham was there) that will make it easier on the WRs. I would also like to see some quick passes to TJ. Try to get consistently 3-6 yards.


12247

Though Cole Kelley is not D-mac, hes likely a better passer and I believe he could handle the Wild Hog.  You are not limited in what you can do with this except for having so many options that the D would finally show up in the back field. 

I want the name, COLECOCKER, for our version of the Belldozer.


Tarheelhawg

Offense was more creative against AM which is promising and could be explosive with so many young impact players.  Hopefully the o-line and defense catch up. 

IMABIELEMA

Quote from: sowmonella on September 23, 2017, 04:19:47 pm
Defenses kind of caught up with the wildcat. It's effective when you spring it on someone out of the blue like today.

There's nothing to "catch" up to.  Wildcat is simply removing the QB from the backfield and adding another blocker in the backfield.  If the OL and FB's make their blocks then the RB will get great yardage.  It's that simple.  You add some wrinkles to it in order to keep defenses honest.  Just watch Auburn & LSU use it in the red zone against us.  It's a jumbo package that works in third and short or redzone situations.

theFlyingHog

Quote from: Ward on September 24, 2017, 09:21:30 pm

what makes it effective is the extra blocker
What makes it effective is it's not what the D prepared for and they have no clue what is about to happen.

Josh Goforth

Quote from: pa_rob424 on September 23, 2017, 04:59:30 pm
If Kelley is taking the snap then you're not running Wildcat
when he was in the were just straight gun with a TE. Hayden was in true wildcat with the tackle over unbalanced. Opened up some monster running lanes.

Bigmac2

The read option with Kelly would be interesting. He may not have the speed of Tim Tebow or Cam Newton however he could be effective in it. It may be an antiquated system but I believe the personnel would be there.