chilly today...hot tamale

[HOGLEG]

Mitch Mustain couldn't carry Kodi Burn's jock strap! And yes I've seen both of them play numerous times.    Seriously, Mustain is a pretty good HS QB. But to hear some of you guys talk, you would think that he's the best to ever come out of AR. Personally, If he doesn't want to be a Razorback I could care less. After this year we will have a QB who has a year of SEC football seasoning. Would you honestly want to throw a true freshman in there and start all over again. I, for one, don't want to wait 2 years to have a winning record. Kodi Burns is the one we need to worry about. He's got the same kind of gun, plenty of accuracy, and is more athletic right now. But more importantly, he will be graduating at the perfect time to be a backup for a while before being thrown into the fire. Mustain is good this recruiting year. Burns will be just as good the following year. I'm just kind of tired of everyone falling all over this kid. Newsflash, this KID (Mustain) will not be able to instantly turn us into national contenders. Hell, as good as Matt was, he couldn't do it with this coaching staff. Further more, If it takes losing Mustain to get Nutt fired, I'm all for it. I would personally buy his plane ticket to Michigan. 'Nuff said! Smite away

[Hoggysoprano]

Mitch Mustain couldn't carry Kodi Burn's jock strap! And yes I've seen both of them play numerous times. Seriously, Mustain is a pretty good HS QB. But to hear some of you guys talk, you would think that he's the best to ever come out of AR. Personally, If he doesn't want to be a Razorback I could care less. After this year we will have a QB who has a year of SEC football seasoning. Would you honestly want to throw a true freshman in there and start all over again. I, for one, don't want to wait 2 years to have a winning record. Kodi Burns is the one we need to worry about. He's got the same kind of gun, plenty of accuracy, and is more athletic right now. But more importantly, he will be graduating at the perfect time to be a backup for a while before being thrown into the fire. Mustain is good this recruiting year. Burns will be just as good the following year. I'm just kind of tired of everyone falling all over this kid. Newsflash, this KID (Mustain) will not be able to instantly turn us into national contenders. Hell, as good as Matt was, he couldn't do it with this coaching staff. Further more, If it takes losing Mustain to get Nutt fired, I'm all for it. I would personally buy his plane ticket to Michigan. 'Nuff said! Smite away

Matt didn't have a great arm, but you are right about one thing, noway Mustain will ever be as good a QB as Matt. Not even close.

[Amityvillehogger]

Thank you.  I'm glad I'm not the only one that thinks Mitch Mustain isn't the savior.  Kodi is definitely more athletic, and i for one would rather have him than Mustain and his mom.  Everyone has been making him out to be the savior of the program from the very start.  Saying if we don't get him than Nutt should be fired.  Oh well if we don't.  Good if we do.  And he definitely will never be as good as Matt Jones.  Yeah he hasn't gotten here yet, but MJ left a pretty huge footprint in the sand on our program.  Nevertheless, GO HOGS!

[pioneerhog]

There isn't one single QB that can come in here and put us in the BCS. We need improvement at other positions, not just QB. Yeah getting a top notch QB will be a start, it will not be the answer. Where does that answer lay? I think Nutt has been trying to figure that out for 8 years now. 

[Theolesnort]

 Only problem, we have a Kodi Burns type already on campas in RJ but he is not coming out of his shell and coaches will soon lose patience if he doesn't make his move and soon.

[WindyCityHog]

Whether Mitch Mustain actually reaches his "potential" isn't really the question here.....It's his "potential" and perception that has the Hog world taking notice.....IF Mustain signs elsewhere, I don't see how Nutt could survive that scenario.  HDN would never be able to live that down....Hog fans would go apecrap.

[pioneerhog]

Whether Mitch Mustain actually reaches his "potential" isn't really the question here.....It's his "potential" and perception that has the Hog world taking notice.....IF Mustain signs elsewhere, I don't see how Nutt could survive that scenario. HDN would never be able to live that down....Hog fans would go apecrap.

Your right Windy. I am not saying a coach deserves to be fired for not getting a recruit, but it will be hard for the fans to forget, it will be even harder if he goes somewhere and is successful.

[Theolesnort]

 That is pretty much gospel truth Windy. This is reminding me of Keith Jackson and Lou Holtz just before he had burn out after not landing him.

[WindyCityHog]

Throw out the "and successful" part...That would just be a further aggravation.  The top-ranked recruit in the state going elsewhere?.....and he's in HDN's own backyard?  A PR disaster...

[Amityvillehogger]

This is true Windy

[HOGLEG]

Only problem, we have a Kodi Burns type already on campas in RJ but he is not coming out of his shell and coaches will soon lose patience if he doesn't make his move and soon.

Robery Johnson was rated the 7th best dual-threat QB in the country in '03. He was a four star recruit. He hasn't exactly been given the opportunity to get any experience. It was hard to put a guy like that in when you've got superman making a late game comeback to save Nutt's ass. It takes time to develop a quality QB in the SEC. There are very, very few QB's that can step in as true freshman with the poise of a Matt Jones and be impact players. If I remember right, even Eli (of the prestigious Manning family...insert sarcasm) redshirted.

[Theolesnort]

Hogleg, if RJ aserts himself from the first day of fall practice and puts room between himself and the rest of the pact then this would be the best case scenario for Ark. The problem I see is that he should have done that in the spring because with his talent and experience advantage there should have been no question who the main man was.

[Theolesnort]

Ps he will be a redshirt sophmore this fall. He needs to asert himself not only as a qb but as a team leader.

[Theolesnort]

Actually I think that his mom is in our camp so be careful.

[tophawg19]

if we don't get mustain nutt will have to get 1 of the top 2 from texas to cover it .
either may be just as good .remember we've only seen their JR . years how much they progress
between then and now could be a world of difference . but we really need 1 of those unless someone comes out of nowhere to set the world on fire .

[HOGLEG]

Hogleg, if RJ aserts himself from the first day of fall practice and puts room between himself and the rest of the pact then this would be the best case scenario for Ark. The problem I see is that he should have done that in the spring because with his talent and experience advantage there should have been no question who the main man was.

Well, according to Nutt... "He's ahead, He's ahead right now. He's ahead b/c of the experience he's got. But Alex is very smart, gets us in and out of the huddle, and he's very accurate. Cole Barthel, got to love his maturity. He's coming along but he hasn't been out there in a while." If I could only find a way to quote him with the same little weasley voice. But in seriousness, according to Hog50 the team already see's him as a leader. IMO  From the little I have seen of Alex Mortenson, he just doesn't have enough arm to be a top-notch QB. Barthel has good arm strength and a nice touch. But he don't even know the playbook yet. I would bet Barthel will end up at #2 this year. I think people will be missing that calm, laid-back, nonchalant attitude we had for 4 years at QB. There will be alot of growing pains while breaking in a QB with no gameday experience. But like I said before, Robert Johnson has as much talent as any of 'em out there. Let's just hope he comes along sooner than later. B/c I would hate to have to wait another year for a freshman to get a year under his belt.

[PorcineSublime]

Here is my take from another thread:

 
The Mitch Mustian deal is such a big deal because of several things.
1. Timing- we are all sick to death of mediocre seasons and are willing to pin our hopes on anything we can. The flipside to this is 
    that we are also looking for any reason to make sense of our failures, and losing the best recruit to come out of AR since Matt
    Jones gives us one.
2. Actual/perceived need- the sky is falling at the QB position. Maybe, maybe not, but we for sure don't have MATT and that makes
    us nervous.
3. Inferiorty complex- poor little us. We have some great players less than ten miles from the stadium, and we can't close the deal
    because we just, well we're just poor old AR.
4. Desire for an OC- somehow we feel that maybe we could get a package deal. Gus/Mitch, boy that makes our mouths water.

I put forth this conclusion. Whether or not the QB's play well this year will dictate where he goes or at least how we feel about. If RJ or AM has a breakout season and he chooses to go elsewhere, we will likely mouth off a little and go on. If we stink it up and the coaches don't seal the deal, a stink worthy of a Tyson plant combined with a Wayerhauser (sp?) plant will ensue. WPS. JMO. 

For what it is worth  I would welcome Mitch with open arms to the U of A family. He seems to be a good kid and to say that he is not one of the best QB prospects in the NATION is denying fact. The key word being prospect. No one knows how anyone will do in college, but he has the tools to do well.


If Mitch or his mother is reading the board here is a message for you:
We as the Razorback nation would welcome you to the fold. Since you live in Springdale, it is likely that you know that the U of A gives a quality education with a great atmosphere. If you are good enough for the NFL, they will find you here, at NW/SE/Midstate college for the blind, or anywhere else you choose to go. If you choose to go elsewhere, most of the fans will understand, but many will not. Ugly things will be said about you, your family, and even your dog. Do not for one minute think that all Razorback fans are jerks. Do understand however, that fair or not, a former Hog in this state will receive perks and second looks that could allow you to be successful beyond what you might be without the UA history. Nice thing to think about for after your NFL career. At any rate good luck, and hope to see you in 06.
                                                               A Fan,  Porcine Sublime

[HOGLEG]

This is exactly what this topic was NOT supposed to be. Some fan groveling to the Mustain clan. NO SOLICITING, please. I can't beleive someone would get on here and basically try to postscript the conversation apologizing to the Mustain family b/c everyone doesn't feel the same way you do. Now don't get me wrong. If he wants to be a Razorback I would cheer for him like I do anyone else. But to rest all my hopes of the Razorback football program on this kid just aint gonna happen. Is he good...sure. Is Kodi Burns good...sure. IMO Burns is better. If the kid or his mom can't take any kind of critism then it probably would be better for them if he went somewhere else. B/c Matt Jones could possibly be the best QB the Razorbacks have ever had and there are people that critisized him for 4 years and still do to this day. I guess I just see it a little differently. I see no reason to apologize for not caring if he comes to AR or not. We've (the state of AR) got one just as good coming out next year. And I will not be one of those fans you described as badmouthing the kid and his family if he doesn't come to AR. But if he does come I just hope it doesn't turn into the Arkansas-Brashears Family-Razorbacks if you know what I mean.

[Porkahontas]

What Mustain does might hold the key to the entire recruiting season.

If Mustain goes elsewhere, what does that tell the rest of the in-state kids? 1)It's ok to go out of state, and 2)Mustain doesn't believe the Hogs offense is good enough to showcase him for the pros. If that's the case, we're talking about the real possibility of whiffing on the Springdale kids who we really want. We're probably already going to lose LT Walker out of state. Losing the Springdale kids would mean the best recruit we'd have a chance to land in state is OL Jim Hart, who's the 5th rated player in the state right now.

If Mustain signs, we'll probably bring in who we want from Springdale, the rest of the in-state kids (except maybe Walker) will probably follow suit, and guys from out of state are liable to take notice and say to themselves "If Arkansas is good enough for one of the top 2 or 3 QB's in the nation, they're good enough for me." We're talking about the same effect Jake Christensen had on recruiting for Iowa last year. Good kids may come to play alongside Mitch if everything is the same between us and another similar school (like a Bama, a KSU, a Texas A&M), especially if the kid being recruited plays on the offensive side of the ball.

The world won't end if Mustain goes elsewhere but I think if he commits early (and all indications are that he'll commit before his senior year is underway), it'll be the momentum swing the coaching staff needs to go out and rake up on other big-time recruits.

[mikeirwin]

This is exactly what this topic was NOT supposed to be. Some fan groveling to the Mustain clan. NO SOLICITING, please. I can't believe someone would get on here and basically try to postscript the conversation apologizing to the Mustain family b/c everyone doesn't feel the same way you do. Now don't get me wrong. If he wants to be a Razorback I would cheer for him like I do anyone else. But to rest all my hopes of the Razorback football program on this kid just aint gonna happen. Is he good...sure. Is Kodi Burns good...sure. IMO Burns is better. If the kid or his mom can't take any kind of critism then it probably would be better for them if he went somewhere else. B/c Matt Jones could possibly be the best QB the Razorbacks have ever had and there are people that critisized him for 4 years and still do to this day. I guess I just see it a little differently. I see no reason to apologize for not caring if he comes to AR or not. We've (the state of AR) got one just as good coming out next year. And I will not be one of those fans you described as badmouthing the kid and his family if he doesn't come to AR. But if he does come I just hope it doesn't turn into the Arkansas-Brashears Family-Razorbacks if you know what I mean.

You may start a topic but nobody on this board controls what happens after you start it.
Some of us are just as tired of the "he ain't so hot, yadda yadda is better" posts regarding Mustain.
It has already been acknowledged that no prospect in the country is a "can't miss." But no HS QB in this state has ever drawn the kind of national attention that Mustain is currently getting. What, are all these coaches after his signature full of crap ?
Some of you guys seem to want Arkansas to continue down the same tired road with the same tired results. This school needs another run pass QB like it needs another walk on kicker.
Mustian LOOKS like the kind of QB we see playing on Saturdays for teams like USC, Oklahoma, Florida and Miami.
There's a reason why they recruit those kind of QB's and not the run/pass athlete types Arkansas goes after.
If HDN had a track record of going out of state and landing Mustain type QB's this would not be that big of a deal. An Arkansas assistant coach told me a couple of years ago that it was gonna take an NFL potential QB from inside the state to change Arkansas poor track record in recruiting quality out of state drop back passers.
Here's what he said: "If we can get one here at home and he lights it up it will show out of state kids that we want to put the ball up just like Florida and Georgia."

[tophawg19]

i agree mike . i feel like most QB recruits show me we can throw the ball like the better qb producing teams . 1st we have to get a QB who can make the throws though .

[Broken Trigger]

This is exactly what this topic was NOT supposed to be. Some fan groveling to the Mustain clan. NO SOLICITING, please. I can't believe someone would get on here and basically try to postscript the conversation apologizing to the Mustain family b/c everyone doesn't feel the same way you do. Now don't get me wrong. If he wants to be a Razorback I would cheer for him like I do anyone else. But to rest all my hopes of the Razorback football program on this kid just aint gonna happen. Is he good...sure. Is Kodi Burns good...sure. IMO Burns is better. If the kid or his mom can't take any kind of critism then it probably would be better for them if he went somewhere else. B/c Matt Jones could possibly be the best QB the Razorbacks have ever had and there are people that critisized him for 4 years and still do to this day. I guess I just see it a little differently. I see no reason to apologize for not caring if he comes to AR or not. We've (the state of AR) got one just as good coming out next year. And I will not be one of those fans you described as badmouthing the kid and his family if he doesn't come to AR. But if he does come I just hope it doesn't turn into the Arkansas-Brashears Family-Razorbacks if you know what I mean.

You may start a topic but nobody on this board controls what happens after you start it.
Some of us are just as tired of the "he ain't so hot, yadda yadda is better" posts regarding Mustain.
It has already been acknowledged that no prospect in the country is a "can't miss." But no HS QB in this state has ever drawn the kind of national attention that Mustain is currently getting. What, are all these coaches after his signature full of crap ?
Some of you guys seem to want Arkansas to continue down the same tired road with the same tired results. This school needs another run pass QB like it needs another walk on kicker.
Mustian LOOKS like the kind of QB we see playing on Saturdays for teams like USC, Oklahoma, Florida and Miami.
There's a reason why they recruit those kind of QB's and not the run/pass athlete types Arkansas goes after.
If HDN had a track record of going out of state and landing Mustain type QB's this would not be that big of a deal. An Arkansas assistant coach told me a couple of years ago that it was gonna take an NFL potential QB from inside the state to change Arkansas poor track record in recruiting quality out of state drop back passers.
Here's what he said: "If we can get one here at home and he lights it up it will show out of state kids that we want to put the ball up just like Florida and Georgia."

That is what i have been thinking for awhile myself.  Who or what says that we have to have an option style quarterback?  Actually, i think when Nutt first came here, we had more of a pass offense.  I think that is one of the big reasons we were attracted to him at Boise State.  They were putting up some pretty good passing numbers.  Of course when Matt Jones came, he was so talented as a runner, how could we not use the offense to display his great running ability.  Let's get a great passing quarterback.

[PorcineSublime]

This is exactly what this topic was NOT supposed to be. Some fan groveling to the Mustain clan. NO SOLICITING, please. I can't beleive someone would get on here and basically try to postscript the conversation apologizing to the Mustain family b/c everyone doesn't feel the same way you do. Now don't get me wrong. If he wants to be a Razorback I would cheer for him like I do anyone else. But to rest all my hopes of the Razorback football program on this kid just aint gonna happen. Is he good...sure. Is Kodi Burns good...sure. IMO Burns is better. If the kid or his mom can't take any kind of critism then it probably would be better for them if he went somewhere else. B/c Matt Jones could possibly be the best QB the Razorbacks have ever had and there are people that critisized him for 4 years and still do to this day. I guess I just see it a little differently. I see no reason to apologize for not caring if he comes to AR or not. We've (the state of AR) got one just as good coming out next year. And I will not be one of those fans you described as badmouthing the kid and his family if he doesn't come to AR. But if he does come I just hope it doesn't turn into the Arkansas-Brashears Family-Razorbacks if you know what I mean.

OK, I have been out of town a few days so no response was given until now. You say I missed the point, I say you missed my point. I think you have every right to your opinion as does anyone on here. My note to the family was meant as a show of support for what appears to be a great kid and by most accounts a great player, not as an apology for your beliefs. I know that some on here think he isn't that great, and maybe he won't be, time will tell.  But Mike put it more eloquently than I did. There are just some of us on here who think he might just turn out to be a top QB. And if you think that he is not, then that is you right as well. I just thought the kid deserved a break from the hatin'. Of course the Razorbacks will go on with or without him. It would just be nice to see him in Cardinal.WPS 

[HOGLEG]

 First of all, Who's hatin'? I gave the kid his due. I said he was good. What else do you want me to say about him. I mean not everyone is a Springdale fanatic like Mike Irwin. And before you rip into me Mike, you have stated you are personal friends w/Gus and think he should be coaching at the U of A and yadda, yadda, yadda. So maybe, just maybe, you are a little biased on your opinions. But anyhow, there are so many ways we could argue back and forth about this. Let me ask ya'll a question. If you were to trade Burns for Mustain this year, would either team be any worse off? If you are impartial and have seen both of them play, you would probably say neither team would suffer. But without all the talent Mustain has at Springdale, I wonder if he would be veiwed the same way he is now (Arkansas' savior). I think not. Here's another one for ya. For as long as Markuson has been coaching here, the knock on him is that he cannot coach the OL to pass block. So what happens to a pocket QB who doesn't have a quality OL in front of him. He ends up on his can about 5 times out of a ten play scripted scrimmage...just like Mort. did. That's why, not only AR, but alot of teams go after dual threat QB's. But to be honest, the thing that probably bothers me the most is a high school KID and HIS PARENTS letting it be known that Arkansas' offensive scheme may not be good enough for them. That Arkansas will have to change up their offense if they want "ME". Could this be more of the same type of egotistical attitude problems we had with the Brashears? I mean what happens if Robert Johnson breaks out this year and becomes the unquestionable leader of the team this year. Even if Mitch has all the talent in the world, would you want to put in a freshman QB and start all over. Or how about wait a year, then have the 'ole 1a, 1b that we've all come to love over the years. Would Mitch/his family/his loyal supporters (Mike Irwin ) sit quietly for two whole years with the reins in the hand of Robert Johnson or would he pick up and transfer? Giving the U of A a black eye nationally for not being able to hang onto and develop a bluechip QB. And then next year. What about Kodi Burns? Where does he fall into the equation? I haven't heard him questioning the style of play. He already has an offer on the table from AR too. And as I've stated before, IMO he is just as good (possibly even better). Burns could throw it around too if he played in that type offense. But he doesn't. Not because he doesn't have the talent. But b/c that is not his coaches philosophy. He wouldn't have to ride the pine as long either since he is a year younger. Meaning, more than likely, he wouldn't have a problem waiting his turn. Brashears was recruited by the Miami's and such. Was he not? So Mustain is not the first pro type QB to be recruited to AR. It's not that I want to travel down the same old road of dual threat QB's. I just don't see it as Mustian being the end to all the problems. We had 14 guys that are playing in the NFL off of the '02-'03 teams. Including (arguably) the best QB/football player to ever wear a Razorback uniform. With all that talent, how far did it take us? The best pocket passer we've had under Nutt was Clint. He was very successful also. But for one reason and one reason only. BECAUSE HE WAS OUR OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR! All that being said, I'm not trying to bash the Mitch Mustain. I just don't understand why everyone veiws him as the road to a National Championship. I guess the only way I could see ya'lls point of veiw is if he can bring in enough of the others (bluechippers) in this recruiting class to be one of the best. But I would still pick Burns over Mustain as the better football player . In closing, I would hope you guys (Mike Irwin) don't take any of my comments as a personal attack. As I am not trying to be sarcastic or ill spirited. Just a simple debate. That's the only reason I participate and enjoy this board. Intillectual debate without a bunch of name calling and such (unlike most message boards). I'll hang up and listen.

[PorcineSublime]

First of all, Who's hatin'? I gave the kid his due. I said he was good. What else do you want me to say about him. I mean not everyone is a Springdale fanatic like Mike Irwin. And before you rip into me Mike, you have stated you are personal friends w/Gus and think he should be coaching at the U of A and yadda, yadda, yadda. So maybe, just maybe, you are a little biased on your opinions. But anyhow, there are so many ways we could argue back and forth about this. Let me ask ya'll a question. If you were to trade Burns for Mustain this year, would either team be any worse off? If you are impartial and have seen both of them play, you would probably say neither team would suffer. But without all the talent Mustain has at Springdale, I wonder if he would be veiwed the same way he is now (Arkansas' savior). I think not. Here's another one for ya. For as long as Markuson has been coaching here, the knock on him is that he cannot coach the OL to pass block. So what happens to a pocket QB who doesn't have a quality OL in front of him. He ends up on his can about 5 times out of a ten play scripted scrimmage...just like Mort. did. That's why, not only AR, but alot of teams go after dual threat QB's. But to be honest, the thing that probably bothers me the most is a high school KID and HIS PARENTS letting it be known that Arkansas' offensive scheme may not be good enough for them. That Arkansas will have to change up their offense if they want "ME". Could this be more of the same type of egotistical attitude problems we had with the Brashears? I mean what happens if Robert Johnson breaks out this year and becomes the unquestionable leader of the team this year. Even if Mitch has all the talent in the world, would you want to put in a freshman QB and start all over. Or how about wait a year, then have the 'ole 1a, 1b that we've all come to love over the years. Would Mitch/his family/his loyal supporters (Mike Irwin ) sit quietly for two whole years with the reins in the hand of Robert Johnson or would he pick up and transfer? Giving the U of A a black eye nationally for not being able to hang onto and develop a bluechip QB. And then next year. What about Kodi Burns? Where does he fall into the equation? I haven't heard him questioning the style of play. He already has an offer on the table from AR too. And as I've stated before, IMO he is just as good (possibly even better). Burns could throw it around too if he played in that type offense. But he doesn't. Not because he doesn't have the talent. But b/c that is not his coaches philosophy. He wouldn't have to ride the pine as long either since he is a year younger. Meaning, more than likely, he wouldn't have a problem waiting his turn. Brashears was recruited by the Miami's and such. Was he not? So Mustain is not the first pro type QB to be recruited to AR. It's not that I want to travel down the same old road of dual threat QB's. I just don't see it as Mustian being the end to all the problems. We had 14 guys that are playing in the NFL off of the '02-'03 teams. Including (arguably) the best QB/football player to ever wear a Razorback uniform. With all that talent, how far did it take us? The best pocket passer we've had under Nutt was Clint. He was very successful also. But for one reason and one reason only. BECAUSE HE WAS OUR OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR! All that being said, I'm not trying to bash the Mitch Mustain. I just don't understand why everyone veiws him as the road to a National Championship. I guess the only way I could see ya'lls point of veiw is if he can bring in enough of the others (bluechippers) in this recruiting class to be one of the best. But I would still pick Burns over Mustain as the better football player . In closing, I would hope you guys (Mike Irwin) don't take any of my comments as a personal attack. As I am not trying to be sarcastic or ill spirited. Just a simple debate. That's the only reason I participate and enjoy this board. Intillectual debate without a bunch of name calling and such (unlike most message boards). I'll hang up and listen.

Obviously I have gotten you stirred up about this. I certainly did not mean to cause such a reaction. I too feel that any QB will only be a part of the solution. And as far your guy goes, I would have admit I know little about him. If he is as good as you say, then I would hope that the staff would close the deal on him as well. Maybe they won't both come, but if we can get one, it would help solidify a question mark postion. As for the hatin' part,guess that was overstated. I really hope you are right and RJ has a breakout season. I have carried the fight for this kid for the last two years. It would be great to be right. Bottom line is that I just get tired of the "if he doesn't commmit to us he isn't that good" crowd. Sorry that I may have included you in that. No offense taken on my end and I meant none to you. We agree on more than we disagree on and I feel we are both true Hog fans.WPS