When has Arkansas ever won on talent?. . .

[Feralhog]

I've been following the program for 30+ years and I don't ever recall Arkansas fielding teams that were loaded with talent.  Judging by recent NFL drafts, the talent level at Arkansas is as good as ever.   Razorback football, for me, has always been defined as having a handful of talent and the rest, what we lacked in talent we made up with effort.  At one time under Nutt, the effort level was pretty good, but not lately.  The 03 Florida and Auburn games are two recent examples.  A hire like Herring could pay huge dividends for this team.  A coach placing this great an emphasis on effort, could be far reaching resulting in a domino type effect that not only impacted the defense, but the rest of the team AND the fans.  In light of the pink jersey fiasco, one of my biggest concerns at this stage, is the Head Coach meddling too much in Herring's business.

[Macgyver_Hawg]

I've been following the program for 30+ years and I don't ever recall Arkansas fielding teams that were loaded with talent.  Judging by recent NFL drafts, the talent level at Arkansas is as good as ever.   Razorback football, for me, has always been defined as having a handful of talent and the rest, what we lacked in talent we made up with effort.  At one time under Nutt, the effort level was pretty good, but not lately.  The 03 Florida and Auburn games are two recent examples.  A hire like Herring could pay huge dividends for this team.  A coach placing this great an emphasis on effort, could be far reaching.  I don't think it would be too big a stretch to envision a domino type effect that not only impacted the defense, but the rest of the team AND the fans.  In light of the pink jersey fiasco, one of my biggest concerns at this stage, is the Head Coach meddling too much in Herring's business.

But we were competitive those first 20 years you started following the program.  Texas usually comes in #1 in recruiting and yet only went to it's first BCS game this past season.

[Feralhog]

I've been following the program for 30+ years and I don't ever recall Arkansas fielding teams that were loaded with talent. Judging by recent NFL drafts, the talent level at Arkansas is as good as ever. Razorback football, for me, has always been defined as having a handful of talent and the rest, what we lacked in talent we made up with effort. At one time under Nutt, the effort level was pretty good, but not lately. The 03 Florida and Auburn games are two recent examples. A hire like Herring could pay huge dividends for this team. A coach placing this great an emphasis on effort, could be far reaching. I don't think it would be too big a stretch to envision a domino type effect that not only impacted the defense, but the rest of the team AND the fans. In light of the pink jersey fiasco, one of my biggest concerns at this stage, is the Head Coach meddling too much in Herring's business.

But we were competitive those first 20 years you started following the program. Texas usually comes in #1 in recruiting and yet only went to it's first BCS game this past season.

And you point is?  My point I guess is twofold.  We were one of the top rated programs throughout the 60's ( I'd be willing to guess that the number of players that went to the NFL back then proabably isn't much more than we've had in recent years) so all this talk of lack of talent in Arkansas has always been the case, yet at one time in our history, we overcame the talent obsticle and we can do it again.  Second, A coach placing a huge emphesis on effort could have one heck of an impact, especially on defense.  For the first time since our heyday, there is an excitement centered around the defense.  THis could spill over into RRS and actually have the crowd become a factor in Fayetteville this season.     

[Oklahawg]

Feral, there is one exception. About 1981 Holtz had assembed enough talent to beat darn near anyone. It didn't last, though, not recruiting can do that to you.

I refuse to allow myself to get behind the 8-ball with the 2005 team until they've actually started playing. So, I am searching for optimism, possibly, or at least finding the best spin possible. I really don't think you need an entire staff of Herrings' to have a great staff. In fact, I think in today's climate too many A-game coaches might just screw things up. Look at the impact of Brother Stoops leaving OU--the defense was suddenly ordinary, with much of the same talent as the year before. We are all hopeful that Chow leaving USC will diminish the impact of their offense. I think its a fair assessment, but I just don't know if we have the talent to have it matter.

[Jim Harris]

Maybe the rest of the country has caught up with us on the "effort" front. We had a monopoly on that for years and now everybody else has figured out how to try harder too. I wondered when that was going to happen.

West Virginia fans religiously believe their teams invented giving-more-effort too. I've sat among 60,000 of them when they spanked Va. Tech year before last.

[Feralhog]

Feral, there is one exception. About 1981 Holtz had assembed enough talent to beat darn near anyone. It didn't last, though, not recruiting can do that to you.

Yeah, but even then, it was still just a handful.  We had a great all purpose Decori Birmingham type player (Gary Anderson), a great "Matt Jones" type impact player on defense and finally, and ironically, two damn good QB's.  When we've been good, we've always seem to have two or three great players and one impact player, not sure we have that this season, but maybe a coach (Herring) could fill that roll. 

[Feralhog]

Maybe the rest of the country has caught up with us on the "effort" front. We had a monopoly on that for years and now everybody else has figured out how to try harder too. I wondered when that was going to happen.

Effort doesn't happen just on game day.  I think there for awhile, the pendulum did swing, and the ultra talented Florida programs dominated football, but the gap has been closed by schools fielding solid athletes that emphasize effort and teamwork.  There's only going to be a handful of Universities that will consistently be loaded with talent, the rest have to play with than hand they've been dealt.  There's enough talent to be had in the states we recruit to field a solid team. 

[hogsanity]

Feral, there is one exception. About 1981 Holtz had assembed enough talent to beat darn near anyone. It didn't last, though, not recruiting can do that to you.

Yeah, but even then, it was still just a handful.  We had a great all purpose Decori Birmingham type player (Gary Anderson), a great "Matt Jones" type impact player on defense and finally, and ironically, two damn good QB's.  When we've been good, we've always seem to have two or three great players and one impact player, not sure we have that this season, but maybe a coach (Herring) could fill that roll. 

Thats the point.  We always have a handful of above average players.  You have to have more than that to win in the SEC.  You can get by on O with a mediocre line if you have studs at wr.  Or with mediocre WR if you have a stud line.  We seem to have neither.  Same on D.  Your ol can be soso if your DBS and LBS are above avg and vice versa.

No, you dont win on talent alone, but you dont win on effort alone either.  And the fact remian, all the way back to atleast the sugar bowl when we played bama in 80 or 81.  Bear Braynt told Holtz he would have to get bigger and better linemen to win.  He couldnt get em here so he left, went to ND and won.  Went to SC, couldnt get enough linemen and now he is unemployed. 

AR can go out and get the top 3 HS qbs in the country, but unitl they get a continual flow of good to great linemenn they will always be 8-3 or worse.

[Feralhog]

Nobody said it was effort alone, at least I certainly didn't

Feral, there is one exception. About 1981 Holtz had assembed enough talent to beat darn near anyone. It didn't last, though, not recruiting can do that to you.

Yeah, but even then, it was still just a handful. We had a great all purpose Decori Birmingham type player (Gary Anderson), a great "Matt Jones" type impact player on defense and finally, and ironically, two damn good QB's. When we've been good, we've always seem to have two or three great players and one impact player, not sure we have that this season, but maybe a coach (Herring) could fill that roll.

Thats the point. We always have a handful of above average players. You have to have more than that to win in the SEC. You can get by on O with a mediocre line if you have studs at wr. Or with mediocre WR if you have a stud line. We seem to have neither. Same on D. Your ol can be soso if your DBS and LBS are above avg and vice versa.

No, you dont win on talent alone, but you dont win on effort alone either. And the fact remian, all the way back to atleast the sugar bowl when we played bama in 80 or 81. Bear Braynt told Holtz he would have to get bigger and better linemen to win. He couldnt get em here so he left, went to ND and won. Went to SC, couldnt get enough linemen and now he is unemployed.

AR can go out and get the top 3 HS qbs in the country, but unitl they get a continual flow of good to great linemenn they will always be 8-3 or worse.

I didn't say we could win on effort alone. It takes a lot of things to field a winning team, talent is certainly one, but in my opinion, if you listed them in order of importance, talent might rank as low as 3rd or 4th.  I do agree that if I could choose, I 'd pick a team that was weighted with talent along the lines, (NOT JUST OFFENSE) However, it's a damn site easier to develop talent along the lines, especially on offense, than it is at the skilled positions. 

[Jaison Black]

nutt didnt get in herring's business with the pink jerserys, nutt got calls/emails from folks about it and handled the situation.

do you just sit around and look for excuses to blame something on nutt?



i tend to agree with what mike said on press row yesterday morning. nutt could be one ofe the great coaches if he were somewhere else. its hard to be a great coach and a die-hard fan of the university. i hope he improves cause i like the guy.

sorry for hijacking the thread, just had to say that about the pink jerseys.

[Feralhog]

nutt didnt get in herring's business with the pink jerserys, nutt got calls/emails from folks about it and handled the situation.

do you just sit around and look for excuses to blame something on nutt?



i tend to agree with what mike said on press row yesterday morning. nutt could be one ofe the great coaches if he were somewhere else. its hard to be a great coach and a die-hard fan of the university. i hope he improves cause i like the guy.

sorry for hijacking the thread, just had to say that about the pink jerseys.

Do you even read my friken posts?  I've come to Nutt's defense so often the last six years I still have chew marks on my @$$.  And Nutt didn't receive emaiSSSSS, he got one email from some friked up dude who had way too much time on his hands.  I heard of no phone calls demanding the hogs quit using the pink jersey, in fact, quite the opposite.  The organization he was supposedly defending even distanced themselves from  Nutt's decision. 

[PennHOG]

I feel so honered to be associated with such amazing talent evaluators here on the board.

You don't have to have superior talent at every position to be successfull. Ark. did have some successfull years when there wasn't superior talent at every position.  The problem is that 3 or 4 of our SEC opponents have close to superior  talent at every position.  I ask some of you old timers here, did the southwest conference have that back in the day?  I don't know I'm too young.  LSU, Florida, Georgia, Tennessee are LOADED!  Look at how many SEC players where just drafted to the NFL the last few years.  It is amazing.

BUT ALSO,

Look at who has won the super bowl 3 of the last 4 years.  The Patriots have superior talent at strategic positions and then the rest of the team uses role playing, smart, hard working team players.  It is this very fact that keeps me believing.  That Arkansas will have a chance.

ALSO, just because Ark ranks 30 something on a couple of recruiting rankings doesn't mean that they don't have alot of talent.  I do know that Herring said that there are some talent deficiencies on defense but I'm hoping that he will put the right guys into the right places that will ensure success.  Some of these guys are probably still growing.  I grew three inches after graduating from high school.

[Feralhog]

I agree Penn. 

ALSO, just because Ark ranks 30 something on a couple of recruiting rankings doesn't mean that they don't have alot of talent.  I do know that Herring said that there are some talent deficiencies on defense but I'm hoping that he will put the right guys into the right places that will ensure success.  Some of these guys are probably still growing.  I grew three inches after graduating from high school.

A program who's national rank in recruiting is in the top 30 has enough to work with.

[Oklahawg]

What UA may need more than anything talentwise is a lot of useful players to flesh out the 2-deep roster. It creates competition for playing time. We could have used a scrimmage this year but didn't have OL depth. The last two recruiting classes didn't necessarily have huge star-power but were very deep in potentially useful players. We'll see.

You can only run 11 onto the field at a time. A rotation at WR, RB plus an extra TE helps, but only 11 on the field at once. Ohio State made it to the BCS CG game with average offensive talent surrounding the gifts of Maurice Clarett. All of that, of course, coupled with a shut-down defense. We can't match-up with Ohio State on defense, and play a harder schedule, or at least one with more diversity across the teams. But, a dominant defense kept ordinary Miss State teams in bowl games under Sherrill. And, even they were not chock full of stellar talent. They were the product of great coaching, solid depth and a couple of NFL-types who anchored the whole thing.

[hogsanity]

I agree Penn.

ALSO, just because Ark ranks 30 something on a couple of recruiting rankings doesn't mean that they don't have alot of talent.  I do know that Herring said that there are some talent deficiencies on defense but I'm hoping that he will put the right guys into the right places that will ensure success.  Some of these guys are probably still growing.  I grew three inches after graduating from high school.

A program who's national rank in recruiting is in the top 30 has enough to work with.

Not when 30th is only 5th or 6th in your conference.  College FB is about depth of talent.  And when you are consistently getting ( theoreticaaly since these recruiting rankings are somewhat subjective until they play acouple seasons ) the 5th or 6th best group of players in your conference you are playing with inferior TEAM talent.  You may have the best Wr or the best RB etc, but overall you are not the better team. 

Now, does the best talent always win, of course not, but it sure helps over a whole season. 

OU last year is a perfect example.  They had better talent overall than any team they played all year, especially on offense.  Until they met USC, and we all know ( and enjoyed ) what happened then.

[Feralhog]

I agree Penn.

ALSO, just because Ark ranks 30 something on a couple of recruiting rankings doesn't mean that they don't have alot of talent. I do know that Herring said that there are some talent deficiencies on defense but I'm hoping that he will put the right guys into the right places that will ensure success. Some of these guys are probably still growing. I grew three inches after graduating from high school.

A program who's national rank in recruiting is in the top 30 has enough to work with.

Not when 30th is only 5th or 6th in your conference. College FB is about depth of talent. And when you are consistently getting ( theoreticaaly since these recruiting rankings are somewhat subjective until they play acouple seasons ) the 5th or 6th best group of players in your conference you are playing with inferior TEAM talent. You may have the best Wr or the best RB etc, but overall you are not the better team.

Now, does the best talent always win, of course not, but it sure helps over a whole season.

OU last year is a perfect example. They had better talent overall than any team they played all year, especially on offense. Until they met USC, and we all know ( and enjoyed ) what happened then.

Everything you posted is BSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!! Except the point regarding depth.  The bottom line is a team that is among the 30 best in the nation in recruiting ( and we've ranked a lot higher than 30 the last vew classes) has a SHOT at fielding a very solid team, with the right coaching. 

[oldfart]

The race is not always to the swift of the battle to the strong....but thats the way to bet

[Macgyver_Hawg]

I've been following the program for 30+ years and I don't ever recall Arkansas fielding teams that were loaded with talent. Judging by recent NFL drafts, the talent level at Arkansas is as good as ever. Razorback football, for me, has always been defined as having a handful of talent and the rest, what we lacked in talent we made up with effort. At one time under Nutt, the effort level was pretty good, but not lately. The 03 Florida and Auburn games are two recent examples. A hire like Herring could pay huge dividends for this team. A coach placing this great an emphasis on effort, could be far reaching. I don't think it would be too big a stretch to envision a domino type effect that not only impacted the defense, but the rest of the team AND the fans. In light of the pink jersey fiasco, one of my biggest concerns at this stage, is the Head Coach meddling too much in Herring's business.

But we were competitive those first 20 years you started following the program. Texas usually comes in #1 in recruiting and yet only went to it's first BCS game this past season.

And you point is?  My point I guess is twofold.  We were one of the top rated programs throughout the 60's ( I'd be willing to guess that the number of players that went to the NFL back then proabably isn't much more than we've had in recent years) so all this talk of lack of talent in Arkansas has always been the case, yet at one time in our history, we overcame the talent obsticle and we can do it again. Second, A coach placing a huge emphesis on effort could have one heck of an impact, especially on defense. For the first time since our heyday, there is an excitement centered around the defense. THis could spill over into RRS and actually have the crowd become a factor in Fayetteville this season.     

My point is that we were competitive so I think we were recruiting better than what we were given credit for.

[hogmary]

There is also another name for effort and it is heart.  The team just prior to the 1964 championship team, spent the summer working out and doing whatever they could to get better.  You have to have leadership and a coach you respect or fear too much to let him down.  Herring will help, I hope, because the trademark of past great Hog teams was defense and special teams.  I still haven't seen great special teams under Nutt, but here's hoping.  I remember the days when our field goal kickers could walk on the field and we fans would be confident that three points was about to go on the board...Tim Webster, Bill McClard, Steve Cox,Steve Little, Ish Ordonez and a couple more.  Someday, maybe we will assign someone as special teams coach who actually appreciates the value of special teams and knows something about it.  Under Bud Grant at Minnesota, being special teams captain was the highest honor the coaching staff could bestow upon a player.  That was one that Jim Lindsey wore proudly.  Wish our coaching staff took it so seriously.

[Theolesnort]

Top 30 classes or better is fine but you better spread that talent across the board. Case in point the 2003 season. How many of us think that with 2 or 3 dominant dlinemen that our season would have been a downer? I don't.

[Theolesnort]

Oldfart, only a fool would argue with the bible. Good point.

[Macgyver_Hawg]

Top 30 classes or better is fine but you better spread that talent across the board. Case in point the 2003 season. How many of us think that with 2 or 3 dominant dlinemen that our season would have been a downer? I don't.

They lollygagged around on offense during the Auburn and Ole Miss games. 

[Feralhog]

I've been following the program for 30+ years and I don't ever recall Arkansas fielding teams that were loaded with talent. Judging by recent NFL drafts, the talent level at Arkansas is as good as ever. Razorback football, for me, has always been defined as having a handful of talent and the rest, what we lacked in talent we made up with effort. At one time under Nutt, the effort level was pretty good, but not lately. The 03 Florida and Auburn games are two recent examples. A hire like Herring could pay huge dividends for this team. A coach placing this great an emphasis on effort, could be far reaching. I don't think it would be too big a stretch to envision a domino type effect that not only impacted the defense, but the rest of the team AND the fans. In light of the pink jersey fiasco, one of my biggest concerns at this stage, is the Head Coach meddling too much in Herring's business.

But we were competitive those first 20 years you started following the program. Texas usually comes in #1 in recruiting and yet only went to it's first BCS game this past season.

And you point is? My point I guess is twofold. We were one of the top rated programs throughout the 60's ( I'd be willing to guess that the number of players that went to the NFL back then proabably isn't much more than we've had in recent years) so all this talk of lack of talent in Arkansas has always been the case, yet at one time in our history, we overcame the talent obsticle and we can do it again. Second, A coach placing a huge emphesis on effort could have one heck of an impact, especially on defense. For the first time since our heyday, there is an excitement centered around the defense. THis could spill over into RRS and actually have the crowd become a factor in Fayetteville this season.

My point is that we were competitive so I think we were recruiting better than what we were given credit for.

But wouldn't the NFL draft tend to dispute your OPINION!

[Macgyver_Hawg]

But wouldn't the NFL draft tend to dispute your OPINION!

No.  The Draft means nothing as far as real talent goes.  Tom Brady went in what round of the draft?  How many players could the average fan name off the Patriots the last three seasons?

Clint Stoerner plays Arena Football, Dallas needed and QB and Ryan Leaf was brought in to take his spot.

[Rocky&Boarwinkle]

The problem is that while our recruiting might be top 30, so were 7 other SEC teams.  The 7 right in front of us.

In the SWC, we were usually at least in the top 3 in talent level, especially in really good years.  Our problem is that the SEC is brutal.  I'm all for tough leagues, but the SEC has a tough time getting people into the NC game because of the beatings, week in and week out.  You can call it tail tucking or whatever, but I would rather be in the Big 12 or something comparable.

[Jim Harris]

There is also another name for effort and it is heart. The team just prior to the 1964 championship team, spent the summer working out and doing whatever they could to get better. You have to have leadership and a coach you respect or fear too much to let him down. Herring will help, I hope, because the trademark of past great Hog teams was defense and special teams. I still haven't seen great special teams under Nutt, but here's hoping. I remember the days when our field goal kickers could walk on the field and we fans would be confident that three points was about to go on the board...Tim Webster, Bill McClard, Steve Cox,Steve Little, Ish Ordonez and a couple more. Someday, maybe we will assign someone as special teams coach who actually appreciates the value of special teams and knows something about it. Under Bud Grant at Minnesota, being special teams captain was the highest honor the coaching staff could bestow upon a player. That was one that Jim Lindsey wore proudly. Wish our coaching staff took it so seriously.

Tim Webster?

[Jim Harris]

The race is not always to the swift of the battle to the strong....but thats the way to bet

that may have been the best first post ever made on this board, next to HSV's "Well, here we are."

[hogmary]

He kicked before McClard and in his final 2 seasons, kicked off while McClard place kicked.  His senior season was 1970 and he kicked for the Green Bay Packers for a couple of years before they drafted Chester Marcol.  He was not spectacular, but he was reliable and consistent.  McClard had better distance on place kicks.

[Jim Harris]

He kicked before McClard and in his final 2 seasons, kicked off while McClard place kicked. His senior season was 1970 and he kicked for the Green Bay Packers for a couple of years before they drafted Chester Marcol. He was not spectacular, but he was reliable and consistent. McClard had better distance on place kicks.

Bob White kicked placements (FGs and PATs) in 1968, before McClard came aboard for all placekicks in 1969-71. I'll buy that he kicked off; glad somebody remembers him.

[Hoggysoprano]

He kicked before McClard and in his final 2 seasons, kicked off while McClard place kicked. His senior season was 1970 and he kicked for the Green Bay Packers for a couple of years before they drafted Chester Marcol. He was not spectacular, but he was reliable and consistent. McClard had better distance on place kicks.

Bob White kicked placements (FGs and PATs) in 1968, before McClard came aboard for all placekicks in 1969-71. I'll buy that he kicked off; glad somebody remembers him.

Hey I was talking to ole RoadHogg and we decided that Bob White would be a good AD.  It takes an attorney now days to do that job, Bob being a criminal attorney could also represent the guys on the football team that get into trouble.  What do you think?

[Feralhog]

But wouldn't the NFL draft tend to dispute your OPINION!

No. The Draft means nothing as far as real talent goes. Tom Brady went in what round of the draft? How many players could the average fan name off the Patriots the last three seasons?

Clint Stoerner plays Arena Football, Dallas needed and QB and Ryan Leaf was brought in to take his spot.

Come on, I'm not interested in this tit for tat $#!+.  By all indications, the talent level has been pretty damn good as of late, when compared to our overall history .   

[Feralhog]

He kicked before McClard and in his final 2 seasons, kicked off while McClard place kicked. His senior season was 1970 and he kicked for the Green Bay Packers for a couple of years before they drafted Chester Marcol. He was not spectacular, but he was reliable and consistent. McClard had better distance on place kicks.

Bob White kicked placements (FGs and PATs) in 1968, before McClard came aboard for all placekicks in 1969-71. I'll buy that he kicked off; glad somebody remembers him.

I played a lot of golf with Bob over the years, in fact, I've been meaning to track him down to see if he would be interested in playing in our member guest the end of the month.  I've not talked to Bob since his wife passed away, I assume he's still practicing law in Fayetteville?  If someone could IM me with how I could get in touch with Bob I'd appreciate it. 

[Macgyver_Hawg]

But wouldn't the NFL draft tend to dispute your OPINION!

No. The Draft means nothing as far as real talent goes. Tom Brady went in what round of the draft? How many players could the average fan name off the Patriots the last three seasons?

Clint Stoerner plays Arena Football, Dallas needed and QB and Ryan Leaf was brought in to take his spot.

Come on, I'm not interested in this tit for tat $#!+. By all indications, the talent level has been pretty damn good as of late, when compared to our overall history .

I'm not saying our talent is bad or anything like that - I just don't think we can honestly say that because we're getting more guys in the nfl that the talent level decades ago wasn't all that good compared to other schools.  It was a different time without ESPN.  I just disagree that you can measure a program by nfl draftees and recruiting.  There's been way too many busts and a lot of the hype around certain athletes are by so called guru's who have their favorites.

[Sleestak Hog]

In 2003 Hogs won purely on talent.  That year they did not have a conference win over a team with a winning record; they beat the teams with less talent than them and lost to the teams with better talent than them.

[Big Papa Satan]

In 2003 Hogs won purely on talent.  That year they did not have a conference win over a team with a winning record; they beat the teams with less talent than them and lost to the teams with better talent than them.

Besides Manning, Ole Miss had lesser talent than Arkansas in 2003.

[Macgyver_Hawg]

We just didn't come to play football against Ole Miss in 2003.  I know there were a couple bad calls with a bad spot from refs and that fumble but we still wouldn't have done much.  That was a hard game to watch.

[Jim Harris]

He kicked before McClard and in his final 2 seasons, kicked off while McClard place kicked. His senior season was 1970 and he kicked for the Green Bay Packers for a couple of years before they drafted Chester Marcol. He was not spectacular, but he was reliable and consistent. McClard had better distance on place kicks.

Bob White kicked placements (FGs and PATs) in 1968, before McClard came aboard for all placekicks in 1969-71. I'll buy that he kicked off; glad somebody remembers him.

Hey I was talking to ole RoadHogg and we decided that Bob White would be a good AD.  It takes an attorney now days to do that job, Bob being a criminal attorney could also represent the guys on the football team that get into trouble.  What do you think?

I think he has represented some of them already.

[RebelliousHog]

I gotta agree with some of the posters. The SEC is a brutal conference. I do think a team with above average talent and strong desire can win. I also think Coach Herring can do a great job. If he can get our D to swarm and tackle well ( didn't this used to be a trademark of UA football?) we have a chance to be in some games that we may not be expected to.  That was my biggest criticism last year. The just awful tackling on D. The just awful coverage by the D-backs.