SEC Vs. Big 12 Debate-Who is better in football? Here's some facts.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

This is a debate that has raged on for some time now and like many of you, I have always been of the opinion that the SEC was the best and toughest conference between the two.

After doing a little research, here is what I found.

Over the last four years, the average rank for recruiting classes in the Big 12 has been #33. The SEC has averaged #25. However, both conferences averaged #30 last year, so the Big 12 appears to trying to close the gap in talent.

In Strength of Schedule over the past four years, the Big 12 has averaged .553%. The SEC has averaged .564%. For the 2008 season the Big 12 came in at .548% to the SEC's .541%.

In terms of win percentage, again over the last four years, the Big 12 has averaged 57.66% to the SEC's 59.0%. For this past season, the Big 12 exceeded the win percentage of the SEC with a 59.57% to a 58.44%.

If you take these three categories and apply each individual team's averages as opposed to doing it as an entire conference, the order of rank would come out this way:

1. Florida
2. Georgia
3. Oklahoma
4. Alabama
5. LSU
6. Texas
7. Auburn
8. Tennessee
9. Nebraska
10. S. Carolina
11. Texas A&M
12. Ole Miss
13. Arkansas
14. Texas Tech
15. Okla State
16. Colorado
17. Missouri
18. K-State
19. Miss State
20. Kansas
21. Kentucky
22. Baylor
23. Iowa State
24. Vanderbilt

It appears that there is no doubt that the SEC overall comes out ahead of the Big 12 in recruiting, SOS and win percentage over the last four years. But it also appears that the Big 12 is catching up and trying to make a play to displace the SEC.

Notice where the majority of the SEC teams are positioned. Will we maintain our superiority and how many SEC bowl teams do you expect to see win?

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I found it interesting that Ole Miss came out ahead of Texas Tech with their bowl game looming. Ole Miss averaged #26 in recruiting over the past four years while Tech averaged #40 while Tech has won 74% of their games to Ole Miss winning 38%. In SOS Tech has averaged .554% to Ole Miss's .543%. Big difference overall.

Is Leach just that much better of a coach that he gets so much more out of his kids?

[IronHog]

Arkansas being less relevant than OkSt and TT really hacks me off.


It's time to kick some tail, and I hope the crumbling of JFB's ivory tower will put Arkansas back as a legit top 20 program.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Arkansas being less relevant than OkSt and TT really hacks me off.


It's time to kick some tail, and I hope the crumbling of JFB's ivory tower will put Arkansas back as a legit top 20 program.

Look at what I posted just above your post about the OM-Tech game. Leach appears to have TRULY done more with less.

[IronHog]

Look at what I posted just above your post about the OM-Tech game. Leach appears to have TRULY done more with less.

Leach is going to stomp a mudhole in OM.


Unlike Pete Carroll he won't call off the dogs.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Leach is going to stomp a mudhole in OM.


Unlike Pete Carroll he won't call off the dogs.

I think Ole Miss will have a lot of luck running the football and they may even exceed their total offense average of 398, but they have NEVER seen the ball thrown like they will see Harrell throw against them and when you add in that Tech as a team, is going to be really ticked that their record setting QB was snubbed and didn't even get an invitation to the Heisman ceremonies, I think they will be out to make a statement on national television. Good recruiting tool for Tech, bad for Ole Miss. But what the heck, they aren't really getting after recruiting anyway.

[IronHog]

I think Ole Miss will have a lot of luck running the football and they may even exceed their total offense average of 398, but they have NEVER seen the ball thrown like they will see Harrell throw against them and when you add in that Tech as a team, is going to be really ticked that their record setting QB was snubbed and didn't even get an invitation to the Heisman ceremonies, I think they will be out to make a statement on national television. Good recruiting tool for Tech, bad for Ole Miss. But what the heck, they aren't really getting after recruiting anyway.

Nutt got lucky this year as Auburn, Arkansas, and  LSU were all down.

He has some success this year with Joe Ferguson's passing plays, but his team is in no way prepared for TT, and TT has enough of an OL to neutralize that crazy good interior DL of OM.

Ball control and play not to lose aren't going to cut it against TT.  Mudhole.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Did you notice, in the individual team rankings, that every single team ahead of us(with the exception of A&M) and six teams beneath us, are in a bowl? Even Vandy, that ranks last of all SEC and Big 12 teams in those three categories. Good grief. It makes me wonder where we would be if we played in the Big 12 North? Not suggesting a change, just wondering.

[IronHog]

Did you notice, in the individual team rankings, that every single team ahead of us(with the exception of A&M) and six teams beneath us, are in a bowl? Even Vandy, that ranks last of all SEC and Big 12 teams in those three categories. Good grief. It makes me wonder where we would be if we played in the Big 12 North? Not suggesting a change, just wondering.

Who knows?

Traditionally every team in the Big 12 outside of Neb, OK, and Tejas was a homecoming level game for Arkansas

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Who knows?

Traditionally every team in the Big 12 outside of Neb, OK, and Tejas was a homecoming level game for Arkansas

Well, we both know we are headed for better things and at a higher rate of speed than most. We'll be fine in the SEC, even though we all take turns beating the snot out of each other. But you know, in looking at where we rank, if we had only had some people show up and got some breaks at key times, we too might be among those in a bowl. I would have loved to have seen that for those seniors that made scarifices this year. That's where being in an easier conference would have helped us. But if we are patient, we'll be fine. I'm encouraged that we are where we are in those rankings. It suggests that we are on the verge of breaking out.

[IronHog]

I would have loved to have seen that for those seniors that made scarifices this year.

We would have made a bowl pretty easy if a few more of the seniors had decided to play this year.

[jamie72921]

I think you may have something here.

While I have been vociferous in defending the SEC, it cannot be denied that the Big XII has closed ground on the SEC.

The problem the Big XII has though is depth. The lower half of the Big XII is still easy meat while the top half is comparable with the top half of the SEC.

[red_beard_82]

Which of the two conferences has teams full of players that are bone crushing hitters, and which of the conferences has teams with great defensive speed.  The big 12 is catching up, but it is mainly OU and Texas that are catching up on the defensive side of the ball.  The SEC has to upgrade its offenses or it will begin to slip.  Texas Tech rose to the number 2 team in the nation without playing a team with a defense that would hit them in the mouth and that could match the speed of their team on offense.  But if you look at the SEC, even Miss. State has a defense that can do that year in and year out. 

OU and Texas are the only programs that bring complete teams to the table each year, and that is why the winner of that game AlMOST always appears in their conference championship game.   

[jabohog]

I found it interesting that Ole Miss came out ahead of Texas Tech with their bowl game looming. Ole Miss averaged #26 in recruiting over the past four years while Tech averaged #40 while Tech has won 74% of their games to Ole Miss winning 38%. In SOS Tech has averaged .554% to Ole Miss's .543%. Big difference overall.

Is Leach just that much better of a coach that he gets so much more out of his kids?

Yeah. Leach has been teaching a system for a long time. Orgeron knew how to recruit, but he wasn't an established head coach. Leach has raised the bar on recruiting, plus he has upped his defense.
The problem that I have is with ole miss and usc over Arkansas. Arkansas has had some hellacious SOS, and a couple of good years with McFadden and Felix at wins. 38% win for ole miss? They didn't win a game last year, did they? I know they both blew Nutt our of the water recruiting, but that was a shocker to me.
Back on post, yes the big 12 is making a major push to clip the SEC. They are doing it with offense. They have good defenses, other than Tech who made strides in that area this year. This year the big 12 will be tough in the bowl games. I believe OU will give UF all they want and more.  I just wish they had pitted Bama against Texas. We would have had a great comparison, stat wise, and visually to go by. Good post Muskogeehogfan.

[Hoggy1]

Coming with the facts as always, good post.

As far as the top teams in each conference...the Big 12 is closing quick, IMO they have a few more years and NC's to win to be better than the SEC

[Abominable Hillbilly]

I think the sec will dominate completely again in a few years due to the new tv contract with espn.  This is the best thing that could ever happen for recruiting purposes.

[want2be]

It would be interesting to see how many NFL players are in the SEC vs Big 12 in the past 5 years also.  That would be more of a sign of developed talent as opposed to recruiting talent. I would guess the SEC would win that comparison by a wide margin.

[FaulknerHogfan]

Man, awsomw work!  I can use this for my friend who is a Big 12 freak!

[Pa-Paw]

It would be interesting to see how many NFL players are in the SEC vs Big 12 in the past 5 years also.  That would be more of a sign of developed talent as opposed to recruiting talent. I would guess the SEC would win that comparison by a wide margin.

Maybe yes and maybe not. The three hottest and biggest recruiting areas in the country have for years been California, Florida, and Texas.  One falls in SEC country and the other.................

[MuskogeeHogFan]

It would be interesting to see how many NFL players are in the SEC vs Big 12 in the past 5 years also.  That would be more of a sign of developed talent as opposed to recruiting talent. I would guess the SEC would win that comparison by a wide margin.

Don't know about the past 5 years, but on current rosters in the NFL, a quick scan reveals these numbers:

SEC: 274 former players

Big 12: 180 former players

[Pa-Paw]

Don't know about the past 5 years, but on current rosters in the NFL, a quick scan reveals these numbers:

SEC: 274 former players

Big 12: 180 former players

Interesting.........where is the link?

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Interesting………where is the link?

Sorry, I didn't copy the link for you guys but you can get it at the same place I did, the SEC and Big 12 Conference sites.

[Nashville Fan]

You forgot an most important stat. BCS championship game winning %. The number of BCS championships won by a conference / the number of championship games played by that conference.

[Pa-Paw]

Don't know about the past 5 years, but on current rosters in the NFL, a quick scan reveals these numbers:

SEC: 274 former players

Big 12: 180 former players

Don't know about the past 5 years, but on current rosters in the NFL, a quick scan reveals these numbers:

SEC: 274 former players

Big 12: 180 former players

I touched base with my friends over on the Sooner site and asked about the disparity of NFL players. Their answer makes some sense "Big XII is only 12 years old, right? SEC is much older"

[Nashville Fan]

I touched base with my friends over on the Sooner site and asked about the disparity of NFL players. Their answer makes some sense “Big XII is only 12 years old, right? SEC is much older”

How would that explain the current nfl roster differential?

[jamie72921]

I touched base with my friends over on the Sooner site and asked about the disparity of NFL players. Their answer makes some sense “Big XII is only 12 years old, right? SEC is much older”

and what is the average career lenght for NFL players? I am sure it is much, much shorter than 12 years.

not a good a excuse at all.

[dr_arkansawyer]

MHF - great compilation!  That was interesting to see things lined out for comparison. 
IMHO, I think that both conferences are outstanding in talent and execution, overall when compared to other conferences.  When I think of the Big 12, the big time programs that come to mind are Texas and OU.  When I think of the SEC, great national powers come to mind - Florida, Alabama, LSU, Tennessee, Georgia and to a lesser extent, Arkansas (Don't get me wrong, I am a hog fan down to my razorback undies, but I am not delusional.  We are headed to national prominence, but not currently or even recently a national power).  These teams, from both conferences, could beat 99% of all other teams in D1 football and probably most perennial NFL bottom-dwellers. 
Overall, statistics may show major parity between our conferences, but I believe that the SEC has FAR MORE star power and a MUCH GREATER capacity to defeat teams from the BIG 12.  I would say that Texas and OU are similar to big fish in a small pond, while the traditional SEC powers are big fish in a much more competitive ocean.  I acknowledge the recent successes of teams in the BIG 12, such as Nebraska, TT, Okie State, Kansas and Mizzou, but I think they were flukes.  These teams aren't competitive every single year.  This was a great year for the BIG 12 and a tough year for SEC, which may reflect a larger parity among D1 schools in general (see USF, BSU, Utah).
IMHO, the SEC is still the greatest conference in college football, with the most talent and the greatest conglomeration of excellent programs.  But we do have to continue to sharpen one another and produce a NC bound team every year.  There will never be another conference full of great southern programs like the SEC.  Besides the 1964 season, moving to the SEC from the SWC might have been JFB's greatest contribution to the UofA. 
The SEC will continue its reign for a long long time, and Arkansas has a bright future playing against the best of the best.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I touched base with my friends over on the Sooner site and asked about the disparity of NFL players. Their answer makes some sense “Big XII is only 12 years old, right? SEC is much older”

Yeah but here's the deal, that list is of current players on NFL rosters, not all-time. How many guys have you ever heard of logging 12 years in the NFL? A few perhaps, but certainly not the norm. If they make it 5 years, they are probably the "average" player in terms of time in the NFL. So the 12 year thing, really isn't applicable.

[rzrbaxfan]

I crunched some numbers a while back and I might just have to dig them out sometime and update them.  I looked at cumulative conference winning percentages over 5 years.  Now, add up the winning percentage of every team, and it adds to 1.  What I found is that in the B12, OU and Tex took a huge slice of that 1, and there was about a 15% gap between them and #3.  In the SEC, there were 5 teams at the top that are within 15% of each other.

I give Mizzou and Kansas credit for scaring some folks in 07 (where are they now?).  I give TT credit for closing the gap a little more.  Did they get the job done? In the end, who is the Big 12 champ again?  You guessed it! OfreakinU.  Meanwhile, in the SEC, we have not had a back to back SEC champ in the BCS era.

Who thought Bama would go undefeated in the regular season after losing to ULM the year before?  How many people had LSU a shoe in for the west? How many people predicted Georgia was going to win it all?  These things happen in a conference that has COMPETITION!!

You can talk 'head2head' records, bowl records, national titles, etc....but when it comes to high caliber competition week in and week out, and a conference champ that is difficult to predict in the preseason, and a champ in the end that is worthy of a spot in the NC game nearly any year....the discussion begins and ends with the SEC.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I crunched some numbers a while back and I might just have to dig them out sometime and update them.  I looked at cumulative conference winning percentages over 5 years.  Now, add up the winning percentage of every team, and it adds to 1.  What I found is that in the B12, OU and Tex took a huge slice of that 1, and there was about a 15% gap between them and #3.  In the SEC, there were 5 teams at the top that are within 15% of each other.

I give Mizzou and Kansas credit for scaring some folks in 07 (where are they now?).  I give TT credit for closing the gap a little more.  Did they get the job done? In the end, who is the Big 12 champ again?  You guessed it! OfreakinU.  Meanwhile, in the SEC, we have not had a back to back SEC champ in the BCS era.

Who thought Bama would go undefeated in the regular season after losing to ULM the year before?  How many people had LSU a shoe in for the west? How many people predicted Georgia was going to win it all?  These things happen in a conference that has COMPETITION!!

You can talk 'head2head' records, bowl records, national titles, etc....but when it comes to high caliber competition week in and week out, and a conference champ that is difficult to predict in the preseason, and a champ in the end that is worthy of a spot in the NC game nearly any year....the discussion begins and ends with the SEC.

In looking at won/loss percentage, there really is little difference between the Big 12 and the SEC. Both conferences have 5 teams over the last four years that have averaged as follows: 1 in each conference that averaged in the 80's, two that averaged in the 70's and two that averaged in the 60's. The remaining 7 teams in each conference populate out in the 30's, 40's and 50's. Not a huge difference between the two. When you have the Big 12 averaging 57.66% and the SEC at 59%, that isn't a huge difference when spread across an entire 12 team conference.

[WindyCityHog]

Hell yeah!!!!!

We are the SEC!!!!!!!!!!

Frank that.

You think teams like Florida, 'Bama, LSU rely on their conference affiliation to justify their hardon?

Losers do that.  The Hogs have been doing just that for 10 years...SEC! SEC!

The SEC is great...but last time I checked, it's the school and not the conference that gets the props.  Relying on the conferencing to prop oneselve's up is a serious case of vaginitis.

Vanderbilt must be proud.

Stop this "SEC" crap.  Best conference no doubt....but that doesn't sate my Hog love.

Who gives a real crap about the Big 12 or the SEC?  When it comes down to it, I'm all hog, SEC be darned.

[want2be]

Hell yeah!!!!!

We are the SEC!!!!!!!!!!

Frank that.

You think teams like Florida, 'Bama, LSU rely on their conference affiliation to justify their hardon?

Losers do that.  The Hogs have been doing just that for 10 years...SEC! SEC!

The SEC is great...but last time I checked, it's the school and not the conference that gets the props.  Relying on the conferencing to prop oneselve's up is a serious case of vaginitis.

Vanderbilt must be proud.

Stop this "SEC" crap.  Best conference no doubt....but that doesn't sate my Hog love.

Who gives a real crap about the Big 12 or the SEC?  When it comes down to it, I'm all hog, SEC be darned.

SEC does mean something otherwise ESPN would not have paid the BIG BUCKS for the  affiliation that begins next year.

Granted the Hogs have not been considered a top tier team in the SEC (YET).....I would imagine in most of the last 10 years we would have ruled the Big 12 North

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Hell yeah!!!!!

We are the SEC!!!!!!!!!!

Frank that.

You think teams like Florida, 'Bama, LSU rely on their conference affiliation to justify their hardon?

Losers do that.  The Hogs have been doing just that for 10 years...SEC! SEC!

The SEC is great...but last time I checked, it's the school and not the conference that gets the props.  Relying on the conferencing to prop oneselve's up is a serious case of vaginitis.

Vanderbilt must be proud.

Stop this "SEC" crap.  Best conference no doubt....but that doesn't sate my Hog love.

Who gives a real crap about the Big 12 or the SEC?  When it comes down to it, I'm all hog, SEC be darned.

For some, SEC affiliation and pride may be as important as being a Hog fan. It isn't for me, but that wasn't the point of this thread. The point of this thread was to actually explore quantative facts that might present some logical, factual comparison between the two in the midst of the ongoing, "which conference is better" debate.

It's nice for a lot of fans, especially at bowl time, to have some pride in the conference that their team belongs to simply because the level of superiority that the teams from their conference exhibits in their play, supports the difficulty of achievement of their own team, especially when your team is a grand total of 6 points(over three games) away from having been 8-4 and having been in a bowl game.

Still, from my standpoint, I think that some of the stats just show that there is increasing parity between the two conferences in terms of talent, SOS and won/loss percentages, top to bottom.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

You forgot an most important stat. BCS championship game winning %. The number of BCS championships won by a conference / the number of championship games played by that conference.

Both conferences have placed 17 teams in the BCS games since the inception of the BCS.

The SEC has had 5 teams in the NCG to the Big 12 having had 6. The SEC has won four to the Big 12's two.

[HoopS]

I hear ya, Windy.   I do get the conference superiority stuff, but ultimately, we need to get better.  And WE need to be a team that helps our conference when numbers are crunched like this.

MUskogee, your rankings had Alabama ahead of Texas.....was that a 5 year ranking?   I really can't see how they've done more than Texas in the last 5 years....and I can't stand Tex.  Perhaps I misunderstood something.

The debate is, to me, about this year only.  My main complaint against us is we have Auburn, Tenn and Arkansas all with down years.   That's 3 traditionally good teams staying home for the holidays.  We have Vandy & Kentucky in a bowl in the same year and that surely hasn't happened more than a few times in the history of this conference. 

I still believe Florida and Bama are darn good.  Then it falls off quite a bit to Georgia, SC, LSU and OM. 

They counter with OU and Tex as darn good.   Tech, OSU, Missouri and Kansas.   
I would like to see the top 6 play each other. 

Historically, we are better.  No doubt.   And we may be better this year, but we have been less than impressive out of conference this year.  Sorry, but that's true. 

I know they don't play D like us, supposedly.   But Texas shut us down big time.  Perhaps being on the road played into that....but we ended up with our worst yardage (I believe) against them and when we are arguing *lack of defense*, then our stats against them are a head scratcher.  And our teams D against Wake, Ga Tech and. Clemson (SC) don't intimidate anybody.  Stats said Georgia would handle Ga Tech.   The game said otherwise.   Stats said SC would beat Clemson....the game said otherwise.  Stats said Vandy would beat Duke and OM would beat Wake....the games didn't prove that out.   Stats say Tex had a crappy Big 12 defense, but the game said they shut our buts down better than defensive heavyweights LSU, Alabama, Florida, Auburn and SC.

I wish all of our bowl games were head to head vs the Big 12. 

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I hear ya, Windy.   I do get the conference superiority stuff, but ultimately, we need to get better.  And WE need to be a team that helps our conference when numbers are crunched like this.

MUskogee, your rankings had Alabama ahead of Texas.....was that a 5 year ranking?   I really can't see how they've done more than Texas in the last 5 years....and I can't stand Tex.  Perhaps I misunderstood something.

The debate is, to me, about this year only.  My main complaint against us is we have Auburn, Tenn and Arkansas all with down years.   That's 3 traditionally good teams staying home for the holidays.  We have Vandy & Kentucky in a bowl in the same year and that surely hasn't happened more than a few times in the history of this conference. 

I still believe Florida and Bama are darn good.  Then it falls off quite a bit to Georgia, SC, LSU and OM. 

They counter with OU and Tex as darn good.   Tech, OSU, Missouri and Kansas.   
I would like to see the top 6 play each other. 

Historically, we are better.  No doubt.   And we may be better this year, but we have been less than impressive out of conference this year.  Sorry, but that's true. 

I know they don't play D like us, supposedly.   But Texas shut us down big time.  Perhaps being on the road played into that....but we ended up with our worst yardage (I believe) against them and when we are arguing *lack of defense*, then our stats against them are a head scratcher.  And our teams D against Wake, Ga Tech and. Clemson (SC) don't intimidate anybody.  Stats said Georgia would handle Ga Tech.   The game said otherwise.   Stats said SC would beat Clemson....the game said otherwise.  Stats said Vandy would beat Duke and OM would beat Wake....the games didn't prove that out.   Stats say Tex had a crappy Big 12 defense, but the game said they shut our buts down better than defensive heavyweights LSU, Alabama, Florida, Auburn and SC.

I wish all of our bowl games were head to head vs the Big 12. 

Those were averages of recruiting rankings, won/loss percentage and SOS over the past 4 years. Breaking it down individually by team, that is how the individual rankings came out.

If you go with this year alone, the Big 12 beat the SEC in 2 of 3 categories and tied in average recruiting ranking.

[HoopS]

Just hard to imagine a system that would have Alabama higher in the last 4 years than Texas.   Bama was 7-6 last year and I beat Texas has barely lost 6 games in 4 years.

Heck, I haven't looked at Tex record over that time, I could be completely wrong - I just know they won a title not long ago and in my mind, Alabama has struggled until this year.   

But you did factor in other stuff.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Just hard to imagine a system that would have Alabama higher in the last 4 years than Texas.   Bama was 7-6 last year and I beat Texas has barely lost 6 games in 4 years.

Heck, I haven't looked at Tex record over that time, I could be completely wrong - I just know they won a title not long ago and in my mind, Alabama has struggled until this year.   

But you did factor in other stuff.

Well, it is close throughout those rankings between teams but even more so between Bama, LSU and Texas. Bama edged Texas in recruiting over those four years and I think that is what made the ever so slight difference.

[HoopS]

Wins and loses on the field certainly didn't weigh in enough, IMO.  Just browsing back a few years, Texas won the national title and finished with 1 lose this year never losing more than 3 games.   Bama had a good season this year, but combined for 13 loses in the last 2.

Sorry bro, but I can't agree with a ranking system that rates the latter team as higher.  It just doesn't pass the test. 

But then, my opinion and $4.95 will getcha about 8oz of Coffee at Starbucks.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Wins and loses on the field certainly didn't weigh in enough, IMO.  Just browsing back a few years, Texas won the national title and finished with 1 lose this year never losing more than 3 games.   Bama had a good season this year, but combined for 13 loses in the last 2.

Sorry bro, but I can't agree with a ranking system that rates the latter team as higher.  It just doesn't pass the test. 

But then, my opinion and $4.95 will getcha about 8oz of Coffee at Starbucks.

Yeah, but that Starbucks is closed now.

Keep in mind that 4 years ago, Alabama was 10-2. The same year that Texas won the NC. So they may have had a couple of lackluster seasons of 6-7 and 7-6, but their recruiting and SOS has remained strong. No additional points were assigned to anything, I just went strictly with the rankings.

[HoopS]

I gotcha.  I just put more emphasis on the W/L then this ranking system.   Thanks for your hard work. 

Speaking of closed stores....

A Circuit City here in Houston was opened one day, and closed the very next.  Hard times are spreading just like the flu. 

[MuskogeeHogFan]

and what is the average career lenght for NFL players? I am sure it is much, much shorter than 12 years.

not a good a excuse at all.

I would agree.

[HoopS]

I concur.

[linze82]

Hell yeah!!!!!

We are the SEC!!!!!!!!!!

Frank that.

You think teams like Florida, 'Bama, LSU rely on their conference affiliation to justify their hardon?

Losers do that.  The Hogs have been doing just that for 10 years...SEC! SEC!

The SEC is great...but last time I checked, it's the school and not the conference that gets the props.  Relying on the conferencing to prop oneselve's up is a serious case of vaginitis.

Vanderbilt must be proud.

Stop this "SEC" crap.  Best conference no doubt....but that doesn't sate my Hog love.

Who gives a real crap about the Big 12 or the SEC?  When it comes down to it, I'm all hog, SEC be darned.

i'm with on this. it's a little embarrasing all the sec rah rah. we need to do something on our own

[MuskogeeHogFan]

i'm with on this. it's a little embarrasing all the sec rah rah. we need to do something on our own

We are in the process. It is all going to work out. We are on our way to a great recruiting class that will help do exactly what both of you are talking about.

Do we realize how many 5 win or less teams since February of 2005 have signed top 25 recruiting classes after a less than shining season the year before?

2005-5
2006-4
2007-3
2008-1

For 2009, there are currently more of the "5 win or less" teams headed towards a top 25 finish than anytime since 2005 with 8 currently in the running. Michigan, Arkansas, Stanford, UCLA, Texas A&M, Auburn, Illinois and Miss State. The recruiting season isn't over and some of these may drop out of the top 25 before signing day, but I feel very encouraged by what I see this staff putting together. I have a feeling we'll be making our contribution towards a better conference record in the near future.

[Pa-Paw]

Wins and loses on the field certainly didn't weigh in enough, IMO.  Just browsing back a few years, Texas won the national title and finished with 1 lose this year never losing more than 3 games.   Bama had a good season this year, but combined for 13 loses in the last 2.

Sorry bro, but I can't agree with a ranking system that rates the latter team as higher.  It just doesn't pass the test. 

But then, my opinion and $4.95 will getcha about 8oz of Coffee at Starbucks.

Yeah, but that Starbucks is closed now.

Keep in mind that 4 years ago, Alabama was 10-2. The same year that Texas won the NC. So they may have had a couple of lackluster seasons of 6-7 and 7-6, but their recruiting and SOS has remained strong. No additional points were assigned to anything, I just went strictly with the rankings.

Yeah, but that Starbucks is closed now.

Keep in mind that 4 years ago, Alabama was 10-2. The same year that Texas won the NC. So they may have had a couple of lackluster seasons of 6-7 and 7-6, but their recruiting and SOS has remained strong. No additional points were assigned to anything, I just went strictly with the rankings.

I would agree.

Yeah, but that Starbucks is closed now.

Keep in mind that 4 years ago, Alabama was 10-2. The same year that Texas won the NC. So they may have had a couple of lackluster seasons of 6-7 and 7-6, but their recruiting and SOS has remained strong. No additional points were assigned to anything, I just went strictly with the rankings.

Yeah, but that Starbucks is closed now.

Keep in mind that 4 years ago, Alabama was 10-2. The same year that Texas won the NC. So they may have had a couple of lackluster seasons of 6-7 and 7-6, but their recruiting and SOS has remained strong. No additional points were assigned to anything, I just went strictly with the rankings.

I gotcha.  I just put more emphasis on the W/L then this ranking system.   Thanks for your hard work. 

Speaking of closed stores....

A Circuit City here in Houston was opened one day, and closed the very next.  Hard times are spreading just like the flu. 

Yeah, but that Starbucks is closed now.

Keep in mind that 4 years ago, Alabama was 10-2. The same year that Texas won the NC. So they may have had a couple of lackluster seasons of 6-7 and 7-6, but their recruiting and SOS has remained strong. No additional points were assigned to anything, I just went strictly with the rankings.

Wins and loses on the field certainly didn't weigh in enough, IMO.  Just browsing back a few years, Texas won the national title and finished with 1 lose this year never losing more than 3 games.   Bama had a good season this year, but combined for 13 loses in the last 2.

Sorry bro, but I can't agree with a ranking system that rates the latter team as higher.  It just doesn't pass the test. 

But then, my opinion and $4.95 will getcha about 8oz of Coffee at Starbucks.

Wins and loses on the field certainly didn't weigh in enough, IMO.  Just browsing back a few years, Texas won the national title and finished with 1 lose this year never losing more than 3 games.   Bama had a good season this year, but combined for 13 loses in the last 2.

Sorry bro, but I can't agree with a ranking system that rates the latter team as higher.  It just doesn't pass the test. 

But then, my opinion and $4.95 will getcha about 8oz of Coffee at Starbucks.

Alabama rated higher than Texas? According to these links, Texas wins hands down in the last ten years. It's not even close.

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Alabama

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Texas

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Alabama rated higher than Texas? According to these links, Texas wins hands down in the last ten years. It’s not even close.

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Alabama

http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Texas

Sorry you went to all of that trouble. If you read the original thread, I said they came out higher in the "three categories I used". Everybody has opinions and stassen uses stats and they aren't any different. Your link reflects won loss records only. Texas obviously has a better won/loss record over the past four years.

[EastTexasHog]

This is a debate that has raged on for some time now and like many of you, I have always been of the opinion that the SEC was the best and toughest conference between the two.

After doing a little research, here is what I found.

Over the last four years, the average rank for recruiting classes in the Big 12 has been #33. The SEC has averaged #25. However, both conferences averaged #30 last year, so the Big 12 appears to trying to close the gap in talent.

In Strength of Schedule over the past four years, the Big 12 has averaged .553%. The SEC has averaged .564%. For the 2008 season the Big 12 came in at .548% to the SEC's .541%.

In terms of win percentage, again over the last four years, the Big 12 has averaged 57.66% to the SEC's 59.0%. For this past season, the Big 12 exceeded the win percentage of the SEC with a 59.57% to a 58.44%.

If you take these three categories and apply each individual team's averages as opposed to doing it as an entire conference, the order of rank would come out this way:

1. Florida
2. Georgia
3. Oklahoma
4. Alabama
5. LSU
6. Texas
7. Auburn
8. Tennessee
9. Nebraska
10. S. Carolina
11. Texas A&M
12. Ole Miss
13. Arkansas
14. Texas Tech
15. Okla State
16. Colorado
17. Missouri
18. K-State
19. Miss State
20. Kansas
21. Kentucky
22. Baylor
23. Iowa State
24. Vanderbilt

It appears that there is no doubt that the SEC overall comes out ahead of the Big 12 in recruiting, SOS and win percentage over the last four years. But it also appears that the Big 12 is catching up and trying to make a play to displace the SEC.

Notice where the majority of the SEC teams are positioned. Will we maintain our superiority and how many SEC bowl teams do you expect to see win?

Stats can say anything.  LSU is a good example.  They went from first to worst.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Stats can say anything.  LSU is a good example.  They went from first to worst.

Stats CAN say anything, and usually do......which is why coaching staffs have a tendency to pay attention to them when scouting other teams. But geez, what do they know and why would we want to check them out?

As for LSU, what really hurt them was going into this season without an experienced QB as a playmaker. That might have made a significant difference for them.

[benthere]

Hell yeah!!!!!

We are the SEC!!!!!!!!!!

Frank that.

You think teams like Florida, 'Bama, LSU rely on their conference affiliation to justify their hardon?

Losers do that.  The Hogs have been doing just that for 10 years...SEC! SEC!

The SEC is great...but last time I checked, it's the school and not the conference that gets the props.  Relying on the conferencing to prop oneselve's up is a serious case of vaginitis.

Vanderbilt must be proud.

Stop this "SEC" crap.  Best conference no doubt....but that doesn't sate my Hog love.

Who gives a real crap about the Big 12 or the SEC?  When it comes down to it, I'm all hog, SEC be darned.

Hogs stood out (fans and team) in the SWC and had top 20 teams more times than not from 1958 - 1991....sadly,many of our Not Too Bright fans have become delusional losers since we joined the SEC.... But at least we play in the toughest football conference and have great (all together now)...facilities. That and 75 cents will get you a bad cup of coffee.