Pitching Questions/Rotation Discussion

[PigWig]

What's the latest on ZachJack?  Is he going to begin the year as an SP or RP?  I know McKinney will start the year on a pitch count, but will he be ready to give us 5-6 innings at the Houston tourney, or are they planning to bring him along slower than that?  I think an ideal rotation by SEC play would be:

Friday- McKinney
Saturday- Taccolini
Sunday- Teague

LR/Lefty Specialist- Rogers

Closer- Jackson

[Kevin]

Teague is middle relief, according to dvh

[bulldog04]

A frosh like Blaine Knight or a JUCO guy as Sunday starter

[JackMcQueen]

What's the latest on ZachJack?  Is he going to begin the year as an SP or RP?

As of right now he's the closer. DVH really wants him in that role.

[A_R_K_A_N_S_A_S]

Pretty sure all of the starters and middle relief will be on a pitch count around 50 at the beginning and then working them up from there.

[pigture perfect]

I hope our conference foes get tired of a diet of Big Mac and Taco's. 😜

[DiamondHogFan]

Sorry guys, haven't been around for the offseason.

Are all pitchers healthy...or close to 100%?  Mainly McKinney and Taco?  I'm assuming they are, just been a long time since I have seen an update.  Please don't bash me, I'm sure all of the info is here or there somewhere.  Just a brief health synopsis of our rotation would be nice.

Thanks in advance, and Go OmaHogs!!

[jry04]

Sorry guys, haven't been around for the offseason.

Are all pitchers healthy...or close to 100%?  Mainly McKinney and Taco?  I'm assuming they are, just been a long time since I have seen an update.  Please don't bash me, I'm sure all of the info is here or there somewhere.  Just a brief health synopsis of our rotation would be nice.

Thanks in advance, and Go OmaHogs!!

McKinney will be ready to go, but will be on a pitch count early. Taco is good to go. Teague is dealing with arm fatigue, so he won't start. I haven't had a chance to hear whether he will pitch at all this week, though. Someone else will probably have more information on that.

[dotnet]

Teague is dealing with arm fatigue, so he won't start. I haven't had a chance to hear whether he will pitch at all this week, though.

Not sure what you mean by "starting".  As of now, Teague isn't going to be in the rotation this year regardless of his health.  He and the coaches both like him coming out of the bullpen. 

Not sure if or how much he'll pitch this weekend either... due to "health"

[ricepig]

Not sure what you mean by "starting".  As of now, Teague isn't going to be in the rotation this year regardless of his health.  He and the coaches both like him coming out of the bullpen. 

Not sure if or how much he'll pitch this weekend either... due to "health"

I hate it when we have a "tired" arm/shoulder even before the season starts, it usually doesn't bode well for their season. Hopefully, it's just that and nothing more.

[FOTP]

Pitching will be very touchy as we start the season; offense will have to carry the slack early on.  VH said he'd have guys "getting healthy on the mound" to start the season, and that's probably an understatement.  I know we are saying so-and-so is ready to go, but that's far from reality.  Hopefully some of these guys have good outings this weekend, but I don't think they even know what to expect.  I know the scrimmages have been rough so far (for pitchers coming back from injury), but it's a process and they'll need time. 

Not only do you have to deal with getting the actual injury healed, but then you have to deal with throwing again and getting your arm in shape.  A lot of time when you've taken extended time off from throwing you will deal with soreness and fatigue that you wouldn't otherwise deal with when on a constant throwing/resting schedule.  You feel OK one day, next day your elbow is completely inflamed and you can't throw.  Lots of uncertainties with the pitching as the season opens, just have to hope everything goes well for the guys as they are working their way back into pitching shape.

Not meaning to sound doom and gloom, just wanted to give you guys a little more insight into where things are at.

[JackMcQueen]

At Media Day DVH said if the season started today the rotation would be McKinney/Taccolini/Knight (Not sure if exactly in that order but I guess we'll find out for sure in the next few days)

[jry04]

Not sure what you mean by "starting".  As of now, Teague isn't going to be in the rotation this year regardless of his health.  He and the coaches both like him coming out of the bullpen. 

Not sure if or how much he'll pitch this weekend either... due to "health"

Not sure why you quoted the word "starting" when I never said it. I said Teague is not going to start. That is a fact.

[jry04]

Pitching will be very touchy as we start the season; offense will have to carry the slack early on.  VH said he'd have guys "getting healthy on the mound" to start the season, and that's probably an understatement.  I know we are saying so-and-so is ready to go, but that's far from reality.  Hopefully some of these guys have good outings this weekend, but I don't think they even know what to expect.  I know the scrimmages have been rough so far (for pitchers coming back from injury), but it's a process and they'll need time. 

Not only do you have to deal with getting the actual injury healed, but then you have to deal with throwing again and getting your arm in shape.  A lot of time when you've taken extended time off from throwing you will deal with soreness and fatigue that you wouldn't otherwise deal with when on a constant throwing/resting schedule.  You feel OK one day, next day your elbow is completely inflamed and you can't throw.  Lots of uncertainties with the pitching as the season opens, just have to hope everything goes well for the guys as they are working their way back into pitching shape.

Not meaning to sound doom and gloom, just wanted to give you guys a little more insight into where things are at.

I know this is going to rub people the wrong way, so I am prepared for the backlash. You seem like a very knowledgeable poster, and I hope you continue to post. However, I can't help but sense some animosity/negativity in your posts towards the staff. Are you a relative of Keaton's? You seem to have a grasp on his situation, but many of your "doom and gloom" posts as you put it haven't been completely accurate. You originally said there was no way Keaton was going to be ready to go this season, and had a back and forth with me about it.

Trust VanHorn, he won't be ready for the season.  Surgery was much more than just a standard labrum repair, he has one chance to rehab this injury properly.  Look for sometime early in SEC play, that is the date the Dr has set for him provided everything goes well with rehab.

This was in response to me saying Van Horn felt McKinney would be ready, and that I trusted this was accurate. You sarcastically told me to trust him, but that he won't be ready for the season. He is on a pitch count, but he is pitching so that is ready to me.

8 months is mid-March, beginning of SEC play; then however long it takes to get the kinks out, I assume he'll be doing to a mid-week game or two to start.

This was in response to me saying the standard recovery time for an injury like this would not last until SEC play, but you insisted I had no clue and should drop the "internet dr schtick." Yet, you just said the healing process is over. I said worse case, without set backs, it would be 8 months/mid-February and he would be ready for the season.
So it turns out Keaton is in fact throwing again in February like I said, with zero inside knowledge other than some background in training and rehabbing from my 7 years of school. Huh, who knew?

He very well may go 8 months, but that still puts him ready for the season. The middle of next season would be a 10 month recovery. Only time it takes that long to recover from this type of injury is by re-injurying during the rehab, or complications from the surgery. Again, I am not trying to argue with you because ultimately I do not know the exact nature of his injury.

Here is some of what i said.


Again, I am not trying to derail a thread, but more just wonder were you wrong or did a miracle happen and everything just turned out for the best for him to be ready to play? You seemed pretty sure he wouldn't be ready, and I honestly don't mean this in a sarcastic way, but you definitely seem to be connected in some way. I know we exchanged some PMs, and so I believe you are credible. I think we can both agree that we are glad his recovery went well and he has a chance to pitch from week 1.

[FOTP]

If I remember correctly you were asserting that hip injuries don't take more than 4-6 months so he'd be fine for the season?

Initially VH said he wouldn't be ready for the season, that was based off of the Dr's initial assessment of 8 month rehab (that's why I must have said to trust VH, instead of arguing with you over the injury and it's rehab timeline).  His rehab was better than Dr anticipated; strength and flexibility numbers were good enough at 7 months that he was comfortable clearing him at that point (instead of 8 months).  The mid-July surgery with the initial 8 month rehab would have put it right at SEC play.  The Dr was very adamant when he cleared him that his hip would not feel normal for a while, but that it was healed and needed to start putting full stress on it.  As I mentioned in a previous post he just started playing catch over 100 feet and long tossing.  College baseball has no minor leagues and the season is short, so makes sense to get healthy and work through the kinks during NC play, so was just noting it'll be a process to get where he wants to be by SEC play.  That is all.

Sorry if you feel I haven't been "accurate", was just passing along some extra info to the guys on the board in posts that are discussing info I know about (mainly to add clarity).  I enjoy following the discussions, even though I don't really partake, and there are some very intelligent BB guys on here.  If I have to deal with you trying to tell me I'm wrong about everything I'll just keep to observing.

[FOTP]

So, do you play one on TV? Lol.

Ha! I don't ever play one, I just listen to what the Dr that performed the surgery tells us!

[jry04]

I'm guessing you pulled me in to past discussions with massively douchie comments like this.  Message board doctors, we're all impressed.

I was not trying to impress anyone. Just pointing out you said multiple times very clearly that he would not be able to pitch until SEC play, and that DVH was wrong. I said the AVERAGE recovery was 4-6 months, but could take up to 8. Clearly said it multiple times, while also stating I knew nothing other than reports on Keaton's injury. Now, you are saying DVH is jot telling the truth about some of our pitchers being healthy. Forgive me if I misread that. I just take it that you think DVH is bs'ing with everything he says, when it is clear you weren't exactly spot on with earlier comments yourself. Like I said, you seemed so sure that he would not play until conference, so I was curious what changed.

You won't have to worry about me trying to prove you wrong on everything.

[FOTP]

You misread that, I said listen to VH, as he was basically saying exactly what I was telling you.

Whether it was initially when he said he wouldn't be ready for start of season, or more recently when he said pitchers "would be getting healthy on the mound".  That means that guys arent fully healthy, and would be working through the kinks to start the season.  He also mentioned smaller than normal pitch counts.  At no point did I say he wasn't telling the truth; actually, he is dropping hints about how our guys are still getting healthy, and I was just adding some additional details.

I suspect you were coming into this looking for some type of back and forth and read it how you wanted to?

[Ebolin]

Projected rotation

1. Keaton McKinney
2. Dominic Taccolini
3. Blaine Knight

Projected Bullpen

Closer: Zach Jackson
First reliever: James Teague
Second reliever: Josh Alberius
Third reliever: Doug Willey
Fourth reliever: Cannon Chadwick
Left-handed specialist: Weston Moore

That's what I'm going with. Now, to be clear: this is perfect-world scenario. AKA - it assumes full health. As for who the midweek starters might be, search me. Not a clue. Something I'll find out Sunday, probably, when Dave previews Mississippi Valley State.

[dotnet]

Not sure why you quoted the word "starting" when I never said it. I said Teague is not going to start. That is a fact.

You said the following:

Teague is dealing with arm fatigue, so he won't start.

You made teague starting dependent on the health of his arm.  I was pointing out that the health of his arm has nothing to do with him starting or not. 

I only quoted "starting" to give you the benefit of the doubt that you were mentioning starting to mean start the year and not start in the rotation

[SPAL]

Chadwick should be a weapon this year. I was REALLY impressed by him in the fall.

[southarkhog06]

Chadwick should be a weapon this year. I was REALLY impressed by him in the fall.

this is great to hear

[PigWig]

Don't sleep on Rogers either.  Having a big-time lefty will be huge for us.  I think he could be our best southpaw since the Smyly/Keuchel years.

[Kevin]

Chadwick should be a weapon this year. I was REALLY impressed by him in the fall.

hope he can throw strikes this year

[SPAL]

hope he can throw strikes this year

I know we said the same thing about him last year. But he was easily the most consistent guy I saw in the fall. Strike after strike....

[ricepig]

I know we said the same thing about him last year. But he was easily the most consistent guy I saw in the fall. Strike after strike....

I'm looking forward to the season starting and getting to watch this group develop. We have more options this year's, hopefully better one's, too.

[lefty08]

You said the following:

You made teague starting dependent on the health of his arm.  I was pointing out that the health of his arm has nothing to do with him starting or not. 

I only quoted "starting" to give you the benefit of the doubt that you were mentioning starting to mean start the year and not start in the rotation

You don't think Teague could start some games midweek?  I do

[dotnet]

You don't think Teague could start some games midweek?  I do

Oh, I think teague has the stuff to do anything. But dvh seems set on him being in the bullpen. I thought he'd be in the rotation during the fall.

The most important thing is always to win weekend series in the sec. If dvh thinks he is the second best arm out of the bullpen, then his primary role will be out of the bullpen on the weekend.

Things can change and you often need four started in a regional. So who knows as the year goes on.

[Ebolin]

Dave just laughed when asked about who the midweek starters would be in the early-season. He's playing that quite close to the vest. Most of us think it will be freshmen, ultimately. He suggested it might be some upperclassmen early and then freshmen later. That's an educated guess, though. He didn't tip much yesterday.

[ricepig]

Oh, I think teague has the stuff to do anything. But dvh seems set on him being in the bullpen. I thought he'd be in the rotation during the fall.

The most important thing is always to win weekend series in the sec. If dvh thinks he is the second best arm out of the bullpen, then his primary role will be out of the bullpen on the weekend.

Things can change and you often need four started in a regional. So who knows as the year goes on.

He seemed to indicate that Teague has electric stuff, that he was a "full" effort type pitcher and was better suited for 2-3 innings of relief. He thought he had to keep some in the tank as a starter to last 5+ innings.

[Ebolin]

He seemed to indicate that Teague has electric stuff, that he was a "full" effort type pitcher and was better suited for 2-3 innings of relief. He thought he had to keep some in the tank as a starter to last 5+ innings.

Teague said as much.

"As we progress I think my  stuff is kind of more associated with a bullpen guy. I have a good mix, but I have two pitches that are dominantly better than the rest. I think out of the bullpen you can play that better than if you were a starter."

[dotnet]

He seemed to indicate that Teague has electric stuff, that he was a "full" effort type pitcher and was better suited for 2-3 innings of relief. He thought he had to keep some in the tank as a starter to last 5+ innings.

Yeah - Teague seems like the pitcher who will have pitched once early in a regional and towards the end will start a game and be told to go out and give as many innings as he can and see what happens.