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Eddie Sutton Not On HOF Finals List

Started by chiefhawg, February 18, 2017, 11:56:07 am

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chiefhawg

February 18, 2017, 11:56:07 am

Atlhogfan1

February 18, 2017, 11:58:36 am #1
Did you miss Sidney is a finalist?!
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 
 

Atlhogfan1

February 18, 2017, 12:12:30 pm #2
"Other first-time Hall of Fame finalists include longtime referee Hugh Evans, Connecticut star Rebecca Lobo, two-time NBA scoring champion Tracy McGrady, five-time All-Star Sidney Moncrief, Baylor women's coach Kim Mulkey, Kansas coach Bill Self and two-time NBA champion coach Rudy Tomjanovich."

Moncrief deserves the respect and attention for this honor from our fans.  Hope he makes it.
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

McKdaddy

February 18, 2017, 12:20:42 pm #3
Would love for Sid to get in.
Don't buy upgrades, ride up grades.

"You are everything that is wrong with this place . . . Ban me"

"CPI, ex-food and energy, is only good for an anorexic pedestrian"--Art Cashin

Torqued pork

February 18, 2017, 12:32:04 pm #4
Quote from: McKdaddy on February 18, 2017, 12:20:42 pm
Would love for Sid to get in.
Sid is our Lance Alworth of basketball. Not as flashy as Bambi, but enough grit, hustle, and smarts to make up for it.

PORKULATOR

February 18, 2017, 01:47:54 pm #5
Sid is my favorite all time. Also, if Eddie could've not liked 'The Drink' so publicly,  he'd be in.
Everytime I reach a goal or achieve something new in life, someone's beat me there and wrote f♡€% you all over it - JD Salinger
I've got a fever and the only perscription...  is more cowbell.- THE Bruce Dickenson.

Dwight_K_Shrute

February 18, 2017, 02:03:05 pm #6
Quote from: PORKULATOR on February 18, 2017, 01:47:54 pm
Sid is my favorite all time. Also, if Eddie could've not liked 'The Drink' so publicly,  he'd be in.

OFFS should have nothing to do with it.  Where does he rank in all time wins?  480 games above .500  Took how many schools to the dance?  I'm not a huge Sutton fan due to how he left Arkansas, but I can still appreciate his accomplishments, his place in CBB history.  It's just stupid that he's not a finalist.  Well it's stupid he's not already in the HOF, it's ridiculous he's not at least a finalist.
Little known fact, but prior to settling on Guantanamo, the Pentagon wanted to house terror suspects at War Memorial Stadium.  It was deemed to be cruel and unusual punishment and in violation of the Geneva Convention.

FineAsSwine

February 18, 2017, 02:10:53 pm #7
Quote from: Dwight_K_Shrute on February 18, 2017, 02:03:05 pm
OFFS should have nothing to do with it.  Where does he rank in all time wins?  480 games above .500  Took how many schools to the dance?  I'm not a huge Sutton fan due to how he left Arkansas, but I can still appreciate his accomplishments, his place in CBB history.  It's just stupid that he's not a finalist.  Well it's stupid he's not already in the HOF, it's ridiculous he's not at least a finalist.

If he had made the finals a time or two, even without winning a championship, he would be in there. This is what is keeping him out, IMO.

Seems to have been his best chance to make the HOF in what was considered to be a weak field this year.  To not even be considered a finalist in this class doesn't seem to bode well for future entry.

FineAsSwine

February 18, 2017, 02:12:32 pm #8
Congrats to Super Sid! One of my favorite Hogs of all time. Should be a shoo in.

Hollywood_HOGan45

February 18, 2017, 02:20:29 pm #9
Another reason to hate Kentucky.

Pig Worshipper

February 18, 2017, 02:53:30 pm #10

Eddie Sutton should be in the Hall of Fame but I won't crawl on my hands and knees to Springfield in protest if he doesn't make it.

East Clintwood

February 18, 2017, 03:19:24 pm #11
Great coach but he couldn't keep a job. ;)
Any dog can be a seeing eye dog if you don't care where you're going.

          Like  blows - Bring back Karma

Inhogswetrust

February 18, 2017, 04:57:40 pm #12
Quote from: Dwight_K_Shrute on February 18, 2017, 02:03:05 pm
OFFS should have nothing to do with it.  Where does he rank in all time wins?  480 games above .500  Took how many schools to the dance?  I'm not a huge Sutton fan due to how he left Arkansas, but I can still appreciate his accomplishments, his place in CBB history.  It's just stupid that he's not a finalist.  Well it's stupid he's not already in the HOF, it's ridiculous he's not at least a finalist.

Exactly. There are some well known coaches and players in the HOF that were racists, drunks or cheaters.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi
 

ErieHog

February 18, 2017, 05:54:59 pm #13
Quote from: Inhogswetrust on February 18, 2017, 04:57:40 pm
Exactly. There are some well known coaches and players in the HOF that were racists, drunks or cheaters.

Character matters.   Eddie's lack of it, hurts him.     You can't get away with it now.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

Inhogswetrust

February 19, 2017, 02:50:36 am #14
Quote from: ErieHog on February 18, 2017, 05:54:59 pm
Character matters.   Eddie's lack of it, hurts him.     You can't get away with it now.

Eddie has his demons just like everyone else. So do those already in the HOF already. To think his demons are worse than them is wrong. To think his makes him lack character is even more wrong.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Iwastherein1969

February 19, 2017, 03:39:21 am #15
I believe that if we all were up for the HOF in our favorite sport for something terrific we had done over a long period of time in that given sport and the world knew everything what we had done in life, not a single person in here badmouthing Eddie Sutton would make the HOF based on this criteria. We all have faults. We all do wrong things when we know we can get away with doing them. Yet when it comes to judging others alongside ourselves, it's the other sorry SOB who fails to make the cut. Eddie Sutton deserves to be in the BASKETBALL HALL OF FAME. Now if we were choosing people for the "GOOD GUY HALL OF FAME" maybe not so much. But then, who in here can honestly say they would make it ?  Sutton built the UA into a national basketball power and went on to do very well at his Alma Mater, OSU. Put the man in.
The long Grey line will never fail our country.

rude1

February 19, 2017, 07:31:25 am #16
Let's see, there was the KY incident were he was coach and there was rampant cheating that landed the program in big trouble. Then it's on to Ok State where he continues his life long love of the bottle that cumulates in him being falling down drunk publicly, gets in his car on his way to catch team plane to a game, and has an accident. These things may have something to do with him not getting in.

Inhogswetrust

February 19, 2017, 08:50:22 am #17
Quote from: rude1 on February 19, 2017, 07:31:25 am
Let's see, there was the KY incident were he was coach and there was rampant cheating that landed the program in big trouble. Then it's on to Ok State where he continues his life long love of the bottle that cumulates in him being falling down drunk publicly, gets in his car on his way to catch team plane to a game, and has an accident. These things may have something to do with him not getting in.

If anyone thinks that at KY the coach has control over any "cheating" they would be mistaken.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

rude1

February 19, 2017, 09:50:25 am #18
Quote from: Inhogswetrust on February 19, 2017, 08:50:22 am
If anyone thinks that at KY the coach has control over any "cheating" they would be mistaken.
He was the coach, it happened under his watch by assistants he hired. Being drunk and not knowing what's going on in your program is no excuse.

ChicoHog

February 19, 2017, 10:06:01 am #19
Still think he was one of the the best in game coaches ever.  Always made great adjustments.  A definite HOF coach IMO.   

IronMountainHog

February 19, 2017, 11:02:04 am #20
Quote from: rude1 on February 19, 2017, 09:50:25 am
He was the coach, it happened under his watch by assistants he hired. Being drunk and not knowing what's going on in your program is no excuse.
He had no clue his head assistant at Oklahoma State, his appointee to turn the job over to was a drug addict. This speaks volumes when you are around him every day and you have idea? The scariest part was that head assistant was his son Sean....

passinghog

February 19, 2017, 12:33:27 pm #21
Deservedly so. Completely overrated coach, imo.

Atlhogfan1

February 19, 2017, 12:39:24 pm #22
A shame some are so obsessed with the Sutton debate that Sidney was overlooked in the OP and most of the thread.   Good someone created a separate thread later in the day yesterday. 

IMO Sutton would be in with a NC or at least a NCG appearance or two as said earlier in the thread.  No comment on all of that other stuff as I see both sides.   
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

ErieHog

February 19, 2017, 12:41:54 pm #23
When you are a career drunk, who oversees cheating and the downfall of one of the major programs of the sport,   breaks a woman's back with an accident that happened while he was driving drunk, then hands the keys to another program over to an assistant who nearly kills himself with drugs.....

Yeah.    You get to wait in line, regardless of your not-that-remarkable without any signature win total,  no championship self.

Its an injustice when Michael Jordan or a Tim Duncan is kept waiting for a HOF induction;  it isn't when George Gervin or Nate Thurmond does.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."
 

HOGINTENNESSEE

February 19, 2017, 01:15:03 pm #24
Quote from: ErieHog on February 19, 2017, 12:41:54 pm
When you are a career drunk, who oversees cheating and the downfall of one of the major programs of the sport,   breaks a woman's back with an accident that happened while he was driving drunk, then hands the keys to another program over to an assistant who nearly kills himself with drugs.....

Yeah.    You get to wait in line, regardless of your not-that-remarkable without any signature win total,  no championship self.

Its an injustice when Michael Jordan or a Tim Duncan is kept waiting for a HOF induction;  it isn't when George Gervin or Nate Thurmond does.

So not a Champion of life?

ErieHog

February 19, 2017, 01:16:58 pm #25
Quote from: HOGINTENNESSEE on February 19, 2017, 01:15:03 pm
So not a Champion of life?

Eddie has enablers, not friends.     That's how he got to this point.    Life champion?  No.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

sadhogfan

February 19, 2017, 01:32:40 pm #26
Quote from: ErieHog on February 19, 2017, 01:16:58 pm
Eddie has enablers, not friends.     That's how he got to this point.    Life champion?  No.

Your hobby horses crack me up.

ErieHog

February 19, 2017, 01:39:28 pm #27
Quote from: sadhogfan on February 19, 2017, 01:32:40 pm
Your hobby horses crack me up.

More the killing of silly sacred cows.   
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

Inhogswetrust

February 19, 2017, 02:57:34 pm #28
Quote from: rude1 on February 19, 2017, 09:50:25 am
He was the coach, it happened under his watch by assistants he hired. Being drunk and not knowing what's going on in your program is no excuse.

Agree. I have always been on record that the coach has to be held responsible. That doesn't mean they always have control over all aspects or situations. That's one reason why quite a few schools have gotten into trouble. People associated with them not coaching have too much control and influence. It's not as prevalent today but still happens.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Inhogswetrust

February 19, 2017, 03:03:14 pm #29
Quote from: ErieHog on February 19, 2017, 01:16:58 pm
Eddie has enablers, not friends.     That's how he got to this point.    Life champion?  No.

100% completely wrong. He has a LOT of true friends. Myself included.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

ErieHog

February 19, 2017, 03:12:06 pm #30
Quote from: Inhogswetrust on February 19, 2017, 03:03:14 pm
100% completely wrong. He has a LOT of true friends. Myself included.

This conversation is a ton of you making excuses for his horrific behavior--  behavior that left people hospitalized, lives and careers wrecked, and ole Eddie 'aw, shucks'-ing his way into a reputation contrary to his conduct.

It is the perfect example of enabling.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

rude1

February 19, 2017, 04:36:53 pm #31
Quote from: ErieHog on February 19, 2017, 03:12:06 pm
This conversation is a ton of you making excuses for his horrific behavior--  behavior that left people hospitalized, lives and careers wrecked, and ole Eddie 'aw, shucks'-ing his way into a reputation contrary to his conduct.

It is the perfect example of enabling.
I agree with this. There is no way the head coach is showing up drunk to practice, games, and every where else, yet those close to him never recognize there is a problem. Anyone who was truly close to him should have been able to spot this from a mile away, instead there obviously had to be lots of looking the other way for it to eventually end with him so drunk he couldn't stand, yet some how allowed to get in his car, go down the street and nearly take someone else's life.

daBoar

February 19, 2017, 04:51:57 pm #32
Quote from: ErieHog on February 19, 2017, 12:41:54 pm
When you are a career drunk, who oversees cheating and the downfall of one of the major programs of the sport,   breaks a woman's back with an accident that happened while he was driving drunk, then hands the keys to another program over to an assistant who nearly kills himself with drugs.....

Yeah.    You get to wait in line,
How about some compassion.  And, how about some affection for the beginning of something great at Arkansas.  No way, Nolan comes to Arkansas, if there were no Sutton. No way Nolan wins the 94 championship without the great teams Sutton pieced together at Arkansas, and the vibe he created.  To me, the win in Albuquerque against UCLA was the all-time greatest at Arkansas............it's what paved the way for the win in NC against Duke 7 years later.  No one, absolutely no one,could conceive that that great Bruin team would go down in the Pit. It happened, and one of the greatest games I've seen.  It was worth the zero I got on my Stat test the next morning.  WPS.

ErieHog

February 19, 2017, 05:05:51 pm #33
Quote from: daBoar on February 19, 2017, 04:51:57 pm
How about some compassion.  And, how about some affection for the beginning of something great at Arkansas.  No way, Nolan comes to Arkansas, if there were no Sutton. No way Nolan wins the 94 championship without the great teams Sutton pieced together at Arkansas, and the vibe he created.  To me, the win in Albuquerque against UCLA was the all-time greatest at Arkansas............it's what paved the way for the win in NC against Duke 7 years later.  No one, absolutely no one,could conceive that that great Bruin team would go down in the Pit. It happened, and one of the greatest games I've seen.  It was worth the zero I got on my Stat test the next morning.  WPS.

Sure, have compassion for Eddie the person.   Don't clean his basketball legacy up, because you feel bad for a guy with a drinking problem, though.

No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

IronMountainHog

February 19, 2017, 05:23:45 pm #34
Quote from: daBoar on February 19, 2017, 04:51:57 pm
How about some compassion.  And, how about some affection for the beginning of something great at Arkansas.  No way, Nolan comes to Arkansas, if there were no Sutton. No way Nolan wins the 94 championship without the great teams Sutton pieced together at Arkansas, and the vibe he created.  To me, the win in Albuquerque against UCLA was the all-time greatest at Arkansas............it's what paved the way for the win in NC against Duke 7 years later.  No one, absolutely no one,could conceive that that great Bruin team would go down in the Pit. It happened, and one of the greatest games I've seen.  It was worth the zero I got on my Stat test the next morning.  WPS.
Do you have compassion for Bobby Petrino?

Inhogswetrust

February 19, 2017, 06:46:24 pm #35
Quote from: ErieHog on February 19, 2017, 03:12:06 pm
This conversation is a ton of you making excuses for his horrific behavior--  behavior that left people hospitalized, lives and careers wrecked, and ole Eddie 'aw, shucks'-ing his way into a reputation contrary to his conduct.

It is the perfect example of enabling.

Not making excuses at all. He has made mistakes. Who hasn't. IF his outside behavior is an issue as I said it should also be an issue for a LOT of people already in the HOF. You have let your feelings towards him be known since the first time you posted about him. Also your avatar tells everyone exactly how you feel. Some of us feel differently and are not making excuses. Simply saying IF they judge him for that then they should also judge some already in the HOF the same way and they appear to not have. 
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Inhogswetrust

February 19, 2017, 06:49:26 pm #36
Quote from: ErieHog on February 19, 2017, 05:05:51 pm
Sure, have compassion for Eddie the person.   Don't clean his basketball legacy up, because you feel bad for a guy with a drinking problem, though.



Some can separate his career accomplishments from his personal life. For all the mistakes he did he has also made a tremendously positive impact on a LOT of players and others. Apparently the HOF voters can do that separation for others but for some reason not him. We simply want consistency.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Inhogswetrust

February 19, 2017, 06:50:55 pm #37
Quote from: rude1 on February 19, 2017, 04:36:53 pm
I agree with this. There is no way the head coach is showing up drunk to practice, games, and every where else, yet those close to him never recognize there is a problem. Anyone who was truly close to him should have been able to spot this from a mile away, instead there obviously had to be lots of looking the other way for it to eventually end with him so drunk he couldn't stand, yet some how allowed to get in his car, go down the street and nearly take someone else's life.

What makes you think others didn't see his problems and tried to help him and not enable him. I personally know of some that did try to help him and does not condone some of his issues.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

daBoar

February 19, 2017, 07:00:55 pm #38
Quote from: IronMountainHog on February 19, 2017, 05:23:45 pm
Do you have compassion for Bobby Petrino?
I'm very forgiving; he was our coach, not our pastor.  (And, he won.)

12247

February 19, 2017, 07:26:44 pm #39
Eddie was a great BB coach for Arkansas and then continued to do well past us.  He had and may still have a serious problem that cost him and others dearly.  Having the wreck, I believe, in a OSU owned vehicle and hurting at least one person has likely cost him in the eyes of the HOF. 

I agree that there are some already in the HOF that have issues and some that are coming up that have issues.  I think Eddie may still make the HOF.

DeltaBoy

February 19, 2017, 08:43:57 pm #40
Sad Eddie not in yet.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Slater

February 19, 2017, 08:49:48 pm #41
Self induced for sure, he was a great coach, forever tainted by the Kentucky scandal and the end at Oklahoma State
FASTEST 40 ILUVMIKE

greasy_corner

February 19, 2017, 09:37:31 pm #42
Maybe he can crawl to the Naismith HOF? 

I'm old enough to remember listening fondly to Coach Sutton's teams on a transistor radio.   

I don't consider him a razorback anymore, so I'll leave the pandering to the bluebloods and Okie-states.  He belongs to them now. 

I'm putting all my energy into rooting for Sidney.  I don't have a vote, so that's all I can do. 
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