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Author Topic: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?  (Read 2066 times)

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HawgWild

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Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« on: November 13, 2017, 12:57:06 pm »

Hasn't JL pretty much accommodated whatever CBB wanted with regard to staff salaries, etc. and let him work his plan? JFB was known to meddle in the coaches under him but that's not been JL's style.

I guess what I'm saying is that CBB has had ample opportunity to build his own program here and it's not worked out. And, there's no one to blame but himself.
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smb

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2017, 01:00:04 pm »

Hasn't JL pretty much accommodated whatever CBB wanted with regard to staff salaries, etc. and let him work his plan? JFB was known to meddle in the coaches under him but that's not been JL's style.

I guess what I'm saying is that CBB has had ample opportunity to build his own program here and it's not worked out. And, there's no one to blame but himself.
Dilly! Dilly!
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Razorbackers

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2017, 01:00:11 pm »

Hasn't JL pretty much accommodated whatever CBB wanted with regard to staff salaries, etc. and let him work his plan? JFB was known to meddle in the coaches under him but that's not been JL's style.

I guess what I'm saying is that CBB has had ample opportunity to build his own program here and it's not worked out. And, there's no one to blame but himself.

For sure. In fact, I'd say CBB had the fans on his side as well for the most part until late last season. Remember how good it felt going 8-5 and winning back to back bowls? We all thought the program was trending up.

5 years is plenty of time to establish yourself as a HC. It just didn't work out for Bret. Shame, I like the guy a lot. Whoever is next will probably get at least 4 if not 5 years as well.
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010HogFan

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2017, 01:01:03 pm »

An Uncommonly fair shake
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East Clintwood

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2017, 01:01:42 pm »

Hasn't JL pretty much accommodated whatever CBB wanted with regard to staff salaries, etc. and let him work his plan? JFB was known to meddle in the coaches under him but that's not been JL's style.

I guess what I'm saying is that CBB has had ample opportunity to build his own program here and it's not worked out. And, there's no one to blame but himself.


Jeff Long is also to blame.

Both for bringing him here and for letting him slide along with no accountability,
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hogsanity

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2017, 01:02:12 pm »

He has been treated fairly. A good hire that just did not work out. It happens ALOT in sports. Guy wins one place, goes to another and does not win nearly as much.
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smb

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2017, 01:02:55 pm »

For sure. In fact, I'd say CBB had the fans on his side as well for the most part until late last season. Remember how good it felt going 8-5 and winning back to back bowls? We all thought the program was trending up.

5 years is plenty of time to establish yourself as a HC. It just didn't work out for Bret. Shame, I like the guy a lot. Whoever is next will probably get at least 4 if not 5 years as well.
Tennessee didn't even give Butch Jones 5.
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Razorbackers

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2017, 01:07:16 pm »

Tennessee didn't even give Butch Jones 5.

Which is crazy, but he also is on a losing streak to every team in the SEC right now. I understand firing him, I don't think they should have done it before the season was out, but he hasn't even won an SEC game yet...in the east.
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Sooie71923

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2017, 01:08:22 pm »

I’ve Been a huge CBB supporter since his hire. He did great things in the B10.

But now I can finally admit, CBB has had a fair shot at the Arkansas job. I never expected him to pull in top talent but to get us to 7-9 wins consistently was my hope.

Time to give another coach a chance and hopefully JL gets it right this time. Not sure how much longer Arkansas can stand to keep firing coaches. We must have stability.

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Calling All Hogs

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2017, 01:10:19 pm »

What Stan Heath and Bielema have shown us is that if a coach, in his first year, completely tanks well below where the program was at, he is probably not going to work out even if subsequent years show gradual improvement.
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HF#1

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2017, 01:14:13 pm »

What Stan Heath and Bielema have shown us is that if a coach, in his first year, completely tanks well below where the program was at, he is probably not going to work out even if subsequent years show gradual improvement.

The 17 game SEC losing streak was excessive.
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hogsanity

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2017, 01:18:11 pm »

What Stan Heath and Bielema have shown us is that if a coach, in his first year, completely tanks well below where the program was at, he is probably not going to work out even if subsequent years show gradual improvement.

Umm, BP went 5-7 his 1st year after HDN won 18 games in the previous 2.
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Gonzo

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2017, 01:23:16 pm »

I’ve Been a huge CBB supporter since his hire. He did great things in the B10.

But now I can finally admit, CBB has had a fair shot at the Arkansas job. I never expected him to pull in top talent but to get us to 7-9 wins consistently was my hope.

Time to give another coach a chance and hopefully JL gets it right this time. Not sure how much longer Arkansas can stand to keep firing coaches. We must have stability.




The Hogs have basically had 3 coaches in the last two decades (interim JL was simply a bandaid). That's not very volatile in today's college game.


Go Hogs!
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rzrbk4life

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2017, 01:24:03 pm »

5 yrs is plenty of time to get your system, players, etc in place. CBP got it done in 4
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hoglady

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2017, 01:25:55 pm »

He's probably had more $$$ for recruiting and hiring assistants than any coach in Arkansas history.
He's had 5 years.
So yes, I consider that a fair shake.
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jkstock04

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2017, 01:33:10 pm »

I love that people still act like this was a great hire. "Just didn't work out." I hope for nothing more than Jeff Long run out of town for the fraud he is and the damage he has done to our program.

Of course Bielema had a fair shake. He had free reign with little to no winning expectations. His coaching ego has to have gone from swellingly gigantic to minuscule in his time here. What's bad is we will have the "just didn't work out"' crowd push a narrative that if a coach of this "caliber" can't win here most likely an impossibility for any coach. Some of the national media will run with this as well.

The further this goes the more our program looks like Kentucky or Vandy (football wise), instead of where we were middle of the road like South Carolina or Mississippi State. Sad that it has had to come to this. Maybe someone who makes decisions will grow some balls and try and do something about it eventually.
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Hogwild

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2017, 01:38:57 pm »


The Hogs have basically had 3 coaches in the last two decades (interim JL was simply a bandaid). That's not very volatile in today's college game.


Go Hogs!

We are about to have our 5th head coach since '07
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S.A.D.C

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2017, 01:42:14 pm »

Which is crazy, but he also is on a losing streak to every team in the SEC right now. I understand firing him, I don't think they should have done it before the season was out, but he hasn't even won an SEC game yet...in the east.

had to- he was out there burning red shirts and playing players with concussions.  If it is over they need to end it before someone like that does more damage.
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phadedhawg

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2017, 01:45:56 pm »

Bielema got a fair shake and it was good of Jeff Long to give him 5 years.  That tells the next coach that Arkansas is a job that will treat you fairly and give you the time and resources you need before firing you if you aren't meeting expectations. 
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Boss Hog in the Arkansas

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2017, 01:47:03 pm »

An Uncommonly fair shake
One of my football coaches said that if you shake it more than twice...we'll im sure you know the rest
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ModestoHOG63

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2017, 01:49:39 pm »

5 years and a truck load of money............oh yea, he got MORE than a fair shake.
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tomw

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2017, 01:51:27 pm »

what about anderson in baketball?? yalll wanting to give him all the time in the world..6 years now and only 2 ncaa bids and both one and done..6 years is more than ample time but the team has only been mediocre at best
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Bret Squealema

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #22 on: November 13, 2017, 01:52:06 pm »

CBB has been given everything he needs to be successful.  He has shown time and again that he can't handle a program when he doesn't have an Alvarez type influence watching his every move.
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HF#1

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2017, 01:52:15 pm »

what about anderson in baketball?? yalll wanting to give him all the time in the world..6 years now and only 2 ncaa bids and both one and done..6 years is more than ample time but the team has only been mediocre at best

The progression has been pretty obvious and he is recruiting at levels we have seen since Nolan.
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Razorbackers

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #24 on: November 13, 2017, 01:53:24 pm »

what about anderson in baketball?? yalll wanting to give him all the time in the world..6 years now and only 2 ncaa bids and both one and done..6 years is more than ample time but the team has only been mediocre at best

2 tournys in 3 years, like 3 out of 4 after this year, with a top 25 class coming in even after getting outbid for Perry.

I don't think you understand what mediocre means.
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HoginMemphis

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #25 on: November 13, 2017, 01:54:01 pm »

Hasn't JL pretty much accommodated whatever CBB wanted with regard to staff salaries, etc. and let him work his plan? JFB was known to meddle in the coaches under him but that's not been JL's style.

I guess what I'm saying is that CBB has had ample opportunity to build his own program here and it's not worked out. And, there's no one to blame but himself.
Even if it can be argued he has not been given a fair shake, i don't care. You figure out how to make it happen in half a decade even if you have adversity. Path to success is usually blocked by several things. You have to figure out how to get under, over or around them. Bielema not only never figured it out, he cannot even identify a problem. Listening to him, the Razorbacks are #1 in the nation during practices. So he is apparently completely blind to what real talent is and thinks his team is wonderful in practices. Word to Bret: no one gives half a shat what your team does during the week and/or how well or badly they do it. All fans care about is how they perform in games on Saturday.

Bielema could get another 5 years and his SEC record would never improve. He does not understand how to manage a program and hire the right coaches.

As for everyone saying it's a shame because he is a likable and nice guy and he's personable and blah blah blah, I am not influenced by that in the least. I don't like Bielema at all. I don't like losers.
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HF#1

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #26 on: November 13, 2017, 01:54:03 pm »

2 tournys in 3 years, like 3 out of 4 after this year, with a top 25 class coming in even after getting outbid for Perry.

I don't think you understand what mediocre means.

Not to mention 2018 and 2019 are loaded.
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OneTuskOverTheLine™

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #27 on: November 13, 2017, 01:59:06 pm »

I love that people still act like this was a great hire. "Just didn't work out." I hope for nothing more than Jeff Long run out of town for the fraud he is and the damage he has done to our program.

 Of course Bielema had a fair shake. He had free reign with little to no winning expectations. His coaching ego has to have gone from swellingly gigantic to minuscule in his time here. What's bad is we will have the "just didn't work out"' crowd push a narrative that if a coach of this "caliber" can't win here most likely an impossibility for any coach. Some of the national media will run with this as well.

The further this goes the more our program looks like Kentucky or Vandy (football wise), instead of where we were middle of the road like South Carolina or Mississippi State. Sad that it has had to come to this. Maybe someone who makes decisions will grow some balls and try and do something about it eventually.


 This times a thousand, but the first part meh... I thought CBB was an excellent hire judging his record. You may have suspected, but you're not going to sell anyone on the fact that you "knew" CBB would in advance be what we all now know in hindsight be a bad hire...

 If you did then YOU be the GDAD.!
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rude1

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #28 on: November 13, 2017, 02:00:37 pm »

what about anderson in baketball?? yalll wanting to give him all the time in the world..6 years now and only 2 ncaa bids and both one and done..6 years is more than ample time but the team has only been mediocre at best
Different sport and he took over a different situation. How often were we making the tourney before he arrived? How many times did we advance? Oh and we were NOT one and done in either tourney, seems you have a problem with the facts.
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colt07

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #29 on: November 13, 2017, 02:04:30 pm »

Riddle me this Batman.

How can two SEC head football coaches be fired (Florida and Tennessee) who both had better records than CBB and we still have the Bielema Hog Train running down the tracks with no stop in sight?

Holy Hog Call Batman. I don't have an answer!
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Kevin

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2017, 02:05:07 pm »

11-27
yes, that is enough
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Calling All Hogs

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2017, 02:07:05 pm »

Umm, BP went 5-7 his 1st year after HDN won 18 games in the previous 2.
I don't consider 5-7 to be tanking especially since Nutt only had 9 wins the two years before the years you mentioned which put his average the previous four years to Petrino at 6.75 wins. Going winless in the SEC for the first time since joining is tanking. 
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Razorbackers

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2017, 02:09:16 pm »

Riddle me this Batman.

How can two SEC head football coaches be fired (Florida and Tennessee) who both had better records than CBB and we still have the Bielema Hog Train running down the tracks with no stop in sight?

Holy Hog Call Batman. I don't have an answer!

Posted this in another thread but it provides an answer to your...uh...riddle.

I will add, I think one of the things that make Arkansas more appealing to potential coaches is Jeff Long and our athletic department.

Florida is a great school and is on the bottom end of the tier 1 football schools. Prime recruiting, top notch facilities, great weather. But they also just fired a coach who won the east twice. And Muschamp is doing way better at a lesser program than he did at Florida. With expectations that high, you could be setting yourself up for a bad time. It's obvious that the problems at Florida (similar to Texas now) run deeper than the current coach.

Tennessee is also a high expectations job, with less of the perks of Florida. Sure, historically, Tenn > Florida imo. But right now? Woof. Tennesee has tier 1 expectations with a currently tier 2 program. Not to mention, if your name isn't Jon Gruden, then you'll be walking into a somewhat hostile situation from the jump. Kiffin, Dooley, Jones, then who? 4 coaches in less than a decade. It's a lot to walk into.

One of the BIGGEST reasons that we haven't fired Bret yet is because we aren't Florida and Tennessee. We don't have all the perks of in state recruiting and location that they have. What we CAN offer, is a place to succeed, with support from the department, a nice paycheck, and less pressure from your bosses. If fans had their way, Bret would have been gone after USC-E this year. What kind of message would that send for our coaching search?

"Hey, come to Arkansas! We will fire you midseason despite being a middle of the pack team in a cutthroat division."

Bret is gone. If he's not, then I'll be as furious as everyone else. And, assuming he is fired, the coaching search has already started. It probably started several weeks ago. These other schools don't have an advantage over us by firing their coach midseason. I think a lot of folks on here (not OP) need to take a breath. This season stinks. Stinks like a butt. But firing Bielema now doesn't get us anywhere closer to a good hire.
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rude1

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #33 on: November 13, 2017, 02:09:25 pm »


 This times a thousand, but the first part meh... I thought CBB was an excellent hire judging his record. You may have suspected, but you're not going to sell anyone on the fact that you "knew" CBB would in advance be what we all now know in hindsight be a bad hire...

 If you did then YOU be the GDAD.!
While no one could have known for sure, there was plenty of evidence to suggest that he was going to be a bad fit, many tried to present the evidence but it was met with anything but objectivity. Fact is those who didn't like the hire and set out to present a case why with facts and figures where told to shut up and quit trolling, at that point Bert was king and anything other than lock stepping behind the fat man was not tolerated.
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OneTuskOverTheLine™

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #34 on: November 13, 2017, 02:13:04 pm »

Different sport and he took over a different situation. How often were we making the tourney before he arrived? How many times did we advance? Oh and we were NOT one and done in either tourney, seems you have a problem with the facts.

 That, plus his recruiting class this year is rolling...
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DeltaBoy

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2017, 02:15:09 pm »

More than  ample opportunity and it time for Long and BB.
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HoginMemphis

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #36 on: November 13, 2017, 02:15:43 pm »

Posted this in another thread but it provides an answer to your...uh...riddle.

I will add, I think one of the things that make Arkansas more appealing to potential coaches is Jeff Long and our athletic department.

Florida is a great school and is on the bottom end of the tier 1 football schools. Prime recruiting, top notch facilities, great weather. But they also just fired a coach who won the east twice. And Muschamp is doing way better at a lesser program than he did at Florida. With expectations that high, you could be setting yourself up for a bad time. It's obvious that the problems at Florida (similar to Texas now) run deeper than the current coach.

Tennessee is also a high expectations job, with less of the perks of Florida. Sure, historically, Tenn > Florida imo. But right now? Woof. Tennesee has tier 1 expectations with a currently tier 2 program. Not to mention, if your name isn't Jon Gruden, then you'll be walking into a somewhat hostile situation from the jump. Kiffin, Dooley, Jones, then who? 4 coaches in less than a decade. It's a lot to walk into.

One of the BIGGEST reasons that we haven't fired Bret yet is because we aren't Florida and Tennessee. We don't have all the perks of in state recruiting and location that they have. What we CAN offer, is a place to succeed, with support from the department, a nice paycheck, and less pressure from your bosses. If fans had their way, Bret would have been gone after USC-E this year. What kind of message would that send for our coaching search?

"Hey, come to Arkansas! We will fire you midseason despite being a middle of the pack team in a cutthroat division."

Bret is gone. If he's not, then I'll be as furious as everyone else. And, assuming he is fired, the coaching search has already started. It probably started several weeks ago. These other schools don't have an advantage over us by firing their coach midseason. I think a lot of folks on here (not OP) need to take a breath. This season stinks. Stinks like a butt. But firing Bielema now doesn't get us anywhere closer to a good hire.

Fla ain't bottom end of tier 1 programs. How many NC's have they won in last 25 seasons?
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woodhog14

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #37 on: November 13, 2017, 02:17:08 pm »

The 17 game SEC losing streak was excessive.

That wasn't all BB. That streak started with JLS.
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Razorbackers

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #38 on: November 13, 2017, 02:17:27 pm »

Fla ain't bottom end of tier 1 programs. How many NC's have they won in last 25 seasons?

For every 2 coaches that are forced out or resign, that negates 1 championship. That's just math.

They're still a top tier school, but it's a mess right now.
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Michael D Huff AIA

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2017, 02:25:29 pm »

5 seasons is long enough to establish a culture.

The culture we have is pathetic.
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Sed76

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #40 on: November 13, 2017, 02:34:30 pm »

For sure he has. In another time he would have been run out of here in year 3 after screwing the pooch against Toledo, getting manhandled by Texas Tech and blowing a second consecutive overtime game to A&M.
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hassettsportsman

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #41 on: November 13, 2017, 02:37:23 pm »

For both of our flagship programs...attendance is still an issue..lagging ticket sales.  For one, that will get a reprieve in 2 games.  The other, ok..so he has some good recruits finally..if he hadn't been Nolan's protégé he would have seen the door by now.  When were the last true sellouts back to back for either program?
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Wants2Win

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #42 on: November 13, 2017, 02:39:07 pm »

He has been treated fairly. A good hire that just did not work out. It happens ALOT in sports. Guy wins one place, goes to another and does not win nearly as much.
It's pretty safe to say it wasn't a good hire.
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HoginMemphis

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #43 on: November 13, 2017, 02:40:39 pm »

That wasn't all BB. That streak started with JLS.
First 4 games of the streak were under JLS. Then Bielema went 0-8 in his first year and lost first 5 of his second year, then shut out Ole Miss and LSU and lost to Mizzou.
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BearsBisonsBoars

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #44 on: November 13, 2017, 03:22:20 pm »


Jeff Long is also to blame.

Both for bringing him here and for letting him slide along with no accountability,

"Bringing him here" - widely heralded at the time. Hindsight is 20/20, but most coaches fail, so that's not saying much.

"No accountability" - the fact of the matter is that you assume this, but have no proof.
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AFWarrior83

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #45 on: November 13, 2017, 03:24:02 pm »

CBB has had 5 years to prove that he’s not an SEC caliber coach. Time for change.
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MJ2

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #46 on: November 13, 2017, 03:30:45 pm »

He's had 25 milliion fair shakes here.    Time to move on.
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PigPusher

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #47 on: November 13, 2017, 04:45:15 pm »

Dilly! Dilly!

Well said. The coach was n charge of the milk shake machine.
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PossumFan

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #48 on: November 13, 2017, 04:54:15 pm »

Wow. And I was called a troll.
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sowmonella

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Re: Has CBB Had a Fair Shake Here?
« Reply #49 on: November 13, 2017, 05:01:21 pm »

There’s a big difference in CMA and the Hoop Hogs having the 2nd best record in the SEC and what BB has done!  Go crawl back under your country a$$ rock and shut up!
You are pushing the envelope there sport. I'd be careful attacking other posters.
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