Arkansas Ain't Alone

[hoghiker]

I've been listening to the Finebaum show quite a bit lately(okay I'm stupid) and a couple of things are real clear. Florida, Tennessee, A&M, Auburn and LSU fan bases are all mad. At first I was listening to get the broader view of the SEC toward Arkansas but eventually got around to just listening for a wiretap into the lives of people crazy about football. I mean crazy as in delusional. Is it the Saban effect (more powerful than the butterfly effect) or is the SEC just drowning in too much money. Arkansas has its fair share of crazies. Not sure we can hold a candle to other SEC fan bases. Arkansas fans are unhappy. We ain't alone. Crazy seems to be the normal.

[Razorbackers]

LSU fired a coach that averaged almost 10 wins a year because he couldn't beat Saban.

Malzahn went to a natty a few years back.

Florida literally won their conference.

Butch Jones has won 8-9 games a year in his time at Tennessee.

Sumlin has averaged 9 wins.

[DLUXHOG]

LSU fired a coach that averaged almost 10 wins a year because he couldn't beat Saban.

Malzahn went to a natty a few years back.

Florida literally won their conference.

Butch Jones has won 8-9 games a year in his time at Tennessee.

Sumlin has averaged 9 wins.

Not as a HC....

[Poker_hog]

I've been listening to the Finebaum show quite a bit lately(okay I'm stupid) and a couple of things are real clear. Florida, Tennessee, A&M, Auburn and LSU fan bases are all mad. At first I was listening to get the broader view of the SEC toward Arkansas but eventually got around to just listening for a wiretap into the lives of people crazy about football. I mean crazy as in delusional. Is it the Saban effect (more powerful than the butterfly effect) or is the SEC just drowning in too much money. Arkansas has its fair share of crazies. Not sure we can hold a candle to other SEC fan bases. Arkansas fans are unhappy. We ain't alone. Crazy seems to be the normal.

Last time around outsiders thought we were crazy for getting rid of Nutt after two relatively good seasons.  Now outsider think we're crazy for not firing a coach that can't win.

[Poker_hog]

Not as a HC....

Yes he did.

[Hog_Swanson]

Not as a HC....

Yes he did, and lost to the seafood bandit.

[HogPharmer]

Not as a HC....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_BCS_National_Championship_Game

[HogPharmer]

Yes he did, and lost to the seafood bandit.

Ole lobsta paws

[DLUXHOG]

Yes he did.

Thought you meant "won" a natty.   There are tons of alsorans in the NC games. 

[HogPharmer]

Yes, the entire SEC is down this year. There's Alabama, and maybe Mississippi State (we'll see this weekend how they fare against UGA), and then there's everyone else. I think most feel that even with the SEC being overall not very good this year, Arkansas STILL can't compete in the conference. That's what makes our situation even worse.

[JohnnyJohn]

There are tons of alsorans in the NC games.

Alsorans like Saban last year and Dabo the year before....

[rzrbackramsfan]

I've been listening to the Finebaum show quite a bit lately(okay I'm stupid) and a couple of things are real clear. Florida, Tennessee, A&M, Auburn and LSU fan bases are all mad. At first I was listening to get the broader view of the SEC toward Arkansas but eventually got around to just listening for a wiretap into the lives of people crazy about football. I mean crazy as in delusional. Is it the Saban effect (more powerful than the butterfly effect) or is the SEC just drowning in too much money. Arkansas has its fair share of crazies. Not sure we can hold a candle to other SEC fan bases. Arkansas fans are unhappy. We ain't alone. Crazy seems to be the normal.

Unfortunately, I think where we are alone in regards to those other fanbases, are that we have a massive buyout on our coach.  So they can actually go a new direction and we can't. 

[HamSammich]

Thought you meant "won" a natty.   There are tons of alsorans in the NC games.

To be fair there is only one also ran a year. And there have only been 15 also rans this century. Also rans < a ton

[Hogwild]

Florida literally won their conference.

That was almost 10 years ago

[DLUXHOG]

To be fair there is only one also ran a year. And there have only been 15 also rans this century. Also rans < a ton

Wait, what?..., you didn't exist in the 20th century?

[Hoggie17]

Yes, the entire SEC is down this year. There's Alabama, and maybe Mississippi State (we'll see this weekend how they fare against UGA), and then there's everyone else. I think most feel that even with the SEC being overall not very good this year, Arkansas STILL can't compete in the conference. That's what makes our situation even worse.

SEC 2016... Except for 1 team, the rest lost 4 or more games
SEC 2015... Except for 1 team, the rest lost 3 or more games, most had 4 or more loses.

1998 until 2012  The SEC was good.

[GunnerHawg70]

Yes, the entire SEC is down this year. There's Alabama, and maybe Mississippi State (we'll see this weekend how they fare against UGA), and then there's everyone else. I think most feel that even with the SEC being overall not very good this year, Arkansas STILL can't compete in the conference. That's what makes our situation even worse.

It's literally the Saban Effect (if that's a thing now).  The SEC minus Bama is looking vulnerable and any team can lose that game that everyone picks them to win.  Bama has literally cornered the market and shows no sign of slowing down.  Until the other teams can recruit players that are by size standards GROWN MEN, the rest of the SEC will continue to seem pedestrian or beatable to the CFB Nation. 

If MSU loses to UGA then it's a wrap for the Bulldogs and all the hype around Vandy will 99.9% end this weekend.  Here's to the Hogs winning and making it interesting going forward...

[HamSammich]

Wait, what?..., you didn't exist in the 20th century?

Doesn't really matter my age.. the BCs started in 98. So hey you got me.
There are 17 also rans in the history of championship games.

[Suidae Suis Scrofa]

Unfortunately, I think where we are alone in regards to those other fanbases, are that we have a massive buyout on our coach.

Here's what I can find on the other coaches' buyouts:

Ed Orgeron - $12,000,000
Kevin Sumlin - $11,250,000
Guz Malzahn - $8,950,000   
Butch Jones -  $8,000,000
Jim McElwain - $9,375,000

Some of these are from late 2016 so may be out of date.  I'd be willing to wage $5 that none of the Hogville regulars think that $8M+ is anything but a massive amount of money.

my sources:
http://247sports.com/college/texas-am/Bolt/Texas-AM-owes-Kevin-Sumlin-hefty-buyout-if-fired-106930470
http://gridironnow.com/butch-jones-buyout-john-currie-tennessee/2/
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/sports/college/auburnauthority/2016/09/18/13795-million-decision-potential-buyout-analysis-gus-malzahn-his-staff/90623234/
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2016/10/26/college-football-coach-salary-database-buyouts-kirk-ferentz-iowa-charlie-strong-texas/92417648/
https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/lsu-coach-ed-orgeron-has-a-hefty-buyout-clause-in-his-contract/

-phil

[rzrbackramsfan]

Here's what I can find on the other coaches' buyouts:

Ed Orgeron - $12,000,000
Kevin Sumlin - $11,250,000
Guz Malzahn - $8,950,000   
Butch Jones -  $8,000,000
Jim McElwain - $9,375,000

Some of these are from late 2016 so may be out of date.  I'd be willing to wage $5 that none of the Hogville regulars think that $8M+ is anything but a massive amount of money.

my sources:
http://247sports.com/college/texas-am/Bolt/Texas-AM-owes-Kevin-Sumlin-hefty-buyout-if-fired-106930470
http://gridironnow.com/butch-jones-buyout-john-currie-tennessee/2/
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/sports/college/auburnauthority/2016/09/18/13795-million-decision-potential-buyout-analysis-gus-malzahn-his-staff/90623234/
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2016/10/26/college-football-coach-salary-database-buyouts-kirk-ferentz-iowa-charlie-strong-texas/92417648/
https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/lsu-coach-ed-orgeron-has-a-hefty-buyout-clause-in-his-contract/

-phil

Really good research.  It shows that Long wasn't the only AD that gave a coach a big buyout and when CBB did get that buyout, things actually did look pretty promising. 

I would argue though, that if those are from late 2016, following this season, they'll all be pretty low buyouts.  I think the buyout decreases every year by about the coaches salary, so take their buyout at the end of last season that you provided, subtract their salary this season, and that will be their buy out at the end of the year.  So I would think they'll all be 4 million at the end of the year.  Except for probably Ed O, i don't think he make that much, his will probably be around $8 Million.  Bret's will be 11.4MM Jan1, 2018. 

[Hog Fan...DOH!]

Ugg, the southern sky just landed on my head. 

[Redhogs]

Thought you meant "won" a natty.   There are tons of alsorans in the NC games.

Ha..ha..would love for an also ran, any also ran, to get us to a NC game. Ah, some of the logic on here, total lack of perspective.

[Suidae Suis Scrofa]

I would argue though, that if those are from late 2016, following this season, they'll all be pretty low buyouts.

The numbers for Sumlin, Jones and Orgeron are all from 2017.  In fact the first two are from articles (see my previous post) that have come out this month.

-phil

[Inhogswetrust]

I've been listening to the Finebaum show quite a bit lately(okay I'm stupid) and a couple of things are real clear. Florida, Tennessee, A&M, Auburn and LSU fan bases are all mad. At first I was listening to get the broader view of the SEC toward Arkansas but eventually got around to just listening for a wiretap into the lives of people crazy about football. I mean crazy as in delusional. Is it the Saban effect (more powerful than the butterfly effect) or is the SEC just drowning in too much money. Arkansas has its fair share of crazies. Not sure we can hold a candle to other SEC fan bases. Arkansas fans are unhappy. We ain't alone. Crazy seems to be the normal.

Heck all fanbases are mad except Bama's.

[al_pigcino]

That was almost 10 years ago

He meant division. 

[rzrbackramsfan]

The numbers for Sumlin, Jones and Orgeron are all from 2017.  In fact the first two are from articles (see my previous post) that have come out this month.

-phil

So 2017 as in this season, but most likely drops by their salary after 2017 like ours.   

[hoghiker]

Heck all fanbases are mad except Bama's.

This is true and the BAMA fans I know will be disappointed, ala mad, if they don't win the national championship. I'm wondering what has taken the fun out of football for a lot of folks. I understand the frustration of Hog fans, I got my own, but I can't ever remember so many SEC fan bases being so riled up at one time. Might just be my historical ignorance.

[Razorbackers]

He meant division.

I did lol.

[Razorbackers]

This is true and the BAMA fans I know will be disappointed, ala mad, if they don't win the national championship. I'm wondering what has taken the fun out of football for a lot of folks. I understand the frustration of Hog fans, I got my own, but I can't ever remember so many SEC fan bases being so riled up at one time. Might just be my historical ignorance.

I think you're right. And all these young bama fans have grown up in the long summer. But Saban is old. And winter is coming. He won't be around forever.

[Swestwill66]

It's literally the Saban Effect (if that's a thing now).  The SEC minus Bama is looking vulnerable and any team can lose that game that everyone picks them to win.  Bama has literally cornered the market and shows no sign of slowing down.  Until the other teams can recruit players that are by size standards GROWN MEN, the rest of the SEC will continue to seem pedestrian or beatable to the CFB Nation. 

If MSU loses to UGA then it's a wrap for the Bulldogs and all the hype around Vandy will 99.9% end this weekend.  Here's to the Hogs winning and making it interesting going forward...

Yeah, Auburn,LSU, Florida, aTm, Tennessee need to recruit better. Lol

[jgphillips3]

This is true and the BAMA fans I know will be disappointed, ala mad, if they don't win the national championship. I'm wondering what has taken the fun out of football for a lot of folks. I understand the frustration of Hog fans, I got my own, but I can't ever remember so many SEC fan bases being so riled up at one time. Might just be my historical ignorance.

Right now, the SEC sucks compared to just four or five years ago.  Thus, everyone is saying, "if we can't win while the league is down, what happens when everyone else gets good again?"  Not to mention, Saban's level of dominance is unprecedented even by Bama standards. 

[RazorbackAlways]

Bielemas got nothing on those coaches. They are all way better than him.

[311Hog]

I think you're right. And all these young bama fans have grown up in the long summer. But Saban is old. And winter is coming. He won't be around forever.

Gumps never pay their debts.

[rickfahr]

Thought you meant "won" a natty.   There are tons of alsorans in the NC games.

Let me know when our alsoran gets to a national title game. Hell, let me know when he gets to an SEC championship game. Hell, let me know when he finishes in the top three of our division.

[hvsupastar]

Thought you meant "won" a natty.   There are tons of alsorans in the NC games. 

Well next time we should hire an alsoran

[HognitiveDissonance]

I've been listening to the Finebaum show quite a bit lately(okay I'm stupid) and a couple of things are real clear. Florida, Tennessee, A&M, Auburn and LSU fan bases are all mad. At first I was listening to get the broader view of the SEC toward Arkansas but eventually got around to just listening for a wiretap into the lives of people crazy about football. I mean crazy as in delusional. Is it the Saban effect (more powerful than the butterfly effect) or is the SEC just drowning in too much money. Arkansas has its fair share of crazies. Not sure we can hold a candle to other SEC fan bases. Arkansas fans are unhappy. We ain't alone. Crazy seems to be the normal.

I remember listening to the call-in shows in Knoxville in 1992 after our epic upset win over #4 Tennessee. Todd Wright's FG at the end.
I had never heard such vitriol. My distinct impression at the time was the Arkansas fans were tame compared to that. It was brutal.
I believe UT's discontent with Johnny Majors had been building for a while, and it wasn't long before Fulmer was in place. But still, that was nasty stuff.

[BigE_23]

Tells me that we're going to have competition in the coaching search if Long pulls the trigger.

[DLUXHOG]

Wrong

Wake up pardner....

[BigE_23]

Wake up pardner....

Telling me to wake up when you "misread" the post? Got it.

And btw, I modified my post after I saw that you admitted your mistake.

[ShadowHawg]

Not as a HC....

Yes he did. Lost to Fla St

[root_hawg]

I know Bama is number 1 but they are not typical Bama team.  No pass rush, defense not as great as times before.

[DeltaBoy]

The Rest of the Nation doesn't want us to be successful. They hated Us and Bobby cause we were winning too much. No one outside of our state wants us to return to the level we were in the 60's and 70's .

[hogsanity]

We are not alone because every year very few teams live up to the hype or expectations ( usually grounded in no reality at all ) of the fans.

But, also over estimated is discontent among the entire fan base based on the few who bother to call radio shows or post on message boards. 

And, we all know at the end of the day the only discontent that matters is among big $ boosters and how that might impact the bottom line.

[BallHog1]

We are not alone because every year very few teams live up to the hype or expectations ( usually grounded in no reality at all ) of the fans.

But, also over estimated is discontent among the entire fan base based on the few who bother to call radio shows or post on message boards. 

And, we all know at the end of the day the only discontent that matters is among big $ boosters and how that might impact the bottom line.

This, the discontent is way over estimated due to the ridiculous over-posting from the few who love to see themselves in print....saying the same thing...over.. and over...and over...

[hogsanity]

This, the discontent is way over estimated due to the ridiculous over-posting from the few who love to see themselves in print....saying the same thing...over.. and over...and over...

Yea, how many times can someone post fire Long or BB cant get it done.

[Al Boarland]

Right now, the SEC sucks compared to just four or five years ago.  Thus, everyone is saying, "if we can't win while the league is down, what happens when everyone else gets good again?"  Not to mention, Saban's level of dominance is unprecedented even by Bama standards.

The SEC is plagued with bad coaching hires. Everyone says it's the Saban Effect, but if the only team programs were losing to was Bama there would be a little more patience. Everyone is getting paid 10+ win money, but everyone can't win 10+ games.

[hogsanity]

The SEC is plagued with bad coaching hires. Everyone says it's the Saban Effect, but if the only team programs were losing to was Bama there would be a little more patience. Everyone is getting paid 10+ win money, but everyone can't win 10+ games.

So what do you do, go out and hire some no body for 2mil? There are not a lot of coaches out there winning 10+ every year so not a lot of coaches worth 10+ win money.

[Porkchop#1]

LSU fired a coach that averaged almost 10 wins a year because he couldn't beat Saban.

Malzahn went to a natty a few years back.

Florida literally won their conference.

Butch Jones has won 8-9 games a year in his time at Tennessee.

Sumlin has averaged 9 wins.

How many times does LSU play bama each year?  About a 1/4 of all of CBB's SEC wins came at Lester's expense.  Miles was fired for much more than just not beating Saban.

[RedRazorHog]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_BCS_National_Championship_Game

+100

[nwahogfan1]

I do not have a problem with getting beat by Bama but I do not like getting beat by 50+ by anyone much less Auburn and then to get beat by Mo. when they are way down right now.