So let's just recap the last couple of weeks

[batmanfan]

This seems to be going like a typical spring for this staff. Correct me if I'm wrong, just trying to lay out the details here.

2 weeks ago we hosted Hardy who we got on quick, visited the next week with an offer and then....nothing. Seemed like there wasn't interest on either side for whatever reason after the visit.

The next week Barrett visited and then we decided we were moving on.

Then this past week we bring in 3 kids who had little to no shot of getting a scholarship to play here.

So, besides wasting our own and these kids times, what was really done here? While everybody else is out trying to help their teams for next year, we basically could have played 2k for 2 weeks straight and just been as well off.

Thats now two kids (Hardy/Smith) who have come up here, and right after seemingly dismissed the thought of even playing here. Thats a red flag to me and thats not the first time thats happened either.

[niels_boar]

If you are a guard and want to get on the court next season and you see Macon (Sr), Barford (Sr), Beard (Sr), CJ Jones (soph), Garland (highly touted frosh) on the roster from a 26-win team, you might come to the conclusion that you will have a much better chance of getting minutes for a team that was god awful last season.  It's not really that mysterious.  As long as Macon comes back, none of this was a big deal.  If he doesn't, his dithering may have hurt us.  Fact is not many Spring signees are going to come close to replacing his production next season.

[batmanfan]

If you are a guard and want to get on the court next season and you see Macon (Sr), Barford (Sr), Beard (Sr), CJ Jones (soph), Garland (highly touted frosh) on the roster from a 26-win team, you might come to the conclusion that you will have a much better chance of getting minutes for a team that was god awful last season.  It's not really that mysterious.  As long as Macon comes back, none of this was a big deal.  If he doesn't, his dithering may have hurt us.  Fact is not many Spring signees are going to come close to replacing his production next season.

But I thought pg was a big concern? If so, why can't someone come in and get minutes? We have alot of combo guards.

Then what scared Zhaire Smith off? Looking at the roster he had to have seen one similar player in Hall who he was rated higher than and maybe a CJ Jones if you count him in that category who barely played last year.

Also, if your scenario is right and playing time is such a big concern, why not make more of an effort in going after a guard who would have to sit a year? Playing time is wide open the next year and that should be appealing to many and there were some nice ones out there...not ones that averaged 4 ppg on a bad team.

Also no excuse for basically having guys on campus the last week and a half who you weren't really even that interested in. Just silly.

[reddawg213]

But I thought pg was a big concern? If so, why can't someone come in and get minutes? We have alot of combo guards.

Then what scared Zhaire Smith off? Looking at the roster he had to have seen one similar player in Hall who he was rated higher than and maybe a CJ Jones if you count him in that category who barely played last year.

Also, if your scenario is right and playing time is such a big concern, why not make more of an effort in going after a guard who would have to sit a year? Playing time is wide open the next year and that should be appealing to many and there were some nice ones out there...not ones that averaged 4 ppg on a bad team.

Also no excuse for basically having guys on campus the last week and a half who you weren't really even that interested in. Just silly.

Minutes.  . . . . Arkansas doesn't play a lot of mins for starters compared to other schools. Most NCAA starters average 30mins plus esp at the lower tier teams. Moses averaged around 26 and everyone else drops off after that. Freshman esp. don't get a lot of mins. There wasn't a freshman that averaged more than 6 mins a game this season. That includes a guy like Hazen, who is 6'9 and was a universal 3-star recruit. He only got 3 mins a game.

So if you are top Freshman recruit and you are looking for a school that will give you immediate playing time and 25-30+ mins a game, while Ark might look like a good situation, recent data might make you lean to a safer bet.

[jjdlc]

What most have been clamoring for is a PG that looks to distribute first more so than another scorer, we have some good options for those.  In that regard, Harris's numbers (2.3 assists and 1.3 TO per game) aren't terrible for a freshman getting 20 minutes per game.  Don't know anything about the Lobo's roster at all, so not sure who he had available to distribute to, assists are tough to gauge sometimes, as it takes more than one player to create an assist.  Not saying this guy is great or anything, just pointing out, that there might be more to it than his points per game.

[rude1]

What most have been clamoring for is a PG that looks to distribute first more so than another scorer, we have some good options for those.  In that regard, Harris's numbers (2.3 assists and 1.3 TO per game) aren't terrible for a freshman getting 20 minutes per game.  Don't know anything about the Lobo's roster at all, so not sure who he had available to distribute to, assists are tough to gauge sometimes, as it takes more than one player to create an assist.  Not saying this guy is great or anything, just pointing out, that there might be more to it than his points per game.

Let's not forget he was doing that little bit in the Mountain West conference, not like he was playing the greatest of competition night in and night out. Seems to be more of what this staff specializes in, low level transfers.

[Hawg Red]

I've come not to expect a lot from the late period in recruiting. A lot of the kids want to go to a school where they have a good shot at playing right away. This staff is one that relies on relationships and bonding, so they are not going to excel in a pinch. It just is what it is. Then, we've usually got key players holding us hostage with their pro decisions. I thought we had a really good shot with Zhaire Smith, and when we didn't land him, I figured we'd get to this point again. I just don't want to see another Wagner/Jenkins signing. The kid from New Mexico isn't knocking my socks off at first glance, but he's athletic and has 3 years to play and a year to develop/learn. Might as well. If Barford and Macon come back, we shouldn't stress too much. If one or both leave, they will have really done a number on us. Who knows who we could have had if the recruits had known a 4th starter was leaving.

[hdturner]

Hogs need to stop recruiting marginal 3 stars players every spring. If we want be top 15 program you need top notch players. CMA is good coach but  his recruiting terrible on out of state players.  You have go steal 4 star out Chicago  every now & then. Nolan got McDonald's AA from all over the country. This can be done at Arkansas. You have get on these kids hard & heavy beginning in 8th grade. AR got  3 full time assistant coaches they recruit top players coast to coast. It seem we always the last one to offer. Their is reason we lose to NC & KY all the time.  In 90's we could compete with these schools because our talent level was just as good.

[ArkansasI]

The rationalization is laughable. When you recruit kids who don't care about or struggle with school, you should expect there will be problems maintaining eligibility. Expect them to go pro... Wherever... ASAP.

How many 3 star/marginal 4 star recruits expect to command significant minutes at the major college level?  Are players looking for the worst programs so they can see the floor?  If so, it seems the Hogs should have been more successful using this strategy for the last 20 years.

I'm elated the Hogs finished the year strong, but I'm more happy that the State of Arkansas produced a bumper crop of recruits that apparently want to play together - or weren't heavily recruited by elite programs.

Whatever the case, I'm sure Mike will get the most out of them.  However, it seems clear that this staff struggles to manage its roster. And it seems clear Mike - or perhaps Arkansas - struggles to close young relationships.

[realistichog]

Mike has NEVER recruited well. He had success at Missouri with kids of friends and jucos. The kids coming in in the next 2 years are Arkansas kids that want to play together. I wish he would prove me wrong but I'm not holding my breath.

[Letsroll1200]

Garland, Gafford and Hall! Whoever signs during this period is just a bonus to a already solid class.

[ShadowHawg]

How many 3 star/marginal 4 star recruits expect to command significant minutes at the major college level?  Are players looking for the worst programs so they can see the floor?  If so, it seems the Hogs should have been more successful using this strategy for the last 20 years.

Nearly all of them.

Transfers are at all time highs because of it.

These twerps have been told by everyone in their sports lives they are the best since they were 8 years old. They actually believe that given minutes they are realistically candidates to be one and done.

These kids believe they are developing their future "brand" by what AAU team they play for and even worse there are "adults" who believe this crap also.

[Big Nasty 34]

But I thought pg was a big concern? If so, why can't someone come in and get minutes? We have alot of combo guards.

Then what scared Zhaire Smith off? Looking at the roster he had to have seen one similar player in Hall who he was rated higher than and maybe a CJ Jones if you count him in that category who barely played last year.

Also, if your scenario is right and playing time is such a big concern, why not make more of an effort in going after a guard who would have to sit a year? Playing time is wide open the next year and that should be appealing to many and there were some nice ones out there...not ones that averaged 4 ppg on a bad team.

Also no excuse for basically having guys on campus the last week and a half who you weren't really even that interested in. Just silly.

You're not gonna get a day one starting game-changing point guard in April or May. Even if we brought in a "true point guard," they wouldn't make that big of an impact next year. Yes, we need a legit distributor, but Barford and Macon demand the basketball so much that a freshman point guard would get little use.

Z Smith might have been a miss, but I'm still not sure how much time he would've gotten next year, either. We will probably see Hall, Jones, and Garland play the "3" a lot not to mention Mike most likely going with his 3 senior guards to end most games. So, again not a lot of available PT IMO.

Get the Harris kid to transfer and he can step in next year as an experienced guard who actually looks to distribute.

[batmanfan]

You're not gonna get a day one starting game-changing point guard in April or May. Even if we brought in a "true point guard," they wouldn't make that big of an impact next year. Yes, we need a legit distributor, but Barford and Macon demand the basketball so much that a freshman point guard would get little use.

Z Smith might have been a miss, but I'm still not sure how much time he would've gotten next year, either. We will probably see Hall, Jones, and Garland play the "3" a lot not to mention Mike most likely going with his 3 senior guards to end most games. So, again not a lot of available PT IMO.

Get the Harris kid to transfer and he can step in next year as an experienced guard who actually looks to distribute.

You may want to look around and see whats happening around the country then.

And you know this kid will help HOW? Stats wise, which is what we have to go off of, its more along the lines of guys who didn't or haven't contributed much.       I hope he is a big time contributor if we land him, but good chance he doesn't turn out as well.

Most schools are in a similar situation as Ark: 1 maybe 2 schollies available...yet we are the only school in the country (or thats what you guys want to think) that can't land anyone due to playing time. It's like we are some juggernaunt team that's rolling in big time talent all over the roster.  But keep REACCCCHHHHING for excuses.

[NWAHog479]

Garland, Gafford and Hall! Whoever signs during this period is just a bonus to a already solid class.

[ArkansasI]

Nearly all of them.

Transfers are at all time highs because of it.

These twerps have been told by everyone in their sports lives they are the best since they were 8 years old. They actually believe that given minutes they are realistically candidates to be one and done.

These kids believe they are developing their future "brand" by what AAU team they play for and even worse there are "adults" who believe this crap also.

The culture eludes me.  I don't know what goes on in players' heads, but I played an array of sports and had a pretty good idea of where I measured up within my teams.  Certainly, coaches are not immune to finding favorites, but Mike lost his best recruits from 2014 and 2015 for failing to play them.

Was there a massive failure to connect with these players while in Fayetteville (or wherever players leave)?  I mean, it takes something to break the bonds of commitment and team.

I just don't see the mystery.  With few exceptions, 18 year old recruits are matriculating from AAU basketball teams onto college teams loaded with 4 years of AAU (or comparable) talent.  Transfers have to sit out a year to gain eligibility, so why not stay where you were so that you might move up the rotation?

The best transfers that Arkansas has received have been players returning home.  I have not seen the same perspective from players that have left our program.

[Big Nasty 34]

You may want to look around and see whats happening around the country then.

And you know this kid will help HOW? Stats wise, which is what we have to go off of, its more along the lines of guys who didn't or haven't contributed much.       I hope he is a big time contributor if we land him, but good chance he doesn't turn out as well.

If you watch film on him, it's easy to see that he actually looks to facilitate and set people up. He has good height and is a plus athlete. You say we need a point guard and he could be that. He's no more of a for sure prospect than anyone else at this point.

And going off of stats we could assume that he will be able to step in as a R-So and lead the team in assists with a very solid A/TO ratio.

[batmanfan]

If you watch film on him, it's easy to see that he actually looks to facilitate and set people up. He has good height and is a plus athlete. You say we need a point guard and he could be that. He's no more of a for sure prospect than anyone else at this point.

And going off of stats we could assume that he will be able to step in as a R-So and lead the team in assists with a very solid A/TO ratio.

Will say his film did look pretty nice and was nice to see the New Mexico fans think so highly of him via the link that was provided earlier.

[batmanfan]

Maybe I'm missing something.  Why is everyone placing so much emphasis on and making the determination that CMA can't recruit based on the spring?  Is it fear of Macon leaving and we haven't seen enough to know who will take up that slack?  The narrative the guy can't recruit is just false.  His '17 class consist of 3 Arkansas kids, 1 borderline 5*, and 2 ~3* and ranked 34.   2018 class:  Right now the # 1 class in the nation.  3-4*, 1-3*, 3 from Arkansas and 1 from GA.  2019 class:  currently #6 class in the nation with an Arkansas kid not yet rated but anticipates to be highly rated because the class is already rated at # 6.  So if I'm understanding all the banter, the narrative is he can only get kids he has connections to or with so therefore he can't recruit.  #34 class with 3 local kids, #1 with 3 out of 4 local kids, #6 with a local kid.  We complain when a local kid go somewhere else and if I get this right, we take recruiting credit away from a coach because he has 3 out of 4 local kids committed and the #1 class in the country and already have another local kid in the fold and rated #6 for the following year.   I'm thinking some folks need to take a long look at this asinine rationale and unsupported narrative.  I'll take 34,1, and 6 every day and twice on Sunday and no sane person would even think about stating, "CMA can't recruit" because the #s definitely don't suggest that.

To me, its because this is becoming a common thing every year. Most are still scarred from life from that awful 2015 spring recruiting period tht was one of the biggest jokes I'd ever seen.

Since recruiting had started going well in state the last bit, I think most were hopeful that they could turn around the out of state recruiting as well. But it's turning out to be the same thing. It's just what it is at this point and I think that's what disappoints most who are irritated right now.

[navyhog24]

To me, its because this is becoming a common thing every year. Most are still scarred from life from that awful 2015 spring recruiting period tht was one of the biggest jokes I'd ever seen.

Since recruiting had started going well in state the last bit, I think most were hopeful that they could turn around the out of state recruiting as well. But it's turning out to be the same thing. It's just what it is at this point and I think that's what disappoints most who are irritated right now.

Late signings or transfers of Wagner/Thomas/Kouassi/Jenkins/Miles do that to ya. See the trend?

[ArkansasI]

Might be something to what you're saying but I've seen the argument many times on these boards about recruiting and signing in state players.  It appears as though the in state crop is as good as it has ever been so why go to Chicago or out of state period?  He has 3 studs coming in already and I view the late signing period as a means to compliment a class, not to make a class.  And, if I can sign a top 20 class without leaving the state, why not?

I'm not sure I'm tracking with you.  I am 100% in favor of signing in-state recruits.  And I am in favor of signing other players from wherever that can help the program.  My concerns are that we appear to struggle to make positive lasting impressions with new recruits from outside Arkansas.

In-state players should be "low hanging fruit" - play in front of and easily followed by friends and family.  I have been critical of Mike for failing to get Arkansans that have gone to conference opponents - Kentucky and Florida.  Those kids are difference makers.  Their losses completely deflate the fans - especially when the players have key roles in lop-sided defeats of the Razorbacks.

This must change.  And I hope we see the beginning of this change with current recruiting class.  We have a group of Arkansans that apparently want to play together.   Are we fortunate that Kentucky wasn't after these players?  Or did Mike and staff do a great job of recruiting these guys?  It doesn't matter - because they are committed.

Many on Hogville argue - quite reasonably - that Mike is not alone in failing to recruit well against Kentucky.  I get it.  But I find it particularly damning when players intimately familiar with Mike and the Razorback program must fear that their professional hopes will be significantly adversely affected by spending one year on the Hill.

What does our out-of-state recruiting reveal?  Players less familiar with the Razorbacks must depend on communications with the staff and impressions gained during recruiting visits to make a decision about Arkansas.  They have not been raised for 18 years to love the Hogs and it doesn't help that several elite players from in-state - with options - have headed out-of-state.

We don't close well during the late recruiting period.  These players' impressions of the program are determined almost exclusively by their relationships with the staff.  And it is fair to question staff evaluation of recruits who are invited to campus but are never extended a committable offer.

The nature of college basketball may be unsettled, but things look particularly haphazard on the Hill.

[ArkansasI]

I guess moreso,  when has UA done this well early in BB recruiting?  Doesn't that take the Spring pressure off?  We are in uncharted waters.  We are witnessing something that has NEVER been done at UA!  #1 so far for '18 and #6 so far for '19.  This has NEVER happened!  We as fans need to focus more on those two facts because spring signees will be compliments and not showstoppers because he already has the showstoppers in the fold.  That's just simple to me..  maybe I'm missing something. Or maybe there is an anti CMA agenda here.... or maybe, nobody can believe UA is being mentioned as #1 in anything so we have to create a negative narrative...  who knows?

You make fair comments.

I catch myself thinking a lot about the program and find myself getting irritated that we can't seem to round the corner.  Why can't Arkansas - with all the investments in facilities and other opportunities of being in NWA - attract a kid from Michigan?  Is Las Vegas more attractive than playing in the SEC?  Mike is an established coach... but what is the reputation he has earned?

You're right about the classes we have lined up.  My concern is that the success we are seeing is a reflection of the State of Arkansas producing good players that want to come to Arkansas regardless of the coach.  When coaches are paid the way they are paid, and fans are expected to contribute what we are expected to contribute, you want to see the positive influence that a coach has upon a recruit's decision.

Perhaps we are seeing the positive influence now in what you have described.  It would be far easier to believe that the coach is a strong recruiter if more of those great players had not grown up playing together in Arkansas.

[batmanfan]

I still don't get it though.  That was '15.  The numbers say the '17 class is rated 34th with 1 schollie left to give.  2 of the 3 coming in are ESPN top 100 of which one is from GA.  I think that qualifies as out of state.  It's obvious to me, the last schollie is to compliment the class, not dependent on MAKING the class but if it's a 3* player, the ranking is obviously going to go up.  He's done the work early, unlike 2015.  He has the top rated class so far for '18.  What else can the man do?  When was the last time ANY UA program EVER had the #1 class in the nation at ANY point?  So by not getting a kid in April '17 that everyone wants him to get disqualifies the fact he already has 3-4*, 2-ESPN top 100, and maybe don't feel the urgency those on here feel makes him a poor recruiter?  A program that has been in the toilet for two decades even having a shot at 2-ESPN top 100 is quit an accomplishment!  And by the way, I know the Gafford family and they say they wanted to play for Anderson and it was a hard decision due to all the top level offers but CMA and Ruston Rifle tipped the scale to Arkansas.  So I know for a fact, it wasn't about staying home.  CMA got who HE wanted early.  This last schollie is a compliment to the class, not the class.  The class is already GREAT!  2-ESPN top 100s.  We have to be insane to complain about that!  Maybe the spring signings mean more to us than him..  just saying.

All 3 are from Arkansas this year. You are thinking of Perry for '18. That class will be lucky to finish in the top 15.

[Atlhogfan1]

I guess moreso,  when has UA done this well early in BB recruiting?  Doesn't that take the Spring pressure off?  We are in uncharted waters.  We are witnessing something that has NEVER been done at UA!  #1 so far for '18 and #6 so far for '19.  This has NEVER happened!  We as fans need to focus more on those two facts because spring signees will be compliments and not showstoppers because he already has the showstoppers in the fold.  That's just simple to me..  maybe I'm missing something. Or maybe there is an anti CMA agenda here.... or maybe, nobody can believe UA is being mentioned as #1 in anything so we have to create a negative narrative...  who knows?

Heath's 2004 class:  Jefferson committed in the early period but of course went straight to NBA, Hill and Thomas were both top 50 recruits signed.

You don't really believe the 2018 class will stay at #1 do you?

Who knows what your other screen names have been "new" poster? 

[FineAsSwine]

Heath's 2004 class:  Jefferson committed in the early period but of course went straight to NBA, Hill and Thomas were both top 50 recruits signed.

You don't really believe the 2018 class will stay at #1 do you?

Who knows what your other screen names have been "new" poster?

Gotta admit though, future classes looking mighty good!

[rude1]

Lol!  Keep the faith my friend.  Whoever they sign unless some 4 or 5* is released and commit is going to sit any way.  Would you come to the UA in a late signing period knowing what they have coming in '18?

I might give this some merit if I didn't remember that it has gone this exact same way every spring period over the last six years. At some point you just have to admit this staff is putrid at recruiting in the spring / late recruiting period. They still haven't shown they can build relationships with  high school kids outside the state and land high caliber players, maybe the state continues to produce the talent needed that they won't need to, or that is the hope.

[orgkeith]

We are talking about the 13th scholarship for the team.  Get a life, really, get a life🤐

[niels_boar]

How many 3 star/marginal 4 star recruits expect to command significant minutes at the major college level?  Are players looking for the worst programs so they can see the floor?  If so, it seems the Hogs should have been more successful using this strategy for the last 20 years.

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/tracking-transfer-division-i-men-s-basketball

"...about 40% of all MBB players who enter Division I directly out of high school depart their initial school by the end of their sophomore year."

"... close to 90% of all MBB transfers say they leave for athletic reasons."

It's laughable to disregard that at present a roster with at least 5 guards slated to get significant minutes will not factor into a recruit's decision.  They aren't waiting till their junior year to play anywhere.  It's not like Hardy didn't have other options besides us to sign with a program that was better than 11 wins last season.  Playing time had to have figured into his decision if other factor$ didn't. He had better basketball options. We don't even know how the staff projected him relative to current players and future recruits. Fact is we most likely will never know why any individual recruit makes the decision that he does.

The roster looks a lot different without Macon.  Suddenly an inexperienced player most likely has to start, and at worst a spot is vacant on the second unit.  You can legitimately tell a recruit that they can compete for a starting role and that whoever wins it vacates a prominent role on the second unit.

We won 26 games with Beard and Barford being the primary ballhandlers.  It's an exaggeration to believe that lots of PG minutes are available.  It would take a special player to get major minutes next season over what we have returning, and it would be the exception rather than the rule that we could find anybody in that category at this date even if we could pick and choose.  I remember two summers ago all the teeth gnashing that LSU signed 4-star Sampson in the late period.  Never mind that he was from Baton Rouge, he was rated in the top 40 by ESPN.  He averaged 6 minutes and shot 26% in SEC play as a frosh on an NIT-level team.  He was a good pickup that is developing into a good player, but players like Hardy would have to be massively underrated if they could walk into the gym and play 20+ minutes at PG next season.  Fans always underestimate the returning players whose faults they know and whose improvement they can't anticipate.

This is why I generally don't waste time following recruiting closely.  I always regret it when I do. It's always about who we don't get instead of who we do sign.

[ShadowHawg]

The culture eludes me.  I don't know what goes on in players' heads, but I played an array of sports and had a pretty good idea of where I measured up within my teams.  Certainly, coaches are not immune to finding favorites, but Mike lost his best recruits from 2014 and 2015 for failing to play them.

Was there a massive failure to connect with these players while in Fayetteville (or wherever players leave)?  I mean, it takes something to break the bonds of commitment and team.

I just don't see the mystery.  With few exceptions, 18 year old recruits are matriculating from AAU basketball teams onto college teams loaded with 4 years of AAU (or comparable) talent.  Transfers have to sit out a year to gain eligibility, so why not stay where you were so that you might move up the rotation?

The best transfers that Arkansas has received have been players returning home.  I have not seen the same perspective from players that have left our program.

Really?

Babb transferred to his brother's college coach. He isn't a big time contributor there either.

Mickelson is a perfect example of a guy who was told he was better than he really was. He transferred from playing time to scrub status because it was the coaches fault he wasn't getting better.

I guess you believe that you play kids so they don't get mad? Playing time is earned. If a guy can't see the floor much in his 3rd year ain't Iowa state, then why was he supposed to get big minutes as a frosh here?

Whitt transferred to Martin who had built a relationship with him while at Mo St.

[FineAsSwine]

Really?

Babb transferred to his brother's college coach. He isn't a big time contributor there either.

Mickelson is a perfect example of a guy who was told he was better than he really was. He transferred from playing time to scrub status because it was the coaches fault he wasn't getting better.

I guess you believe that you play kids so they don't get mad? Playing time is earned. If a guy can't see the floor much in his 3rd year ain't Iowa state, then why was he supposed to get big minutes as a frosh here?

Whitt transferred to Martin who had built a relationship with him while at Mo St.

Perfectly laid out but doesn't fit the narrative.

[Razorod]

Really?

Babb transferred to his brother's college coach. He isn't a big time contributor there either.

Mickelson is a perfect example of a guy who was told he was better than he really was. He transferred from playing time to scrub status because it was the coaches fault he wasn't getting better.

I guess you believe that you play kids so they don't get mad? Playing time is earned. If a guy can't see the floor much in his 3rd year ain't Iowa state, then why was he supposed to get big minutes as a frosh here?

Whitt transferred to Martin who had built a relationship with him while at Mo St.

Has Whitt transferred again? I thought he was at SMU? I can't keep up with all these transfers.

[Hawg Red]

Has Whitt transferred again? I thought he was at SMU? I can't keep up with all these transfers.

Yes, Whitt transferred to Larry Brown (at the time) and SMU.

[niels_boar]

BTW I anticipate that Trey Thompson is going to have the ball in his hands at the top quite often next season, which will free up the middle for slashers.  He led us in assist rate this season. Obviously he's not going to do a lot of dribble-drive, but his game means that combo guards in the starting backcourt will make a lot of sense.  My guess is that we are most interested in a PG for development and a situational role next season, rather than a player to dominate the ball for long stretches.

[FineAsSwine]

BTW I anticipate that Trey Thompson is going to have the ball in his hands at the top quite often next season, which will free up the middle for slashers.  He led us in assist rate this season. Obviously he's not going to do a lot of dribble-drive, but his game means that combo guards in the starting backcourt will make a lot of sense.  My guess is that we are most interested in a PG for development and a situational role next season, rather than a player to dominate the ball for long stretches.

This sounds most reasonable.

[ArkansasI]

Really?

Babb transferred to his brother's college coach. He isn't a big time contributor there either.

Mickelson is a perfect example of a guy who was told he was better than he really was. He transferred from playing time to scrub status because it was the coaches fault he wasn't getting better.

I guess you believe that you play kids so they don't get mad? Playing time is earned. If a guy can't see the floor much in his 3rd year ain't Iowa state, then why was he supposed to get big minutes as a frosh here?

Whitt transferred to Martin who had built a relationship with him while at Mo St.

I thought Babb was doing quite well at Iowa State.?. I know I watched him at the end of the year and he was one of thee most exciting players on the floor. And I believe Iowa State has a better program than Arkansas. I have no doubt we could use him.

I'm not sure what Mickelson has to do with this, other than he received a scholarship to play basketball at KU. Mike didn't recruit him to Arkansas and I have no idea if he tried to keep him once he was hired. If Hunter would have been one of the best 13 players on the team, I don't know why you wouldn't encourage him to stay. KU apparently was willing to put up with him. Of course, maybe it's easier to play at Kansas...

I didn't realize Whitt had moved on. If he's a good player, we should have tried to keep him. If he's not a good player, then Mike's recruiting is even worse than I've complained about. Whitt was the star recruit in his class, and now you're telling me he can't play.

I don't believe you play kids to keep them from getting mad. But since you've brought the player to Fayetteville, I assume there is some reason for it. If they can't break into the playing rotation as freshman, as the head coach that has taken responsibility for the player and program, perhaps you could manage the relationship well enough to help it mature and grow. Not all answers are found somewhere else.

On the other hand, if a player has earned playing time, I don't know why you'd sit him just because he's an underclassman. Can't say I'm intimately familiar with every situation, but I haven't seen tons of talent bottlenecking minutes during Mike's tenure.

[ArkansasI]

http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/tracking-transfer-division-i-men-s-basketball

"...about 40% of all MBB players who enter Division I directly out of high school depart their initial school by the end of their sophomore year."

"... close to 90% of all MBB transfers say they leave for athletic reasons."

It's laughable to disregard that at present a roster with at least 5 guards slated to get significant minutes will not factor into a recruit's decision.  They aren't waiting till their junior year to play anywhere.  It's not like Hardy didn't have other options besides us to sign with a program that was better than 11 wins last season.  Playing time had to have figured into his decision if other factor$ didn't. He had better basketball options. We don't even know how the staff projected him relative to current players and future recruits. Fact is we most likely will never know why any individual recruit makes the decision that he does.

The roster looks a lot different without Macon.  Suddenly an inexperienced player most likely has to start, and at worst a spot is vacant on the second unit.  You can legitimately tell a recruit that they can compete for a starting role and that whoever wins it vacates a prominent role on the second unit.

We won 26 games with Beard and Barford being the primary ballhandlers.  It's an exaggeration to believe that lots of PG minutes are available.  It would take a special player to get major minutes next season over what we have returning, and it would be the exception rather than the rule that we could find anybody in that category at this date even if we could pick and choose.  I remember two summers ago all the teeth gnashing that LSU signed 4-star Sampson in the late period.  Never mind that he was from Baton Rouge, he was rated in the top 40 by ESPN.  He averaged 6 minutes and shot 26% in SEC play as a frosh on an NIT-level team.  He was a good pickup that is developing into a good player, but players like Hardy would have to be massively underrated if they could walk into the gym and play 20+ minutes at PG next season.  Fans always underestimate the returning players whose faults they know and whose improvement they can't anticipate.

This is why I generally don't waste time following recruiting closely.  I always regret it when I do. It's always about who we don't get instead of who we do sign.

I don't question the number of transfers or the excuses for leaving. However, just because kids may be doing it elsewhere doesn't mean you shouldn't develop a culture of stability - especially when it appears to wreak havoc on your program.

The rest of your post makes no sense. If we don't need the player, then why did we recruit him?  If you argue he had better options, it may be that you are unwilling to admit that Mike's interpersonal skills are not convincing. Plenty of coaches fill their rosters with good players. Mike has not assembled enough talent at Fayetteville to get through the second round. Good players should find playing time on the Hill.

If you're saying the players Mike is recruiting aren't special... I hope they are. That's why I'm disappointed when they go elsewhere.

[FineAsSwine]

I thought Babb was doing quite well at Iowa State.?. I know I watched him at the end of the year and he was one of thee most exciting players on the floor. And I believe Iowa State has a better program than Arkansas. I have no doubt we could use him.

I'm not sure what Mickelson has to do with this, other than he received a scholarship to play basketball at KU. Mike didn't recruit him to Arkansas and I have no idea if he tried to keep him once he was hired. If Hunter would have been one of the best 13 players on the team, I don't know why you wouldn't encourage him to stay. KU apparently was willing to put up with him. Of course, maybe it's easier to play at Kansas...

I didn't realize Whitt had moved on. If he's a good player, we should have tried to keep him. If he's not a good player, then Mike's recruiting is even worse than I've complained about. Whitt was the star recruit in his class, and now you're telling me he can't play.

I don't believe you play kids to keep them from getting mad. But since you've brought the player to Fayetteville, I assume there is some reason for it. If they can't break into the playing rotation as freshman, as the head coach that has taken responsibility for the player and program, perhaps you could manage the relationship well enough to help it mature and grow. Not all answers are found somewhere else.

On the other hand, if a player has earned playing time, I don't know why you'd sit him just because he's an underclassman. Can't say I'm intimately familiar with every situation, but I haven't seen tons of talent bottlenecking minutes during Mike's tenure.

You obviously don't know much about these players and the team but you can have your say I guess.

[HardingHog]

I thought Babb was doing quite well at Iowa State.?. I know I watched him at the end of the year and he was one of thee most exciting players on the floor. And I believe Iowa State has a better program than Arkansas. I have no doubt we could use him.

I'm not sure what Mickelson has to do with this, other than he received a scholarship to play basketball at KU. Mike didn't recruit him to Arkansas and I have no idea if he tried to keep him once he was hired. If Hunter would have been one of the best 13 players on the team, I don't know why you wouldn't encourage him to stay. KU apparently was willing to put up with him. Of course, maybe it's easier to play at Kansas...

I didn't realize Whitt had moved on. If he's a good player, we should have tried to keep him. If he's not a good player, then Mike's recruiting is even worse than I've complained about. Whitt was the star recruit in his class, and now you're telling me he can't play.

Nick Babb:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/nick-weiler-babb-1.html

Hunter Mickelson:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/hunter-mickelson-1.html

..... You didn't know Whitt moved on???

Did you go into a coma and just wake up?
Did you miss his entire freshman season and then his transfer??

[ArkansasI]

Nick Babb:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/nick-weiler-babb-1.html

Hunter Mickelson:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/hunter-mickelson-1.html

..... You didn't know Whitt moved on???

Did you go into a coma and just wake up?
Did you miss his entire freshman season and then his transfer??

I didn't know Whitt moved on from SMU.  Maybe he didn't.  I'm not even sure that's what the previous post referenced.

[HOGINTENNESSEE]

I didn't know Whitt moved on from SMU.  Maybe he didn't.  I'm not even sure that's what the previous post referenced.

Still at SMU