Stan Heath Gets Beat By Cleveland St.!

[san1981]

Cleveland St. 73
South FL.  70


Not a very good start. Not saying I was hoping he got beat, I am hoping him the best.

[ErieHog]

Cleveland St. 73
South FL.  70


Not a very good start. Not saying I was hoping he got beat, I am hoping him the best.

What makes it even worse is that his team shot 60% from 3pt range, and still lost.

[CallThemHawgs!]

Ouch... not good. Cleveland st?

[67Hog]

Damn!

Can't root against Stan!

[masonselby]

not making excuses for stan.... but they were missing their best player who avg 15 pts and 10 rebs last year, he was suspended for one game

the thing i noticed was that s. fl. was ahead 67-59 with 4 min to play and lost, sounds like alot of our games last year, he just doesnt condition his players to finish games

[USCoastGuard]

heath was fired when he needed to be fired. nutt has not been...sickening. FIRE NUTT!!

[dmac4sainthood]

I saw the game tonight...Heath's team just colapsed...bad turnovers, bad shots, an airball, and missed two fts that would have iced it...aka the mccurdy at LSU scenario. 

USF is really, really bad.  They just have no talent.  Stan will do a good job there. 

[josh_sec33]

I saw the game tonight...Heath's team just colapsed...bad turnovers, bad shots, an airball, and missed two fts that would have iced it...aka the mccurdy at LSU scenario. 

USF is really, really bad.  They just have no talent.  Stan will do a good job there. 

Gee, that' sort of sounds familiar...that's how his teams played a lot last year.

Oh and our current football coach does this very well as well.

[stronguard]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

[Tigerhog14s]

What did Stan inherit down there? Were they in a rebuilding year?

[mathhog]

I for one am rooting for Stan...

South Florida has ZERO talent... if they win 14 games this year it will be a miracle

If South Florida makes the NCAAs Stan should be coach of the year.

I seriously believe he gets them in the tourney in 3 years.  Remember, the man can recruit, plus he's in TAMPA.  But this year?  Expect to lose to the Gardner-webbs of the world a LOT.

[mathhog]

What did Stan inherit down there? Were they in a rebuilding year?

NOTHING  and HECK YES

[Tigerhog14s]

What did Stan inherit down there? Were they in a rebuilding year?

NOTHING  and HECK YES

Saw KY get beat by Gardner Webb. I think thats a bit bigger.

[mathhog]

What did Stan inherit down there? Were they in a rebuilding year?

NOTHING  and HECK YES

Saw KY get beat by Gardner Webb. I think thats a bit bigger.

huh?

i never said otherwise, i think a cellar dwellar Big east team losing to Cleveland state is NOT an "upset".  Kentucky losing at home to G-W is monumental.

[ErieHog]

Cleveland Steamered.   

Good way to describe the Heath Era at any school, regarding how they 'finish a game'.

[dmac4sainthood]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

[yraciv]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

What about Hooten?  He worked his way in w/ an impressive 5-6 record at Boise State.  Lets be honest he got the job b/ of the Nutt coaching name, and AR background.  I actually think Heath is an alright coach, and has learned from one of the best in Izzo.  The problem w/ South Florida is no talent yet.  Their 2nd best player is a 2 star from Magnolia, who was also offered by Ole Miss and Louisiana Tech, but their best player didn't even play.  Heath actually is already starting to turn around the talent w/ two good signees late.

[dmac4sainthood]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

What about Hooten?  He worked his way in w/ an impressive 5-6 record at Boise State.  Lets be honest he got the job b/ of the Nutt coaching name, and AR background.  I actually think Heath is an alright coach, and has learned from one of the best in Izzo.  The problem w/ South Florida is no talent yet.  Their 2nd best player is a 2 star from Magnolia, who was also offered by Ole Miss and Louisiana Tech, but their best player didn't even play.  Heath actually is already starting to turn around the talent w/ two good signees late.

-Houston

By the spectrum of all football coaches, junior high-pro...is very good...he just is...say what you want, but frankly, you can't last that long and get the far by accident.  You just can't.

By the spectrum of his level....Houston is mediocre at best.  However, the point I was making is at the college and pro level, the difference between a "bad" coach and a "great" coach, is a very slim margin.  Right now, we would have to consider Les Miles very good, given his record....now what if a couple of the gutsy play calls backfire....he becomes mediocre in a hurry.  Sure, all coaches have flaws...even the best have flaws, but to say someone who has coached in the SEC for 10 years, by the standards of all coaches isn't at least a good coach, is flat wrong.

I don't think Houston is a good coach by SEC standards, but he certainly has lasted a pretty long time in coaching.  For whatever the reason, he has.

I am the biggest Heath fan there is.  I think he is a great man, with great recruiting skills, and an improving coach.  Think about something, everyone steadily improves as they coach longer and longer, the same as any other job.  Lawyers, doctors, engineers...they all get better as they do their job longer.  They just do perform on the same public stage.  What we fail to realize is that we are examining the elite. 

For example:  I hate antoine walker...I have said "he sucks" many times.  But is antoine walker a sucky basketball player?  Of course not, he has played in the NBA for a long time.  I am evaluating him compared to the absolute best and using Kobe, Wade, and LeBron as the standard...so then of course...if thats the standard, he isn't very good.

HDN is no different...he might be the Antoine Walker of coaches...next to Richt, Saban, Meyer, Carroll, and others in that class...he isn't exactly the cream of the crop, but considering he not only reached 1A, but stayed there for over a decade....that is pretty impressive for anybody. 

[phadedhawg]

bah...

too bad for Stan but it is just one game...

I can't help but pull for Heath.  He wasn't a great coach for us but he had class and good character.

As days go by I appreciate those things more and more...

[dmac4sainthood]

bah...

too bad for Stan but it is just one game...

I can't help but pull for Heath.  He wasn't a great coach for us but he had class and good character.

As days go by I appreciate those things more and more...

Plus there is always one thing that makes it not look as bad...at least he isn't at an SEC school, and just lost in the coaches vs cancer tournament to a low tier team....that would be Billy G's claim to fame...for the record, I still like Billy and he will do a great job at UK.

[HootieHaterfromALA]

What did Stan inherit down there? Were they in a rebuilding year?

As long as Heath is the coach they will continue to be in a rebuilding year!! Pelphrey is going to take Heath's players and make him look really bad by actually doing something with them.

[FelixJonesorDMAC?]

I for one am rooting for Stan...

South Florida has ZERO talent... if they win 14 games this year it will be a miracle

If South Florida makes the NCAAs Stan should be coach of the year.

I seriously believe he gets them in the tourney in 3 years.  Remember, the man can recruit, plus he's in TAMPA.  But this year?  Expect to lose to the Gardner-webbs of the world a LOT.

It's not about whether you can recruit, it's about coaching.  Heath can't coach.  He has no discipline.  That is why his teams lose their lead with 4 minutes to go in  a game.

[Buck Ocean]

This is the same Stan Heath tale told 'round world.

Stan has been under some great tutaluge or whatever.  But the great Michigan State teams always had a point guard and a power forward.  Not to mention the rest of the Spartan's were all top notch recruits.  Kent State had a magical season.  Honestly, I don't know who the hell they had on that team but if a Gardner-Webb can beat Kentucky's McDonald's All-Amercian's then we know coaching can occasionally win over talent....occasionally.

Go back to Stan's first years at Arkansas:  8 wins.  14 or so wins.  No point guard.  Just guards forced to play point.  Look at the assistant's he surrounds himself with.  Nobody ever in jeopardy of educating him or taking his job.  Pelfrey comes right in and hires an SEC NCAA tourney veteran in Evans.

Hey, I gotta buddy in Tampa....and he tells me that the USF players are really pumped about Stan.  He's a players coach.  I think they'll like Stan Heath the role model.  I don't think they'll like Stan Heath, basketball philosopher.

[Dugann]

don't know much about his team dose he have much talent coming back?  Wow 60% from 3 point and lost ..wow.  I wish him the best but that a tough loss.

[stronguard]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

You're one of the dumber posters on this board if you think STANLEY is a good coach.  Read more post less.   Oh and ask Bucknell if they think STANLEY is a good coach.

A good coach is one who fills the needs of hisprogram through recruitig, who adapts his style to fit the talent he has, and who can make in game adjustments when things are not working.  STANLEY did none of these. 

Go watch some cartoons and leave the posting to the grown ups DMAc.  Most of us here have forgotten more about sports than you will ever know.

[Wiseguy]

I bet there was a lot of hand on hip action by Stan.

[pfrg999]

I for one am rooting for Stan...

South Florida has ZERO talent... if they win 14 games this year it will be a miracle

If South Florida makes the NCAAs Stan should be coach of the year.

I seriously believe he gets them in the tourney in 3 years.  Remember, the man can recruit, plus he's in TAMPA.  But this year?  Expect to lose to the Gardner-webbs of the world a LOT.

Stan was s good guy... just not the coach that we needed here..  I wish him the best...
Nuttjob could learn a vast amount of class from Stan

[pfrg999]

I bet there was a lot of hand on hip action by Stan.

That's his underwear model look

[booogaga]

i am glad. that guy was a looser

[Gomer_Says_Hey]

I heard that when Heath addressed his team after the game, he was so upset that he actually raised his voice.
Nah, just kidding. Stan would never do that.

Seriously, I have nothing against Stan and wish him well. I wish he would have succeeded here, but he demonstrated that he simply wasn't an SEC caliber coach. The Big East is loaded with quality, proven coaches - Pitino, Calhoun, Boeheim, JT III, Jamie Dixon, etc. I hope the folks at South Florida have lots of patience.

[Dugann]

If they have zero talent then yea this is going be a long year for him.  He can recruit.  I think he will get that team going in the right direction.  Just know know if he has the fire/attitude to get them to the next step in evolution.  I hope he dose great guy hell of a recruiter.  I did think he had done all he can here and was time for fresh blood.  I wish him the best of luck there for sure.

[hogman1974]

Heath's club was outscored 14-3 in the final 4 minutes, including a 12-0 run up to the 1 minute mark.  How many of those collapses did we have to suffer through.  You can talk about "no talent" all you want, but they had an 11 point lead with 4 minutes and Heath tenses up, and so does his team.  Great guy, but a really bad coach.

[stronguard]

Heath's club was outscored 14-3 in the final 4 minutes, including a 12-0 run up to the 1 minute mark.  How many of those collapses did we have to suffer through.  You can talk about "no talent" all you want, but they had an 11 point lead with 4 minutes and Heath tenses up, and so does his team.  Great guy, but a really bad coach.

Carefull hogman.  DMac4 might get a bit upset that you are calling his boy STANLEY a poor coach.  But you're right, the proof is in the pudding.

[neblon]

THe question is; Did they have "FRESH LEGS" at the end?

The way they were outscored at the end it doesn't appear so.

[dmac4sainthood]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

You're one of the dumber posters on this board if you think STANLEY is a good coach.  Read more post less.   Oh and ask Bucknell if they think STANLEY is a good coach.

A good coach is one who fills the needs of hisprogram through recruitig, who adapts his style to fit the talent he has, and who can make in game adjustments when things are not working.  STANLEY did none of these. 

Go watch some cartoons and leave the posting to the grown ups DMAc.  Most of us here have forgotten more about sports than you will ever know.

Youre a funny funny person.  If you actually had any clue about coaching, and was something other than a dumb fan without perspective...which most fans are...they are ignorant.  It sort of goes along with the territory of being a fan.

For the record, Bucknell is also a very well coached team, with very smart players.

Enlighten me about something...how do you get to be a head coach at the college level, and in major divison 1 basketball, if you are a bad basketball coach?  Oh wait, I forgot, you obviously thought you knew something, but you don't!

Every coach, head or assistant, if you make it to that level, is a good coach.  Here is the problem, YOU ARE AGAINST GOOD COACHES TOO!  If you know so much about sports...why did you not take up a career in it?

You are nothing but an ignorant fan, who runs his mouth about something, he frankly doesn't know much about.  Give folks some credit for actually being able to establish a CAREER...at a VERY HIGH LEVEL....in a HIGHLY COMPETITVE FIELD!

I give all coaches credit, even the ones who lose, because to get to that level, is extremly tough, and extremly competitve.  To even get an opportunity at that level, makes you exceptional by the ranks of all coaches.  Does that make you elite...absolutly not, you have to prove that as a head coach at the college level.  I never said Stan was elite...he isn't.  He was an elite assistant, but has not proven to be any more than a mediocre division 1 basketball head coach thus far.  But is he a good coach...of course he's a good coach you idiot!

The great and unique thing about athletics:
Its the only area where people with an elementary level of knowledge will criticize people with a phd level of knowledge and act smug while doing it!

[stronguard]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

You're one of the dumber posters on this board if you think STANLEY is a good coach.  Read more post less.   Oh and ask Bucknell if they think STANLEY is a good coach.

A good coach is one who fills the needs of hisprogram through recruitig, who adapts his style to fit the talent he has, and who can make in game adjustments when things are not working.  STANLEY did none of these. 

Go watch some cartoons and leave the posting to the grown ups DMAc.  Most of us here have forgotten more about sports than you will ever know.

Youre a funny funny person.  If you actually had any clue about coaching, and was something other than a dumb fan without perspective...which most fans are...they are ignorant.  It sort of goes along with the territory of being a fan.

For the record, Bucknell is also a very well coached team, with very smart players.

Enlighten me about something...how do you get to be a head coach at the college level, and in major divison 1 basketball, if you are a bad basketball coach?  Oh wait, I forgot, you obviously thought you knew something, but you don't!

Every coach, head or assistant, if you make it to that level, is a good coach.  Here is the problem, YOU ARE AGAINST GOOD COACHES TOO!  If you know so much about sports...why did you not take up a career in it?

You are nothing but an ignorant fan, who runs his mouth about something, he frankly doesn't know much about.  Give folks some credit for actually being able to establish a CAREER...at a VERY HIGH LEVEL....in a HIGHLY COMPETITVE FIELD!

I give all coaches credit, even the ones who lose, because to get to that level, is extremly tough, and extremly competitve.  To even get an opportunity at that level, makes you exceptional by the ranks of all coaches.  Does that make you elite...absolutly not, you have to prove that as a head coach at the college level.  I never said Stan was elite...he isn't.  He was an elite assistant, but has not proven to be any more than a mediocre division 1 basketball head coach thus far.  But is he a good coach...of course he's a good coach you idiot!

The great and unique thing about athletics:
Its the only area where people with an elementary level of knowledge will criticize people with a phd level of knowledge and act smug while doing it!

When you are in a profession you are compared to your peers.  STANLEY is in the coaching profession, he is compared to his peers, he is not a quality coach.  And though I may not have taken the road of athletics as a profession, I count numerous coaches on the HS and college level as my friends and many of them have come to me for advice on matters pertaining to their respective teams.  I'm not trying to make myself sound important, but if you question my knowledge then I feel compelled to defend myself.

You call me ignorant.   I can assure you that I've forgotten more about sports, politics, love and life in general than you will ever know.   You're a mid twenties punk who thinks he knows more than he does. 

Here's another great thing about athletics.  There is a definitive score of your success.  STANLEY's was piss poor.  Any moron can see it, except you.

[dmac4sainthood]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

You're one of the dumber posters on this board if you think STANLEY is a good coach.  Read more post less.   Oh and ask Bucknell if they think STANLEY is a good coach.

A good coach is one who fills the needs of hisprogram through recruitig, who adapts his style to fit the talent he has, and who can make in game adjustments when things are not working.  STANLEY did none of these. 

Go watch some cartoons and leave the posting to the grown ups DMAc.  Most of us here have forgotten more about sports than you will ever know.

Youre a funny funny person.  If you actually had any clue about coaching, and was something other than a dumb fan without perspective...which most fans are...they are ignorant.  It sort of goes along with the territory of being a fan.

For the record, Bucknell is also a very well coached team, with very smart players.

Enlighten me about something...how do you get to be a head coach at the college level, and in major divison 1 basketball, if you are a bad basketball coach?  Oh wait, I forgot, you obviously thought you knew something, but you don't!

Every coach, head or assistant, if you make it to that level, is a good coach.  Here is the problem, YOU ARE AGAINST GOOD COACHES TOO!  If you know so much about sports...why did you not take up a career in it?

You are nothing but an ignorant fan, who runs his mouth about something, he frankly doesn't know much about.  Give folks some credit for actually being able to establish a CAREER...at a VERY HIGH LEVEL....in a HIGHLY COMPETITVE FIELD!

I give all coaches credit, even the ones who lose, because to get to that level, is extremly tough, and extremly competitve.  To even get an opportunity at that level, makes you exceptional by the ranks of all coaches.  Does that make you elite...absolutly not, you have to prove that as a head coach at the college level.  I never said Stan was elite...he isn't.  He was an elite assistant, but has not proven to be any more than a mediocre division 1 basketball head coach thus far.  But is he a good coach...of course he's a good coach you idiot!

The great and unique thing about athletics:
Its the only area where people with an elementary level of knowledge will criticize people with a phd level of knowledge and act smug while doing it!

When you are in a profession you are compared to your peers.  STANLEY is in the coaching profession, he is compared to his peers, he is not a quality coach.  And though I may not have taken the road of athletics as a profession, I count numerous coaches on the HS and college level as my friends and many of them have come to me for advice on matters pertaining to their respective teams.  I'm not trying to make myself sound important, but if you question my knowledge then I feel compelled to defend myself.

You call me ignorant.   I can assure you that I've forgotten more about sports, politics, love and life in general than you will ever know.   You're a mid twenties punk who thinks he knows more than he does. 

Here's another great thing about athletics.  There is a definitive score of your success.  STANLEY's was piss poor.  Any moron can see it, except you.

You are right about all the things you know more than me about...
except basketball.  I guarantee it. 

Its ok that you are a FAN...and you had FANS EXPECTATIONS...and unfortunatly, he didn't reach YOUR EXPECTATIONS.

Don't even try to compare your knowledge of basketball to mine...Its good to know that your expertise is derived from the fact you have friends as high school coaches.  Good to know that makes you an expert on basketball. 

You probably also believe any coach who has spent more than 10 years in anything other than mid major or higher basketball is a poor coach, simply because they haven't moved up...which is obviously a fans perspective, because as fans of a high major program, we have a very arrogant approach to any school, player, or coach we do not percieved at "our level", which is of course is rediculous.

[MDH]

STANLEY is not a quality coach.  Haven't we been over this?

Good showing of ignorance.

If people do not understand that the margin or error is razor thin between huge success and fired, they are ignorant.

You can not accidentally work your way into D1, much less high D1.

Enlighten me what is a good or quality coach then?  What are its attributes?

What these fools forget is that EVERYBODY AT THIS LEVEL IS A FANTASTIC COACH!  That is why the talent differential is so important.  If you are a great coach with bad talent, against a great coach with great talent, you know what...you lose!

You're one of the dumber posters on this board if you think STANLEY is a good coach.  Read more post less.   Oh and ask Bucknell if they think STANLEY is a good coach.

A good coach is one who fills the needs of hisprogram through recruitig, who adapts his style to fit the talent he has, and who can make in game adjustments when things are not working.  STANLEY did none of these. 

Go watch some cartoons and leave the posting to the grown ups DMAc.  Most of us here have forgotten more about sports than you will ever know.

Youre a funny funny person.  If you actually had any clue about coaching, and was something other than a dumb fan without perspective...which most fans are...they are ignorant.  It sort of goes along with the territory of being a fan.

For the record, Bucknell is also a very well coached team, with very smart players.

Enlighten me about something...how do you get to be a head coach at the college level, and in major divison 1 basketball, if you are a bad basketball coach?  Oh wait, I forgot, you obviously thought you knew something, but you don't!

Every coach, head or assistant, if you make it to that level, is a good coach.  Here is the problem, YOU ARE AGAINST GOOD COACHES TOO!  If you know so much about sports...why did you not take up a career in it?

You are nothing but an ignorant fan, who runs his mouth about something, he frankly doesn't know much about.  Give folks some credit for actually being able to establish a CAREER...at a VERY HIGH LEVEL....in a HIGHLY COMPETITVE FIELD!

I give all coaches credit, even the ones who lose, because to get to that level, is extremly tough, and extremly competitve.  To even get an opportunity at that level, makes you exceptional by the ranks of all coaches.  Does that make you elite...absolutly not, you have to prove that as a head coach at the college level.  I never said Stan was elite...he isn't.  He was an elite assistant, but has not proven to be any more than a mediocre division 1 basketball head coach thus far.  But is he a good coach...of course he's a good coach you idiot!

The great and unique thing about athletics:
Its the only area where people with an elementary level of knowledge will criticize people with a phd level of knowledge and act smug while doing it!

When you are in a profession you are compared to your peers.  STANLEY is in the coaching profession, he is compared to his peers, he is not a quality coach.  And though I may not have taken the road of athletics as a profession, I count numerous coaches on the HS and college level as my friends and many of them have come to me for advice on matters pertaining to their respective teams.  I'm not trying to make myself sound important, but if you question my knowledge then I feel compelled to defend myself.

You call me ignorant.   I can assure you that I've forgotten more about sports, politics, love and life in general than you will ever know.   You're a mid twenties punk who thinks he knows more than he does. 

Here's another great thing about athletics.  There is a definitive score of your success.  STANLEY's was piss poor.  Any moron can see it, except you.

I wouldn't say that it was piss poor.  Just not good enough for Arkansas.  Same thing happened to Tubby at KY.  It all goes back to the history of the programs.  That's a big reason why the KY/BG/AR/JP thing is so damn interesting to me.  It's got so many interconnections it's destined to be the stuff of legends- provided BG picks things up at KY and JP keeps things going forward here.

[stronguard]

No DMac4.  You are missing the point.  I AM NOT an expert in basketball.  Unfortunately neither are you.  But I AM smart enough to see that STANLEY was in waaaaaaaay over his head.  I can't say the same for you.   Does STANLEY know more than your run of the mill rec league coach?  Sure he does.  But when you are the coach of a major D-1 program then you are compared to other coaches of major D-1 programs.  He compares very unfavorably.  And though this may not be popular, one of the biggest reasons that he got a chance in the "big-time" was because the U of A was trying to cover up the racist leanings of its AD by hiring another minority candidate to fill the job left by Nolan.  STANLEY was not the best man for the job, but he did solve a sticky situation with the national media.  All that being said. STANLEY is not a quality coach in the universe of D-1 Coaches.

Many highly successful coaches spend their entire careers at low level jobs.  Whatever makes them happy.   Most coaches though are type A personalities that feel the need to compete at the highest possible level.  STANLEY has made this jump, but once he made it, everyone saw that he does not have what it takes to succeed.  South Florida will be the next school to see this.


As for you MDH.  The funniest thing I have read all night is you comparing what happened to Tubby to STANLEY.  Tubby won a NC, Tubby fielded a top 25 team almost every single year he was there, Tubby made it past the 1st round of the NCAA's.  I have a lot of family in the bluegrass state, Tubby's biggest problem was that he didn't beat Pitino. 

[MDH]

As for you MDH.  The funniest thing I have read all night is you comparing what happened to Tubby to STANLEY.  Tubby won a NC, Tubby fielded a top 25 team almost every single year he was there, Tubby made it past the 1st round of the NCAA's.  I have a lot of family in the bluegrass state, Tubby's biggest problem was that he didn't beat Pitino. 

Which was not good enough for Kentucky...  The situations were similar.  I didn't say Heath was as good as Smith.  Comprehend more and post less.

[dmac4sainthood]

No DMac4.  You are missing the point.  I AM NOT an expert in basketball.  Unfortunately neither are you.  But I AM smart enough to see that STANLEY was in waaaaaaaay over his head.  I can't say the same for you.   Does STANLEY know more than your run of the mill rec league coach?  Sure he does.  But when you are the coach of a major D-1 program then you are compared to other coaches of major D-1 programs.  He compares very unfavorably.  And though this may not be popular, one of the biggest reasons that he got a chance in the "big-time" was because the U of A was trying to cover up the racist leanings of its AD by hiring another minority candidate to fill the job left by Nolan.  STANLEY was not the best man for the job, but he did solve a sticky situation with the national media.  All that being said. STANLEY is not a quality coach in the universe of D-1 Coaches.

Many highly successful coaches spend their entire careers at low level jobs.  Whatever makes them happy.   Most coaches though are type A personalities that feel the need to compete at the highest possible level.  STANLEY has made this jump, but once he made it, everyone saw that he does not have what it takes to succeed.  South Florida will be the next school to see this.


As for you MDH.  The funniest thing I have read all night is you comparing what happened to Tubby to STANLEY.  Tubby won a NC, Tubby fielded a top 25 team almost every single year he was there, Tubby made it past the 1st round of the NCAA's.  I have a lot of family in the bluegrass state, Tubby's biggest problem was that he didn't beat Pitino. 

I will agree...as much as I am a Stan fan...maybe his biggest supporter, and I will continue to be on that ship success or fail...because I wholeheartedly believe in him...I will not compare him to Tubby!

To add: Tubby's problem was he didn't want to put up the the bs that the top recruits put you through.  Tubby wanted to recruit his players and play his way...considering he may have had one of the least talented SEC teams (I mean after Rondo, Crawford, and Morris...name his highly talented players in the past few years) I think he did a heck of a job at UK, considering he put himself at a talent disadvantage.  In my mind, Tubby is one of the best floor coaches in college basketball.

Think about it: Bobby Perry?  Shagari Alleyne? Lucasz Obzut?  Ravi Moss?  Who were those guys?  But Tubby won games, a lot of games, against more talented teams with those guys!

[HawgG]

To bad I missed this debate, oh how easy it would have been for me with this topic.

Damn shame really.

[Bomis Hawg]

Honestly, I think his first year at Arkansas had more talent than USF has now.
Still, you have to win games you should win without these reoccuring errors.

Big East is not the SEC, but the difference in talent levels from then til now compare to what he has on his team are about the same.  Just keep an eye on Stan.  We'll see what he has.  Next year will start the guage.  This year, though, might be ugly.  Some of it will be his fault, not all.

[ErieHog]

Honestly, I think his first year at Arkansas had more talent than USF has now.
Still, you have to win games you should win without these reoccuring errors.

Big East is not the SEC, but the difference in talent levels from then til now compare to what he has on his team are about the same.  Just keep an eye on Stan.  We'll see what he has.  Next year will start the guage.  This year, though, might be ugly.  Some of it will be his fault, not all.

USF returns the nation's leading rebounder, and one of the better defensive teams in the Big East on the whole;  while they had an atrocious record, the cupboard is far from bare.

Heath *should* win more this year than they did last year, with even a competent coaching job.

[Hogginitall]

No DMac4.  You are missing the point.  I AM NOT an expert in basketball.  Unfortunately neither are you.  But I AM smart enough to see that STANLEY was in waaaaaaaay over his head.  I can't say the same for you.   Does STANLEY know more than your run of the mill rec league coach?  Sure he does.  But when you are the coach of a major D-1 program then you are compared to other coaches of major D-1 programs.  He compares very unfavorably.  And though this may not be popular, one of the biggest reasons that he got a chance in the "big-time" was because the U of A was trying to cover up the racist leanings of its AD by hiring another minority candidate to fill the job left by Nolan.  STANLEY was not the best man for the job, but he did solve a sticky situation with the national media.  All that being said. STANLEY is not a quality coach in the universe of D-1 Coaches.

Many highly successful coaches spend their entire careers at low level jobs.  Whatever makes them happy.   Most coaches though are type A personalities that feel the need to compete at the highest possible level.  STANLEY has made this jump, but once he made it, everyone saw that he does not have what it takes to succeed.  South Florida will be the next school to see this.


As for you MDH.  The funniest thing I have read all night is you comparing what happened to Tubby to STANLEY.  Tubby won a NC, Tubby fielded a top 25 team almost every single year he was there, Tubby made it past the 1st round of the NCAA's.  I have a lot of family in the bluegrass state, Tubby's biggest problem was that he didn't beat Pitino. 

All you have to do is look at Heath's road record while he was at Arkansas. 

"The Razorbacks went to only two NCAA Tournaments in Heath's five seasons, and both resulted in early exits. Plus, Heath racked up a Southeastern Conference road record of 7-33, including a 2-6 mark in 2007."

That is not the sign of a good coach.  He's a nice guy, but not a good coach.  You can't just keep saying stuff like "he has to be good, he got to this level", etc.  While it's true he had to be good enough on a lower level to get a chance at this level, he proved that he was not good enough to be successful on this level (at least not yet) once he reached it. 

As someone pointed out, South Florida was up by a fairly significant margin with under two minutes to play and they collapsed.  We saw that plenty with his teams at Arkansas.  This is not a new thing, nor is it a good thing.

http://www.nwaonline.com/articles/2007/03/27/news/032707uabkbheathfront.txt

[HogMavFan]

This is the same Stan Heath tale told 'round world.

Stan has been under some great tutaluge or whatever.  But the great Michigan State teams always had a point guard and a power forward.  Not to mention the rest of the Spartan's were all top notch recruits.  Kent State had a magical season.  Honestly, I don't know who the hell they had on that team but if a Gardner-Webb can beat Kentucky's McDonald's All-Amercian's then we know coaching can occasionally win over talent....occasionally.

Go back to Stan's first years at Arkansas:  8 wins.  14 or so wins.  No point guard.  Just guards forced to play point.  Look at the assistant's he surrounds himself with.  Nobody ever in jeopardy of educating him or taking his job.  Pelfrey comes right in and hires an SEC NCAA tourney veteran in Evans.

Hey, I gotta buddy in Tampa....and he tells me that the USF players are really pumped about Stan.  He's a players coach.  I think they'll like Stan Heath the role model.  I don't think they'll like Stan Heath, basketball philosopher.

I think they like the Stan Heath that doesn't run their asses in practice.

[HawgG]

Honestly, I think his first year at Arkansas had more talent than USF has now.
Still, you have to win games you should win without these reoccuring errors.

Big East is not the SEC, but the difference in talent levels from then til now compare to what he has on his team are about the same.  Just keep an eye on Stan.  We'll see what he has.  Next year will start the guage.  This year, though, might be ugly.  Some of it will be his fault, not all.

USF returns the nation's leading rebounder, and one of the better defensive teams in the Big East on the whole;  while they had an atrocious record, the cupboard is far from bare.

Heath *should* win more this year than they did last year, with even a competent coaching job.

HaHaHa, better defensive teams.

USF slowed the ball down so much that teams didn't get the chance to score a lot of points.

Yes Kentrell Gransberry is a good player to bad Stan didn't have him or Holmes for that game.Those are two of their better players and much needed players on that roster.He won't get Holmes until the end of the semester.

[HawgG]

I think they like the Stan Heath that doesn't run their asses in practice.

From what I gather Stan is a lot tougher on USF players then he was here.

Plenty of demanding running drills, cursing out players , threats and picking fights by Heath at USF as I have been told.