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Detailed look at new HC Chad Morris.

Started by bennyl08, December 06, 2017, 06:45:46 pm

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bennyl08

Morris is still relatively young at 49 years old. He has an extensive history as a HS coach in Texas with a 169-38 record. He jumped straight up to OC/QB coach at Tulsa in 2010 starting his collegiate coaching career where he was also associate HC. After one year in Tulsa, he was the OC/QB coach at Clemson for 4 years from 2011-2014 when he then accepted the HC job at SMU where he has a 14-22 record. Not great by any stretch but only once coach (June Jones) has had a better record in the 30 years since the death penalty there.

Morris played QB in high school, but never played in college, where he majored in math and also got a minor in statistics.

Below, I'll talk about Morris's impact at each of his three previous collegiate stops. In a following post, I'll provide the numbers compiled.

TULSA: He didn't do anything there that hadn't been done before, but his one year at Tulsa definitely ranks among the better years from 2008-present. His passing attack ranked lower in completion percentage and higher in ypa and rating suggesting that deeper throws were attempted and not just a dink and dunk passing while still being efficient. While sacks and TFL's had a marked improvement from the previous year, they are among the bottom half of what Tulsa experienced, a common theme. Also, the one year there, he did have NFL TE Charles Clay to work with, but his stats were not any better than previous years and actually had fewer td's.

CLEMSON: His time at Clemson provides an interesting case study. Before his time at Clemson, they tiger's were constantly bowling but nothing too major. Once he arrived, they haven't had fewer than 10 wins since then. However, once he left, the team also had a demonstrable increase in performance. So, hard to really judge his performance as the OC there since they improved when he went there, but improved any more after he left.

Scoring jumped up quite a bit when he took the clemson OC job, rushing improved a bit in yards and not so much in ypc, passing greatly jumped forward. With the passing, there was also the vertical game until his fourth year. 3rd and 4th down conversions improved. RZ scoring didn't improve much, TOP got worse until his fourth year, which was by far his worst (more on that later). The team became much worse with sacks and tfl's as was hinted with the one year at Tulsa. However, the record did improve. Why the big drop in the fourth year? While the NFL talent leaving was pretty steady, two big time receivers left (Hopkins and Bryant), they lost an NFL guard, and then they also lost their starting qb. Watson played well the first half of the season, but was injured and the backup was not very good at all. After Morris left, the offensive scoring ranks decreased slightly, but the rushing and ypc greatly improved, passing yardage fell off a bit in compensation, third and 4th down conversions improved after he left, TOP improved after he left (to be expected with the increased running game), TFL and sacks dropped way, way down.

SMU: SMU is also an interesting look. The program had been in turmoil but the main coach before him had actually build some success before personal problems undisclosed led to a quick crash and burn before Morris came in and brought the program close to the moderate success of before. Every offensive statistic (didn't look at defense since that isn't his knowledge area) improved during his time there. Further, given his lack of experience, small changes in philosophy seem to appear as well. Increased emphasis on the run game and not just the passing game. More emphasis on sustaining drives. Time of possession decreased as time went on for him, as a result of more scoring from the offense and bigger chunk plays. Further, while his sack and TFL numbers are on the higher side, even by SMU standards, but unlike his previous stop, there is actually marked improvement in line play. Still not great, but improvement.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

bennyl08

Now focusing on wins and box score type of stuff

TULSA: Went 10-3 his only year there in 2010, Tulsa was 5-7 the previous year but was 10+ the 2 years before that. Short success in record in the 2 years after he left (new HC as well), but then it has been quite bad. 3 years with 3 or less wins, one year at 6-7, and then an anomaly at 10-3 in 2016. In his one season there, the only blowout loss was 65-28 @okla state (11-2). They even beat ND (8-5) 28-27. 7 games over 40 points. Only 1 game under 20 points, a 21-18 loss @SMU (7-7).

CLEMSON: Clemson jumped up to winning 10+ games a year when he first got there, in Swiney's 3rd year. Clemson has continued that since he left. Before he got there, they were a perennial bowl team but had been 20 years since they were a double digit win team. In terms of bowl games, Clemson went to two orange bowls, getting blown out against WVU in one and squeaking past Ohio St in the other. They beat LSU and Okla in lesser bowls. 23 games with 40+ points in the 4 seasons at clemson OC and 10 games with under 20 points. They lost 8 of those 10 games. 7-9 record against teams ranked at the time the two played. 6 of their total losses were blowout losses defined as being 21+ point losses. Overall record of 42-11 as the OC at clemson. In games decided by 8 points or less, clemson was 9-1 in his time there.

SMU: Following the school's death penalty in the mid-80's, SMU hadn't been able to qualify for a bowl game until June Jones became coach a bit less than a decade ago. He built the team up towards 4 straight bowl games (3-1 in those games) from 2009-2012. The program dipped in 2013 going 5-7 but collapsed in 2014 as the HC Jones cited personal reasons for needing to leave. In comes Morris in 2015. Year 1, he goes 2-11, and played 4 ranked teams. He kept the game within 19 points in a 56-37 loss to TCU, being as close as 5 points away midway through the 4th quarter. They also were within 5 points midway through the 4th against ranked Temple, before losing to them as well 60-40. Despite the bad record, they had 3 games with 40+ points that year (going 1-2 in those games), and only 3 games with <20 points. In year 2, the team went 5-7. This year, only one game with 40+ points (an OT loss to Tulsa), and 3 games with <20 points. With no close games in year one, SMU went 2-2 in games decided by 8 points or less in year 2 under Morris. There were 6 blowout losses (losses of 20+ points) and 2 blowout victories (same rubric). Year 3, the team improved to 7-5. Only 2 blowout losses and both only barely qualified as such. 3 blowout wins. 3-2 in games decided by 8 points or less. 7 games with 40+ points (going 5-2 in those games) and 22 points was the lowest score for SMU, so no games under 20 points.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

 

bennyl08

Some numbers: Unless otherwise noted here, values listed are NCAA ranks. Scoring offense is as described. Rushing gives the yard per game rank and the yards per carry rank. The first being higher than the second suggests high volume use of the run game relative to the success of those carries. The second number being higher suggests that the run game is being under utilized relative to it's success.

Passing game for before and after is just the ranking of the yards per game. For when the coach is there, you see that same ranking and then in parenthesis, the ranking of completion %, ypa, and qb rating respectively. Int's is total thrown ranking.

LONG gives the ranking for the number of 20+ yard plays and the number of 40+ yard plays respectively. The second number being higher suggests that when plays went big, they went really big. The first number being higher suggest that chunk plays were there but that they didn't break away for longer as often.

3rd and 4th down numbers give the ranking for the conversion percentages. RZ shows the ranking for scoring percentage in the redzone with the following number providing the raw td %. I.e. not a ranking on the second number. High first number shows that when in the red zone, the team ranked low on how often it was able to get points. High second number shows that when in the redzone, that percent of the time they scored td's. The scoring percentage ranking correlates more with winning games though than the percentage of td's scored interestingly enough. TOP is ranking of time of possession.

TFL is tackle for loss rankings and the same for sacks.

Tulsa: before: scoring offense 2nd, 43rd,
rushing offense (total/ypc): 5/5, 58/82, passing 9, 32, INT 115, 35 LONG n/a, n/a
3rd down 1, 65, 4th down 75 116 RZ 26/74, 82/56 TOP 78, 58
TFL 55, 108 Sacks 52, 118
during scoring offense 6th,
rushing offense: 15/14, passing: 13th(56/26/27), INT 41 LONG 3/7
3rd down 16 4th down 51 RZ  32/66 TOP 45
TFL 43 Sacks 74
after, scoring offense 29, 30, 103, 94, 21, 6, 60,
rushing offense: 25/27, 9/26, 70/79, 90/96, 61/103, 8/34, 16/27, passing 44, 84, 101, 37, 11, 30, 108, INT 112, 73, 119, 117, 14, 75, 38 LONG 27/7, 21/8, 93/120, 89/100, 16/13, 38/11, 62/21
3rd down 52, 76, 97, 85, 26, 20, 32,  4th down 91 41, 39, 107, 55, 22, 32,  RZ 82/59, 77/65, 93/47, 103/54, 51/61, 22/62, 36/74 TOP 113, 50, 103, 24, 110, 67, 109
TFL 35, 21, 51, 28, 63, 24, 66,  Sacks 33, 2, 6, 70, 117, 47, 75,

Clemson: before: scoring offense 60th, 28, 86,
rushing offense: 100/99, 40/19, 79/78, passing 58, 88, 78, , INT 96, 64, 70,  LONG n/a, n/a, 89/45
3rd down 112 67, 66 4th down 93 111, 62 RZ 68/53, 69/55, 111/54 TOP 83 106, 82,
TFL 96, 40, 26 Sacks 95, 24, 34
during, scoring offense 23, 6, 8, 54,
rushing offense: 59/55, 36/70, 56/73, 91/108, passing 21(64, 46,42), 13(10/6/4), 9(6,13,8), 39(14,50,41), INT 63, 85, 59, 64 LONG 18/12, 4/8, 24/17, 61/105
3rd down 35, 5, 35, 53 4th down 73 1, 35, 112,  RZ 73/57, 1/73, 51/68, 113/48 TOP 105, 92, 112, 34,
TFL 78, 75, 103, 107,  Sacks 87, 88, 102, 68
after scoring offense 16, 14, 21,
rushing offense: 21/30, 71/73, 33/34, passing 23, 7, 52, INT 104, 120, 28 LONG 2/35, 9/98, 50/26
3rd down 13, 8, 10,  4th down 42, 22, 3,  RZ 14/60, 66/72, 14/76 TOP 26, 55, 44
TFL 17, 26, 37 Sacks 19, 22, 62

SMU: before: scoring offense 93, 45, 74, 69, 53, 76, 128,
rushing offense: 120/119, 102/79, 81/27, 101/56, 95/65, 119/110, 121/115, passing 17, 15, 21, 24, 63, 8, 114, INT 119, 73, 70, 118, 93, 59, 86,  LONG n/a, n/a, 12/34, 25/67, 63/90, 75/23, 127/110
3rd down 99 112, 37, 64, 70, 78, 118 4th down 69, 69, 27, 108, 116, 69, 61 RZ 89/57, 12/70, 58/69, 100/60, 89/49, 98/54, 124/41 TOP 117, 28, 46, 44, 4, 87, 92,
TFL 27, 61, 20, 46, 65, 63, 107,  Sacks 72, 103, 107, 83, 100, 116, 127
during, scoring offense: 71, 71, 8,,
rushing offense: 74/97, 81/91, 44/27, passing 70(88,64,71), 34(107,78, 92), 16(71, 27, 27), INT 14, 120, 59 LONG 66/81, 56/41, 7/15
3rd down 65, 39, 30 4th down 114, 112, 9 RZ 60/68, 111/46, 41/67 TOP 38, 54, 78
TFL 125, 90, 40 Sacks 125, 73, 37
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

TebowHater

Great post. Thanks for taking the time to analyze.

Not quite as great results as I was hoping to see, but not surprised.

bennyl08

TL;DR

If you want the condensed version, sacks and TFL's will likely be a big problem offensively for us with Morris on board, but for the first time in his collegiate career, he did start to finally limit some of those as time went on at SMU. He will increase scoring and improve the offense, primarily by means of the passing game but he doesn't ignore the running game either. Chunk plays lead to low time's of possession with Morris which will strain our defenses. Morris's worst seasons come with high ToP for him and his best seasons are when the offense rarely has the ball because it scores quickly. He doesn't seem to bring a ton of improvement in terms of 3rd and 4th down conversions, though like tackles for loss, he did show for his first time effort to improve those during his stay at SMU.

The guy is still a relatively young coach, and especially so at the collegiate level. So, his coaching philosophy is still changing. The guy has a numbers background and didn't play football in college, though he was a qb in HS. He spent a long time coaching HS football in texas and then has risen extremely quickly through the college ranks to get to where he is now, with a similar path as Gus.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

bennyl08

One area you may have noticed that I haven't covered is recruiting.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

TXArcher


TebowHater

Quote from: TXArcher on December 06, 2017, 07:04:25 pm
Well, cover it please.

Definitely hoping for him to cover it to.

I briefly looked at just his time at SMU before he was hired and their recruiting fell by ~10 ranks upon his arrival.

farmhawg

From theflyinghog

Jeff Long is sitting around drinking some fruity girl drink and reading this and realizing he was the wrong man for the job. We're crazy. We love us some damn hog football. There may be a bunch of suits sitting behind glass on gameday but dammit you better not cross us airplane-tracking, fence-jumping, hangar-breakin-entering night-vision purchasin sumbitches! We're Miracle on Markham and 4th and 25, 7 overtime-winning tear down the goalposts and drag em down Dickson because you ain't goin to the BCS, fat phil!! BRING ME A COACH WITH A PAIR AND SACRIFICE A VIRGIN CUZ ITS TIME TO FUSCING WIN!!!!

bennyl08

https://247sports.com/Coach/Chad-Morris-749/AllTimeRecruits

Recruiting isn't as easy to cover because the information either isn't out there or isn't as well compiled. Above is the best single source I know of. On his all time recruits list, you'll see the players that it is known he was either the primary or the secondary recruiter on.

Several high round NFL draft picks including Deshaun Watson and Shaq Lawson. Other names you probably recognize would be Zac Brooks, Jordan Leggett.

Looking only at his time at memphis, since much of the recruiting at Tulsa and Clemson would have been out of his control, at least at memphis, the recruiting was either his or from people he hired...

Before Chad Morris was HC
2010: #71, 20 3*'s, 81.43 avg
2011: #77, 8 3*'s, 77.97 avg
2012: #92, 6 3*'s, 77.13 avg
2013: #90, 7 3*'s, 77.45 avg
2014: #78, 12 3*'s, 78.42 avg

2015*: #77, 1 4*, 15 3*'s, 79.44 avg, had short time to compile this class
2016: #61, 18 3*'s, 81.81 avg
2017: #56, 1 4*, 20 3*'s, 81.87 avg
2018*: #82, 10 3*'s, 80.75 avg, obviously this class is not yet complete
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

bennyl08

Quote from: TebowHater on December 06, 2017, 07:06:29 pm
Definitely hoping for him to cover it to.

I briefly looked at just his time at SMU before he was hired and their recruiting fell by ~10 ranks upon his arrival.

Where were you looking? Based on 247, it only went up save for this last recruiting cycle which isn't complete yet.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

bennyl08

So, all in all, I'd agree with the reports that he's a pretty good recruiter. He wasn't the best recruiter at Clemson, but he got some big time players for them.

SMU hadn't had any 4* players in the 5 years before he got there. He was able to get 2 4* players in the first three years there. Hard to say what would have happened over the next two months for the finish of the 2018 class had he stayed. The average rating of the recruit for 2018 is still higher than the 4 years before he got there.

Based on his time at Clemson, he's had experience recruiting with some of the big boys. He's gotten better players to go to SMU than they've had in a long time.

If he can simply sustain the recruiting that Bielema has done and can fix the x's and o's part, then we should be an 8-9 win team on average with a couple 10 win seasons every 5 years or so.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

PorkSoda

what's all this mean?  our QB better be elusive.

"I became insane, with long intervals of horrible sanity." ― Edgar Allan Poe
"If quantum mechanics hasn't profoundly shocked you, you haven't understood it yet. Everything we call real is made of things that cannot be regarded as real." – Niels Bohr
"A mind stretched to a new idea, never returns to its original dimensions" ~ Oliver Wendell Holmes
Quote from: PonderinHog on August 07, 2023, 06:37:15 pmYeah, we're all here, but we ain't all there.

 

Großer Kriegschwein

Quote from: bennyl08 on December 06, 2017, 06:45:46 pm
Morris is still relatively young at 49 years old. He has an extensive history as a HS coach in Texas with a 169-38 record. He jumped straight up to OC/QB coach at Tulsa in 2010 starting his collegiate coaching career where he was also associate HC. After one year in Tulsa, he was the OC/QB coach at Clemson for 4 years from 2011-2014 when he then accepted the HC job at SMU where he has a 14-22 record. Not great by any stretch but only once coach (June Jones) has had a better record in the 30 years since the death penalty there.

Morris played QB in high school, but never played in college, where he majored in math and also got a minor in statistics.

Below, I'll talk about Morris's impact at each of his three previous collegiate stops. In a following post, I'll provide the numbers compiled.

TULSA: He didn't do anything there that hadn't been done before, but his one year at Tulsa definitely ranks among the better years from 2008-present. (Brought the offense back into the Top-5 nationally after regressing significantly the year after Gus left for Auburn. In 2009 they regressed from #1 to #35, but in 2010 Morris helped them get back to #5 nationally)His passing attack ranked lower in completion percentage and higher in ypa and rating suggesting that deeper throws were attempted and not just a dink and dunk passing while still being efficient. While sacks and TFL's had a marked improvement from the previous year, they are among the bottom half of what Tulsa experienced, a common theme. Also, the one year there, he did have NFL TE Charles Clay to work with, but his stats were not any better than previous years and actually had fewer td's.

CLEMSON: His time at Clemson provides an interesting case study. Before his time at Clemson, they tiger's were constantly bowling but nothing too major. Once he arrived, they haven't had fewer than 10 wins since then. However, once he left, the team also had a demonstrable increase in performance. So, hard to really judge his performance as the OC there since they improved when he went there, but improved any more after he left.

Scoring jumped up quite a bit when he took the clemson OC job, rushing improved a bit in yards and not so much in ypc, passing greatly jumped forward. With the passing, there was also the vertical game until his fourth year. 3rd and 4th down conversions improved. RZ scoring didn't improve much, TOP got worse until his fourth year, which was by far his worst (more on that later). The team became much worse with sacks and tfl's as was hinted with the one year at Tulsa. However, the record did improve. Why the big drop in the fourth year? While the NFL talent leaving was pretty steady, two big time receivers left (Hopkins and Bryant), they lost an NFL guard, and then they also lost their starting qb. Watson played well the first half of the season, but was injured and the backup was not very good at all. After Morris left, the offensive scoring ranks decreased slightly, but the rushing and ypc greatly improved, passing yardage fell off a bit in compensation, third and 4th down conversions improved after he left, TOP improved after he left (to be expected with the increased running game), TFL and sacks dropped way, way down. (some of this can be attributed to the development of Deshaun Watson, who in 2014, was a true freshman starter. As he developed, his game awareness became better and took less sacks etc...)

SMU: SMU is also an interesting look. The program had been in turmoil but the main coach before him had actually build some success before personal problems undisclosed led to a quick crash and burn before Morris came in and brought the program close to the moderate success of before. Every offensive statistic (didn't look at defense since that isn't his knowledge area) improved during his time there. Further, given his lack of experience, small changes in philosophy seem to appear as well. Increased emphasis on the run game and not just the passing game. More emphasis on sustaining drives. Time of possession decreased as time went on for him, as a result of more scoring from the offense and bigger chunk plays. Further, while his sack and TFL numbers are on the higher side, even by SMU standards, but unlike his previous stop, there is actually marked improvement in line play. Still not great, but improvement.
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davril98


bennyl08

Quote from: Großer Kriegschwein on December 06, 2017, 07:41:12 pm


By what metric was tulsa top 5? They were #6 in scoring. They were 2nd in scoring in 2008, dropped to 43rd, then back up to 6th. That type of variability isn't uncommon. Heck, from 2014 to 2017, they went from 94th, to 21st to 6th, then back to 60th. There was a coaching change from 14-15 where the offensive improvement was seen, but then that dropped back down to the 60's.

While Watson did develop after Morris left, it's not like he had nothing to work with his first three years. Tahj Boyd was every bit as athletic as Watson and able to avoid the sack, and was a senior in Morris's third year. So, what you posted isn't a valid excuse. Further, this is a pattern that's shown up at each of his jobs. Tulsa was worse off in lost yardage plays with him than they were without. Clemson was worse off as well. As poorly as SMU has done, they did worse with him in lost yardage plays as well before he eventually brought them back to about where they were before.

If you want to make a counter argument about the sacks and tfl's, the way to go about that would be to then look at the total number of plays ran. Morris runs a very fast paced offense. Maybe there's a 20% increase in plays run per game such that there will naturally be an increase in plays that go for a loss. Given the magnitude of the changes, I don't think that would explain it all, but there is a chance that explains at least part.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

Großer Kriegschwein

Total Offense

Taj Boyd wasn't nearly the runner that Deshaun Watson was. Decent yes, but not nearly as elusive.

I think you're digging too much looking for something that you probably won't find.
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TebowHater

Quote from: bennyl08 on December 06, 2017, 07:32:25 pm
Where were you looking? Based on 247, it only went up save for this last recruiting cycle which isn't complete yet.

Hmmm. I was using 247 too. These were the numbers. I just rechecked, linked below.

Morris - Average 78.67
2017 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8113
2016 - Natl Rank: 75 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8142
2015 - Natl Rank: 81 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8045

Jones - Average 71.3 (3 years prior to Morris: 74)
2014 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 9 Avg Rating: 0.7855
2013 - Natl Rank: 72 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8047
2012 - Natl Rank: 70 AAC Rank: 4 Avg Rating: 0.8130
2011 - Natl Rank: 67 AAC Rank: 3 Avg Rating: 0.7960
2010 - Natl Rank: 66 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8261
2009 - Natl Rank: 73 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8094


2015 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2015-Football/Commits
2016 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2016-Football/Commits
2017 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2017-Football/Commits

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bennyl08

Quote from: TebowHater on December 06, 2017, 08:58:49 pm
Hmmm. I was using 247 too. These were the numbers. I just rechecked, linked below.

Morris - Average 78.67
2017 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8113
2016 - Natl Rank: 75 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8142
2015 - Natl Rank: 81 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8045

Jones - Average 71.3 (3 years prior to Morris: 74)
2014 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 9 Avg Rating: 0.7855
2013 - Natl Rank: 72 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8047
2012 - Natl Rank: 70 AAC Rank: 4 Avg Rating: 0.8130
2011 - Natl Rank: 67 AAC Rank: 3 Avg Rating: 0.7960
2010 - Natl Rank: 66 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8261
2009 - Natl Rank: 73 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8094


2015 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2015-Football/Commits
2016 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2016-Football/Commits
2017 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2017-Football/Commits

Weird, because the same site:

https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Football/CompositeTeamRankings

Has for example 2015, memphis is rated #77, not 81 with an average rating of 79.44 and not .8045

Guessing one of them is using a composite and the other is using just 247's own personal ratings? Strange that there would be such a difference between the two. I.e. 2015 isn't that different, but 2017's is very different. We're talking about a 56 ranking vs a 80 ranking.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

PorkSoda

Quote from: TebowHater on December 06, 2017, 08:58:49 pm
Hmmm. I was using 247 too. These were the numbers. I just rechecked, linked below.

Morris - Average 78.67
2017 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8113
2016 - Natl Rank: 75 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8142
2015 - Natl Rank: 81 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8045

Jones - Average 71.3 (3 years prior to Morris: 74)
2014 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 9 Avg Rating: 0.7855
2013 - Natl Rank: 72 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8047
2012 - Natl Rank: 70 AAC Rank: 4 Avg Rating: 0.8130
2011 - Natl Rank: 67 AAC Rank: 3 Avg Rating: 0.7960
2010 - Natl Rank: 66 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8261
2009 - Natl Rank: 73 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8094


2015 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2015-Football/Commits
2016 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2016-Football/Commits
2017 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2017-Football/Commits
IOW he did slightly more with slightly less.

but then again, its must have been a huge change for him going from coaching clemson athletes to SMU's bottom of the barrel recruiting situation.

Now he is going to be coaching SEC athletes while also coaching against somewhat higher tier SEC athletes.

should be interesting to see how he does.
"I became insane, with long intervals of horrible sanity." ― Edgar Allan Poe
"If quantum mechanics hasn't profoundly shocked you, you haven't understood it yet. Everything we call real is made of things that cannot be regarded as real." – Niels Bohr
"A mind stretched to a new idea, never returns to its original dimensions" ~ Oliver Wendell Holmes
Quote from: PonderinHog on August 07, 2023, 06:37:15 pmYeah, we're all here, but we ain't all there.

Hogwasher

Absolutely don't want this to come across as a smart AZZED question-  just curious what you all's day jobs are?  Lots of research and football IQ being shared...... pretty impressive!

TebowHater

Quote from: bennyl08 on December 06, 2017, 09:07:21 pm
Weird, because the same site:

https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Football/CompositeTeamRankings

Has for example 2015, memphis is rated #77, not 81 with an average rating of 79.44 and not .8045

Guessing one of them is using a composite and the other is using just 247's own personal ratings? Strange that there would be such a difference between the two. I.e. 2015 isn't that different, but 2017's is very different. We're talking about a 56 ranking vs a 80 ranking.

That site for me shows

81 in 2015 - https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Football/CompositeTeamRankings
75 in 2016 - https://247sports.com/Season/2016-Football/CompositeTeamRankings
80 in 2017 - https://247sports.com/Season/2017-Football/CompositeTeamRankings

TebowHater

Quote from: bennyl08 on December 06, 2017, 09:07:21 pm
Weird, because the same site:

https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Football/CompositeTeamRankings

Has for example 2015, memphis is rated #77, not 81 with an average rating of 79.44 and not .8045

Guessing one of them is using a composite and the other is using just 247's own personal ratings? Strange that there would be such a difference between the two. I.e. 2015 isn't that different, but 2017's is very different. We're talking about a 56 ranking vs a 80 ranking.

Wait are you checking MEMPHIS or smu...

Norvell is not our coach, and yes Memphis got better with Norvell.........

oh yikes.

Note: Unfortunately we couldn't have hired Norvell and our admins wish we could have. This was out of their hands. Let's not start that debate here and focus on Morris's recruiting, or lack thereof.

 

TebowHater

Quote from: bennyl08 on December 06, 2017, 07:31:28 pm
https://247sports.com/Coach/Chad-Morris-749/AllTimeRecruits

Recruiting isn't as easy to cover because the information either isn't out there or isn't as well compiled. Above is the best single source I know of. On his all time recruits list, you'll see the players that it is known he was either the primary or the secondary recruiter on.

Several high round NFL draft picks including Deshaun Watson and Shaq Lawson. Other names you probably recognize would be Zac Brooks, Jordan Leggett.

Looking only at his time at memphis, since much of the recruiting at Tulsa and Clemson would have been out of his control, at least at memphis, the recruiting was either his or from people he hired...

Before Chad Morris was HC
2010: #71, 20 3*'s, 81.43 avg
2011: #77, 8 3*'s, 77.97 avg
2012: #92, 6 3*'s, 77.13 avg
2013: #90, 7 3*'s, 77.45 avg
2014: #78, 12 3*'s, 78.42 avg

2015*: #77, 1 4*, 15 3*'s, 79.44 avg, had short time to compile this class
2016: #61, 18 3*'s, 81.81 avg
2017: #56, 1 4*, 20 3*'s, 81.87 avg
2018*: #82, 10 3*'s, 80.75 avg, obviously this class is not yet complete

That awkward moment when we think our coach improved his school's recruiting but it turns out to be the recruiting rankings of the coach we didn't hire (Memphis). (couldn't have sadly).

In fact, our coach made his school's recruiting worse.

Oh boy.

bennyl08

Quote from: Großer Kriegschwein on December 06, 2017, 08:50:24 pm
Total Offense

Taj Boyd wasn't nearly the runner that Deshaun Watson was. Decent yes, but not nearly as elusive.

I think you're digging too much looking for something that you probably won't find.

Thought it might have been total offense. Still, it was something that Tulsa had already recently done just 2 years before and something they've done again just 2 years ago. It's an impressive feat no doubt about it, but it's not a groundbreaking one. Given that Tulsa has proven to be a place that large number of people can get a top 10 offense going, it's a check mark on his resume that he is one three to do it in the past decade, but it's not a panty dropper either. It'd be like passing for 4k yards in a Leach offense. Still tough to do and not everybody can do it. But, you aren't going to be a shoe in heisman winner or first round draft pick for that either.

I keep thinking Watson was a 4.8 runner and forget that he's a 4.7 runner. So yeah, checking the combine numbers, Watson was significantly more athletic than Boyd. However, the guys who came before Boyd, Parker and Harper were even less athletic and didn't take as many sacks. Further, we're also talking about tfl's. Doesn't explain why every stop he's been at sees an increase in lost yardage plays when he's there and then a decrease as soon as he leaves.

I'm not looking for anything. I knew chad morris' name had been floating around before but this morning, I couldn't have told you where he coached at. The only coaches I had really looked into were Norvell, Fuentes, and somebody else who I already forgot about. So, today, i went looking to see what Morris had done with a blank slate. I've reported more positives than negatives so implying that I'm out to get him doesn't even make sense.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

bennyl08

Quote from: TebowHater on December 06, 2017, 09:14:17 pm
Wait are you checking MEMPHIS or smu...

Norvell is not our coach, and yes Memphis got better with Norvell.........

oh yikes.

Note: Unfortunately we couldn't have hired Norvell and our admins wish we could have. This was out of their hands. Let's not start that debate here and focus on Morris's recruiting, or lack thereof.

I might have been.

I didn't keep up with the coaching search before so memphis, ucf, usf, smu, they all kind of blend together for me.

I think the rest of the stuff is right because i was in a system of command-f and recording the values for tulsa, clemson, and sum in that order. But when I switched gears to recruiting... Guess my brain was tired.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

TebowHater

Quote from: bennyl08 on December 06, 2017, 09:26:33 pm
I might have been.

I didn't keep up with the coaching search before so memphis, ucf, usf, smu, they all kind of blend together for me.

I think the rest of the stuff is right because i was in a system of command-f and recording the values for tulsa, clemson, and sum in that order. But when I switched gears to recruiting... Guess my brain was tired.

No problem. Appreciate the work.

Basically, though, SMU's recruiting fell fairly markably upon his arrival. Consistently in the top half of the AAC to exclusively in the bottom half. National recruiting rankings fell, too.

bennyl08

Quote from: TebowHater on December 06, 2017, 08:58:49 pm
Hmmm. I was using 247 too. These were the numbers. I just rechecked, linked below.

Morris - Average 78.67
2017 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8113
2016 - Natl Rank: 75 AAC Rank: 7 Avg Rating: 0.8142
2015 - Natl Rank: 81 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8045

Jones - Average 71.3 (3 years prior to Morris: 74)
2014 - Natl Rank: 80 AAC Rank: 9 Avg Rating: 0.7855
2013 - Natl Rank: 72 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8047
2012 - Natl Rank: 70 AAC Rank: 4 Avg Rating: 0.8130
2011 - Natl Rank: 67 AAC Rank: 3 Avg Rating: 0.7960
2010 - Natl Rank: 66 AAC Rank: 5 Avg Rating: 0.8261
2009 - Natl Rank: 73 AAC Rank: 6 Avg Rating: 0.8094


2015 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2015-Football/Commits
2016 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2016-Football/Commits
2017 - https://247sports.com/college/southern-methodist/Season/2017-Football/Commits

Yeah, from that, he didn't improve their ranking at all. He did appear to build up the averaging rating of the players. However, the biggest improvement was during Jones tenure as HC where the team made several bowl games in a row.

Yikes.

He still has the accomplishments with offensive and defensive player recruitment at Clemson, but that was at clemson. Not great to see that he didn't do much at SMU. Kind of makes you want to hire Jones instead of Morris. However, Jones is old and again, Morris is still very green as a collegiate coach.

Definitely liked the numbers from memphis better... Though from when I was looking at Memphis, I liked the idea of hiring Fuentes much, much more than Norvell.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse