Six words that show how bad it really is

[oldbooniehog]

Based on comments I've read here and elsewhere, it seems that many Hog fans don't understand just how bad the situation really is today.

Here are just six little words to that might help clarify.

"Secret Service special agent Brian Marr."

http://www.thv11.com/story/news/crime/2015/07/22/two-razorback-basketball-players-arrested-on-forgery-charges/30531589/

For those who still don't get it.

http://www.secretservice.gov/

[WarPig88]

Based on comments I've read here and elsewhere, it seems that many Hog fans don't understand just how bad the situation really is today.

Here are just six little words to that might help clarify.

"Secret Service special agent Brian Marr."

http://www.thv11.com/story/news/crime/2015/07/22/two-razorback-basketball-players-arrested-on-forgery-charges/30531589/

For those who still don't get it.

http://www.secretservice.gov/

Secret Service has always handled counterfeit cases. There was a printer in Alma who got arrested in the 80s who admitted to printing the money who never even got a conviction and still has a business to this day.

Let's let this play out. Most likely these guys will plea to something because they are not the primary targets.

This is a statewide case, not a case of some college kids printing money in their dorm room.

[TrueBlue]

Knowingly passing off counterfeit money is usually a Class 4 felony, which carries a minimum of 2 years and a maximum of 10 years of imprisonment and/or a fine of up to $100,000

[BadHog]

Knowingly passing off counterfeit money is usually a Class 4 felony, which carries a minimum of 2 years and a maximum of 10 years of imprisonment and/or a fine of up to $100,000

And immediate dismissal from this basketball team

[moses_007]

This is a real serious situation.  Nothing at all like a little pot possession or a DWI.

[WarPig88]

Knowingly passing off counterfeit money is usually a Class 4 felony, which carries a minimum of 2 years and a maximum of 10 years of imprisonment and/or a fine of up to $100,000

Most cases are not taken to trial but are settled with plea bargains. These most likely will fit that scenario as well.

There was a lawyer familiar with the case on the radio today who expects them to be able to plea down to class c felonies and get probation instead of jail time.

[Veritas Arkansas]

Knowingly passing off counterfeit money is usually a Class 4 felony, which carries a minimum of 2 years and a maximum of 10 years of imprisonment and/or a fine of up to $100,000

If the Feds take it.

I would be shocked if the Feds indict any of these players.

[Thepigdoctor]

We need to start paying our players more

[pigture perfect]

The biggest problem for us is that the Feds don't care when basketball season starts.

And my conspiracy theory du jour, is that the people at Ft. Knox are Kentucky fans and they set us up.

[duckman]

Most cases are not taken to trial but are settled with plea bargains. These most likely will fit that scenario as well.

There was a lawyer familiar with the case on the radio today who expects them to be able to plea down to class c felonies and get probation instead of jail time.

And they will be done with basketball here....  MOTHO

[bob slydell]

We need to start paying our players more

Funny you mention that. Could the people ultimately behind this be considered boosters? And if so, are these impermissible benefits? Never know with the NCAA involved.

[twistitup]

Funny you mention that. Could the people ultimately behind this be considered boosters? And if so, are these impermissible benefits? Never know with the NCAA involved.

I bet they were given fake cash by a Kentucky booster posing as an Arkansas booster - they are out to get us

[Pork Twain]

Knowingly passing off counterfeit money is usually a Class 4 felony, which carries a minimum of 2 years and a maximum of 10 years of imprisonment and/or a fine of up to $100,000

I know I was surprised when I read the initial charges forgery, but then the article goes on to discuss counterfeit bills.  Those are not the same and one is a federal crime with a MUCH heavier sentence.

Here's to hoping these kids had no idea what they were passing on.

[SwineGrind]

Knowingly passing off counterfeit money is usually a Class 4 felony, which carries a minimum of 2 years and a maximum of 10 years of imprisonment and/or a fine of up to $100,000

This shouldn't be an issue if they accept $20s. 

[PonderinHog]

I could only come up with five words...   

[Veritas Arkansas]

I know I was surprised when I read the initial charges forgery, but then the article goes on to discuss counterfeit bills.  Those are not the same and one is a federal crime with a MUCH heavier sentence.

Here's to hoping these kids had no idea what they were passing on.

No, they are the same.  A person commits forgery in the first degree in Arkansas if the possess counterfeit money with the purpose to defraud someone else.

[Pork Twain]

No, they are the same.  A person commits forgery in the first degree in Arkansas if the possess counterfeit money with the purpose to defraud someone else.

No, possessing counterfeit bills and producing counterfeit bills are no the same.  That is what I was alluding to.  Of course that is me assuming that those three had a hand in the production and I realize that is a big leap.

[husker71]

my guess is that is that it is some other student with a printer that is sophisticated enough to make a reasonable facsimile of a $20 bill and this guy said hey I can get close to the basketball players by handing them a handful of $20s (put they knew they were bogus)  I have seen good counterfeit and bad counterfeit (feel the paper) my guess is that these were middle of the road 20s   just my opinion

[Veritas Arkansas]

No, possessing counterfeit bills and producing counterfeit bills are no the same.  That is what I was alluding to.  Of course that is me assuming that those three had a hand in the production and I realize that is a big leap.

In Arkansas law both making and possessing are treated the same - both activities are covered under Forgery in the 1st Degree.

There is no difference under state law.

Here's the exact statute - Arkansas Code 5-37-201 in case you're interested.

a) A person forges a written instrument if, with purpose to defraud, the person makes, completes, alters, counterfeits, possesses, or utters any written instrument that purports to be or is calculated to become or to represent if completed the act of a person who did not authorize that act.

(b) A person commits forgery in the first degree if he or she forges a written instrument that is:

(1) Money, a security, a postage or revenue stamp, or other instrument issued by a government; or

(2) A stock, bond, or similar instrument representing an interest in property or a claim against a corporation or its property.

[Redbug]

We need to start paying our players more

funny....IF they coulda waited another few days the new student athlete extra benefit is supposed to kick in....correct???....another approx $900 a month @ U of A to cover the cost of actual schools expense....

[nwahogfan1]

If the Feds take it.

I would be shocked if the Feds indict any of these players.

These kids need the right council and it will be thrown out as a trumped up charge against poor Minority kids. 

[Big Nasty 34]

Long needs to drop basketball tickets to about $10 max so fans might still come out. We need to support the remaining guys, but many fans don't wanna spend 25 bucks or whatever the cost for bad basketball

[HotlantaHog]

Do we really believe these college kids were sophisticated enough to organize a counterfeit scheme? I think there is likely more to the story ...

There is also a great tradition in American justice ... innocent until proven guilty.  I would withhold judgment until we know a bit more.

[Veritas Arkansas]

These kids need the right council and it will be thrown out as a trumped up charge against poor Minority kids. 

No.

[MountieDawg]

I bet they were given fake cash by a Kentucky booster posing as an Arkansas booster - they are out to get us

Its a better chance it was LSU.... They have experience in making counterfiet money!  Billy Cannon

[urkillnmesmalls]

Another concern was brought up by a caller yesterday on DTS that Rick dismissed.  His concern, and I think it was valid, is how this might also lead to a further investigation centered on improper benefits.  The money came from somewhere, and although Rick seemed to indicate that passing $20's is not like $100's, in the NCAA's mind, that's not the bigger issue. 

I fear ugliness.    

[Piggage]

The biggest problem for us is that the Feds don't care when basketball season starts.

I don't care anymore either.

[ricepig]

Another concern was brought up by a caller yesterday on DTS that Rick dismissed.  His concern, and I think it was valid, is how this might also lead to a further investigation centered on improper benefits.  The money came from somewhere, and although Rick seemed to indicate that passing $20's is not like $100's, in the NCAA's mind, that's not the bigger issue. 

I fear ugliness.    

Yeah, they really cared about those Auburn and Ole Miss recruits with pictures of $100's.

[urkillnmesmalls]

Yeah, they really cared about those Auburn and Ole Miss recruits with pictures of $100's.

That's apples and oranges isn't it?  That gets into where the money came from, and how traceable it is when you're just seeing a picture.  "That came from my rich Aunt Mary who has a wicked tomato farm."   

I'm sure it's going to come out very clearly where this printed money was coming from, and at that point I guess the NCAA can decide what the intent was. 

I don't see how it wouldn't cause some questions to be asked, but I certainly hope it ends up being more like how hard they went after the kids flashing $100's.       

[Wild Bill Hog]

And they will be done with basketball here....  MOTHO

This would be my bet.

[The real Hogules]

I know I was surprised when I read the initial charges forgery, but then the article goes on to discuss counterfeit bills.  Those are not the same and one is a federal crime with a MUCH heavier sentence.

Here's to hoping these kids had no idea what they were passing on.

Well, while I hope that you are correct, to me at least it looks bad that one of the players exchanged 6 - $50.00 bills for 3- $100.00 bills.
As much as it pains me to say it, I believe that they were aware of the situation and chose to do it anyway.

[duckman]

Well, while I hope that you are correct, to me at least it looks bad that one of the players exchanged 6 - $50.00 bills for 3- $100.00 bills.
As much as it pains me to say it, I believe that they were aware of the situation and chose to do it anyway.

This

[Wild Bill Hog]

Well, while I hope that you are correct, to me at least it looks bad that one of the players exchanged 6 - $50.00 bills for 3- $100.00 bills.
As much as it pains me to say it, I believe that they were aware of the situation and chose to do it anyway.

At least he got the math part correct.

[ricepig]

At least he got the math part correct.

If it was a normal checkout employee, they were perplexed.

[PonderinHog]

Well, while I hope that you are correct, to me at least it looks bad that one of the players exchanged 6 - $50.00 bills for 3- $100.00 bills.
As much as it pains me to say it, I believe that they were aware of the situation and chose to do it anyway.

If he had only asked for 2 C-notes, that would have been an admission of guilt.

[hogman99]

Long needs to drop basketball tickets to about $10 max so fans might still come out. We need to support the remaining guys, but many fans don't wanna spend 25 bucks or whatever the cost for bad basketball

This is the best post I have seen in quite sometime.  That 20,000 seat arena will look real bad when only 5,000 show up for conference games. The non-conference games will be much worse.

[Karma]

Well, while I hope that you are correct, to me at least it looks bad that one of the players exchanged 6 - $50.00 bills for 3- $100.00 bills.
As much as it pains me to say it, I believe that they were aware of the situation and chose to do it anyway.

That one fact changes the whole story - at least for Beard.

[hogman99]

I know I was surprised when I read the initial charges forgery, but then the article goes on to discuss counterfeit bills.  Those are not the same and one is a federal crime with a MUCH heavier sentence.

Here's to hoping these kids had no idea what they were passing on.

They are not kids, they are all over the age of 18.

[LA Football fan]

Beard is cooked and there is no denying it.  Nobody, and I mean nobody goes into a store with $50.00 bills to have them exchanged for $100.00.   People would normally do this at a bank if they really needed to get change.  Most stores, especially tobacco or liquor stores have their clerks drop large bills immediately into a safe due to the high incidences of armed robbery.  That means it would be rare for them to even have a single $100 bill on hand, much less three.  Usually when someone wants change, they want to exchange the larger bill for the smaller one.   I just don't see the prosecutor buying that he didn't know.   

What concerns me if this was not the first time this was done and the reason they were caught was they came back and tried again.   We will find out soon enough though.  I just don't see Beard overcoming this one.  The other two are more likely to be looked on with favor due to just the lower number of charges. 

[Biggus Piggus]

Secret Service has always handled counterfeit cases. There was a printer in Alma who got arrested in the 80s who admitted to printing the money who never even got a conviction and still has a business to this day.

Let's let this play out. Most likely these guys will plea to something because they are not the primary targets.

This is a statewide case, not a case of some college kids printing money in their dorm room.

When you are running a statewide sting operation, it's always good practice to charge three major-college basketball players before you have used them to get to the kingpin.

Right?

[jry04]

Beard is cooked and there is no denying it.  Nobody, and I mean nobody goes into a store with $50.00 bills to have them exchanged for $100.00.   People would normally do this at a bank if they really needed to get change.  Most stores, especially tobacco or liquor stores have their clerks drop large bills immediately into a safe due to the high incidences of armed robbery.  That means it would be rare for them to even have a single $100 bill on hand, much less three.  Usually when someone wants change, they want to exchange the larger bill for the smaller one.   I just don't see the prosecutor buying that he didn't know.   

What concerns me if this was not the first time this was done and the reason they were caught was they came back and tried again.   We will find out soon enough though.  I just don't see Beard overcoming this one.  The other two are more likely to be looked on with favor due to just the lower number of charges. 

Unfortunately, I agree.

[urkillnmesmalls]

Beard is cooked and there is no denying it.  Nobody, and I mean nobody goes into a store with $50.00 bills to have them exchanged for $100.00.   People would normally do this at a bank if they really needed to get change.  Most stores, especially tobacco or liquor stores have their clerks drop large bills immediately into a safe due to the high incidences of armed robbery.  That means it would be rare for them to even have a single $100 bill on hand, much less three.  Usually when someone wants change, they want to exchange the larger bill for the smaller one.   I just don't see the prosecutor buying that he didn't know.   

What concerns me if this was not the first time this was done and the reason they were caught was they came back and tried again.   We will find out soon enough though.  I just don't see Beard overcoming this one.  The other two are more likely to be looked on with favor due to just the lower number of charges.

At what point would anyone think it was a good idea to ask for LARGER bills?  It's obvious Beard's life as a criminal was going to be short-lived if he reached that as his solution to get "real money," for fake bills.  Unless the person running the register was in on it, that makes absolutely no sense. 

Who in their right mind wouldn't IMMEDIATELY think something was fishy when someone wanted to exchange smaller bills for larger ones?  Coins...OK, I get that, but at what point does, "Hey man, these 6 fifties are making my wallet too fat.  Can I exchange them for 3 hundreds?" ever sound like a reasonable request, MUCH LESS a good idea?   

[netteltonhog]

As far as the Sting operation goes in looking for the kingpin, a woman from Maumelle was arrested and charged with running a counterfeit operation about 2 weeks ago. These basketball players are little fish.

[duckman]

When you are running a statewide sting operation, it's always good practice to charge three major-college basketball players before you have used them to get to the kingpin.

Right?

Think about that, makes you wonder who that kingpin could be....

[ricepig]

Think about that, makes you wonder who that kingpin could be....

Let's just blame it on Brad Bolding and be done......

[TexArkHogFan]

I work the late night drive thru in a liquor store.  I have NEVER had anybody ask me to change a smaller bill for a larger one.  That would be a big red flag.  It is very easy to detect a counterfeit $50  or $100 dollar bill by a simple eye test if you know what to look for in addition to the old marker that turns black instead of gold if you are in doubt. If the news reports are correct, he tried it on six different 50s.  How stupid is that?  We don't usually check $20s as we get too many of them, but if word was out to do so, we would.  I did get a counterfeit 1878 Trade Dollar once and I thought how stupid is it for anybody to use a silver Trade Dollar as I knew they were worth a bunch.  I pocketed it and put the $1 in the register and got to thinking about it and took it to a gold and silver shop for authenticity and wasn't too surprised when they told me it was counterfeit.  I was only out a dollar and I still have it as a novelty. With today's security cameras you can't get by with anything.  We have 26 of them in our store and people have been arrested for shoplifting based on the security tape which is routinely checked.   

[WarPig88]

When you are running a statewide sting operation, it's always good practice to charge three major-college basketball players before you have used them to get to the kingpin.

Right?

How do you think they find the big fish? By putting the screws to the little fish.

So yes, this would be the logical chain of events.

[WarPig88]

I work the late night drive thru in a liquor store.  I have NEVER had anybody ask me to change a smaller bill for a larger one.  That would be a big red flag.  It is very easy to detect a counterfeit $50  or $100 dollar bill by a simple eye test if you know what to look for in addition to the old marker that turns black instead of gold if you are in doubt. If the news reports are correct, he tried it on six different 50s.  How stupid is that?  We don't usually check $20s as we get too many of them, but if word was out to do so, we would.  I did get a counterfeit 1878 Trade Dollar once and I thought how stupid is it for anybody to use a silver Trade Dollar as I knew they were worth a bunch.  I pocketed it and put the $1 in the register and got to thinking about it and took it to a gold and silver shop for authenticity and wasn't too surprised when they told me it was counterfeit.  I was only out a dollar and I still have it as a novelty. With today's security cameras you can't get by with anything.  We have 26 of them in our store and people have been arrested for shoplifting based on the security tape which is routinely checked.

Having counterfeit in your possession is a crime. Novelty or not.

[Hawg Red]

Beard is toast. 9 counts. Stone-cold proof that he exchanged $20 and $50 dollar bills for 100s. Who does that? Someone who knows they have phoney cash and wants to unload it for the real thing. He'll be lucky to end up the starting PG for the 2016-2017 Little Rock Trojans. I'm very concerned for his future as a person, forget basketball (because he might as well at this point).

JaCorey just threw away the rest of his college career, but with just one count (and seemingly the least guilty of the three), he should come out with the lightest punishment.

Dustin Thomas will be the transfer that never was. Good luck to him.

I hate that these kids did this. I know they're young. But surely they have to see what's happening to their peers across the country in both basketball and football. So much to lose. Why risk it? Just dumb.

[WarPig88]

And they will be done with basketball here....  MOTHO

No crap sherlock. Read my earlier posts.

Williams and the kid from Colorado may not be depending on the circumstances of how they came across the money.

It's obvious that Beard was the distributor of the money. He could have given them the money without having told them it was counterfeit as loans or something knowing that he would get real money when they paid him back.

Let's wait and see exactly what the details are. I would say that I can't really see a scenario where Beard ever plays here again.