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Would you be happy with these numbers next year?

Started by MuskogeeHogFan, June 09, 2017, 09:47:35 am

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Pork Twain

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 10, 2017, 03:02:30 pm
We need to produce more and more consistently on offense this year and the defense, will show up. I think that Paul Rhoads has got this.
I think it is just the opposite.  I believe that with an improved defense, the offense will settle in and not feel pressured to score on every drive and end up making a lot fewer mistakes.  I do agree that will lead to the offense putting up better numbers, because the defense should actually make more stops this year.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

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MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: Pork Twain on June 10, 2017, 03:25:37 pm
I think it is just the opposite.  I believe that with an improved defense, the offense will settle in and not feel pressured to score on every drive and end up making a lot fewer mistakes.  I do agree that will lead to the offense putting up better numbers, because the defense should actually make more stops this year.

I wasn't meaning to say anything different. I believe that a lot of times last year, especially later in the season, the offense and AA in particular, felt the pressure to make things happen to try to win games because they didn't feel that they could count on the defense to hold up their end. AA tried to force a lot of balls that he shouldn't have that led to the end of promising drives in the Opponents RZ or in our end of the field that led to opponents scores.

And it wasn't just him, other players made key mistakes at key times and perhaps because they felt the pressure to make something happen. So I totally agree that an improved defense this year that provides us with an opportunity to win more games should take the pressure off of the offense at least to the extent that they don't feel that it is all up to them to win games.
Go Hogs Go!

 

LRRandy

A key to the offense being better will be the receivers ability to get off the ball and run good routes to get open. Not necessarily a given. I can see reason to be confident in the OC's ability to plan for success. The QB's abity to run the offense and be a top QB in the sec.  Even that there is talent in the WR room. With the inexperience at RB and the unproven WR core the proof will be in the pudding. You say you know the receivers will be good Muskogee. You hope they will. You don't know that they will. They very well may be good and if they are then the 8 or 9 wins may in fact come. If the receivers struggle to get open or catch balls 5 wins may be staring you right in the face.
This is fun, isn't it.

MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: LRRandy on June 10, 2017, 03:51:27 pm
A key to the offense being better will be the receivers ability to get off the ball and run good routes to get open. Not necessarily a given. I can see reason to be confident in the OC's ability to plan for success. The QB's abity to run the offense and be a top QB in the sec.  Even that there is talent in the WR room. With the inexperience at RB and the unproven WR core the proof will be in the pudding. You say you know the receivers will be good Muskogee. You hope they will. You don't know that they will. They very well may be good and if they are then the 8 or 9 wins may in fact come. If the receivers struggle to get open or catch balls 5 wins may be staring you right in the face.

Let's be accurate, what I actually said was that I thought that our WR's would be better than advertised, and I think that they will. And of course, if any of us truly are Hog fans, we all hope that they will.
Go Hogs Go!

LRRandy

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 10, 2017, 04:03:19 pm
Let's be accurate, what I actually said was that I thought that our WR's would be better than advertised, and I think that they will. And of course, if any of us truly are Hog fans, we all hope that they will.
ok. What exactly is advertised?
This is fun, isn't it.

MuskogeeHogFan

Go Hogs Go!

LRRandy

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 10, 2017, 05:07:48 pm
puh-ten-tial
haha. Got it. They will be as good as their puhtential. Not sure that's how that is spelled.
This is fun, isn't it.

HognotinMemphis

With as bad as the defense will be, and with losses on offense, especially Williams, this could easily be a losing season given the schedule. If the Hogs lose at home to TCU, they will be lucky to go 5-7.This very likely will be Bielema's last year at Arkansas.
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______________________
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MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: HoginMemphis on June 10, 2017, 05:29:40 pm
With as bad as the defense will be, and with losses on offense, especially Williams, this could easily be a losing season given the schedule. If the Hogs lose at home to TCU, they will be lucky to go 5-7.This very likely will be Bielema's last year at Arkansas.

Just love you guys who post as if to say, "I'm just being realistic", in order to be able to manage your emotions in the fall. This team isn't going 5-7 and the defense (IMO) is not going to be "bad". It may not be great, but the defense will be better than last year...good but not great.
Go Hogs Go!

lefty08

Quote from: HoginMemphis on June 10, 2017, 05:29:40 pm
With as bad as the defense will be, and with losses on offense, especially Williams, this could easily be a losing season given the schedule. If the Hogs lose at home to TCU, they will be lucky to go 5-7.This very likely will be Bielema's last year at Arkansas.

LOL
Re: So far the UC press conference is hilarious   Reply
Losing gracefully isn't taught in second-tier programs. See Arkansas, Cincinnati, et al.
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nwahogfan1

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 10, 2017, 05:38:17 pm
Just love you guys who post as if to say, "I'm just being realistic", in order to be able to manage your emotions in the fall. This team isn't going 5-7 and the defense (IMO) is not going to be "bad". It may not be great, but the defense will be better than last year...good but not great.

I don't see how the defense can be worse than last year so with new DC and new scheme I  think it will also be better.  Offense scares me. Will OL get it done? How will our inexperieced WRs do? Also, We have only one experienced RB.   Lots of growing up early if we want to get to 8+ wins.


Hogs-n-Roses

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 10, 2017, 02:40:47 pm
Obviously the numbers from 2016 are our actual numbers. For 2017 I looked at what I thought might be reasonably possible. And if we can achieve those numbers for 2017 on both offense and defense we should win more than 7.

Let's think about this for a moment and you might see why I projected those numbers.

Last year we had an O-Line that didn't function well as a unit. Changes in blocking schemes, blocking techniques, foot placement, having to think too much instead of executing and then injured players being forced to play because we didn't have anyone as good or better to fill that spot. That weakened their ability to drive off the ball and at the very least, hold their ground. Anytime an O-Lineman is getting backed up into the backfield outside of design (run or pass plays) it creates a variety of problems for everyone. We also had RB's running to the wrong holes at times or missing their cut back lanes, missing their block in pass pro and TE's who were missing their chip blocks which help set up a play.

Even with all of those negative things swirling around on offense, we still managed to run for over 2100 yards and pass for over 3400 yards and that was with several second half breakdowns where the offense stalled. It is my understanding that many, if not all, of these problems have been rectified.

For most of the season the defense was an exercise in futility. I believe that the scheme was bad most of the time, alignments weren't correct, quality adjustments weren't made, details weren't emphasized and players were asked to do things that they weren't capable of doing, and then probably criticized when they couldn't do them. This most likely led to the de-motivation of the entire unit and might have resulted in some infighting and finger pointing because no one likes to get their arse chewed all the time when they are trying their best to do what is asked of them.

It is my understanding that all of this (if that is how it all went down), despite having to learn a new scheme, has been corrected under Paul Rhoads.

Offensively, we have some pretty solid weapons even if inexperienced. The O-Line has got their act together under Anderson but don't expect perfection. If one guy screws up his responsibilities on any given play, it can screw up the entire play. That said, we are more talented and more experienced and I believe it will show in our O-Line play this fall.

Though it was a shame to lose RWIII, I believe that the combination of Whaley, Maleek Williams and Hammonds will pick up the slack. We will run for more yards this season than we did the last. At TE, Cantrell, Kraus and O'Grady will get the job done along with incoming Jeremy Patton. Our WR's are going to be better than advertised with Stewart, Martin and Jones on one side, Cornelius, Pettway and Nance on the other, with Hammonds being stuck out in the Slot at times.

I think Allen will have a similar Senior season as his older brother did, with around the same completion percentage as he had, but with more wins.

I'm not going into detail on defense but given all that went wrong last year and the lack of motivation, I expect the defense this year to feel like they have something to prove in every game and will play improved football as a result. We will have a good defense and one that I think that we can be proud of (especially after last year) that will help keep us in games and give us an opportunity to win. Not a great defense by SEC standards, but good and certainly far better than last season.

That's the reason for some of these numbers and my optimism.
I ll buy into your optimism on the offense to a point and even give you the benefit of the doubts I'm concerned with which is depth of quality Oline  play or back up play and this is also taking into acct we will have minimal injury issues. A glaring issue which shud not be 5 years into the system.

Where my deepest concerns is the defense and changing systems. I even see why we're doing it. In years past I have seen us make changes in position and it not work out to well. Just a couple of years ago we were going to move a down defensive end to middle LB and we were all excited cause it looked so good on paper. The change from a hand on the ground was far more a change than we all expected. Experience is a key component. I just hope our guys adjust to the changes/assignments quickly. Good example was Froholdt last year. I think the DE turned LB was Smith.

HognotinMemphis

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 10, 2017, 05:38:17 pm
Just love you guys who post as if to say, "I'm just being realistic", in order to be able to manage your emotions in the fall. This team isn't going 5-7 and the defense (IMO) is not going to be "bad". It may not be great, but the defense will be better than last year...good but not great.
If the defense improves in every statistic by 50%, it will still be bad. I would bet your life that the Hogs will struggle to get 4-4 in SEC play. If injuries occur to key players, which happens most years, this season could easily end up in the gutter.

If Hogs are good enough to beat TCU, probably looking at 8-4 or 7-5. If not, 6-6 or 5-7.

Do you think it possible for this to be Bielema's last season if Hogs go 5-7? Not necessarily being fired, but could leave on his own for easier program?

I don't want you to agree with me because you're weak. I want you to agree with me because you know I'm right.
______________________
President Obama promised to begin to slow the rise of the oceans and to heal the planet. My promise is to help you and your family." - Mitt Romney

 

Pork Twain

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 10, 2017, 03:36:51 pm
I wasn't meaning to say anything different. I believe that a lot of times last year, especially later in the season, the offense and AA in particular, felt the pressure to make things happen to try to win games because they didn't feel that they could count on the defense to hold up their end. AA tried to force a lot of balls that he shouldn't have that led to the end of promising drives in the Opponents RZ or in our end of the field that led to opponents scores.

And it wasn't just him, other players made key mistakes at key times and perhaps because they felt the pressure to make something happen. So I totally agree that an improved defense this year that provides us with an opportunity to win more games should take the pressure off of the offense at least to the extent that they don't feel that it is all up to them to win games.
I think we are actually saying the same thing and have been.  Just more of a chicken vs egg discussion.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

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orgkeith

Defense was terrible last year.  It can improve and still be bad.  We really have a lack of talent on defense.  Receivers are going to be an issue.  If we don't beat TCU this thing is going to fall apart and we will be in serious trouble breaking in a new QB the next year.  Still, a lot of things could go right.  The OL could jell, Whaley have a big year, Martin and Jones produce and Agim, Harris, Capps, Pulley and some others on defense step up.  TCU game looks like a tipping point one way or the other.

LZH

Quote from: HoginMemphis on June 11, 2017, 10:38:44 am
If the defense improves in every statistic by 50%, it will still be bad. I would bet your life that the Hogs will struggle to get 4-4 in SEC play. If injuries occur to key players, which happens most years, this season could easily end up in the gutter.

If Hogs are good enough to beat TCU, probably looking at 8-4 or 7-5. If not, 6-6 or 5-7.

Do you think it possible for this to be Bielema's last season if Hogs go 5-7? Not necessarily being fired, but could leave on his own for easier program?



Folks around here are gonna turn on ol' Bret bigger'n Dallas if he doesn't even break .500 this year. A lot of the apologists will flip in a heartbeat.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Mike_e

I just don't get why some are worried so much about switching schemes.

Playing defense isn't that complicated.  You wonder why every fall the defense seems to start ahead of the offense?  It isn't because the offense has been slacking over the summer it's because the offense has to get a number of steps precisely correct for each play or it folds like a house of cards.

The defense on the other hand only has a couple of reads to go through for each individual.  Sure there are more for some positions but for the most part just getting into the general area (in time) to make the tackle is fine.

Here is a saying for you "complexity is the product of simple things multiplied together".

Where the defense gets bogged down comes from having too many choices to make.  Each of them simple enough by themselves  but each example takes time and when there are too many too much time is taken and the player can't get there in time.  Being speedier isn't the issue, the issue is in not getting a fast enough start.

From what I've seen of CPR he gets that.  Having your hands on the ground?  You can't usually make a tackle with your hands on the ground it takes a couple of steps to rise up and disengage the o lineman.  Stand a couple of your DL up and they get that much a quicker start to being where they need to be on time.  Stop worrying about having to get everything exactly right and just go make plays is going to make a world of difference.

We're going to be OK on D this year.
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MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: HoginMemphis on June 11, 2017, 10:38:44 am
If the defense improves in every statistic by 50%, it will still be bad. I would bet your life that the Hogs will struggle to get 4-4 in SEC play. If injuries occur to key players, which happens most years, this season could easily end up in the gutter.

If Hogs are good enough to beat TCU, probably looking at 8-4 or 7-5. If not, 6-6 or 5-7.

Do you think it possible for this to be Bielema's last season if Hogs go 5-7? Not necessarily being fired, but could leave on his own for easier program?



Wow, really? A 50% improvement is still bad? I guess we will just have to agree to disagree because I would love to see a 50% improvement.

We aren't going to go 5-7 but I would have be inside Bieliema's head to know whether he would choose to resign or not, if that did occur. I'm not so I couldn't render an opinion on what he would choose to do. I feel like he has two seasons left here by contract. If he wins 9 in either of those 2 years, look for the possibility of an extension. Do you think he would agree to an extension if offered?
Go Hogs Go!

Pork Twain

Quote from: HoginMemphis on June 11, 2017, 10:38:44 am
If the defense improves in every statistic by 50%, it will still be bad. I would bet your life that the Hogs will struggle to get 4-4 in SEC play. If injuries occur to key players, which happens most years, this season could easily end up in the gutter.

If Hogs are good enough to beat TCU, probably looking at 8-4 or 7-5. If not, 6-6 or 5-7.

Do you think it possible for this to be Bielema's last season if Hogs go 5-7? Not necessarily being fired, but could leave on his own for easier program?


If even the Cleveland Browns improved by 50%, they would be pretty good...  At least you are consistent.  You have been equally negative about every coach we have had.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

Pork Twain

Quote from: LZH on June 11, 2017, 10:43:57 am
Folks around here are gonna turn on ol' Bret bigger'n Dallas if he doesn't even break .500 this year. A lot of the apologists will flip in a heartbeat.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.
So all fans that were willing to give a coach this year to prove he is the right man, are apologists?  I have long said that this is the make or break year for CBB.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

Al Boarland

Quote from: Mike_e on June 11, 2017, 10:46:53 am
I just don't get why some are worried so much about switching schemes.

Playing defense isn't that complicated.  You wonder why every fall the defense seems to start ahead of the offense?  It isn't because the offense has been slacking over the summer it's because the offense has to get a number of steps precisely correct for each play or it folds like a house of cards.

The defense on the other hand only has a couple of reads to go through for each individual.  Sure there are more for some positions but for the most part just getting into the general area (in time) to make the tackle is fine.

Here is a saying for you "complexity is the product of simple things multiplied together".

Where the defense gets bogged down comes from having too many choices to make.  Each of them simple enough by themselves  but each example takes time and when there are too many too much time is taken and the player can't get there in time.  Being speedier isn't the issue, the issue is in not getting a fast enough start.

From what I've seen of CPR he gets that.  Having your hands on the ground?  You can't usually make a tackle with your hands on the ground it takes a couple of steps to rise up and disengage the o lineman.  Stand a couple of your DL up and they get that much a quicker start to being where they need to be on time.  Stop worrying about having to get everything exactly right and just go make plays is going to make a world of difference.

We're going to be OK on D this year.

You forgot about the other team being bigger, stronger, faster. Tackles get broken, players juked or just blown right by. 

MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: Al Boarland on June 11, 2017, 11:36:26 am
You forgot about the other team being bigger, stronger, faster. Tackles get broken, players juked or just blown right by. 

Holy cow, we are in real trouble! Might as well cancel the season since everybody we play is apparently bigger, stronger and faster than we are at every single position going into this season and we are going to fail repeatedly. We'll have to see if we can talk Bielema into bringing you in the locker room for the pre-game pep talk.
Go Hogs Go!

Al Boarland

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 11, 2017, 11:45:40 am
Holy cow, we are in real trouble! Might as well cancel the season since everybody we play is apparently bigger, stronger and faster than we are at every single position going into this season and we are going to fail repeatedly. We'll have to see if we can talk Bielema into bringing you in the locker room for the pre-game pep talk.

I don't think we're in trouble. I think we won't have a very good season. Seems like 8 wins would make some happy with where the program is in year 5. If the external expectation is 7/8 wins in year 5 we are just treading water. You won't bring in better talent winning that many games. That's a problem.

Pork Twain

June 11, 2017, 11:57:34 am #73 Last Edit: June 11, 2017, 12:59:10 pm by Pork Twain
Quote from: Al Boarland on June 11, 2017, 11:50:34 am
I don't think we're in trouble. I think we won't have a very good season. Seems like 8 wins would make some happy with where the program is in year 5. If the external expectation is 7/8 wins in year 5 we are just treading water. You won't bring in better talent winning that many games. That's a problem.
Lots of teams bring in better talent, with worse records, over a longer period of time.  The problem with Arkansas is the average number of wins we have had each year since we joined the SEC and the fact that there is not a lot of talent close to Fayetteville.  Winning will not change that.  I still think we will do much better than many on here do, but we will never consistently pull in top classes.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

 

MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: Al Boarland on June 11, 2017, 11:50:34 am
I don't think we're in trouble. I think we won't have a very good season. Seems like 8 wins would make some happy with where the program is in year 5. If the external expectation is 7/8 wins in year 5 we are just treading water. You won't bring in better talent winning that many games. That's a problem.

OK, that's a far more rational statement than your previous one.

Here's the deal in my opinion. We have talent and pretty good talent, some of it experienced, some of it not, but still talented. Arkansas, on both sides of the ball since joining the SEC, has never had Alabama level talent, nor Auburn, Florida, Georgia, LSU or even A&M level talent. We have had from time to time, some individual players who have stepped up and helped make a difference but overall, our kids have had to develop and play motivated and over their heads to beat the big boys in this conference at times. Listening to you and some others, that sounds as if it is impossible, yet it has happened.

So many times the ability to win more games has been about developed talent, excellent scheming on both sides of the ball and the odd bounces that the oblong shaped ball can take at key times in games. It can also be about timing as it relates to your opponents and their losses to graduation and the draft. But there is another factor that few discuss because it is much more difficult to identify and measure and yet it has at least as much to do with whether a team wins or loses and that is the mental attitude and preparedness that exists between the ears. I think that you and others on this board are going to be surprised with the big difference that is going to make for this team. No one has to believe that or even believe that it is going to happen, but those who have personally experienced what I am talking about, know how much of a difference that can make for a team.

We had some issues last year. We weren't well prepared at times, we didn't make good adjustments, we had some attitude problems, there was too much pressure on the offense to do it all and there was a lack of leadership to counter many of these things. It is my understanding that those things have been purged from the program. There are no guarantees of course, but I think that despite the doubters, this team is going to prove a lot to a lot of people this year and they are capable of doing that.

Now none of us like winning just 7-8 games each year and if that continues, I would bet that Long isn't going to tolerate it forever either. If it continues, things will change. When will it be enough? Well, Bielema has this season and the next to win 9 or more game before his contract is up. I would be disappointed if we win just 7-8 the next two seasons (or worse) and Long extends Bielema's contract, but I don't think that will happen. But even if Bielema doesn't get it done, Long is still going to want a HC that runs a clean program that contains all of the same values that Bielema produces now and he isn't going to compromise those values just to hire a guy who can win 10-11 games here each year or every few years. Question is, is there someone who can win more games here with our recruiting disadvantages and still maintain the level of integrity within the program that Long is going to require of them? So while everybody is grinching around about, "We need to win more, we need to win more, win now, win now!", you better be asking yourself who we can go hire that gives us that chance and isn't going to be in conflict with Long's goals for the program.
Go Hogs Go!

Pork Twain

June 11, 2017, 01:05:10 pm #75 Last Edit: June 11, 2017, 01:34:15 pm by Pork Twain
This is not the 60's or 70's and we are not in the SWC anymore.  I have always had a really hard time dreaming up who we could hire here:

Not a total bag of dicks

See us as a destination job

See us as something more than a lateral move from their current position

Could recruit out-of-state players at a high level to make up for our shallow talent pool

Win 10-11 games a year

I have always come up blank, because we have more built-in disadvantages than any other SEC team.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

HognotinMemphis

Quote from: Pork Twain on June 11, 2017, 11:30:52 am
If even the Cleveland Browns improved by 50%, they would be pretty good...  At least you are consistent.  You have been equally negative about every coach we have had.
Yeah, all two of them...Nutt and Bielema. I was not negative about Petrino but continue with exaggeration.
I don't want you to agree with me because you're weak. I want you to agree with me because you know I'm right.
______________________
President Obama promised to begin to slow the rise of the oceans and to heal the planet. My promise is to help you and your family." - Mitt Romney

HognotinMemphis

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 11, 2017, 10:47:29 am
Wow, really? A 50% improvement is still bad? I guess we will just have to agree to disagree because I would love to see a 50% improvement.

We aren't going to go 5-7 but I would have be inside Bieliema's head to know whether he would choose to resign or not, if that did occur. I'm not so I couldn't render an opinion on what he would choose to do. I feel like he has two seasons left here by contract. If he wins 9 in either of those 2 years, look for the possibility of an extension. Do you think he would agree to an extension if offered?
My point is, 50% better than last in the country awful = bad. If you made a 50 on a test, which is a F, and you improve by 50% on the next test and make a 75, that is still a middling C which is going to be bad in the SEC.

You must know a lot to issue an edict that the Hogs will not go 5-7. You forget that were only 1 game better than that last year? It is not unlikely the Hogs will go 6-6 again and with injuries and loss of RW, 5-7 is no stretch. The other teams in the SEC are not sitting on status quo.

If he wins 9? He has not sniffed 9 wins in 4 seasons. Winning 9 in either of next 2 seasons seems unlikely. Beyond that, who knows...assuming he lasts that long.
I don't want you to agree with me because you're weak. I want you to agree with me because you know I'm right.
______________________
President Obama promised to begin to slow the rise of the oceans and to heal the planet. My promise is to help you and your family." - Mitt Romney

MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: Pork Twain on June 11, 2017, 01:05:10 pm
This is not the 60's or 70's and we are not in the SWC anymore.  I have always had a really hard time dreaming up who we could hire here:

See us as a destination job

See us as something more than a lateral move from their current position

Could recruit out-of-state players at a high level to make up for our shallow talent pool

Win 10-11 games a year


I'll say this and I have said this from the start, the kind of team that we are trying to build (developed talent, R/S at a  lot of positions) in a Pro Style, Power Football kind of Offense, especially with the difficulties involved with recruiting at Arkansas, is a team that it takes a longer time to build. Once built, it should be easier to maintain. But I have to admit that this is taking a tad longer than I expected. Or maybe it isn't. By all rights we should have won 9 to 10 games last year in Bielema's 4th season at the helm and had that happened, I doubt anyone would have anything negative to say.

This is a key season for Bielema. Basically I think it comes down to win 9 or more games or start looking for an exit plan. I would hate that because I like so much of what Bielema has brought to Arkansas and I would like to see it built upon.

But if Bielema can't meet or exceed 9 wins this season it may be time for Long to reevaluate the type of coach that we need here. I have unfortunately decided that, while I really am not a fan of the HUNH, speeded up, RPO, throw it all over the field type of offense, it may be easier for us to recruit to and use to compete against the big time recruiting machines that we tend to face in the SEC. Now you still need a defense, but that wouldn't change even if we stayed in a Pro Style. Offensively I think it just may be easier to recruit to the wide open offense than the Pro Style and you don't have to have as big O-Linemen that require so much time to develop, you just need good pass blockers and run-screeners. With a lot of motion and misdirection in those offenses, you keep opponents moving around and guessing where you are going and that movement helps set up blocking angles for your O-Linemen (and other blockers) so that they may only have to screen opponents for a couple or three seconds or so as opposed to having to over-power them.

I can't believe I am saying this but if Bielema does fail, I think that is the direction we should go.
Go Hogs Go!

factchecker

Quote from: HoginMemphis on June 11, 2017, 02:43:20 pm
You must know a lot to issue an edict that the Hogs will not go 5-7. You forget that were only 1 game better than that last year? It is not unlikely the Hogs will go 6-6 again and with injuries and loss of RW, 5-7 is no stretch. The other teams in the SEC are not sitting on status quo.

We didn't go 6-6 last season.

7-5 was our regular season record.
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OMAHOGS

Pork Twain

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 11, 2017, 02:44:02 pm
I'll say this and I have said this from the start, the kind of team that we are trying to build (developed talent, R/S at a  lot of positions) in a Pro Style, Power Football kind of Offense, especially with the difficulties involved with recruiting at Arkansas, is a team that it takes a longer time to build. Once built, it should be easier to maintain. But I have to admit that this is taking a tad longer than I expected. Or maybe it isn't. By all rights we should have won 9 to 10 games last year in Bielema's 4th season at the helm and had that happened, I doubt anyone would have anything negative to say.

This is a key season for Bielema. Basically I think it comes down to win 9 or more games or start looking for an exit plan. I would hate that because I like so much of what Bielema has brought to Arkansas and I would like to see it built upon.

But if Bielema can't meet or exceed 9 wins this season it may be time for Long to reevaluate the type of coach that we need here. I have unfortunately decided that, while I really am not a fan of the HUNH, speeded up, RPO, throw it all over the field type of offense, it may be easier for us to recruit to and use to compete against the big time recruiting machines that we tend to face in the SEC. Now you still need a defense, but that wouldn't change even if we stayed in a Pro Style. Offensively I think it just may be easier to recruit to the wide open offense than the Pro Style and you don't have to have as big O-Linemen that require so much time to develop, you just need good pass blockers and run-screeners. With a lot of motion and misdirection in those offenses, you keep opponents moving around and guessing where you are going and that movement helps set up blocking angles for your O-Linemen (and other blockers) so that they may only have to screen opponents for a couple or three seconds or so as opposed to having to over-power them.

I can't believe I am saying this but if Bielema does fail, I think that is the direction we should go.
I agree and think we should have won two more last year and been much more competitive in a couple others.  I am hoping that canning Smith will fix that.

I will always believe that Bobby P was the perfect coach for Arkansas.  His style was what we needed and I am not sure if we will get a better fit in my lifetime.  Damn his horny ass...
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

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MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: HoginMemphis on June 11, 2017, 02:43:20 pm
My point is, 50% better than last in the country awful = bad. If you made a 50 on a test, which is a F, and you improve by 50% on the next test and make a 75, that is still a middling C which is going to be bad in the SEC.

You must know a lot to issue an edict that the Hogs will not go 5-7. You forget that were only 1 game better than that last year? It is not unlikely the Hogs will go 6-6 again and with injuries and loss of RW, 5-7 is no stretch. The other teams in the SEC are not sitting on status quo.

If he wins 9? He has not sniffed 9 wins in 4 seasons. Winning 9 in either of next 2 seasons seems unlikely. Beyond that, who knows...assuming he lasts that long.

Well since we weren't "last in the country" last year in total defense, your projection is incorrect to begin with. And 50% improvement as compared to what? Last season to the previous season or just 50% overall?

We won't go 5-7, we won't go 6-6 either. Just watch.
Go Hogs Go!

Pork Twain

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on June 11, 2017, 03:27:34 pm
Well since we weren't "last in the country" last year in total defense, your projection is incorrect to begin with. And 50% improvement as compared to what? Last season to the previous season or just 50% overall?

We won't go 5-7, we won't go 6-6 either. Just watch.
Bless his heart...

Last year we were ranked #76 in total defense (426 ypg) and 85 in scoring defense (31.1 ppg)  Now if we were 50% better in both of those areas...213 ypg (1st, by almost 50 ypg) and 15.5 ppg (7th), that would be mighty fine.  This is why you can't take this guy serious.

http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/22
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

HognotinMemphis

Quote from: factchecker on June 11, 2017, 02:47:22 pm
We didn't go 6-6 last season.

7-5 was our regular season record.
Ok. Felt like 6-6.
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The Aubran game last year made me want to puke! And for the rest of my weekend I had my Darksider stuff back out .
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Mike_e

Quote from: Al Boarland on June 11, 2017, 11:36:26 am
You forgot about the other team being bigger, stronger, faster. Tackles get broken, players juked or just blown right by.

Except those other teams aren't all that much bigger, stronger or faster than the players we have right now.

Getting juked is a mental lapse, no matter what the head or feet do the center mass has to obey the laws of physics.  Getting "just" blown by is also a mental mistake though from a couple of different areas.  Either a scheme problem where no one is giving help to the corner in need or the other player(s) have missed the play.

Being good is entirely doable, being great may take some time but that is what it is all about- working towards a goal.
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hogcard1964

Quote from: moses_007 on June 09, 2017, 09:35:17 pm
This team can't sustain drives with freshmen running backs and green junior college receivers.  I look for a really bad year.

There's 6 automatic wins on the schedule as is.   We get a bounce our way, catch some breaks, and we're quite possibly nearing 8-9 wins.

MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: hogcard1964 on June 12, 2017, 06:06:40 am
There's 6 automatic wins on the schedule as is.   We get a bounce our way, catch some breaks, and we're quite possibly nearing 8-9 wins.

Nothing is ever "automatic" to me, but if the kids and staff are totally committed and we get better scheming on defense, along with the oblong shaped ball bouncing our way occasionally at key times, you never know what might happen. Bielema "needs" 9 wins this season if he hopes to prolong his stay here. The pressure is on and I guarantee you that the kids on the team don't want to see this season go the way it did last year so I expect to see us play better football this season. Like any other team, we need to actually make some breaks for ourselves and be the beneficiary of some breaks handed to us by our opponents.
Go Hogs Go!