Help me understand

[Hawg Red]

Tell me now! What do you know?

Good vibrations.

[hogsanity]

I'm not a mod, nor would I ever want to be one, but yes, a lot of posters disappeared.  The thing you seem to be missing is, they weren't banned for attacking CMA, they were banned because they insisted on derailing every single thread in jump ball.  Every single thread, no matter the original topic, became a pissing contest over CMAs dismal recruiting, or some aspect of our play they didn't like, etc.  Jump ball became very much unreadable.

As far as the original topic here, from what I've seen, at best, the most hopeless optimists seem to think this team is an NIT at best.  Personally, I don't know, I do think the roster is better than CMA's first year, and probably even his second (at least if Beard comes back).  I also think the team will benefit from having veterans with multiple years in the system.  We won 18 that first year, but our SOS is better this year, so who knows.  I really don't want to put a prediction to anything until I've seen them play.

The thing is, all the discussion this summer had to be about recruiting because recruiting is where the players come from. And, the derailing was two sided. Any criticism was met with sunshine about how great Mike is. 

I have said before, Mike is a great guy, good coach, and average recruiter. A guy who runs a clean program and wins some games. What is wrong with that?

[jjdlc]

The thing is, all the discussion this summer had to be about recruiting because recruiting is where the players come from. And, the derailing was two sided. Any criticism was met with sunshine about how great Mike is. 

I have said before, Mike is a great guy, good coach, and average recruiter. A guy who runs a clean program and wins some games. What is wrong with that?

Didn't say it wasn't two sided, posters from both sides disappeared.  The point is, discussion about the poor recruiting was fine, but it needed to be kept in its own threads.  Instead it found its way into posts about everything from problems going on at other schools, to posts about Quall's injury and rehab.

Your statement pretty much sums up my thoughts on CMA.

[-Blu]

The thing is, all the discussion this summer had to be about recruiting because recruiting is where the players come from. And, the derailing was two sided. Any criticism was met with sunshine about how great Mike is. 

That is incorrect.  Most posters (including myself) expressed disappointment in how things went down in the Spring as far as recruiting.  The difference is we didn't want to turn EVERY SINGLE THREAD (like your doing now) into a bashing session of the staff.  Most people rather actually look at the positives and move on and discuss other things rather than something negative that's in the past that we can't control.  2015 Spring recruiting was bad, we get it, we know, nothing we can do about it now.  2016 is looking much better let's talk about that.  Jaylen Barford the #1 JUCO has been killing it so far this season, I've posted updates in the recruiting fourm about him, for someone that seems so concerned about recruiting, you would think you would have made an appearance in that thread, but that's something positive that doesn't fit your agenda.

[warriorlion]

I was very optimistic and then I watched them practice last week.  15 wins will be a good year for this bunch.  Hope I am wrong but to many weak areas.

[The_Iceman]

That is incorrect.  Most posters (including myself) expressed disappointment in how things went down in the Spring as far as recruiting.  The difference is we didn't want to turn EVERY SINGLE THREAD (like your doing now) into a bashing session of the staff.  Most people rather actually look at the positives and move on and discuss other things rather than something negative that's in the past that we can't control.  2015 Spring recruiting was bad, we get it, we know, nothing we can do about it now.  2016 is looking much better let's talk about that.  Jaylen Barford the #1 JUCO has been killing it so far this season, I've posted updates in the recruiting fourm about him, for someone that seems so concerned about recruiting, you would think you would have made an appearance in that thread, but that's something positive that doesn't fit your agenda.

Barford, Macon, and Bailey is a step in the right direction, but we need so much more than than for 2016.

[Danny J]

I was very optimistic and then I watched them practice last week.  15 wins will be a good year for this bunch.  Hope I am wrong but to many weak areas.

I also think that finishing right around .500 will be likely. I think maybe around 17 regular season.

[UNCLE BACK]

Blu, azhog10, UNCLE BACK, TomBeeHog, WarPig88, MikeIrwin and letsroll1200 all seem to think this is a tournament team. Most people in Jump Ball are realistic and realize this is an NIT team at best but some of Jump Ball are overrating this team.

Now the most realistic guys on this season are Hogsanity, Bigdaddyhog, Hawg Red, Erie Hog, Biggus, Porkinson Disease, Deep Shoat, nwahogfan1, Breems and atlhog. TheRazorbackGuy yours truly is also being realistic

If I have said we would be a tournament team, please remind me when? I feel like we can win 18 or 19 games possibly which likely doesn't even get us in the NIT. All I have said is Mike can get more done with less and that I feel like we can be decent. If this team makes the NCAA tourney, Id be shocked. I'm just not down on Mike like most. We have not lost to bad teams at Bud Walton and we have been fun to watch. Please don't say that I said we would make the dance... Winning the SEC tourney would likely be our only chance at that.

[TomBigBeeHog]

If I have said we would be a tournament team, please remind me when? I feel like we can win 18 or 19 games possibly which likely doesn't even get us in the NIT. All I have said is Mike can get more done with less and that I feel like we can be decent. If this team makes the NCAA tourney, Id be shocked. I'm just not down on Mike like most. We have not lost to bad teams at Bud Walton and we have been fun to watch. Please don't say that I said we would make the dance... Winning the SEC tourney would likely be our only chance at that.

He's got it all wrong. Not that he cares. This is what I said in the game predictions thread...

9-3 non conference. 10-8 conference. 1 SEC tournament win. NIT 1 win.  21-13 overall. Nothing to write home about but not bad, all things considered.

19 wins in regular season and possibly 2 more wins in the SEC tourney and NIT. But again, some people never let the facts get in the way of their agenda.

[hawgfan4life]

I really don't understand the wait and see philosophy.  Why should we wait when we can start being negative and bash the coach, the players, the team, and its overall success right now?  Really doesn't make sense!  Some fans......SHEESH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TomBigBeeHog]

I really don't understand the wait and see philosophy.  Why should we wait when we can start being negative and bash the coach, the players, the team, and its overall success right now?  Really doesn't make sense!  Some fans......SHEESH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

+1

[WilsonHog]

Let me step away from being an admin for a minute and make an observation using my own beliefs about the upcoming season.

I do not believe we will be a tournament team - although I have zero evidence to base that on. No games. I said last week that I thought we'd be a little better than .500.

Now, then. Here comes the important part.

Let's suppose that every time we get beat, I log on to Jump Ball just to remind people of how bad I thought we'd be. Should we happen to win, I log on to mitigate that win with whatever ammunition I can find. Just for good measure, every time I get the opportunity I'm going to talk about how badly recruiting went.

Do you know what I deserve for that?

To be banned.

Okay, now I'm an admin again.

[The_Iceman]

Let me step away from being an admin for a minute and make an observation using my own beliefs about the upcoming season.

I do not believe we will be a tournament team - although I have zero evidence to base that on. No games. I said last week that I thought we'd be a little better than .500.

Now, then. Here comes the important part.

Let's suppose that every time we get beat, I log on to Jump Ball just to remind people of how bad I thought we'd be. Should we happen to win, I log on to mitigate that win with whatever ammunition I can find. Just for good measure, every time I get the opportunity I'm going to talk about how badly recruiting went.

Do you know what I deserve for that?

To be banned.

Okay, now I'm an admin again.

I will never be happier than the day I come on here in a few months and declare my support for Mike again and say how much I was wrong about him and the upcoming dreadful 2015-2016 season.

I doubt that day will come, but as someone who has been going with my father to games since BWA opened, and someone who will still be going to games including the upcoming exh. Game, I will love it if it does.

[WilsonHog]

I will never be happier than the day I come on here in a few months and declare my support for Mike again and say how much I was wrong about him and the upcoming dreadful 2015-2016 season.

I doubt that day will come, but as someone who has been going with my father to games since BWA opened, and someone who will still be going to games including the upcoming exh. Game, I will love it if it does.

For me, it's not a matter of supporting or not supporting; the currency of that is as worthless as those bills Jacorey was pushing.

[TexomaRazorback]

This one is hard to call.  We have so many new players and so many players that left.  We have the best outside shooting we've had in a while, but not much size for the inside game.  Who knows.

[Breems]

For me, it's not a matter of supporting or not supporting; the currency of that is as worthless as those bills Jacorey was pushing.

Well done.

That's what people don't get, especially those that cry about being labeled and say they can't express their opinions.

[rude1]

Nobody truly knows what to expect from this years team. Just not enough information available to make any kind of prediction one way or the other right now IMO. This season for me is simply a matter of seeing the product on the floor before putting together any observations. Of course when you look at the players on paper with so little coming back, it's hard to imagine enough skills gained over the summer to field a team that contends for anything, BUT that is why they play the games........

[Biggus Piggus]

This is definitely the first year we've been the darkhorse since Petrino was here.

DEFINITELY.

I am sick of this complete bull tactic some people on here use to deflect the absolutely horrifying condition of the men's basketball program under Mike Anderson by throwing in some completely irrelevant non-points about football.

[TomBigBeeHog]

DEFINITELY.

I am sick of this complete bull tactic some people on here use to deflect the absolutely horrifying condition of the men's basketball program under Mike Anderson by throwing in some completely irrelevant non-points about football.

Lots of hyperbole there.

[-Blu]

Lots of hyperbole there.

Hyperbole?  You need to get with the program around here buddy. CMA and basketball program = bad, CBB and football program = good.  Anybody can see CMA is dragging this program in the mud and we'd be lucky to go .500 this year.  CBB has us looking really good the future is bright we're going to go .500 this year and play another .500 team in a bowl game.  CMA can only dream about getting results like that.  Plus CBB has cooler catch phrases.  #uncommon

[TheRazorbackGuy]

DEFINITELY.

I am sick of this complete bull tactic some people on here use to deflect the absolutely horrifying condition of the men's basketball program under Mike Anderson by throwing in some completely irrelevant non-points about football.

Don't understand the comparison of the football coach and hoops coach. Two totally different sports. Biggus is correct on this issue. Lets stick to hoops on Jump Ball

[-Blu]

Don't understand the comparison of the football coach and hoops coach. Two totally different sports. Biggus is correct on this issue. Lets stick to hoops on Jump Ball

Yes, let's focus on that, and not how you lied on everyone.  Let's pretend that didn't happen.

[The_Iceman]

DEFINITELY.

I am sick of this complete bull tactic some people on here use to deflect the absolutely horrifying condition of the men's basketball program under Mike Anderson by throwing in some completely irrelevant non-points about football.

Yes, Trying to completely rebuild an 85 man roster than was depleted from the poor recruiting of Petrino and a basically death penalty year with JLS, to Mike Anderson taking over the basketball program from Pelphrey and having to put together a 13 man roster where only 5 play at a time is a much different task.

No excuse for the poor 2015 offseason that has left this program in shambles entering year 5.

[-Blu]

Yes, Trying to completely rebuild an 85 man roster than was depleted from the poor recruiting of Petrino and a basically death penalty year with JLS, to Mike Anderson taking over the basketball program from Pelphrey and having to put together a 13 man roster where only 5 play at a time is a much different task.

No excuse for the poor 2015 offseason that has left this program in shambles entering year 5.

What does roster sizes have to do with bashing one coach in every single thread and not the other?  We can debate all day long who inherited a worse situation CMA or CBB.  We can debate all day long which is easier to turn around basketball or football, but that's completely irrelevant to what's going on here.

Point is, it's become acceptable to bash the basketball coach, yet it's unacceptable to say anything negative about the football coach. Every single thread on jump ball contains some sort of CMA bashing, yet you go to MMQB the mods lock threads that contain bashing and ban people.  We have guys like yourself that pretty much bash CMA in every thread, with stuff that is months old now.  Yet, over here we have a mod in Biggus who openly bashes the basketball coach, yet if you read his posts in MMQB he's frequently in defense of CBB and gets all over people if they try to bash him.  You can try to justify that in your head with roster sizes and it's football all you want, but it's a double standard, and it's not right.

[hogman99]

Hyperbole?  You need to get with the program around here buddy. CMA and basketball program = bad, CBB and football program = good.  Anybody can see CMA is dragging this program in the mud and we'd be lucky to go .500 this year.  CBB has us looking really good the future is bright we're going to go .500 this year and play another .500 team in a bowl game.  CMA can only dream about getting results like that.  Plus CBB has cooler catch phrases.  #uncommon

I'm not going to disagree with your above post except for one item. #fastest40 is just as dumb as #uncommon

[-Blu]

I'm not going to disagree with your above post except for one item. #fastest40 is just as dumb as #uncommon

touche

[hogsanity]

What does roster sizes have to do with bashing one coach in every single thread and not the other?  We can debate all day long who inherited a worse situation CMA or CBB.  We can debate all day long which is easier to turn around basketball or football, but that's completely irrelevant to what's going on here.

Point is, it's become acceptable to bash the basketball coach, yet it's unacceptable to say anything negative about the football coach. Every single thread on jump ball contains some sort of CMA bashing, yet you go to MMQB the mods lock threads that contain bashing and ban people.  We have guys like yourself that pretty much bash CMA in every thread, with stuff that is months old now.  Yet, over here we have a mod in Biggus who openly bashes the basketball coach, yet if you read his posts in MMQB he's frequently in defense of CBB and gets all over people if they try to bash him.  You can try to justify that in your head with roster sizes and it's football all you want, but it's a double standard, and it's not right.

Do you read mmqb? There have been people bashing BB since about 13 seconds after his hiring was announced.

But here is what I just truly do not understand. Why, on a message board, are ANY opinions stiffled? If you want to post " Mike Anderson is the greatest basketball coach of all time " in every thread, so what. And if someone else wants to post " Mike Anderson is never going to get it done here " again, so what?

As for this thread and this forum, I just want some clear guidelines. I assume, even though he said he was posting as an individual not as an admin, that Tom's post pretty much lays out that people are not going to be able to criticize by mentioning past recruiting, mentioning most people thought the team was not going to be very good, or mentioning that a win over a team like is really not a big deal.

Finally your comment about double standards is exactly the problem some of us have. Mike has done nothing more than did Heath or Pel. Like it or not the college basketball world judges you on the NCAAT. Pel went to 1 in his 4 years and won 1 ncaat game. Heath went twice in 5 years and won zero. Mike has been to 1 in 4 years and won 1 ncaat game. The basketball world looks at those 3 guys the same way. They think that Arkansas should not be a once every 5 year tournament team. Yet 2 of those 3 were run out of town on a rail, after being tarred and feathered by the fans.

If you want to compare football and basketball, at least do so in points in each coaches tenure. Through 2.5 season of each, they are about equal. BB has been to the equivalent of the NIT by making a bowl last year, and MA was on his way to the NIT at the end of year 3.

[wheelspigharvey]

Finally your comment about double standards is exactly the problem some of us have. Mike has done nothing more than did Heath or Pel. Like it or not the college basketball world judges you on the NCAAT. Pel went to 1 in his 4 years and won 1 ncaat game. Heath went twice in 5 years and won zero. Mike has been to 1 in 4 years and won 1 ncaat game. The basketball world looks at those 3 guys the same way. They think that Arkansas should not be a once every 5 year tournament team. Yet 2 of those 3 were run out of town on a rail, after being tarred and feathered by the fans.

Looking at the records, it's pretty clear that Heath maybe didn't get a fair shake, but we also know that the he wasn't the best fit in the world.  When comparing Pel and Mike, trajectory matters whether you like it or not.  One appearance followed by bad seasons that got worse vs bad seasons getting better followed by an NIT and then a tournament appearance, winning one game in both aren't the same.  They just aren't, end of story.

[hogsanity]

When comparing Pel and Mike, trajectory matters whether you like it or not.  One appearance followed by bad seasons that got worse vs bad seasons getting better followed by an NIT and then a tournament appearance, winning one game in both aren't the same.  They just aren't, end of story.

To homers, it matters to homers. and then only when it fits the agenda. Heath, 3 years of noting, then back to back ncaat appearances, looks like the same trajectory to me ( and Pel took Heath's players to a 3 ncaat appearance ), but there were very very few who were upset that Heath was let go ( now there were many not happy with his replacement but that is a different story ). I do not remember many people pointing out that the program was on a upwards trajectory, they were too busy whining about how boring Heath's style of ball was. 

[The_Iceman]

Looking at the records, it's pretty clear that Heath maybe didn't get a fair shake, but we also know that the he wasn't the best fit in the world.  When comparing Pel and Mike, trajectory matters whether you like it or not.  One appearance followed by bad seasons that got worse vs bad seasons getting better followed by an NIT and then a tournament appearance, winning one game in both aren't the same.  They just aren't, end of story.

Mike's trajectory right now...
Year one (18-14): level (Pelphrey went 18-13)
Year two (19-13): level (or slightly up)
Year three (22-12): NIT appearance, so up
Year four (27-9): way up
Year five: worst recruiting class in the SEC, No NCAA appearance, maybe no NIT apperance = DOWN
Year six: on pace to have anywhere from a decent to great recruiting class (depending on Cook and Monk), should have a better year than year five, no doubt, but won't be better than year four unless we get Monk = UP

The trajectory of this program is inconsistent. It is likely that after year six, his biggest accomplishment will be a win over Wofford in the NCAA tournament. I don't see how anyone can consider Mike Anderson to have this program heading anywhere but mediocre. He failed this program and fanbase with his pitiful effort and performance in the 2015 offseason. It is unacceptable to me and should be for everyone else. I am holding him to the standard Mike set for himself with his resume and his promises. I don't give a flip about Nolan and his history.

[-Blu]

Mike's trajectory right now...
Year one (18-14): level (Pelphrey went 18-13)
Year two (19-13): level (or slightly up)
Year three (22-12): NIT appearance, so up
Year four (27-9): way up
Year five: worst recruiting class in the SEC, No NCAA appearance, maybe no NIT apperance = DOWN
Year six: on pace to have anywhere from a decent to great recruiting class (depending on Cook and Monk), should have a better year than year five, no doubt, but won't be better than year four unless we get Monk = UP

The trajectory of this program is inconsistent. It is likely that after year six, his biggest accomplishment will be a win over Wofford in the NCAA tournament. I don't see how anyone can consider Mike Anderson to have this program heading anywhere but mediocre. He failed this program and fanbase with his pitiful effort and performance in the 2015 offseason. It is unacceptable to me and should be for everyone else. I am holding him to the standard Mike set for himself with his resume and his promises. I don't give a flip about Nolan and his history.

lol what a joke, 2015 and 2016 haven't even been played yet, how can you judge him on what hasn't even happened yet.  You said your a lawyer right?  Don't you judge people by the facts and what you can prove?  You can't prove anything about 2015 and 2016 season because they haven't been played, so how in the world are you going to factor those years into his trajectory, that makes no sense at all.

And I don't know if your bitter because the football team didn't do what you thought this year or not, but I mean your a completely different poster than what you use to be, all you do now is complain about every little thing CMA does now.  What's funny about that is, if basketball team ends up being a lot better than you thought, then your going to be one of those guys that jump right back on the bandwagon and act like you've been supportive the whole time.

[-Blu]

Do you read mmqb? There have been people bashing BB since about 13 seconds after his hiring was announced.

But here is what I just truly do not understand. Why, on a message board, are ANY opinions stiffled? If you want to post " Mike Anderson is the greatest basketball coach of all time " in every thread, so what. And if someone else wants to post " Mike Anderson is never going to get it done here " again, so what?

As for this thread and this forum, I just want some clear guidelines. I assume, even though he said he was posting as an individual not as an admin, that Tom's post pretty much lays out that people are not going to be able to criticize by mentioning past recruiting, mentioning most people thought the team was not going to be very good, or mentioning that a win over a team like is really not a big deal.

Finally your comment about double standards is exactly the problem some of us have. Mike has done nothing more than did Heath or Pel. Like it or not the college basketball world judges you on the NCAAT. Pel went to 1 in his 4 years and won 1 ncaat game. Heath went twice in 5 years and won zero. Mike has been to 1 in 4 years and won 1 ncaat game. The basketball world looks at those 3 guys the same way. They think that Arkansas should not be a once every 5 year tournament team. Yet 2 of those 3 were run out of town on a rail, after being tarred and feathered by the fans.

If you want to compare football and basketball, at least do so in points in each coaches tenure. Through 2.5 season of each, they are about equal. BB has been to the equivalent of the NIT by making a bowl last year, and MA was on his way to the NIT at the end of year 3.

Hogsanity I'm not going to lie, I didn't read your post, and don't intend to, you know how I feel about your views, I don't even bother arguing with you anymore.  But, thanks for sharing.

[wheelspigharvey]

To homers, it matters to homers. and then only when it fits the agenda. Heath, 3 years of noting, then back to back ncaat appearances, looks like the same trajectory to me ( and Pel took Heath's players to a 3 ncaat appearance ), but there were very very few who were upset that Heath was let go ( now there were many not happy with his replacement but that is a different story ). I do not remember many people pointing out that the program was on a upwards trajectory, they were too busy whining about how boring Heath's style of ball was.

I'm not saying getting rid of Heath was a good idea, I'm just saying w/r/t Pel vs Mike trajectory matters, and that you can't say 1 in 4 makes them equivalent because it matters that Mike's program is getting better and Pel's got worse.

I'll go ahead and say this.  The worst case our program has going for us now is that Mike is a stable but mediocre coach, which means that if we don't make it to where we think we ought to be in a few more seasons, the next guy will not be taking over a dumpster fire, and that may be attractive to whatever marquee name we are going after. 

[wheelspigharvey]

It is likely that after year six, his biggest accomplishment will be a win over Wofford in the NCAA tournament.

I'm not willing to concede that we won't make the tournament NEXT season already.  That's some say-it-til-it's-true, doubt-sowing-disguised-as-facts type business.

[The_Iceman]

lol what a joke, 2015 and 2016 haven't even been played yet, how can you judge him on what hasn't even happened yet.  You said your a lawyer right?  Don't you judge people by the facts and what you can prove?  You can't prove anything about 2015 and 2016 season because they haven't been played, so how in the world are you going to factor those years into his trajectory, that makes no sense at all.

And I don't know if your bitter because the football team didn't do what you thought this year or not, but I mean your a completely different poster than what you use to be, all you do now is complain about every little thing CMA does now.  What's funny about that is, if basketball team ends up being a lot better than you thought, then your going to be one of those guys that jump right back on the bandwagon and act like you've been supportive the whole time.

The SEC has hired better coaches and recruited better players across the board. Our roster is depleted of talent and we squander away a great season by bringing in the worst recruiting class in the SEC. I would be a pretty bad lawyer if I couldn't look at those facts and determine that the upcoming season is going to be very bad.

I hope this team surprises and is better than we expect. At best, that means we make the NIT. That shouldn't be acceptable from a coach that came in with the resume of rebuilding programs and getting teams consistently to the NCAA Tournament.

[-Blu]

I'm not willing to concede that we won't make the tournament NEXT season already.  That's some say-it-til-it's-true, doubt-sowing-disguised-as-facts type business.

Iceman traveled to the future.  Right now he's watching us in 2017 NCAA tournament as a 12 seed in round 64 with 1:00 minute left and we're down by 5. 

[RME]

lol what a joke, 2015 and 2016 haven't even been played yet, how can you judge him on what hasn't even happened yet.  You said your a lawyer right?  Don't you judge people by the facts and what you can prove?  You can't prove anything about 2015 and 2016 season because they haven't been played, so how in the world are you going to factor those years into his trajectory, that makes no sense at all.

And I don't know if your bitter because the football team didn't do what you thought this year or not, but I mean your a completely different poster than what you use to be, all you do now is complain about every little thing CMA does now.  What's funny about that is, if basketball team ends up being a lot better than you thought, then your going to be one of those guys that jump right back on the bandwagon and act like you've been supportive the whole time.

Well, he can definitely prove Arkansas had the worst recruiting class in the SEC. http://247sports.com/Season/2015-Basketball/CompositeTeamRankings?Conference=SEC
I'm sure you can also prove that poor recruiting leads to poorer teams? But heck, what do I know. Don't quote me on that.

And, based on the other trends and notions that he presents, I'd say his projected trajectories for 2015/2016 aren't that far off.

SPOILER ALERT: I'm not an Anderson hater. I believe in giving coaches time, BUT I also believe that basketball turnaround should be evident more quickly than a football turnaround.

[hawginbigd1]

Mike's trajectory right now...
Year one (18-14): level (Pelphrey went 18-13)
Year two (19-13): level (or slightly up)
Year three (22-12): NIT appearance, so up
Year four (27-9): way up
Year five: worst recruiting class in the SEC, No NCAA appearance, maybe no NIT apperance = DOWN
Year six: on pace to have anywhere from a decent to great recruiting class (depending on Cook and Monk), should have a better year than year five, no doubt, but won't be better than year four unless we get Monk = UP

The trajectory of this program is inconsistent. It is likely that after year six, his biggest accomplishment will be a win over Wofford in the NCAA tournament. I don't see how anyone can consider Mike Anderson to have this program heading anywhere but mediocre. He failed this program and fanbase with his pitiful effort and performance in the 2015 offseason. It is unacceptable to me and should be for everyone else. I am holding him to the standard Mike set for himself with his resume and his promises. I don't give a flip about Nolan and his history.

Well put Ice!

IMO there is no comparison to Heath and Pel, with where we are. IMO we were on the verge of collapse under those 2, there was a poor culture and no discipline or "GOOD" leadership on those teams. I don't like the way MA does everything from a basketball standpoint, but I accept we might do things differently. He has been a success in most measures in his career, but is a little light on tourney appearances and success. As you, I think he totally blew the 2015 offseason, and I was concerned about it from the end of the early period last year. I know some will get upset by this but one of my fears is that MA is becoming NR, and getting lazy with recruiting! CMA is a very cool dude, but IMO is not the most dynamic personality in the world, and personality is a big seller to people in this world and that includes recruits. It doesn't matter how great a coach MA is, and how clean he runs a program if you can't get the dudes to win the games!

[RME]

The SEC has hired better coaches and recruited better players across the board. Our roster is depleted of talent and we squander away a great season by bringing in the worst recruiting class in the SEC. I would be a pretty bad lawyer if I couldn't look at those facts and determine that the upcoming season is going to be very bad.

I hope this team surprises and is better than we expect. At best, that means we make the NIT. That shouldn't be acceptable from a coach that came in with the resume of rebuilding programs and getting teams consistently to the NCAA Tournament.

Definitely. Even 4 within the West have the potential to be pretty scary (notice I said potential, for all you people who jump on every word.) We know what Pearl and Howland can do. Jones has had LSU on a decent upswing, and you have to like Avery Johnson's potential. Then you look across at the East and have Barnes at Tenn? Yeesh.

[-Blu]

The SEC has hired better coaches and recruited better players across the board. Our roster is depleted of talent and we squander away a great season by bringing in the worst recruiting class in the SEC. I would be a pretty bad lawyer if I couldn't look at those facts and determine that the upcoming season is going to be very bad.

I hope this team surprises and is better than we expect. At best, that means we make the NIT. That shouldn't be acceptable from a coach that came in with the resume of rebuilding programs and getting teams consistently to the NCAA Tournament.

The SEC has hired coaches that are out of their prime that got fired by other schools, I'm all for us giving the conference it's props and hope we become stronger in basketball, but don't try to hype these new coaches up like we're about to be the big 12 or something. There is a reason those guys got fired.

And your prediction, is just that a prediction,  I don't know why you keep saying it like it's facts.  You like the rest of us, have no idea where this team will finish.  This could be the worst team in razorback history or it could be a team that surprises a lot of people and end up being pretty good.  If Dayton can come out of the A10 conference with 7 scholarship players and sneak in the tournament, I wouldn't put Arkansas sneaking in the tournament in the SEC with 10 scholarship players completely out the realm of possibilities.  Lot of unknowns, sit back, relax, and let things unfold.

[wheelspigharvey]

I would be a pretty bad lawyer if I couldn't look at those facts and determine that the upcoming season is going to be very bad.

You said after year 6 we will likely only have one tournament win, so I read that as not making the tournament next season.  I guess we could make the tournament and lose the first game and that still be true.

Also if we're going to compare ourselves to other teams, the season is upon us, let's talk about the actual games.  All these programs discussed are probably on the upswing.  Can we beat them this season?

[ArkansasI]

Mike's trajectory right now...
Year one (18-14): level (Pelphrey went 18-13)
Year two (19-13): level (or slightly up)
Year three (22-12): NIT appearance, so up
Year four (27-9): way up
Year five: worst recruiting class in the SEC, No NCAA appearance, maybe no NIT apperance = DOWN
Year six: on pace to have anywhere from a decent to great recruiting class (depending on Cook and Monk), should have a better year than year five, no doubt, but won't be better than year four unless we get Monk = UP

The trajectory of this program is inconsistent. It is likely that after year six, his biggest accomplishment will be a win over Wofford in the NCAA tournament. I don't see how anyone can consider Mike Anderson to have this program heading anywhere but mediocre. He failed this program and fanbase with his pitiful effort and performance in the 2015 offseason. It is unacceptable to me and should be for everyone else. I am holding him to the standard Mike set for himself with his resume and his promises. I don't give a flip about Nolan and his history.

I think this fairly describes some of the frustration that many of us have with the basketball program.  Also, when our best in-state talent is not investing in the program, it's pretty clear that the program's trajectory is not what we hope for or reasonably expect.

We have a new $48M practice facility... That's a lot of money that may have bought us credibility with some junior college standouts, but apparently not with the players that seem closest to the program.  Do they know something that we don't?

When it comes to Mike's resume, he is performing fairly consistent with what he has accomplished in the past.  That, for some, is further cause for discouragement.  Many had hoped that coming home to Arkansas might elevate his recruiting network.  I don't believe that this has occurred.  As we enter Mike's longest tenure at a school, the spring events and current state of the program do not offer much hope that things will improve in the future.

[The_Iceman]

Well put Ice!

IMO there is no comparison to Heath and Pel, with where we are. IMO we were on the verge of collapse under those 2, there was a poor culture and no discipline or "GOOD" leadership on those teams. I don't like the way MA does everything from a basketball standpoint, but I accept we might do things differently. He has been a success in most measures in his career, but is a little light on tourney appearances and success. As you, I think he totally blew the 2015 offseason, and I was concerned about it from the end of the early period last year. I know some will get upset by this but one of my fears is that MA is becoming NR, and getting lazy with recruiting! CMA is a very cool dude, but IMO is not the most dynamic personality in the world, and personality is a big seller to people in this world and that includes recruits. It doesn't matter how great a coach MA is, and how clean he runs a program if you can't get the dudes to win the games!

I have nothing against Mike as a person or even an in-game coach. Last year was amazing and fun to watch. However, in year five of Mike Anderson's tenure at Arkansas, I did not expect the program to dip so low again. I expected him to have a bad first couple years to get things in pace and get his players here, but never did I expect him to have another year in his tenure where an upcoming season looked as bleak as this...where an NIT birth would be a good year.

He has all the talent he needs in-state to build the foundation for a program: Archie Goodwin (2012), Portis (2013), Beard (2014), Kevaughn Allen (2015), Monk and Curry (2016). Then, just go out and land some complementary pieces from the surrounding areas, JUCOs, and transfers. There is no excuse for a coach to have the resources of this program, have a secure contract, and entering his 5th season....to have this program at the point we are now...staring a terrible season right in the face.

I don't mind a rebuilding season where you have a roster full of young talent that is going to need seasoning, but what I saw on the floor at the practice Saturday was not that.

[The_Iceman]

You said after year 6 we will likely only have one tournament win, so I read that as not making the tournament next season.  I guess we could make the tournament and lose the first game and that still be true.

I mean, we could do very well in the 2017 NCAA Tournament. But with Mike Anderson running this program, we shouldn't have to be looking forward two seasons for a glimmer of hope.

[wheelspigharvey]

I don't mind a rebuilding season where you have a roster full of young talent that is going to need seasoning, but what I saw on the floor at the practice Saturday was not that.

I wasn't there Saturday but I do have to say that I did like what I saw at the RW game all things considered.  Not perfect, definitely sloppy, and Kouassi was kind of a disappointment, but overall we were physical and no one was scared to mix it up, and I was really impressed by Miles, Kingsley, and to a lesser extent Thompson (I think he may be stepping into Harris' role) and was pretty happy with Whitt.  I was also happy to see Kikko because it tells me we have a program that our former players still rep and want to be a part of.

[-Blu]

Well, he can definitely prove Arkansas had the worst recruiting class in the SEC. http://247sports.com/Season/2015-Basketball/CompositeTeamRankings?Conference=SEC
I'm sure you can also prove that poor recruiting leads to poorer teams? But heck, what do I know. Don't quote me on that.

And, based on the other trends and notions that he presents, I'd say his projected trajectories for 2015/2016 aren't that far off.

SPOILER ALERT: I'm not an Anderson hater. I believe in giving coaches time, BUT I also believe that basketball turnaround should be evident more quickly than a football turnaround.

I like how you guys keep bringing up worst recruiting class in the SEC.  Did you guys actually look at the players a lot of those teams had? I guarantee you Alabama, Ole Miss, Tennessee, Georgia, and Vandy would all trade their entire class for Whitt.  He's by far better than any of those players those teams recruited.

Next, Jenkins reclassified so he was unranked.  He was a late bloomer that got discovered during AAU ball this summer.  Had he stayed 2016 and played a year in prep he would have without a doubt received his ranking on every service and probably ended up being a mid-tier 3-star guy, which is what Rivals gave him.  That ranking also doesn't include Willy Kouassi (grad transfer), who coming out of high school was a top 100 player.  If they would have ranked Jenkins a 3-star and included Kouassi (4-star) high school ranking then we would have ended up close to a top 5 class in the conference.  But, by all means keep pumping that we had the last ranked ranked class nonsense out there. 

Oh and FYI, those worried about ranking get ready to be disappointed again this year as well.  ESPN doesn't rank JUCOs, so when they talk about recruiting classes on the SEC Network and all that, our class will probably not even be ranked, even if we land Monk.  Does that mean that #1 and #2 JUCO suck?  According to you guys, probably does.

[The_Iceman]

Oh and FYI, those worried about ranking get ready to be disappointed again this year as well.  ESPN doesn't rank JUCOs, so when they talk about recruiting classes on the SEC Network and all that, our class will probably not even be ranked, even if we land Monk.  Does that mean that #1 and #2 JUCO suck?  According to you guys, probably does.

I used the 247 system to conclude Arkansas had the last ranked class in the SEC, mostly because they do the best job with basketball recruiting because they rank JUCO's. I will use them again in 2016. Cook, Macon, and Barford would be three 4-star recruits if we get Cook. I will not simply ignore that. My frustration with Mike is his failure in the 2015 offseason and the fact I am going to have to sit through a bad season when he is in year 5.

I don't mind you disagreeing with my opinion, but don't try to make me out as an agenda driven Mike hater who will argue every fact for the negative.

Yes, Kouassi, Jenkins, and even Hannahs are nice additions. But when you lose Portis, Qualls, Madden, Harris....and then Babb, Williams, and Beard (for now); you have to do better than that.

[RME]

I like how you guys keep bringing up worst recruiting class in the SEC.  Did you guys actually look at the players a lot of those teams had? I guarantee you Alabama, Ole Miss, Tennessee, Georgia, and Vandy would all trade their entire class for Whitt.  He's by far better than any of those players those teams recruited.

Next, Jenkins reclassified so he was unranked.  He was a late bloomer that got discovered during AAU ball this summer.  Had he stayed 2016 and played a year in prep he would have without a doubt received his ranking on every service and probably ended up being a mid-tier 3-star guy, which is what Rivals gave him.  That ranking also doesn't include Willy Kouassi (grad transfer), who coming out of high school was a top 100 player.  If they would have ranked Jenkins a 3-star and included Kouassi (4-star) high school ranking then we would have ended up close to a top 5 class in the conference.  But, by all means keep pumping that we had the last ranked ranked class nonsense out there. 

Oh and FYI, those worried about ranking get ready to be disappointed again this year as well.  ESPN doesn't rank JUCOs, so when they talk about recruiting classes on the SEC Network and all that, our class will probably not even be ranked, even if we land Monk.  Does that mean that #1 and #2 JUCO suck?  According to you guys, probably does.

Like Ice said, 247 does rank JUCO's.

Find in my posts where I said that.

[-Blu]

I used the 247 system to conclude Arkansas had the last ranked class in the SEC, mostly because they do the best job with basketball recruiting because they rank JUCO's.

If you seriously think we brought in the least amount of talent in the SEC this year, you know absolutely nothing about college basketball, no way to sugarcoat that.  Your basically saying you would take Alabama, Ole Miss, Tennessee, Georgia, and Vandy recruiting class (a bunch of low tier 3 stars) over Whitt, that's ridiculous.

[RME]

If you seriously think we brought in the least amount of talent in the SEC this year, you know absolutely nothing about college basketball, no way to sugarcoat that.  Your basically saying you would take Alabama, Ole Miss, Tennessee, Georgia, and Vandy recruiting class (a bunch of low tier 3 stars) over Whitt, that's ridiculous.

Didn't know one player (Whitt) could make up a whole team. Why run anyone else out there? Why doesn't Mike focus on getting one potentially great player instead of several good players like these morons at Bama, Ole Miss, etc.? Didn't realize Whitt was worth about 12 wins that you're hyping him up to be.