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Bo is hopeless

Started by hawgon, November 16, 2017, 03:43:26 pm

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Martygit

Quote from: John Snow on November 16, 2017, 04:48:50 pm
I guess Mike Irwin is now Gord Gecko from the movie Wall Street and has insider knowledge with Stephens inc who helped write the bond ??

If Shep Russell, who is a bond lawyer with Friday, Eldredge & Clark and who has been involved in writing the bonds for Stephens in the past, is reading this, I bet he's getting a good chuckle
RIP OTR, REV

Oklahawg

I am struggling with the logic behind some of the acrimony.

If I am trying to get a construction loan (that becomes a mortgage loan once I take occupancy) for a house I wish to build then the bank is going to investigate my capacity to pay it off. The UA's financial records are rather public. Because donations to the RF can impact taxes those records are pretty meticulous also, right?

I am struggling to figure out how the financial side of this got off the ground without some assurances in place to prevent was is being proposed as a problem.
I am a Hog fan. I was long before my name was etched, twice, on the sidewalks on the Hill. I will be long after Sam Pittman and Eric Mussleman are coaches, and Hunter Yuracheck is AD. I am a Hog fan when we win, when we lose and when we don't play. I love hearing the UA band play the National Anthem on game day, but I sing along to the Alma Mater. I am a Hog fan.<br /><br />A liberal education is at the heart of a civil society, and at the heart of a liberal education is the act of teaching. - Bart Giamatti <br /><br />"It is a puzzling thing. The truth knocks on the door and you say, 'Go away, I'm looking for the truth,' and so it goes away. Puzzling." ― Robert M. Pirsig<br /><br />Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good, too.  – Yogi Berra

 

ricepig

Quote from: Oklahawg on November 16, 2017, 04:52:38 pm
I am struggling with the logic behind some of the acrimony.

If I am trying to get a construction loan (that becomes a mortgage loan once I take occupancy) for a house I wish to build then the bank is going to investigate my capacity to pay it off. The UA's financial records are rather public. Because donations to the RF can impact taxes those records are pretty meticulous also, right?

I am struggling to figure out how the financial side of this got off the ground without some assurances in place to prevent was is being proposed as a problem.

Because it isn't a problem.

Grizzlyfan

Quote from: MartinGit on November 16, 2017, 04:48:12 pm
I'd have to go back and look and I may have the exact numbers wrong but the bond issue is only for $120M+ with the balance of the $160M projected cost to be come up with by the university.  I can't imagine that there would be $40M in interest on the $120M over a two year period - the rate would be too high (basically 15%/year or so)
Not $40million for the construction period.  $40million for the life of issue.  20 years as currently projected.

Martygit

Quote from: Oklahawg on November 16, 2017, 04:52:38 pm
I am struggling with the logic behind some of the acrimony.

If I am trying to get a construction loan (that becomes a mortgage loan once I take occupancy) for a house I wish to build then the bank is going to investigate my capacity to pay it off. The UA's financial records are rather public. Because donations to the RF can impact taxes those records are pretty meticulous also, right?

I am struggling to figure out how the financial side of this got off the ground without some assurances in place to prevent was is being proposed as a problem.

That's why Mike Irwin's statement is so totally off base
RIP OTR, REV

Martygit

Quote from: Grizzlyfan on November 16, 2017, 04:54:01 pm
Not $40million for the construction period.  $40million for the life of issue.  20 years as currently projected.

Ah, got it - of course!
RIP OTR, REV

ricepig

Quote from: MartinGit on November 16, 2017, 04:50:48 pm
If Shep Russell, who is a bond lawyer with Friday, Eldredge & Clark and who has been involved in writing the bonds for Stephens in the past, is reading this, I bet he's getting a good chuckle

If Shemp Howard of the Three Stogies is reading, he's getting a good chuckle out of this!

jvanhorn

Quote from: The Hawg Marshal on November 16, 2017, 03:51:43 pm
He really asked this question to a man named Booger?

I think that was a typo.  It was Gomer's cousin Goober he was talking too.

factchecker

Quote from: Oklahawg on November 16, 2017, 04:52:38 pm
I am struggling with the logic behind some of the acrimony.

That's because the logic is continuously altered.  The goalposts are always moving.

"Why are we expanding the stadium..... it never sells out!"

The expansion is for the seats that are high in demand.  If we were adding to the 500s I'd agree but we aren't.

"Why are we spending so much money on so few seats?"

Only $46m of the cost is attributed to cost of the seating. The rest of the cost is dedicated to improving the entire stadium - including adding elevators, improving concessions, and giving our players a suitable game day locker room.

AND of course my all time favorite:

"WHAT ABOUT THE STUDENTS?!?!???!? :'("

We are the ONLY instate program that doesn't steal money from our students.  $0 dollars are collected from mandatory student fees.  ZERO.
The athletic department gives money to the university.
Money donated to the athletic department and stadium expansion is not taking away from academics or university. In fact, the stadium expansion could possibly make more money for the university by wowing prospective students and donors.

However, if people are so worried about The University of Arkansas then they can donate here:

https://onlinegiving.uark.edu

It's not the logic behind the acrimony but rather the motivation.
WORK FOR IT
PLAN ON IT
EARN IT
OMAHOGS

Tony Perkis

Somebody get this this man off the air. Dear God. Listening to him now and he's calling fans out left and right for "not knowing as much as him"

The Hawg Marshal

Quote from: Tony Perkis on November 16, 2017, 05:16:08 pm
Somebody get this this man off the air. Dear God. Listening to him now and he's calling fans out left and right for "not knowing as much as him"
I never listen to him, so it doesn't bother me.

factchecker

Quote from: Tony Perkis on November 16, 2017, 05:16:08 pm
Somebody get this this man off the air. Dear God. Listening to him now and he's calling fans out left and right for "not knowing as much as him"

Our fans thought that it was Long's decision to switch to Pepsi.

They don't know very much.
WORK FOR IT
PLAN ON IT
EARN IT
OMAHOGS

John Snow

Trey Biddy on 103.7 the buzz just said that bond issue story as false and a made up conspiracy theory.

 

The Hawg Marshal

Quote from: John Snow on November 16, 2017, 05:21:30 pm
Trey Biddy on 103.7 the buzz just said that bond issue story as false and a made up conspiracy theory.
Well now.

GuvHog

Quote from: ricepig on November 16, 2017, 04:53:46 pm
Because it isn't a problem.

Let's say a Contractor bids on a project and his bid is calculated using 1 large crew working during the daytime hours. He gets the bid but well after construction has started, he realizes in order to finish the project on time, he has to hire 2 more crews so work can be done around the clock. What do you think that will do to the cost of building the project??
Bleeding Razorback Red Since Birth!!!

ricepig

Quote from: GuvHog on November 16, 2017, 05:25:13 pm
Let's say a Contractor bids on a project and his bid is calculated using 1 large crew working during the daytime hours. He gets the bid but well after construction has started, he realizes in order to finish the project on time, he has to hire 2 more crews so work can be done around the clock. What do you think that will do to the cost of building the project??

Eat into his profit because he has a GMP with the owner.

AlmaHog2011

Quote from: RyanMallettsEgo on November 16, 2017, 03:52:43 pm
Get that outta here. It doesn't fit the pitchfork narrative!

So you think Arkansas fans don't care about the truth? I  was glad to read most are sold but I mostly glad that the Long is gone and I hope guys like you go with him to his next bigtime job. Real question none of you want to answer is why didn't Nebraska jump to hire the guy who cleaned up dirty ole Arkansas?

Davidr295

He is a Jeff Long butt kisser and Beilema gives him access no previous coach gave. Now he might have to actually work for a living instead of spouting off Long and Beilema regime talking points.

huntindoc

He's supposed to be on the Finebaum show in a few minutes.  We'll see if he's through with his temper tantrum

hoghearted

maybe it isn't that he's having a tantrum. maybe his foul mood is because his hemorrhoids are bothering him.
It really is this simple. Unchecked government power leads to corruption, and lack of accountability for it is drastically eroding confidence in our institutions.    aristotle

Davidr295

I dont get all the crying over it. Dont most Athletic Directors that have had two straight failed football hires and the football programs being on fire get the sack along with the head coach? The writting was kinda on the wall with this being the last season for Beliema.

factchecker

Quote from: Davidr295 on November 16, 2017, 05:42:11 pm
I dont get all the crying over it. Dont most Athletic Directors that have had two straight failed football hires and the football programs being on fire get the sack along with the head coach? The writting was kinda on the wall with this being the last season for Beliema.

I don't see much crying in this thread.

There is a ton of people stating facts and refuting BS.

The Razorbacks are bigger than a coach or an athletic director.
WORK FOR IT
PLAN ON IT
EARN IT
OMAHOGS

RebHog

Quote from: GuvHog on November 16, 2017, 05:25:13 pm
Let's say a Contractor bids on a project and his bid is calculated using 1 large crew working during the daytime hours. He gets the bid but well after construction has started, he realizes in order to finish the project on time, he has to hire 2 more crews so work can be done around the clock. What do you think that will do to the cost of building the project??

Absolutely nothing lol that is on the contractor. He can choose to eat into his own profits like ricepig said or risk liquidated damages for not making the agreed upon deadline. Will more than likely try to claim rain days when someone spits and pray to hear the coveted words "change order". It doesn't appear you have any dealings with contractors on large scale projects I would sit this conversation out.....

Ironhawg

Guys if I stated anything at the start of this thread that was incorrect and added to the confusion on this issue I sincerely apologize.  When Irwin was on I was busy on a project and was trying to do that and listen to Irwin too.  Add in the fact that I know doodle squat about bonds and you have confusion on my part.

 

GuvHog

Quote from: RebHog on November 16, 2017, 06:09:56 pm
Absolutely nothing lol that is on the contractor. He can choose to eat into his own profits like ricepig said or risk liquidated damages for not making the agreed upon deadline. Will more than likely try to claim rain days when someone spits and pray to hear the coveted words "change order". It doesn't appear you have any dealings with contractors on large scale projects I would sit this conversation out.....

Under normal circumstances that is true but if something unforeseen happens to slow down the construction (bad weather, for example), that would be out of the Contractors control. I'm not in the conversation to prove anyone wrong, I just want to learn from people who know.
Bleeding Razorback Red Since Birth!!!

Bubba's Bruisers

Quote from: GuvHog on November 16, 2017, 06:25:38 pm
Under normal circumstances that is true but if something unforeseen happens to slow down the construction (bad weather, for example), that would be out of the Contractors control. I'm not in the conversation to prove anyone wrong, I just want to learn from people who know.

That would be out of his control, and depending on the contract terms, he might be granted additional contract time so as to avoid or minimize LD's, but he wouldn't be granted additional $$'s.  He'd only be eligible for additional $$'s if the project scope changed.  Typically.
I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heal.

Genesis 3:15

Davidr295

Quote from: factchecker on November 16, 2017, 05:45:30 pm
I don't see much crying in this thread.

There is a ton of people stating facts and refuting BS.

The Razorbacks are bigger than a coach or an athletic director.

Ment  more towards bo and his hissy fit

RebHog

Quote from: GuvHog on November 16, 2017, 06:25:38 pm
Under normal circumstances that is true but if something unforeseen happens to slow down the construction (bad weather, for example), that would be out of the Contractors control. I'm not in the conversation to prove anyone wrong, I just want to learn from people who know.

That is what my joke was about someone spitting they are going to claim a rain day.This happens all the time.....rain days/inclement weather if approved does extend the deadline. In my experience if the contractor has been good and easy to deal with most of the time the days are approved with no fuss. The difficult ones, however, that try to nickel and dime and cry for a change order on a weekly basis will look at weather data for requested rain day and get feedback from onsite inspector before approval. 

twistitup

November 16, 2017, 07:28:39 pm #128 Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 12:23:49 pm by twistitup
Bo lost a business partner and his drinking buddy is on verrryy thin ice.

Not a good week for the lil jockey
How you gonna win when you ain't right within?

Here I am again mixing misery and gin....

hamARchy in the USA

Quote from: Tony Perkis on November 16, 2017, 05:16:08 pm
Somebody get this this man off the air. Dear God. Listening to him now and he's calling fans out left and right for "not knowing as much as him"

It's rare when I listen to his show and when I do that's typically what I hear of him and his flunkies -- seizing on a meaningless caller mistake and painting the entire fan base as ignorant while unwittingly revealing their own ignorance in the process.

(notOM)Rebel123

Quote from: MartinGit on November 16, 2017, 04:50:48 pm
If Shep Russell, who is a bond lawyer with Friday, Eldredge & Clark and who has been involved in writing the bonds for Stephens in the past, is reading this, I bet he's getting a good chuckle

Ha! So true. I've had the privilege of working with Shep on several bond issues....Shep is the Man! He's getting a big kick out of all the bond experts on Hogville.
"Knowledge is Good"....Emil Faber

Tony Perkis

Quote from: hamARchy in the USA on November 16, 2017, 08:07:26 pm
It's rare when I listen to his show and when I do that's typically what I hear of him and his flunkies -- seizing on a meaningless caller mistake and painting the entire fan base as ignorant while unwittingly revealing their own ignorance in the process.
Yep. Hit it on the head. May have a slight case of LMS.

Martygit

Where is Mike Irwin? Why isn't he weighing in on this discussion?
RIP OTR, REV

(notOM)Rebel123

Quote from: MartinGit on November 16, 2017, 08:38:44 pm
Where is Mike Irwin? Why isn't he weighing in on this discussion?

Well, for starters, he was totally wrong on the bond issue covenants today on the radio...
"Knowledge is Good"....Emil Faber

Martygit

Quote from: (notOM)Rebel123 on November 16, 2017, 08:41:26 pm
Well, for starters, he was totally wrong on the bond issue covenants today on the radio...

Well, yeah - but I thought he might at least come on here and either defend his statements by saying that's what someone told him or do a mea culpa - guess not
RIP OTR, REV

(notOM)Rebel123

Bo knows more than the Board of Trustees, just ask him. Ha! He sounds like a whiny kid who didn't get his cookies. He's kissed so much CBB & JL butt over the last few years he's panicking because his boys are out. Of course, he'll talk down to any caller who questions him. Sad....
"Knowledge is Good"....Emil Faber

bulldog04

Quote from: (notOM)Rebel123 on November 16, 2017, 09:00:57 pm
Bo knows more than the Board of Trustees, just ask him. Ha! He sounds like a whiny kid who didn't get his cookies. He's kissed so much CBB & JL butt over the last few years he's panicking because his boys are out. Of course, he'll talk down to any caller who questions him. Sad....
He was the same way with Nutt

DeltaBoy

Bo might not to have that inside track with the new Coach !
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Hoggy Hogalot

Quote from: buldozer on November 16, 2017, 04:41:04 pm
^^^This^^^ If I recall correctly, Bo is from FL
and doesn't care about the razorbacks. We need a guy from Arkansas doing our statewide radio show. Next thing he'll be calling us terrorist. Oh wait....Chuck Barrett already did that.

Paragould Bulldog

Beau should go back to hitting on college girls back in the day at Club West and leave the reporting to others.

SooieGeneris

Quote from: hawgon on November 16, 2017, 03:43:26 pm
So, Irwin just told that one of the reasons that Long was fired was that the BOT is very suspicious that he has not yet and may not be able to sell 80% of the suites and boxes in the NEZ before completion and that if they don't, then the university is on the hook for payment of the bonds immediately.

So, Bo then immediately launches into his summation that Long was fired because of the preference for an Arkansas flavor to the athletic department.

What?!  I don't know the ends and outs of the NEZ project but if what Irwin said is true about the suspicions of the BOT then that is a pretty fricking HUGE deal.  That is a program, even university crippling big fricking deal.  It would at the very least make Arkansas a national laughing stock and poster child for excess.  It is also staggeringly reckless.

People can say what they want about Irwin, but he is WAY more reliable than Little Bo Peep or Wee Wally..
KJ Jefferson, one of only 2 QBs in UA history to go 2-0 in Bowl Games..

Mac attack: McAdoo & McGlothern co-winners of the Thorpe Award 2023?

(notOM)Rebel123

Quote from: SooieGeneris on November 16, 2017, 10:01:59 pm
People can say what they want about Irwin, but he is WAY more reliable than Little Bo Peep or Wee Wally..

Mike is wrong on the bond issue.
"Knowledge is Good"....Emil Faber

PygmalionEffect2

QuoteThe Pledged revenues do not include A. tuition or fee revenues collected by U of A

QuoteThe Board has further covenanted that it will, to the extent necessary to maintain Pledged Revenues at the 115% coverage described in the preceding sentence, impose a Student Athletic Fee on students


So I guess this is saying they wouldn't allow the expansion of the stadium to negatively impact tuition prices for students which would place yet another cost impediment towards the opportunity for higher education of Arkansas' youth.









We'll just call it a Student Athletic Fee.




Long was a crafty ole devil wasn't he?

Glad he's gone.
President Donald Trump, on "60 Minutes," Nov. 13, 2016
"Facebook and Twitter were the reason we won this thing."

Hannity - This Nunes memo is going to make Watergate look like someone stole a candy bar.

ricepig

Quote from: PygmalionEffect2 on November 17, 2017, 07:37:32 am

So I guess this is saying they wouldn't allow the expansion of the stadium to negatively impact tuition prices for students which would place yet another cost impediment towards the opportunity for higher education of Arkansas' youth.









We'll just call it a Student Athletic Fee.




Long was a crafty ole devil wasn't he?

Glad he's gone.

That actually is in every bond issued by the University, it has to be.

ricepig

One last note, the GMP on the project came in at $132m, I was always told that they had a $20m fudge factor built into the $160m estimated cost for overruns and changes. I don't know if that included putting up the big screen in the South end of not.

Cinco de Hogo

I'm not going to read this whole thread and I'm not alway in Irwin's corner but it seems this situation has been turned on it's head by the usual Long supporters.  My advice, don't take anything they say as 100% accurate because what they listen to is spin coming from the former AD's office.  Right now we are in a new era and it is entirely possible that some of that spin as presented to the BOT wasn't accurate or misleading. 

Let me let you in on a clue, all sales are not made in NWA and Jeff Long was depending on things he couldn't control while at the same time trying to center control in NWA.  In the end the product on the field allowed an opportunity for some strong arm tactics that centered around the expansion. 

See, all we had to do was win and You know what Jeff thought of that.  You can argue the semantics but records don't lie.

Some of you need to give your blind faith a rest and just let's Long ride off into the sunset.  The BOT actually HAS the correct information while yours is likely some form of spin.  However, all is good we will get a new AD and Coach, the money will come back and it will be like the situation never existed in the first place.  Then you can tell all of us you were correct after all.

But for now....


hoghiker

Quote from: Grizzlyfan on November 16, 2017, 03:54:31 pm
Why does it have to be that he is "angry"?  Why can't he be confused?  like many of us.
This. I listen to the Bo Show several days a week. Bo is not alone in thinking that firing the AD and the coach in the same short span puts UA in a tight spot. No Ad, no coach (I know, I know, but its going to happen) and the people lined up to hire coaches this year is like the lunch line at your local elementary school. Not a optimum situation.

Cinco de Hogo

Quote from: hoghiker on November 17, 2017, 08:25:50 am
This. I listen to the Bo Show several days a week. Bo is not alone in thinking that firing the AD and the coach in the same short span puts UA in a tight spot. No Ad, no coach (I know, I know, but its going to happen) and the people lined up to hire coaches this year is like the lunch line at your local elementary school. Not a optimum situation.

We are at worst the 3rd best job, what exactly is the problem that would keep you hanging on to a losing staff?

hoghiker

Quote from: Cinco de Hogo on November 17, 2017, 08:29:43 am
We are at worst the 3rd best job, what exactly is the problem that would keep you hanging on to a losing staff?
I think it is time for BB to go. I doubt Bo thinks that much differently than the rest of us. I think most people in the media like BB because he's quotable, easy to access and a pretty likable dude. The point I think he's making, along with many other fans, state and national media people is that having this kind of chaos in your athletic department is not a prescription (best practice if you will) when your up against a pretty tight timeline to hire a coach. We'll see. I hope it all works out for Hogdom; however, I don't think its irrational to think the situation could be better  for a coaching search. H Making a single great hire is hard enough. Hitting it  into the bleachers on both coach and AD appears to be a tough chore.

Razorbackers

Quote from: John Snow on November 16, 2017, 05:21:30 pm
Trey Biddy on 103.7 the buzz just said that bond issue story as false and a made up conspiracy theory.

There are an insane number of theories going around about Long that have no basis in reality.

Insurance fraud, embezzlement, the bond issue.

The fact is, these folks made a rash decision to out him. Look at how much money he's going to get! Why would they authorize his contract only 2 years ago if they were somewhat sour on him? Why would they authorize the stadium expansion if they hated it so much? On and on it goes.

These guys have more money than sense. They were mad that Long didn't let them into his inner circle and that he didn't get down on his knees and go BD on them for being rich. Instead of flying to little rock every week to take them to dinner he was going to gymnastics and soccer games and being on campus.

They fired him without cause and are going to pay a lot of money to him, so they could throw a hail mary to Gus and put a sycophant into the AD position. I mean, it almost sounds like a coup. Those don't tend to work out well in the long run. How many stories do we have from college athletics about power hungry and rogue boosters and money men? I'm worried about the future of the athletics department.

Maybe the new AD will calm me down. Wanna get rid of Long? Fine. I think it's dumb but fine. Replace Long with a member of the RF? I'm worried.