To those complaining about basketball recruiting.....

[Hogbody]

Pel got three 4* players his last two years for our 13 allowed scholarships.  31% of the total allowed scholarships.

8 were 3* or higher for 61.5%

1 was a 2* for 8%
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Petrino got 15 players 4* or higher his two years for 85 scholarships.  18% of the allowed scholarships. 

43 were 3* or higher out of 85 for 50.5%

10 were 2* for 12%

Catching my drift?

All star ratings according to rivals.com

[donewithdale]

no

[Hogbody]

no

The percentage of quality player is higher in the basketball classes and yet the football class is viewed as the savior of the football program, the class that is going to start winning it all right away, BP is the best recruiter in the galaxy, yet those players havent done anything yet.

Pel recruits a similar class ranking wise and everyone think's that it is death and doom for our program.

[donewithdale]

Take out Pel's mistakes that never made it to campus or were kicked off.

[ua_hogs]

hogbody, WTH; you cant bring math and logic on to hogville, this thread will make it nowhere now.

[donewithdale]

hogbody, WTH; you cant bring math and logic on to hogville, this thread will make it nowhere now.

The math and logic must be completed.  We're not close here.

[HOG FAN 4 LIFE]

Basketball is completely different than football.  If your team is going to be elite like our old teams used to be, we need to get a 5 star recruit every 1 or 2 years.  Auburn and Alabama should not be out recruiting us in basketball.

[Hogbody]

hogbody, WTH; you cant bring math and logic on to hogville, this thread will make it nowhere now.

I know man it sucks.

I also wanted to address the posters who think 1 and done players are the ones that will get us to where we want to be as a program.

Last year, Kansas State had two 1 and done players, Michael Beasley and Bill Walker.  What did they do?  Went 21-12 with a second round loss in the tourney to Wisconsin.  Hmmm...I guess that's just fantastic.

[3kgthog]

Just a mite of difference between the number of players on a basketball team. And 4-star guys don't win championships in basketball. Ask Stan Heath.

[HOG FAN 4 LIFE]

I know man it sucks.

I also wanted to address the posters who think 1 and done players are the ones that will get us to where we want to be as a program.

Last year, Kansas State had two 1 and done players, Michael Beasley and Bill Walker.  What did they do?  Went 21-12 with a second round loss in the tourney to Wisconsin.  Hmmm...I guess that's just fantastic.

We are now 1-7 in conference play.  I would take 21-12 right now.

[Oliver]

The percentage of quality player is higher in the basketball classes and yet the football class is viewed as the savior of the football program, the class that is going to start winning it all right away, BP is the best recruiter in the galaxy, yet those players havent done anything yet.

Pel recruits a similar class ranking wise and everyone think's that it is death and doom for our program.

Address donewithdale's point.

[Hogbody]

Address donewithdale's point.

about the players that didnt make it to campus?   I just edited it.  Both Petrino and Pel had a 3* in their rankings that either didnt make it to campus or has since left.  Didnt really change much.

[Hogbody]

We are now 1-7 in conference play.  I would take 21-12 right now.

just to be in the same boat next year?

[donewithdale]

about the players that didnt make it to campus?   I just edited it.  Both Petrino and Pel had a 3* in their rankings that either didnt make it to campus or has since left.  Didnt really change much.

Didn't change much?  When one player doesn't make it onto Petrino's actual 85 scholarship roster, we have 84 other players to cover that.  When two players don't make Pel's roster when we were already going to be 2 scholarships short of max that leaves 9 scholarship players.  Huge difference.  Catching my drift why people should stop trying to compare BP to Pel?

[HOG FAN 4 LIFE]

just to be in the same boat next year?

If we don't start getting 5 star recruits or at least high end 4 stars, then yes.

[Hogbody]

Didn't change much?  When one player doesn't make it onto Petrino's actual 85 scholarship roster, we have 84 other players to cover that.  When two players don't make Pel's roster when we were already going to be 2 scholarships short of max that leaves 9 scholarship players.  Huge difference.  Catching my drift why people should stop trying to compare BP to Pel?

petrino is going to be losing at least four of those 3* players depending on who makes it to campus.  either that or they grayshirt

[donewithdale]

Pel is theoritically doing the right thing for the longterm future of the program by trying to balance the classes.  Too bad that may be for the benefit of his successor. 

And why do we have to recruit academic risks?  Our basketball program should be better than that.  Recruit kids that can get into a 4 year college.  Hundreds of kids are able to do it and play D1 basketball every year from high schools and jucos.  We can't find enough that can play at an SEC level and max out our 13 scholarship limit?

[donewithdale]

petrino is going to be losing at least four of those 3* players depending on who makes it to campus.  either that or they grayshirt

And how is that comparable to basketball?  Are we in danger of having so many eligible players that 4 will have to grayshirt?

[Hogbody]

And how is that comparable to basketball?  Are we in danger of having so many eligible players that 4 will have to grayshirt?

Just saying that the number above reflect ALL of the signings for this class, not all of which will be on campus this year.

[HogCzar1]

The issue here is that the major difference is that Nolan early in his tenure was able to get Ron Huery out of Memphis before we had developed a winning team. That started the Memphis connection at a time when Memphis St. was struggling.
  Nolan was able to land McDonald's All American type talent such as Todd Day, Lee Mayberry, and Corliss. In addition, Nolan's number 7-12 players could all play and contribute without the team missing a beat. Arlyn Bowers? Darrell Hawkins? Roger Crawford? Dwight Stewart? Divor Rimac?
  I personally want Pelphrey to succeed badly. I just think that unless he is able to broaden his recruiting base beyond what it seems to be now, it will be improbable that he can get enough talent to win at a level we all expect.
  In addition, an important question here that I think is fair to ask. Does John Pelphrey have enough coaching contacts to reel in key recruits? Especially nationally? Any that would bypass Rick Pitino or Billy Donovan? This may be the biggest problem he has in terms of his inexperience as a head coach.

[donewithdale]

Just saying that the number above reflect ALL of the signings for this class, not all of which will be on campus this year.

Well if we want to continue down this path of attempting to compare, BP has done a much better job of recruiting players that fill need positions while also building depth at all positions with players who will be eligible next fall.  BP needs to upgrade wr last year so he signs Joe Adams.  He needs bigger backs so he gets Davis and Wingo.  He needs to upgrade CB so he gets the nation's #1 class. 

We need big SEC SG's and Pel signs one who may not make it to campus.  We need help badly at PF and Pel signs one a little undersized who may not make it to campus.  We need a defensive enforcer and Pel signs a project. 

[rude1]

Comparing apples to oranges. Two completely  different sports, no way you can draw any kind of statistical comparison with recruiting that can be relevant. The sheer numbers that it take to make a football program, and th number of D1 programs attempting to fill those rosters, makes a four star recruit much more valuable in football than in basketball.

[Hogbody]

Comparing apples to oranges. Two completely  different sports, no way you can draw any kind of statistical comparison with recruiting that can be relevant. The sheer numbers that it take to make a football program, and th number of D1 programs attempting to fill those rosters, makes a four star recruit much more valuable in football than in basketball.

and yet pelphrey has signed a higher percentage of those 4* players

[Hogbody]

Well if we want to continue down this path of attempting to compare, BP has done a much better job of recruiting players that fill need positions while also building depth at all positions with players who will be eligible next fall.  BP needs to upgrade wr last year so he signs Joe Adams.  He needs bigger backs so he gets Davis and Wingo.  He needs to upgrade CB so he gets the nation's #1 class. 

We need big SEC SG's and Pel signs one who may not make it to campus.  We need help badly at PF and Pel signs one a little undersized who may not make it to campus.  We need a defensive enforcer and Pel signs a project. 

Unfortunately we had to replace 8 players after 1 year.  That makes it very difficult.  I feel like we are headed on the right track, and it will certainly help when the classes get balanced again instead of us having 7 seniors every few years.  That's the wrong way to build a program.

Pel is trying to do it the right way, and it will work down the road.  Hopefully he lasts long enough to see it.

[donewithdale]

Pel should not have held scholarships for this class.  He should have signed enough players who WERE ELIGIBLE to where we have 12 scholarships given + the Golfer who would have Pbev's scholarship.  I get trying to balance classes.  But our fans aren't going to wait for 3-4 years down the road.  Let things work themselves out.  McDonald could have the Golfer's scholarship next year and Pel could send one or two that need to go elsewhere packing to make room for 2 more players who would be ELIGIBLE to play next season.  These classes could get balanced without taking academic risks and having to play with 9 dang players and without any size in our backcourt.

[donewithdale]

Unfortunately we had to replace 8 players after 1 year.  That makes it very difficult.  I feel like we are headed on the right track, and it will certainly help when the classes get balanced again instead of us having 7 seniors every few years.  That's the wrong way to build a program.

Pel is trying to do it the right way, and it will work down the road.  Hopefully he lasts long enough to see it.

And he should have signed 8 players who were eligible to play D1 basketball and weren't head cases.  Transfers, failures and 'recommending' kids seek playing time elsewhere takes care of balancing classes.

[Beaverfever]

Dude your argument is all kinds of messed up.  First your argument assumes comparing stars in basketball and football is comparing apples to apples, it isn't.  Secondly, your math is off.  Why do you count all 85 scholarships against petrino when he only recruited about 50-55 guys.  Also you don't account for the two 5 stars that BP has brought in.  Pel has brought in none.  Lastly, you assume that signing alot of star players makes you a good recruiter (read Tomhog's post).

[NWASooner]

Basketball recruiting is worlds different than football.

For one thing, there is a big difference between a 4 star and 5 star player in basketball.  Sanchez was a 4 star, for example.  In football, the difference can be minimal.

Also, in football, you want depth in recruiting.  I'd rather have a class full of 3 and 4 stars than a class with two 5 stars and a gaggle of 2 and 3 stars.  In basketball, one big time player makes all the difference.

The main difference, though, is that basketball recruiting "stars" are suprisingly accurate.  All the players play against each other for years in AAU play, whereas a blue chip lineman rarely plays against another blue chipper.  If a basketball player is rated 5 star, high 4 star, or McDonald's All American, he's a baller.

All that being said, that seems to be the weak link with Pelphrey.  Johnny Big Time is not on the horizon.

[RZRBack_FAN]

Only a retard compares Football recruiting in the SEC to Basketball Recruiting! Give me a break.

[HogBreath]

Only a retard compares Football recruiting in the SEC to Basketball Recruiting! Give me a break.

Exactly right.  Trying to compare the two is laughable.  Get real.

[Pork Twain]

Comparing basketball and football is foolish.

[Coondog Hog]

Pel is theoritically doing the right thing for the longterm future of the program by trying to balance the classes. 

The thread and this mess should have ended right here.

Too bad that may be for the benefit of his successor. 

If this happens then the ptb at the university are all darned fools