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Better start planning for a big reduction in television money

Started by hawgon, January 02, 2017, 11:02:02 am

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hogsanity

Quote from: sickboy on January 02, 2017, 01:37:33 pm
I do. Once ESPN's contracts with the cable companies expire, that will change. There may be windows in the contract that allow them to start the transition sooner rather than later. I don't know what their specific deals looks like off the top of my head. HBO is starting to do it.

So much of ESPN's revenue though is tied to being carried on cable systems. They get close to 8$ per month per subscriber whether they watch ESPN or not. They charge ad rates based on potential eyeballs. This assertion that they will start their own streaming service and get off cable/sat and somehow make more money is crazy.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

The Great Hambino

Quote from: hogsanity on January 02, 2017, 02:23:20 pm
So much of ESPN's revenue though is tied to being carried on cable systems. They get close to 8$ per month per subscriber whether they watch ESPN or not. They charge ad rates based on potential eyeballs. This assertion that they will start their own streaming service and get off cable/sat and somehow make more money is crazy.

No it isn't. HBO has led the way. Showtime, Stars, etc., premium channels have followed. ESPN already has a streaming only service if you try to use watchespn from overseas without a VPN. They could flip a switch tomorrow and sell streaming only. Everything is already on place. This is why they pimp their streaming and app 30 tomes an hour.

 

Jackrabbit Hog

I've felt for years that the ridiculous and obscene money that the networks pay for big time sports is very analogous to the stock market and the sub-prime mortgage fiasco.  It's like nobody's been paying attention, but someday somebody's going to and it's all gonna come crumbling down. 
Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

ricepig

Quote from: elksnort on January 02, 2017, 02:22:02 pm
Problem I have with cutting the cord is that it is still more reliable than streaming.

I bought stock in some cable companies years ago to hedge my cable bill, they've doubled and one has quadrupled. About the same as the cable bill.

NuttinItUp

Quote from: sickboy on January 02, 2017, 01:59:46 pm
Oh, right. This is the window I spoke of. What are you paying for ESPN on Sling?

$0

I just sign up for the free 7-day trial, watch football games, then cancel. (rinse, repeat every Saturday) If I watched more stuff, I wouldn't mind paying for it though, but everything else I watch (non-sports) I can get on Netflix or Hulu or wherever.

Jackrabbit Hog

Quote from: ricepig on January 02, 2017, 02:27:54 pm
I bought stock in some cable companies years ago to hedge my cable bill, they've doubled and one has quadrupled. About the same as the cable bill.

I'm no genius, but I think I see a pattern there...
Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

NuttinItUp

Quote from: ricepig on January 02, 2017, 02:03:41 pm
You don't pay for Sling, Direct TV, or PS Vue, those are free? We're talking about legal ways, you can pirate cable TV too, so it isn't cutting the cord, it's stealing it from somewhere else, lol.

My son in Chicago uses my cable login, beer is more expensive he said, lol.
No, you said cable:
Quote from: ricepig on January 02, 2017, 11:35:28 am
They probably weren't college football fans to begin with. I think money will still be there, it may come from different media besides cable. I don't think it will be going up, but as long as Fox is wanting to bid, I don't think it will go down appreciably.

Those online streaming services aren't cable.

Technically satellite isn't cable either.

NuttinItUp

Quote from: rhames on January 02, 2017, 02:01:23 pm

Those are still packages. I think espn will have a standalone service soon.

Probably true. I only ever use them to log into ESPN3.com (WatchESPN) though, so basically it is a standalone service for what I use it for.

I guess that isn't all the way true; very occasionally I will watch a game on Fox Sports Net or whatever it is, but most of the games I watch on ESPN. (or regular stations like CBS, but those are available with a regular antenna)

hogsanity

Quote from: The Great Hambino on January 02, 2017, 02:26:46 pm
No it isn't. HBO has led the way. Showtime, Stars, etc., premium channels have followed. ESPN already has a streaming only service if you try to use watchespn from overseas without a VPN. They could flip a switch tomorrow and sell streaming only. Everything is already on place. This is why they pimp their streaming and app 30 tomes an hour.

But HBO has always been a premium service, not reliant on ad revenue, and not paying billions for one specific piece of content. Their business model when buying all the sports content was based on cable subscriber revenues, not having to do it as a premium stand alone streaming service. If ESPN is in 70 million cable/sat homes, they are getting approx $560,000,000 per month in subscriber revenue. To match that as a stand alone at $20 they would have to have just under 30million subscribers to their streaming service. Plus those only interested in colege football might only subscribe from Sept-Jan, which would mean they would need even more subscribers to meet revenue.  Now, over time ESPN may pay lower rights fees to offset some of the costs, but it is still a total switch in revenue production that is the issue.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

NuttinItUp

Quote from: The Great Hambino on January 02, 2017, 02:20:21 pm
Kodi.
Yes. Specifically related to hacked Amazon Firestick.

For those interested, google it. Can't really discuss it here.

WorfHog

Cable and satellite are dead too. Most everyone I know either uses their parents login information to access anything behind a paywall or subscribes to PSVue or SlingTV.

longpig

Don't be scared, be smart.

(notOM)Rebel123

The ratings have dropped since the games were moved to New Year's Eve.
It will be interesting to see if the ratings bounce back next year when the semi-final games are played on New Years Day.
"Knowledge is Good"....Emil Faber

 

hogsanity

Quote from: (notOM)Rebel123 on January 02, 2017, 02:48:11 pm
The ratings have dropped since the games were moved to New Year's Eve.
It will be interesting to see if the ratings bounce back next year when the semi-final games are played on New Years Day.

it is not just the rating for the playoffs though, it is rating for football in general.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

(notOM)Rebel123

Quote from: hogsanity on January 02, 2017, 02:49:29 pm
it is not just the rating for the playoffs though, it is rating for football in general.

I understand that. I was referring to the Article the OP linked, which was addressing the playoff ratings.
"Knowledge is Good"....Emil Faber

hog.goblin

the users are getting tired of the games the network affiliates and services play as well.

right now I can't watch the FL-Iowa game because ABC is being blocked because of a dispute with DirecTV

thankfully I don't want to watch that game, and we can watch any other shows on Hulu.

I don't side on DirecTV, ABC, or the local affiliate on this, it just tells me none of them have their act together.

ricepig

Quote from: (notOM)Rebel123 on January 02, 2017, 02:57:54 pm
I understand that. I was referring to the Article the OP linked, which was addressing the playoff ratings.

See 123, that's your problem, you try to limit yourself to the OP, lol.....

Jackrabbit Hog

Quote from: hog.goblin on January 02, 2017, 02:58:32 pm

right now I can't watch the FL-Iowa game because ABC is being blocked because of a dispute with DirecTV


Count your blessings.  Offensive football is being set back decades.
Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

(notOM)Rebel123

Quote from: ricepig on January 02, 2017, 02:59:49 pm
See 123, that's your problem, you try to limit yourself to the OP, lol.....

I'm a poor multi-tasker.
"Knowledge is Good"....Emil Faber

elksnort

I will say this:
Suddenlink is very reliable with my Internet and cable. And they damn well should for $297.00 per month.

NuttinItUp

Quote from: elksnort on January 02, 2017, 03:05:46 pm
I will say this:
Suddenlink is very reliable with my Internet and cable. And they damn well should for $297.00 per month.


Sow Lancelot

"Nec vitia nostra nec remedium tolerare possumus." Livy
Nihil boni sine labore, sic vis pacem, para bellum.

rhames

Quote from: elksnort on January 02, 2017, 03:05:46 pm
I will say this:
Suddenlink is very reliable with my Internet and cable. And they damn well should for $297.00 per month.



Holy cow.


"I'm too drunk to taste this chicken"

"Can we get some waffles after we get some ass?" - Aunt Tiffany Freeman

Quote from: Hamdsome 1 on September 05, 2023, 06:43:26 pmSTHU. I get in more steps per day, at work, than you could possibly fathom.
The only down time my legs see is when seated in 1st Class.

HiggiePiggy

Quote from: NuttinItUp on January 02, 2017, 11:06:43 am
Too many cord-cutters?

We cut the cord. Able to get other type of tv packages with out having to watch them try and raise the price on us over and over.  We can still get ESPN channels
If a man speaks and no woman is around to hear him, is he still wrong?

 

elksnort

Quote from: rhames on January 02, 2017, 03:40:41 pm


Holy cow.



It includes land line also that we dont use.
Not that it matters, but it's tax deductible.

hawgon

So, you guys who cut the cord, what internet provider do you use?  Do you still use cable for your internet?

HiggiePiggy

Quote from: hawgon on January 02, 2017, 03:43:54 pm
So, you guys who cut the cord, what internet provider do you use?  Do you still use cable for your internet?

As of right now we still use U-verse internet.
If a man speaks and no woman is around to hear him, is he still wrong?

hawgon


hog.goblin

Quote from: elksnort on January 02, 2017, 03:43:15 pm
It includes land line also that we dont use.
Not that it matters, but it's tax deductible.

So you're willing to give away $10 to save $4?

HiggiePiggy

Quote from: hawgon on January 02, 2017, 03:53:34 pm
I can't get that.

You can go with cox also. If there is another type of internet to get that is a lot cheaper then I would go to that.  I think we are paying about 40 for internet.
If a man speaks and no woman is around to hear him, is he still wrong?

alohawg

Quote from: The Great Hambino on January 02, 2017, 12:42:13 pm
You didn't see the Clemson player go for the OSU players junk the other night? The Ocho is here!

I really wish there was a way to unsee things. I had no idea what was coming when that popped up on my social media feed.  ::)
Gayest crap in the history of college athletics outside a wresting circle.
"It's difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it."
-Upton Sinclair

"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."
― J. Krishnamurti

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https://t.me/covidbc

hawgon

Quote from: HiggiePiggy on January 02, 2017, 03:56:24 pm
You can go with cox also. If there is another type of internet to get that is a lot cheaper then I would go to that.  I think we are paying about 40 for internet.

The only decent option we have for internet is Cable One.

ricepig

Quote from: elksnort on January 02, 2017, 03:43:15 pm
It includes land line also that we dont use.
Not that it matters, but it's tax deductible.

I would imagine if you were audited that you use some of that for personal, and not business reasons, lol.

ricepig

Quote from: hog.goblin on January 02, 2017, 03:54:58 pm
So you're willing to give away $10 to save $4?

Yeah, it took me about 10-15 years of farming to figure out all those deductions weren't making/saving me money, haha.

HiggiePiggy

If a man speaks and no woman is around to hear him, is he still wrong?

elksnort

Quote from: hog.goblin on January 02, 2017, 03:54:58 pm
So you're willing to give away $10 to save $4?
Perhaps I have gotten too personal with my fairs. If you would lime to advise me them PM or not.
I when I turn the TV on I want reliability I get that but suddenlink. I hear Bad stories about satellite and Direct TV and all that other stuff you get a little cloud in the sky and the damn thing didn't work. Plus I need reliable internet for my work. Sorry I let you in on my affairs

elksnort

Last thing I will say on this.

I work at home and in the road. My suddenlink bill is for internet, cable and land line. Its all bundled. My accountant says I can.  Frankly, paying this bill is the least if my worries. Not having work is. And I've been there.
Now carry on.........

ricepig

Quote from: elksnort on January 02, 2017, 04:41:43 pm
Perhaps I have gotten too personal with my fairs. If you would lime to advise me them PM or not.
I when I turn the TV on I want reliability I get that but suddenlink. I hear Bad stories about satellite and Direct TV and all that other stuff you get a little cloud in the sky and the damn thing didn't work. Plus I need reliable internet for my work. Sorry I let you in on my affairs

I laugh when Suddenlink runs those ads in Occasions about being chosen #1 internet provider in Jonesboro! Well, unless you are a business, I think Ritter can provide for them too in the city charter, then one doesn't have much of a choice. I hate Suddenlink, and cringe when I open the bill every month, but not many options. I wonder if CW&L could do it? I know they could, but I guess they don't want to.

ricepig

Quote from: elksnort on January 02, 2017, 04:46:38 pm
Last thing I will say on this.

I work at home and in the road. My suddenlink bill is for internet, cable and land line. Its all bundled. My accountant says I can.  Frankly, paying this bill is the least if my worries. Not having work is. And I've been there.
Now carry on.........

You really should get out of the road....

ChicoHog

As another poster said the ratings for 2014 season games were on New Years Days with the Rose Bowl and Sugar Bowl.  Huge difference from New Years Eve.  Also Saturday's games were not very competitive, especially the Clemson game, which makes people leave the channel. As soon as the games are back on New Years Day next year, a Monday, I bet the ratings go back up again. It would be great if they could do that every year the power of the Rose Bowl would not let them.  Playing on a Saturday that is not New Years Eve in 2 years will also help immensely in the ratings. 

NFL ratings are down due to many reasons but I think the biggest is too many games on TV.  Sunday afternoon, Sunday night, Thursday night, Monday night, etc.,  The players hate the Thursday games and I bet the next labor agreement the NFLPA tries to cut back on those games.  Plus so many games don't matter like yesterday when more than half the games meant absolutely nothing and many star players are sitting out.  What keeps the NFL going strong is gambling and Fantasy football. 

hogsanity

Quote from: sevenof400 on January 02, 2017, 04:42:02 pm
Sow,

You sound similar to Wilson in a lot of this - and that's not a bad thing at all.  College sports were different back in the day - and much better in so many ways. Attending a game was something special back then because you knew you would see, hear and feel in person what made a college gameday so special.  Despite ESPN (and other media outlets) attempts to simulate it, nothing beats the experience of actually attending a college football game when the environment surrounding the game was about the experience in the stadium. 

I still recall watching games at various locations throughout the country, and each stadium was memorable in some way.  The thing was you had to be there to experience it.  I still recall my first game at Fayetteville - sitting up high in the stands taking in all the sights and sounds there were.  It was truly a sensual treat that no TV can ever duplicate.  People were different back then too - most were there to root on their team and you didn't have the obnoxious fans so common to the experience today. 

We have lost a lot when it comes to the football experience and, in part, it contributes to the explanation of the decline of interest in the sport. 

until just a few years ago, if you wanted to see a team play you had to go to the stadium most of the time. Many of us still remember the days when there were 2 games on per week on ABC, everything else was regional stuff or your local team might be on tape delay after the 10pm news. Now you can see about 50 different teams every Sat plus games on just about every other night of the week too. 
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

The Great Hambino

Cable or other cheaper, if available, internet and direct TV now are currently the best options that aren't kodi in terms of value.

mizzouman

Sports viewership is down and has been declining over several years.  This has been reported many times. 

But what I find interesting is that with the ticket prices skyrocketing and everyone staying home to watch, how is TV viewership declining?  If anything, it should be going up.

The only answer is that people don't care to watch sports as much since they can get instant scores on the their phone and perhaps watch a replay, if their team wins, the next day, DVR.  In other words, watching a game live isn't a priority.

Jackrabbit Hog

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

Pork Twain

Quote from: sevenof400 on January 02, 2017, 11:50:16 am
I hope this is the end of ESPN.

Everything that was good about ESPN is no longer. 
Kinda like MTV
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

Augustus

This just looks like Breitbart is taking a known issue and using it to fit their agenda/narrative.

The CFB Playoff and ESPN have recognized that have the New Year's Six on New Years Eve has hurt ratings, and I believe are working this year to change the dates to something other than New Years Eve.

Also, as some here have suggested, I don't believe the viewers who are streaming via Roku/Sling/WatchESPN/etc, are counted towards ratings.

It doesn't necessarily have to do with the "librul" ESPN network, as Breitbart suggests.

hawgon

The better answer is that no matter how many of the 100,000 or so who might be there on game day and who are giving up their tickets to stay home and watch on TV, it is just a small percentage of the folks who had been watching overall.

Uberanubis

Quote from: sickboy on January 02, 2017, 11:44:54 am
What's going to happen is that ESPN is going to break away from under the thumb of cable companies and they'll start their own streaming services... cable's going to die in the form we know now it when ESPN and FOX Sports do break away. People will pay to subscribe to ESPN like they do Netflix or HULU and ESPN will end up generating more bottom dollar without the cable companies. It's just a matter of time.



actually i dont believe this. if ESPN did that why would i pay more money for something when i can just listen to the radio and get what i need. cable cutters, are cable cutters for a reason. its all about value
Quote from: East TN HAWG on January 31, 2015, 11:37:05 am
I think it's a common event whether it is in AR or around the world where a group of Hog fans get together.  I've seen it in TN, TX, LA and in Germany.  Being a Razorback is like being in a brotherhood.  When the brotherhood meet, they call the Hogs.

Karma

Ratings were very high for the season. you can't base it on one night's games. Plus, its clear that website has an agenda rather than reporting fairly.

NaturalStateReb

Quote from: hawgon on January 02, 2017, 11:02:02 am
You don't have to agree with the premise of the article as to WHY viewership is down, but it is way down.  And this is just the latest in a long trail of information that points to ESPN not being able to give the crazy money they have in the past for college football.  I don't know what is going to happen or how it will all shake out, but I'm pretty sure that the model will change and we should probably begin to think about planning accordingly.

http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2017/01/02/espn-5-6b-debacle-football-semifinal-ratings-32-2014/

I don't know that TV money is going to go down for the SEC, but it's not going to go up radically, either.  That's why I think SEC expansion may be over.
"It's a trap!"--Houston Nutt and Admiral Ackbar, although Ackbar never called that play or ate that frito pie.