RWIII

[Poker_hog]

Well - even Bo Mattingly said on his show yesterday it sure seems like it could have been more than a stinger. That Raleigh was having tingling and numbness in his arms and hands on Sunday morning.
So when you hear that - of course, it leads to conjecture.

Exactly.  Everything points to this being more serious than a stinger.  I'm not sure why that term keeps getting thrown out there.  Has an actual doctor said it was just a stinger or are people just repeating what the sec announcers were speculating on live tv?

[EastexHawg]

Same with Hockey, NASCAR, Lacrosse, Rugby, Sumo wrestling, Soccer....Heck let's just give it all up and give everyone a "participation trophy"!

It's much safer to play football on a video game.  Much cooler in the A/C and not as far to the Twinkies, either.  There are bugs and dirt and other people who might interrupt your games and playing on the phone, maybe even want to talk to you.  Physical exertion is so old school.  Plus mom runs the house and even if she didn't dad lives in a state of constant fear of everything.

BTW, this in no way has anything to do with Rawleigh.  I am not informed enough about the specifics of his case to have the audacity to offer an opinion about what he should do.  I wish him the best whatever he and his family decide.

[bphi11ips]

Well - even Bo Mattingly said on his show yesterday it sure seems like it could have been more than a stinger. That Raleigh was having tingling and numbness in his arms and hands on Sunday morning.
So when you hear that - of course, it leads to conjecture.

I haven't heard Bo Mattingly's comments since Saturday. I did hear the announcers state during the telecast that the report was stinger. It wasn't expressed as conjecture, but that isn't to suggest the report was wrong or that the injury was  not more serious than originally diagnosed. Only that the comments were not presented as conjecture.

It's perfectly okay to post prayers and well wishes and love and support for Rawleigh and his family. They should know we love him and appreciate his devotion and contribution to the Razorbacks. He has been a great one. I just think making assumptions at this point is premature.

[buldozer]

There is no doubt that RWIII will do great no matter what path he goes down and all Hog fans will support him also!

[Seebs]

Medical hardship him. Make him a student coach. Keep momma happy. Get his brother. Hire him as a GA. Leave UA with a masters. Life is good.

[PorkSoda]

I think he'll  be back.
I love going to football games and watching football as much as anyone.
But I'll use this as another opportunity to wish the game of football would just go away. And I think it gradually will over the next 30-40 years. Society will get less barbaric and finally put an end to it.
The human body was NOT MADE to collide with other bodies like that.
Time for football to cease.

Other sports are fine. Basketball is a graceful game, small chance of traumatic injury. Track and Field, same thing. Baseball slight risk, but not much.

Football and boxing have to go.

um, that's just dumb.  our bodies were made to take a lot of abuse and have the ability to heal.  humans survived hundreds of thousands of years before modern medicine and in much more violent circumstances than american style football.

[Hog10S]

um, that's just dumb.  our bodies were made to take a lot of abuse and have the ability to heal.  humans survived hundreds of thousands of years before modern medicine and in much more violent circumstances than american style football.

I am very pro-football.  However, I just have to comment on the above.  Yes, times were more violent in the past, more so than football, but life expectancy was like 40.  So, I don't think I would point to that as a reason to open the floodgates on things that can severely injure oneself.

[HognitiveDissonance]

I am very pro-football.  However, I just have to comment on the above.  Yes, times were more violent in the past, more so than football, but life expectancy was like 40.  So, I don't think I would point to that as a reason to open the floodgates on things that can severely injure oneself.

You beat me to it. I was just about to reply that life expectancy in those days was 30-40.

I think society outlawed 'sports' such as the gladiators. Football/boxing doesn't compare to that, but it's along those same lines. We'll get there eventually, and 500 years now when people study our culture they'll look back on our game of football as a poor commentary on our society the way we look back at some of the ancient civilizations and their forms of pleasure.

[HognitiveDissonance]

Think about it. In the 1950s, coaches wouldn't even give water to players during practice. They evolved, got better.
In the 1980s/90/00s, concussions became more prevalent. The game evolved, rules are being implemented to limit the violent collisions, such as kickoff returns.
Society evolves. It's very slow, but the game will hopefully become more like a 7-on-7 low contact game than the violent game of today.
I still think fans will attend. It's still State U or their fav NFL team, they're still on grass, it's fresh air, marching bands, tailgating, all the things people love about football.
Just fewer concussions and injuries.

[a0ashle]

um, that's just dumb.  our bodies were made to take a lot of abuse and have the ability to heal.  humans survived hundreds of thousands of years before modern medicine and in much more violent circumstances than american style football.

Not all humans survived.

Seriously though, the survival of the entire species is not what concerns people about the medical issues associated with playing football.

[PorkSoda]

my point was that he said the human body is not designed to receive impact. 

of course it is designed to for impact, among other things.

and of course there is a limit to what it can withstand.

and of course we want to be as safe as reasonably possible.

its just stupid to act like Football is any more dangerous than anything else in life.

or that eventually humans will evolve to the point where competitive sports no longer are needed.

Baseball has more injuries than football.  His whole premise is ignorant.

[PorkSoda]

You beat me to it. I was just about to reply that life expectancy in those days was 30-40.

I think society outlawed 'sports' such as the gladiators. Football/boxing doesn't compare to that, but it's along those same lines. We'll get there eventually, and 500 years now when people study our culture they'll look back on our game of football as a poor commentary on our society the way we look back at some of the ancient civilizations and their forms of pleasure.

I don't buy it.  the difference between football and gladiators is that football players dont go out with the intention of hurting / killing.  its not even the comparable unless you consider badminton a violent sport.

competitive sports have been in existence since the beginning of civilization.  they are a healthy outlet for our aggressive nature.  Doing away with them would only result in more out bursts of less than healthy aggression.

[LZH]

Think about it. In the 1950s, coaches wouldn't even give water to players during practice.

1950's? Man my last year was '84, and even then all we got was a Dixie cup of ice halfway thru practice....including August two-a-days. Sounds crazy but that sure is the way it was.

[Reservoir Hogs]

You beat me to it. I was just about to reply that life expectancy in those days was 30-40.

I think society outlawed 'sports' such as the gladiators. Football/boxing doesn't compare to that, but it's along those same lines. We'll get there eventually, and 500 years now when people study our culture they'll look back on our game of football as a poor commentary on our society the way we look back at some of the ancient civilizations and their forms of pleasure.

life expectancy was 40 because of mass infanticide due to lack of abortion alternatives for sick and crippled babies...

[a0ashle]

its just stupid to act like Football is any more dangerous than anything else in life.

Football is as safe as reading a book or working a desk job. Humans were designed to run full force into eachother, we know this because there head and neck are built exactly like a Ram's head/neck.

[PorkSoda]

Football is as safe as reading a book or working a desk job. Humans were designed to run full force into eachother, we know this because there head and neck are built exactly like a Ram's head/neck.

our body has built in suspension and flexibility.  somehow thousands of athletes play and practice football through out the year and manage not to die.

amazing that could happen considering we aren't built like a goat.

[hogcard1964]

Just be thankful this is an area (RB) the Hogs appear to be very deep in.

[a0ashle]

our body has built in suspension and flexibility.  somehow thousands of athletes play and practice football through out the year and manage not to die.

amazing that could happen considering we aren't built like a goat.

"manage not to die"

Low bar you have there. Thousands survive car wrecks too, are we built for that?

[a0ashle]

I don't really want  to continue to prolong this sidetrack, this thread isn't about the safety of football but rather the safety of it for a player with previous life threatening neck injury. We are talking about a specific human being, not the human species.

[PorkSoda]

"manage not to die"

Low bar you have there. Thousands survive car wrecks too, are we built for that?

to a certain extent our bodies can recover from trauma.  whats your point?

we are pretty far down the rabbit hole at this point, so I'm not even sure what point we are trying to reach any more, other than that, because someone got injured is not a valid reason to do away with sports.

[PorkSoda]

I don't really want  to continue to prolong this sidetrack, this thread isn't about the safety of football but rather the safety of it for a player with previous life threatening neck injury. We are talking about a specific human being, not the human species.

true, I apologize for derailing, and wish RW3 the best.

[LZH]

"manage not to die"

Low bar you have there. Thousands survive car wrecks too, are we built for that?

Cavemen's cars were a lot slower.....

[Ex-Trumpet]

Anyone have an update for us out-of-staters?

[BigE_23]

my point was that he said the human body is not designed to receive impact. 

of course it is designed to for impact, among other things.

and of course there is a limit to what it can withstand.

and of course we want to be as safe as reasonably possible.

its just stupid to act like Football is any more dangerous than anything else in life.

or that eventually humans will evolve to the point where competitive sports no longer are needed.

Baseball has more injuries than football.  His whole premise is ignorant.

Ignorant by definition means "lacking knowledge or awareness." You should check yourself.

The research that's being done regarding the long term effects of playing football at a high level is undeniable. You should acquaint yourself with it before spouting off about gladiators and such.

But as has already been mentioned, this thread is about RW3 and HIS longterm health...to which I think we can all agree to wish him the best and pray for his continued safety.

[PonderinHog]

Anyone have an update for us out-of-staters?

The latest I've heard is that it was a stinger.  You're welcome.

[hawganatic]

You beat me to it. I was just about to reply that life expectancy in those days was 30-40.

I think society outlawed 'sports' such as the gladiators. Football/boxing doesn't compare to that, but it's along those same lines.

You say you don't compare it to that, but then you compare it to that...

With that said, did you really just compare football, a sport where they are covered from head to toe in padding and shots to the head are outlawed, to a culture where slaves were forced to go out and fight for their lives?  Really?

[PorkSoda]

Ignorant by definition means "lacking knowledge or awareness." You should check yourself.

The research that's being done regarding the long term effects of playing football at a high level is undeniable. You should acquaint yourself with it before spouting off about gladiators and such.

But as has already been mentioned, this thread is about RW3 and HIS longterm health...to which I think we can all agree to wish him the best and pray for his continued safety.

research has also been done on the affects of car accidents.  are you going to stop driving your car?

maybe ignorant isnt the right word.  "short sighted" or maybe "narrow perspective" or "completely off base" would have been a better description.

[Gonzo]

Society will get less barbaric and finally put an end to it.

You mean this society that has cheered on the rise of Jerry Springer, COPS, and the UFC? I would hope you're more accurate than not, but I'm not sure I have the same expectations.



Go Hogs!

[Gonzo]

I am very pro-football.  However, I just have to comment on the above.  Yes, times were more violent in the past, more so than football, but life expectancy was like 40.  So, I don't think I would point to that as a reason to open the floodgates on things that can severely injure oneself.

Of course we should. We're protecting too many Darwin Award candidates from themselves



Go Hogs!

[PorkSoda]

You mean this society that has cheered on the rise of Jerry Springer, COPS, and the UFC? I would hope you're more accurate than not, but I'm not sure I have the same expectations.



Go Hogs!

I'm sure he envisions a world where fans cheer on such competitive sports as document filing or cloud gazing.

[HognitiveDissonance]

You say you don't compare it to that, but then you compare it to that...

With that said, did you really just compare football, a sport where they are covered from head to toe in padding and shots to the head are outlawed, to a culture where slaves were forced to go out and fight for their lives?  Really?

I said 'along the same line', because it is. They're both headed down the violent pathway. One(gladiators) are on the extreme end(fighting to the death) of that path, the others(football/boxing) are still on the violent path(repeated collisions/banging/tackling/hitting/injuries), but not as extreme. They are cousins to each other.

Other sports don't have this trauma at all, and are not on the violent pathway. Like, basketball.

Football: bad. Basketball: good.

[HognitiveDissonance]

my point was that he said the human body is not designed to receive impact. 

of course it is designed to for impact, among other things.

and of course there is a limit to what it can withstand.

and of course we want to be as safe as reasonably possible.

its just stupid to act like Football is any more dangerous than anything else in life.

or that eventually humans will evolve to the point where competitive sports no longer are needed.

Baseball has more injuries than football.  His whole premise is ignorant.

You reasonably believe football isn't more dangerous than anything else in life, or compared to other sports(just to stick to sports)? C'mon man. Of course it is.
What are the injuries in baseball? Pulled hammies? Pulled groin? They are not as traumatic and long lasting, potentially. They don't typically have the same level of danger.
Has Major League Baseball settled court cases to pay victims like the NFL has?
To the 'competitive' comment...you don't think basketball games aren't competitive? There are other sporting outlets of aggression and competitive juices.

[HognitiveDissonance]

to a certain extent our bodies can recover from trauma.  whats your point?

we are pretty far down the rabbit hole at this point, so I'm not even sure what point we are trying to reach any more, other than that, because someone got injured is not a valid reason to do away with sports.

It's the type of injuries that are possible, as compared to other sports, and we're not talking about doing away with sports. Just football/boxing. I said nothing about other sports.

[HognitiveDissonance]

research has also been done on the affects of car accidents.  are you going to stop driving your car?

maybe ignorant isnt the right word.  "short sighted" or maybe "narrow perspective" or "completely off base" would have been a better description.

Another poor analogy.
You and I pretty much have to have an automobile to function in today's world. Like, hold a job.
Playing football is a choice.

[PorkSoda]

It's the type of injuries that are possible, as compared to other sports, and we're not talking about doing away with sports. Just football/boxing. I said nothing about other sports.

baseball has more injuries that football.

[PorkSoda]

Another poor analogy.
You and I pretty much have to have an automobile to function in today's world. Like, hold a job.
Playing football is a choice.

for some people, football is their job.

you are on a football message board saying football should be done away with.  what kind of reaction were you expecting?

[HognitiveDissonance]

I'm sure he envisions a world where fans cheer on such competitive sports as document filing or cloud gazing.

I have given basketball as a competitive sport, with very low risk of traumatic injury. An excellent sport.
Please make your argument that basketball is not competitive.

How about another. Track and field. Ever heard of the Olympic Games?
Please make your argument that Track is not competitive.

Or what about golf? Tennis? Other very low risk sports.
Are you saying that hoopsters, runners, golfers, and tennis players aren't competitive?

Actually, what you're saying is they're not aggressive enough i.e. people have an urge to go hit somebody and release aggression in a controlled way. Which gets back to my 'barbaric' point.

Plenty of sports are highly competitive without being dangerous and 'barbaric'.

[PorkSoda]

You reasonably believe football isn't more dangerous than anything else in life, or compared to other sports(just to stick to sports)? C'mon man. Of course it is.
What are the injuries in baseball? Pulled hammies? Pulled groin? They are not as traumatic and long lasting, potentially. They don't typically have the same level of danger.
Has Major League Baseball settled court cases to pay victims like the NFL has?
To the 'competitive' comment...you don't think basketball games aren't competitive? There are other sporting outlets of aggression and competitive juices.

what doing think getting hit in the head with a line drive baseball would feel like?

plus baseball is boring as hell. 

[elviscat]

Football should be abolished, it's to detrimental to ones health. Watch the movie, "Concussion" and tell me it's worth it. It is killing a lot of people and leaving others with permanent brain damage and disabilities, it's not worth it. We can enjoy other sports that don't put the pressure on ones body. I enjoy watching it, but does it really matter? I can find another hobby that will give me just as much pleasure and no one is hurt doing it.

[PorkSoda]

I have given basketball as a competitive sport, with very low risk of traumatic injury. An excellent sport.
Please make your argument that basketball is not competitive.

How about another. Track and field. Ever heard of the Olympic Games?
Please make your argument that Track is not competitive.

Or what about golf? Tennis? Other very low risk sports.
Are you saying that hoopsters, runners, golfers, and tennis players aren't competitive?

Actually, what you're saying is they're not aggressive enough i.e. people have an urge to go hit somebody and release aggression in a controlled way. Which gets back to my 'barbaric' point.

Plenty of sports are highly competitive without being dangerous and 'barbaric'.

and they are boring to watch. 

[HognitiveDissonance]

baseball has more injuries that football.

How many concussions and life-changing injuries in baseball? Few.
Football. Many.

It's because of the repeated collisions. Former NFL players who develop degenerative joint problems and/or brain injuries. That's why the NFL settled out of court.

Everyone knows this, including you. You're just arguing for the sake.

[PorkSoda]

Football should be abolished, it's to detrimental to ones health. Watch the movie, "Concussion" and tell me it's worth it. It is killing a lot of people and leaving others with permanent brain damage and disabilities, it's not worth it. We can enjoy other sports that don't put the pressure on ones body. I enjoy watching it, but does it really matter? I can find another hobby that will give me just as much pleasure and no one is hurt doing it.

nobody is going to pay you millions of dollars to demonstrate your basket weaving skills.

at this point, everyone that plays knows there is a risk of injury.  damn near anything worth doing has risk involved.  some of us don't live in a bubble, living in constant fear of injury.

[1highhog]

my point was that he said the human body is not designed to receive impact. 

of course it is designed to for impact, among other things.

and of course there is a limit to what it can withstand.

and of course we want to be as safe as reasonably possible.

its just stupid to act like Football is any more dangerous than anything else in life.

or that eventually humans will evolve to the point where competitive sports no longer are needed.

Baseball has more injuries than football.  His whole premise is ignorant.

In what way has humans evolved in the last 500 years?  Or the last 1,000 years for that matter?  Humans are not going to "evolve" to a point to where they no longer need or want a specific thing, they're going to be the same as they are today.  How did this topic about RWIII get onto Evolution?

I'd like to point out that my whole feeling on this matter is that I want Raleigh Williams to fully recover from his injuries and make his own decision about what to do about ever setting foot on a football field in order to play the game he loves so much.  There is just to much at stake for him to take this decision lightly.  If it was me, I'd say I'm done, get my education, and try to get my foot in the door, and if I had the love and passion for the game, I'd get into Coaching.  It's one of the highest paying gigs a person can get.

[HognitiveDissonance]

for some people, football is their job.

you are on a football message board saying football should be done away with.  what kind of reaction were you expecting?

Exactly the reaction that was expected.
Some see the point is valid, others think it's crazy.

[HognitiveDissonance]

what doing think getting hit in the head with a line drive baseball would feel like?

plus baseball is boring as hell.

I was going to mention that. Baseball has had a few deaths. I can think of two deaths by hit in the head by a pitch...and there was the guy with the Travelers hit by a line drive and died a few years ago. So there is some risk with baseball, yes.

But comparatively speaking with football, not very close at all.

[PorkSoda]

How many concussions and life-changing injuries in baseball? Few.
Football. Many.

It's because of the repeated collisions. Former NFL players who develop degenerative joint problems and/or brain injuries. That's why the NFL settled out of court.

Everyone knows this, including you. You're just arguing for the sake.

If you didn't know that bashing your head repeatedly could cause brain damage, then I don't know what to tell you. 

its not stopping very many people from still working their entire lives to get a chance to play football professionally.  safety equipment is getting better all the time.  many players will likely retire early to preserve their bodies for later in life.

I'm not sure where you get off telling other people what they should be allowed to do with their lives.

[Dwight_K_Shrute]

Medical hardship him. Make him a student coach. Keep momma happy. Get his brother. Hire him as a GA. Leave UA with a masters. Life is good.

This.  Football is tough.  Some people play a lifetime and never get hurt.  Others suffer debilitating injuries not just from a one time event but often from years of constant pounding. We are now just able to understand real consequences of the repetitive beating these guys take.

The fact that RWIII came back from the injury that he had and put up the numbers he did puts him in the favorite Hog HOF for me.  He has nothing left to prove in terms of heart, toughness, spirit, character, leadership etc.  But unfortunately it is those qualities that make it difficult for people to walk away from the game so I can thoroughly understand him not wanting to.  It needs to be made easier for players to transition and even encouraged, hell celebrated for making an extremely difficult decision.

Great kid and family that we are lucky to have as part of the Razorback Nation, and should have our full support regardless of which path he chooses.   

[PorkSoda]

I was going to mention that. Baseball has had a few deaths. I can think of two deaths by hit in the head by a pitch...and there was the guy with the Travelers hit by a line drive and died a few years ago. So there is some risk with baseball, yes.

But comparatively speaking with football, not very close at all.

sure, but the risk of injury in football is not enough to deter people from wanting to play it.  when I was a kid I thought wearing pads was for [CENSORED].  we tackled to the ground WWF style.  heck, we played basketball WWF style too.

[HognitiveDissonance]

nobody is going to pay you millions of dollars to demonstrate your basket weaving skills.

at this point, everyone that plays knows there is a risk of injury.  damn near anything worth doing has risk involved.  some of us don't live in a bubble, living in constant fear of injury.

Or you can be Lebron James, making $30 mil a year and $100mil in endorsements, playing a sport with a 0.00001 % chance of having a degenerative injury that would affect his later years.

This is silly. Yes, everything you do involves some risk, we all know that. Even not getting out of bed involves risk...the risk of low activity causing heart disease. We all know you assume some risk with everything. This discussion is about the percentage of that risk, which is much higher playing a game like football. Stop making straw man arguments.

[PorkSoda]

"The fatality rate for skydiving is around 1 death per 100,000 jumps and the average is skewed by experienced jumpers misjudging high-performance landings (swooping). Ignoring these competency-based breakdowns for a moment, performing 17 skydives in a year poses around the same average risk of fatality as driving a car 10,000 miles in a year. For BASE jumping it is closer to a roughly estimated 1 death per 500-1000 jumps so is, roughly, more than a hundred times more fatally prone to risk than skydiving."

going to outlaw sky diving? outlaw base jumping?  or are we going to realize that we live in a free country were we allow people to assume the amount of risk they are comfortable with.