Is this the year that we beat Alabama?

[Letsroll1200]

The streak will not end. NO!!!

[bennyl08]

Actually, the 2010 team was arguably more talented than the 09 NC. Julio and Ingram along with Trent Richardson, Marcell Dareus, Eddie Lacy, Maze, were coming back. They suffered a lot of injuries including Ingram's minor knee surgery. G-Mac couldn't get it done in the air and the team never played up to its potential.

I'm not making a case for being undefeated every year, but Bama hasn't lost more than 1 regular season game since 2010. So what I'm saying is every dog has its day, they seldom have 2 in the same season against the Tide. It's gonna be mighty hard for any SEC west team to get to Atlanta with more than 1 conference loss, even if they beat Bama. Ask the rebels?

It may have had more individual talent, but the team itself was unquestionably much worse.

Your statements kind of are making the argument for being undefeated every year. The arguments presented aren't that we will beat Bama this year. The arguments are that the probability of Bama being susceptible to defeat this year are higher than in recent years by MHF and then additions from me that likely strengths and weaknesses of the Bama team next year align well with our team's own likely strengths and weaknesses.

Your response has been that it is laughable for Bama to have weaknesses and provided arguments that you will simply reload and completely dismissed any notion that the team will for the forseeable future ever do anything but get even better despite recent history to the contrary.

[code red]

The streak will not end. NO!!!

I would put a lot of money on this.  Esp in Ttown.

[TUSKtimes]

It may have had more individual talent, but the team itself was unquestionably much worse.

Your statements kind of are making the argument for being undefeated every year. The arguments presented aren't that we will beat Bama this year. The arguments are that the probability of Bama being susceptible to defeat this year are higher than in recent years by MHF and then additions from me that likely strengths and weaknesses of the Bama team next year align well with our team's own likely strengths and weaknesses.

Your response has been that it is laughable for Bama to have weaknesses and provided arguments that you will simply reload and completely dismissed any notion that the team will for the forseeable future ever do anything but get even better despite recent history to the contrary.

Since Alabama has only had one undefeated season since Saban has been here, yet won 4 national titles, the idea I'm making the argument for perfection every year is far more laughable. With one loss in the SEC, all things are possible as far as the playoffs are concerned.

In fact, I can also say, the CCG often settles nothing as far as who gets the playoff invite. Ohio State was chosen with one loss and they had no invite to their championship game. The 2 that were invited were playing for the rose bowl. If Alabama had lost to Florida, the consensus was that they are in the playoffs even with a loss to the gators. So the B1G and SECCG were tits on a bull. In truth, the PAC 12 and ACCCG could only hurt Washington and Clemson in the playoffs, in that neither were playing the second-best team in their conference in Colorado and VaTech and who were not going to the playoffs regardless. Had Clemson and Washington not had to play their CCG, they would still have been invited. The fact is the playoff committee had the right 4 teams after their 12th regular season game. So just getting to Atlanta or any other conference game may not be all that important for playoff consideration in the long run.

On your last point about matching up with our style, I have no idea how you figure that Arkansas didn't struggle mightily with our read option scheme last season. Our QB and running backs often looked like they were out to practice early in Fayetteville. I would think the Razorbacks change to the 3-4 is a lot about trying to get the defense in a better position against this type of run scheme.

[bennyl08]

Since Alabama has only had one undefeated season since Saban has been here, yet won 4 national titles, the idea I'm making the argument for perfection every year is far more laughable. With one loss in the SEC, all things are possible as far as the playoffs are concerned.

Then why so defensive about arguments that you could lose a game this year?

In fact, I can also say, the CCG often settles nothing as far as who gets the playoff invite. Ohio State was chosen with one loss and they had no invite to their championship game. The 2 that were invited were playing for the rose bowl. If Alabama had lost to Florida, the consensus was that they are in the playoffs even with a loss to the gators. So the B1G and SECCG were tits on a bull. In truth, the PAC 12 and ACCCG could only hurt Washington and Clemson in the playoffs, in that neither were playing the second-best team in their conference in Colorado and VaTech and who were not going to the playoffs regardless. Had Clemson and Washington not had to play their CCG, they would still have been invited. The fact is the playoff committee had the right 4 teams after their 12th regular season game. So just getting to Atlanta or any other conference game may not be all that important for playoff consideration in the long run.

Don't see any relevance to the topic at hand here.

On your last point about matching up with our style, I have no idea how you figure that Arkansas didn't struggle mightily with our read option scheme last season. Our QB and running backs often looked like they were out to practice early in Fayetteville. I would think the Razorbacks change to the 3-4 is a lot about trying to get the defense in a better position against this type of run scheme.

Read my post and you'll see what I do figure and what I don't figure and you won't have to try to guess what I'm saying.

[TUSKtimes]

Then why so defensive about arguments that you could lose a game this year?

Don't see any relevance to the topic at hand here.

Read my post and you'll see what I do figure and what I don't figure and you won't have to try to guess what I'm saying.

I'm going to go ahead and assume that's you in the avy.

[bennyl08]

I'm going to go ahead and assume that's you in the avy.

I do love me some milk.

Care to read through my post (you are an alabama fan so I apologize for not putting pictures in there for you) and read what I actually wrote, or make up things that you assume I said and then try to attack me for what you made up?

[TUSKtimes]

I do love me some milk.

Care to read through my post (you are an alabama fan so I apologize for not putting pictures in there for you) and read what I actually wrote, or make up things that you assume I said and then try to attack me for what you made up?

I think I'll leave you with your lunch, it's the one area no one should be able to question your aptitude. 

[bennyl08]

I think I'll leave you with your lunch, it's the one area no one should be able to question your aptitude.

So, you refuse to read detailed arguments, preferring to try to shots at the poster? Also, I'd like to see you try to take my lunch money. Gonna just buy like 5 milks and ignore the food.

[uams1989]

And while Alabama has recruited better than we have and Saban has built one heck of a good football program, it is some Alabama fans who think that their team is absolutely invincible and incapable of being negatively affected by little things like losing the most players ever to the NFL Draft. You guys are just like any other fans of any other school when you talk about players that are going to be replacing players that were lost. It's always a case of, "But you just don't understand what a great athlete this kid is...he is an All World player who squats 1200 lbs.". Well, they all have to learn and gain experience. Our kids are just the same. There is a reason that the games are played. We hope that we will play very well.

No MHF. You are so smart, you can't comprehend. These replacements have been playing almost as many minutes. That's been the key. Usually the upperclassmen are the starters and underclassmen are rotating in for considerable minutes. That's why there is rarely a drop. It has nothing to do with a starter leaving and a non-experienced player stepping in.

Has nothing to do with Bama fans like me or Tusk just blindly saying "well, they're at Bama so they have to be good..."

And, with the last few Bama recruiting classes being ranked as some of the best ever anywhere, it's possible they may not only not see a drop but they could be even better.

[GoHogzzGo]

No MHF. You are so smart, you can't comprehend. These replacements have been playing almost as many minutes. That's been the key. Usually the upperclassmen are the starters and underclassmen are rotating in for considerable minutes. That's why there is rarely a drop. It has nothing to do with a starter leaving and a non-experienced player stepping in.

Has nothing to do with Bama fans like me or Tusk just blindly saying "well, they're at Bama so they have to be good..."

And, with the last few Bama recruiting classes being ranked as some of the best ever anywhere, it's possible they may not only not see a drop but they could be even better.

Unfortunately I agree with this, and it makes me sick. I think Nick Saban's success is really hurting the rest of the division. So dominate for so long. Multiple teams need to start beating him yearly to have an impact.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

No MHF. You are so smart, you can't comprehend. These replacements have been playing almost as many minutes. That's been the key. Usually the upperclassmen are the starters and underclassmen are rotating in for considerable minutes. That's why there is rarely a drop. It has nothing to do with a starter leaving and a non-experienced player stepping in.

Has nothing to do with Bama fans like me or Tusk just blindly saying "well, they're at Bama so they have to be good..."

And, with the last few Bama recruiting classes being ranked as some of the best ever anywhere, it's possible they may not only not see a drop but they could be even better.

Thanks for visiting our site. While you are at it, read the original post, which will explain the premise that you are arguing against.

[bennyl08]

No MHF. You are so smart, you can't comprehend. These replacements have been playing almost as many minutes. That's been the key. Usually the upperclassmen are the starters and underclassmen are rotating in for considerable minutes. That's why there is rarely a drop. It has nothing to do with a starter leaving and a non-experienced player stepping in.

Has nothing to do with Bama fans like me or Tusk just blindly saying "well, they're at Bama so they have to be good..."

And, with the last few Bama recruiting classes being ranked as some of the best ever anywhere, it's possible they may not only not see a drop but they could be even better.

If the backups played anywhere near as many minutes as the starters, then they grossly under produced. If the backups were equally as productive, then they played a heckuva lot fewer minutes than the starters.

However, the backups couldn't have been as impactful as the starters given the relative percentages of tackles, tackles for loss, and sacks. Per tackle, the backups had significantly fewer impact plays than the starters. There are no ifs ands or buts about that.

Now, they will be a year more experienced and should improve from one year to the next. However, the jump in performance would have to be incredibly large to match the production of the players the program is losing and that is far from a guarantee to happen.

[uams1989]

Thanks for visiting our site. While you are at it, read the original post, which will explain the premise that you are arguing against.

Not visiting your site. I've been a member for more than 10 years. I've seen your OP a lot over the last 10 years.

Again, you try to hide your wish in a question. You use a question to try to convince everyone to agree with you or what you hope. That's fine, but, just come out and say you think the Hogs will beat Bama this year. Boards like this are based on opinions. I respect that. I respect that Hog fans want the Hogs to beat Bama. You just are condescending and use all your research and number of words to try to convince everyone you know better or more.

I don't expect any Hog fan to like it but if Saban and Bama's success was as you opine, then Bama would be up and down every other year or two. It's more than having the top recruiting classes years in a row. It's the player development and that comes from game experience.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Not visiting your site. I've been a member for more than 10 years. I've seen your OP a lot over the last 10 years.

Again, you try to hide your wish in a question. You use a question to try to convince everyone to agree with you or what you hope. That's fine, but, just come out and say you think the Hogs will beat Bama this year. Boards like this are based on opinions. I respect that. I respect that Hog fans want the Hogs to beat Bama. You just are condescending and use all your research and number of words to try to convince everyone you know better or more.

I don't expect any Hog fan to like it but if Saban and Bama's success was as you opine, then Bama would be up and down every other year or two. It's more than having the top recruiting classes years in a row. It's the player development and that comes from game experience.

Man, for someone who has been on Hogville for 10 years you are sure are thin skinned. And if you read the OP, which hasn't been up at anytime before since it directly pertains to your team for 2017, you'll notice that I wasn't condescending in the least and I was pretty doggone complimentary of Alabama. I thought it was a very fair evaluation.

And nowhere did I say that we would beat Alabama, but of course we want to beat Alabama. I'm sorry, does that offend you? The question was, is this coming year one of the years that Alabama experiences a slight downturn and therefore, might present an opportunity for us? Now if you are so sensitive that the original post bothers you to this extent that you have to respond like this (which would indicate that you never read it), then I have to wonder why you are even on a Razorback fan site.

[toshortrock]

they got us for home come n game,,does that answer your question

[toshortrock]

never know

[Bebop]

Is this the year that we beat Alabama? A&M?

That's a more fair comparison.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Is this the year that we beat Alabama? A&M?

That's a more fair comparison.

Different thread.

[uams1989]

Man, for someone who has been on Hogville for 10 years you are sure are thin skinned. And if you read the OP, which hasn't been up at anytime before since it directly pertains to your team for 2017, you'll notice that I wasn't condescending in the least and I was pretty doggone complimentary of Alabama. I thought it was a very fair evaluation.

And nowhere did I say that we would beat Alabama, but of course we want to beat Alabama. I'm sorry, does that offend you? The question was, is this coming year one of the years that Alabama experiences a slight downturn and therefore, might present an opportunity for us? Now if you are so sensitive that the original post bothers you to this extent that you have to respond like this (which would indicate that you never read it), then I have to wonder why you are even on a Razorback fan site.

Not thin skinned at all.  You know what I mean about a repeat thread. These types start this time every year.

I never said that you said the Hogs would beat Bama. That's what I'm saying. You don't say that.

My disagreement is the basis for your argument...but wait, it wasn't an argument. You were just asking everyone else what they thought, right?  Right...

I'm a Hog fan too. I'm glad there are plenty of rational and realistic Hog fans here.

[HamSammich]

We win 7 , we beat Bama. CBB gets an extension. Call me Hammadamas

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Not thin skinned at all.  You know what I mean about a repeat thread. These types start this time every year.

I never said that you said the Hogs would beat Bama. That's what I'm saying. You don't say that.

My disagreement is the basis for your argument...but wait, it wasn't an argument. You were just asking everyone else what they thought, right?  Right...

I'm a Hog fan too. I'm glad there are plenty of rational and realistic Hog fans here.

You mean as long as they agree that "rationally and realistically" there isn't any way possible that Arkansas might beat Alabama?

And look, I'm not saying that the odds of beating them are high, time and games have proven that to be true. But every few years Alabama experiences a dip in performance and still having not read the original post, you don't understand what I was suggesting or else you might cease to protest.

[Poker_hog]

You mean as long as they agree that "rationally and realistically" there isn't any way possible that Arkansas might beat Alabama?

And look, I'm not saying that the odds of beating them are high, time and games have proven that to be true. But every few years Alabama experiences a dip in performance and still having not read the original post, you don't understand what I was suggesting or else you might cease to protest.

I don't think anyone said it's impossible.  It's just a long shot, like 20:1.

What odds would you give it?

[HamSammich]

I don't think anyone said it's impossible.  It's just a long shot, like 20:1.

What odds would you give it?

Ive been known to gamble... If I had to cover the bets I would put Bama at -190 atm.



edited.. its a minus

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I don't think anyone said it's impossible.  It's just a long shot, like 20:1.

What odds would you give it?

You are answering a question that was posed to someone who considers themselves to be a "realist" when it comes to competing with Alabama, which means, he doesn't think we will beat them anytime in the future. As for me assigning odds to us beating Alabama, read above, I already addressed that.

[Poker_hog]

Ive been known to gamble... If I had to cover the bets I would put Bama at -190 atm.



edited.. its a minus

If I could get a casino in Vegas to give me those odds I'd bet half a years salary on bama.

Last year at home it was -700.  This year I bet it's closer to -1000.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

If I could get a casino in Vegas to give me those odds I'd bet half a years salary on bama.

Last year at home it was -700.  This year I bet it's closer to -1000.

I would tell anyone willing to bet half their annual salary on a college football game to check out the idiot in the mirror.

[hogcard1964]

We win 7 , we beat Bama. CBB gets an extension. Call me Hammadamas

Rock me Hammadamas!

[jkstock04]

The last time they had a "down" year was 2010. Of course that's the year we had them on the ropes in fville and couldn't finish the game. They went 5-3 in conference that year. For us that would be an exceptional year. '08 and '09 were typical powerhouse years where they went undefeated.

Since 2010 they have never lost more than 1 conference game. Unbelievable feat there. Of course last year was another undefeated season.

I sometimes wonder being a Bama fan if winning ever gets old?

[Poker_hog]

I would tell anyone willing to bet half their annual salary on a college football game to check out the idiot in the mirror.

It's a calculated risk like any other investment.  A true investor would be an idiot to pass on this.  Expected roi would be around 35%.

[arlhog]

We....the fans of the Razorbacks....have not a clue how this defense will look next year.  We are hanging our hats on style to solve the issues from the last 2 season.  Yet there is no evidence of that being the case...we will just have to set back and see.

You may not have a clue how our defense is going to play this year but I've got a really good idea how Saban's defense will play, and that is our biggest problem.  They are awesome.  I love the hogs and always will but you have to be honest with yourself and see what he's doing at bama pretty amazing.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

It's a calculated risk like any other investment.  A true investor would be an idiot to pass on this.  Expected roi would be around 35%.

99.9% of the salaried folks I know earn their living and invest wisely. The exception was a Korean dude I knew many years ago. He dabbled in counterfeit clothing, hand bags, etc...
$150k was his annual cut courtesy of his family. He couldn't buy anything on credit. Cash on the barrel for everything.

It seems the Feds hold some contempt for the Asian Mafia.

Now if you're salaried like most everyone else, it's stupid regardless of ROI.

[jkstock04]

You may not have a clue how our defense is going to play this year but I've got a really good idea how Saban's defense will play, and that is our biggest problem.  They are awesome.  I love the hogs and always will but you have to be honest with yourself and see what he's doing at bama pretty amazing.

Here's how I look at it...when in the past have we actually played with them and how?

2010...they for sure had a few soft spots that year. A true "down"'year for them. A lot of hype going into that game and they walked into a rowdy crowd and got popped in the mouth pretty quick to start the game off. They were lucky in my opinion to get out of Fayetteville with a win that day.

2014...I guess some may say this was a down year for them since they didn't win a natl championship, but I would say they were plenty salty this year. I think we had a combination of things going for us. Rowdy crowd in Fayetteville, and they probably were looking past us as a pushover team. Our defense clicked decently at times that year for sure too.

Another factor in that game nobody really talked about, it was a nasty night weather wise. Cold and dreary. Kind of a heavy mist in the air with a north wind whipping around. They didn't like that worth a damn and wanted no part of it. They were ready to take it to the house. I took notice of them huddled up on the sidelines no emotion and shivering...plain and simple they wanted no part of that game.

Alex Collins fumble through the end zone was enough to save them...and once again they were very lucky to get out of Fayetteville with a win that night. I'll tell you those two games piss me off much more so than any of the beat downs they gave us because we were so close.

Moral of the story it looks to me like we need to catch them coming to Fayetteville, rowdy crowd, maybe them looking ahead of us a little bit, and also maybe get some sort misc. factor like nasty weather for us to play with them and have a chance. We also can't make bad mistakes like turnovers...that's a given.

[factchecker]

Alex Collins fumble through the end zone was enough to save them...and once again they were very lucky to get out of Fayetteville with a win that night. I'll tell you those two games piss me off much more so than any of the beat downs they gave us because we were so close.

Alex fumbled in the game but I think your describing the situation with Kody Walker catching a pass and fumbled through the end zone.

Alex was also suspened for a qtr (maybe longer) for being late to a meeting.

Another problem was that we dropped at least two should have been interceptions.  One of them hit our defensive back right in the chest and he dropped it.

Overall, you made some great points.  Alabama is tough to beat.  We'd probably have fans breaking in our stadium and rushing the field if we found a way to beat them this season.

[jkstock04]

Alex fumbled in the game but I think your describing the situation with Kody Walker catching a pass and fumbled through the end zone.

Alex was also suspened for a qtr (maybe longer) for being late to a meeting.

Another problem was that we dropped at least two should have been interceptions.  One of them hit our defensive back right in the chest and he dropped it.

Overall, you made some great points.  Alabama is tough to beat.  We'd probably have fans breaking in our stadium and rushing the field if we found a way to beat them this season.

Ya you are right that is the play I was thinking of...was Walker. Should have been 7 there for sure.

[bennyl08]

I remember being in the student section for the 2010 game. Strong armed Mallett was throwing the ball away and somehow doesn't get it far enough out of bounds and a Bama players makes a highlight interception.

[HF#1]

Short answer is, no.

[HF#1]

I can see that Davis kid running through our 3 man front and LB's like a hot knife through butter.  It won't be pretty.

[Hardcore Hoggy]

One outcome isn't dependent upon the other. I want to beat A&M as well, but if I had to pick between the two, I'll take Alabama.

Same here, we've been there and done that with TAMU, it's been a minute since we beat Bama though. We have to get that monkey off our back.

I think we lose this year, but we're not completely in the weeds, we COULD beat them.

The last 3 years, at least, I didn't even think there was a chance of it

[Al Boarland]

I can see that Davis kid running through our 3 man front and LB's like a hot knife through butter.  It won't be pretty.

I've seen just as many 3-4's get shredded as I have 4-3's. The 2013 SECC game comes to mind. That was ugly.

[Sweet Feet]

We wont beat Alabama until Saban retires. 0-10

[Mike_e]

We wont beat Alabama until Saban retires. 0-10

Nah, you got that backwards- we beat them and then he retires. 

[The Hawg Marshal]

I go into each year thinking this is the year that we beat them. Yep this is the year!

[wikipedia brown]

i think that itll be tough as ever, but, at this point we are due one ffs. If our new d.c. makes as serious of a turnaround that smith made in his first year; we could be lethal.