THE BUZZ SHILLS Whiff of Racism

[Razorback8]

3)  You don't fire a guy after going 7-1 and 10-3, no matter how bad the previous body of work.  Should have fired him last year while you had the opportunity. 

Now that's a post I will agree with...because we had the chance last year, and now I think we have to stick it out with HDN until another down year.

But more importantly...300th post!

[Ark Blitz]

I was not comparing the records or football vs. basketball, by the way.  I just see mediocrity from both of them.  The media, particularly the radio call in shows at night, pander to nutt and don't give SH the same treatment.  Why?

If having a top 15 football team right now is mediocre then yes I guess we're mediocre.  We've blown out 2 top 15 teams and our only losses are to 3 top 7 teams.  Right now the media isn't going to get on Nutt that hard.  And if we were to fire a guy who just won the SEC West Division we would be a bigger laughing stock than Bama is right now

Houston Nutt's record at Arkansas over nine years is the classic definition of mediocrity.  I'm not surprised you think otherwise since apparently you are perfectly happy with Gomer as your coach.

How about you not assume I'm a Nutt fan because I'm not, but I am smart enough to know you don't fire a guy after a 7-1 record in the SEC's regular season.  I do think he's done a much better job than Heath though

I'm still seeing the same problem throughout this thread.

1)  There shouldn't be a comparison between the two (see earlier replies).
2)  You're not being a Nutt supporter because you say he had a good year.
3)  You don't fire a guy after going 7-1 and 10-3, no matter how bad the previous body of work.  Should have fired him last year while you had the opportunity. 

Noone wants to reply to anything we say Fresh Legs.  I'm done with this thread because 99% of the posters know that this isn't a racist situation.  This thread needs to go in the trash.

How would you know what is and what's not racist??  Let me guess....

[Razorback8]

How would you know what is and what's not racist??  Let me guess....

...French?

[Ark Blitz]

I was not comparing the records or football vs. basketball, by the way.  I just see mediocrity from both of them.  The media, particularly the radio call in shows at night, pander to nutt and don't give SH the same treatment.  Why?

If having a top 15 football team right now is mediocre then yes I guess we're mediocre.  We've blown out 2 top 15 teams and our only losses are to 3 top 7 teams.  Right now the media isn't going to get on Nutt that hard.  And if we were to fire a guy who just won the SEC West Division we would be a bigger laughing stock than Bama is right now

Houston Nutt's record at Arkansas over nine years is the classic definition of mediocrity.  I'm not surprised you think otherwise since apparently you are perfectly happy with Gomer as your coach.

How about you not assume I'm a Nutt fan because I'm not, but I am smart enough to know you don't fire a guy after a 7-1 record in the SEC's regular season.  I do think he's done a much better job than Heath though

I'm still seeing the same problem throughout this thread.

1)  There shouldn't be a comparison between the two (see earlier replies).
2)  You're not being a Nutt supporter because you say he had a good year.
3)  You don't fire a guy after going 7-1 and 10-3, no matter how bad the previous body of work.  Should have fired him last year while you had the opportunity. 

Noone wants to reply to anything we say Fresh Legs.  I'm done with this thread because 99% of the posters know that this isn't a racist situation.  This thread needs to go in the trash.

How would you know what is and what's not racist??  Let me guess....

First of all there hasn't been one thought laid out that could even be substantiated.  The guys argues that racism occurs because heat is being applied to a coach with a lower percentage.   First of all, he should never have compared the two.  Secondly, based on his logic Ford, Kines, and Crow should down at the Law Offices of Gary Green right now filing some papers. 

If you guys want to argue around here, you going to have to bring more than this.

The Media protects Nutt and they don't do you the same for Heath.  That's the bottom line. 

I forgot "Fresh Legs"  knows all about what is racist and what is not!

Take your blind folds off.   

[Pragmatic PiG]

I was not comparing the records or football vs. basketball, by the way.  I just see mediocrity from both of them.  The media, particularly the radio call in shows at night, pander to nutt and don't give SH the same treatment.  Why?

If having a top 15 football team right now is mediocre then yes I guess we're mediocre.  We've blown out 2 top 15 teams and our only losses are to 3 top 7 teams.  Right now the media isn't going to get on Nutt that hard.  And if we were to fire a guy who just won the SEC West Division we would be a bigger laughing stock than Bama is right now

Houston Nutt's record at Arkansas over nine years is the classic definition of mediocrity.  I'm not surprised you think otherwise since apparently you are perfectly happy with Gomer as your coach.

How about you not assume I'm a Nutt fan because I'm not, but I am smart enough to know you don't fire a guy after a 7-1 record in the SEC's regular season.  I do think he's done a much better job than Heath though

I'm still seeing the same problem throughout this thread.

1)  There shouldn't be a comparison between the two (see earlier replies).
2)  You're not being a Nutt supporter because you say he had a good year.
3)  You don't fire a guy after going 7-1 and 10-3, no matter how bad the previous body of work.  Should have fired him last year while you had the opportunity. 

Noone wants to reply to anything we say Fresh Legs.  I'm done with this thread because 99% of the posters know that this isn't a racist situation.  This thread needs to go in the trash.

How would you know what is and what's not racist??  Let me guess....

First of all there hasn't been one thought laid out that could even be substantiated.  The guys argues that racism occurs because heat is being applied to a coach with a lower percentage.   First of all, he should never have compared the two.  Secondly, based on his logic Ford, Kines, and Crow should down at the Law Offices of Gary Green right now filing some papers. 

If you guys want to argue around here, you going to have to bring more than this.

The Media protects Nutt and they don't do you the same for Heath.  That's the bottom line. 

I forgot "Fresh Legs"  knows all about what is racist and what is not!

Take your blind folds off.   

I believe your first line to be true, but ask yourself....are there other factors more significant than race that may be causing this?

I believe yes, I also agree with the previous posters that this thread is dead unless you can bring up a well thought out rationale to substantiate

"take your blind folds off" doesn't count

[artyhog]

I think the Media protects both of them.

Take you hate glasses off.

[artyhog]

If you will notice, poeple don't like loosers, no matter which color they have.

[artyhog]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

[kgr]

Racism is stupid; but, not all stupidity is racist.

It isn't color is it location.  HDN is from the L.R. area, he has kissed the media's ass.  They (especially Hootens) wanted him as coach.  They love him because he doesn't keep the proper separation between media and coach.  They created him and they love him.

Stan is not from Ark. and is not a kiss ass to the L.R. media.  Also, in all honesty, Stan Heath knows more BB than HDN knows FB.  But he is not a good coach.  He yells from the sidelines the correct action for his players to take and they look at him with blank expressions and continue to screw up.  He apparently can't teach what he knows to his team which is his coaching failure, not his lack of knowledge.

[Ark Blitz]

How can anybody sit here at say that Nutt is not protected? 

Nutt and FB are good friends.  The Media knows that they can't ask Nutt the hard questions.  The media doesn't protects both them.  Nutt is way more protected than Stan.

[Pragmatic PiG]

I think the Media protects both of them.

Take you hate glasses off.

Its an observation that has been made time and time again

I don't wear glasses, do you? 

[Ark Blitz]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

In 9 yrs what has Nutt done?

[WilsonHog]

Houston Nutt has three things going for him that Stan Heath does not:

(1) He is from Arkansas....hence, he is "one of us";

(2) He has made an art form out of backslapping the right people and making friends with people in high places (as an aside, I've talked to several well-connected Arkansas State fans who are convinced that the man most responsible for keeping Dickey Nutt employed at ASU is Houston); and

(3) He followed Danny Ford and Jack Crowe.

One final word: it is never so much about what you know as WHO you know. If you and I are both up for the same job, it doesn't matter if you're better or more qualified than me if I know the right person.

Houston has connections everywhere.........stop and ask yourselves how he got the job in the first place. He came to Fayetteville as a token interview and left as a finalist for the job. All that remained was for the right people to exert influence on his behalf. That's the way the world works, especially in a small state like Arkansas.       

[artyhog]

How can anybody sit here at say that Nutt is not protected? 

Nutt and FB are good friends.  The Media knows that they can't ask Nutt the hard questions.  The media doesn't protects both them.  Nutt is way more protected than Stan.

Nutt is the football coach.  Frank is a football guy.  THey are still selling out the FB stadiums.  BWA has not been full for many games lately.  Didn't you know it is about the bottom line?

[Ark Blitz]

How can anybody sit here at say that Nutt is not protected? 

Nutt and FB are good friends.  The Media knows that they can't ask Nutt the hard questions.  The media doesn't protects both them.  Nutt is way more protected than Stan.

Nutt is the football coach.  Frank is a football guy.  THey are still selling out the FB stadiums.  BWA has not been full for many games lately.  Didn't you know it is about the bottom line?

You got to be kidding me.  Nutt and FB are friends.  And FB is taking care of his friend.  So, the football games are getting sold out bc of Nutt?  If Nutt would have had another losing season he still would have gotten the ext.

[jamie72921]

Does Butch Davis deserve no credit for Coker's NC?  What talent a coach is left with by his predecessor is a huge factor.  I don't understand at all how you can say Ford deserves no credit and it should all go to Nutt.  That's like saying Terry Bowden deserves all the credit for his AU teams and Pat Dye deserves none.  And again, this is off topic of the thread.

Something is wrong in our state with our media coverage.

Butch was successful, Pat Dye was successful, Danny Ford was....

I just think it's ludicrous that players on a bad team play great, not because of the new coach, but because the old coach who is no longer made them great...but just couldn't get it out of them.

It's very relevant to this thread as we are discussing one of the reasons HDN gets less criticism than SH.  The PTB agree with my opinion of 1998 and 1999 and that has carried HDN for a long time with them.

Danny Ford won a national championship as a head football coach. Not many do that.

Danny Ford also was the first Razorback coach to win the western division. He was able to bring in the most talented group of Hogs Nutt has yet to coach to date after Crowe and Hatfield had litterally destroyed our talent level.

However Ford didn't get along with JFB and Broyles is no fool. He could see that if he left Ford in place there wouldn't be any getting rid of him for a while and that would have left him with 2 head coaches ( Nolan and Ford) who don't mind as well as Nutt.

[artyhog]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

Really?  Dickey Nutt is a good coach?  No wonder so many support Houston if that is the case.

I don't know anything about thehh Coach Dickey brother, so I will not comment on him.

Most support winners. Some support the Coach for who he is.  

[Pragmatic PiG]

Houston Nutt has three things going for him that Stan Heath does not:

(1) He is from Arkansas....hence, he is "one of us";

(2) He has made an art form out of backslapping the right people and making friends with people in high places (as an aside, I've talked to several well-connected Arkansas State fans who are convinced that the man most responsible for keeping Dickey Nutt employed at ASU is Houston); and

(3) He followed Danny Ford and Jack Crowe.

One final word: it is never so much about what you know as WHO you know. If you and I are both up for the same job, it doesn't matter if you're better or more qualified than me if I know the right person.

Houston has connections everywhere.........stop and ask yourselves how he got the job in the first place. He came to Fayetteville as a token interview and left as a finalist for the job. All that remained was for the right people to exert influence on his behalf. That's the way the world works, especially in a small state like Arkansas.       

Thank you

I would also add that for a certain segment of the hogfan base, the 25 and younger crowd, my experience is that many of these fans's first experience with a winner with regards to the hogs was with the hoops team. Many like my fiancee seem to grade out the hoops team much tougher than the football squad, even more than a decade after the NC

the only memories of any successes for these folks connected to arkansas football is during the nutt years

[Razorback8]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

In 9 yrs what has Nutt done?

I am not a big Nutt supporter...but that's a dumb question.

6 bowl games in 8 years.
2 bowl games in the 8 years before that.

[WilsonHog]

Let me pose one question here...........

Why should Nutt and Heath be held to the same standard?

[WilsonHog]

WE WERE HORRIBLE THE WHOLE DECADE PRIOR TO NUTT.  That does not make him a good coach.  Better than what we had?  Yes.  A good coach.  No.  He's had a mediocre record here.  There is a huge difference.  I guess if you think mediocre is all we can ever be, that would explain your settling for nutt "success".

Consider that it could be that "success" is defined differently for football and basketball at UA.

[artyhog]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

Says who?  Using what criteria?  He is not a good coach.  My opinion vs. yours.

Me. Mine.  It is the only one that I can control.

[artyhog]

Let me pose one question here...........

Why should Nutt and Heath be held to the same standard?

Isn't the media supposed to try to be objective?  I know reality is most aren't.  They have their agendas for different reasons. 

You've got to kidding.  The media objective?  Best laugh of the day.

[Ark Blitz]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

In 9 yrs what has Nutt done?

I am not a big Nutt supporter...but that's a dumb question.

6 bowl games in 8 years.
2 bowl games in the 8 years before that.

So, this makes him a good coach?? WOW.  You have got to be kidding.  Were those bowls big name bowls?

[Fatty McGee]

-Houston Nutt's SEC and overall record are better

-Houston Nutt has won postseason games before

-Nutt has finished in the top 25 before

-Nutt has to compete with 8 other schools that have equal or more tradition, better facilities, and better fans than the Hogs.  Heath competes with 1-2 teams that have better facilities, fans, and more tradition

-Nutt has had another big name program ask him to be their coach, Heath hasn't

-Nutt has won COY honors, Heath never has

-Nutt has won a division title, Heath hasn't

You neglect to mention Nutt has had almost twice as long to do it, and inherited a team with numerous pro players, while Heath inherited a team that might not have won a JUCO championship.

[artyhog]

Let me pose one question here...........

Why should Nutt and Heath be held to the same standard?

Isn't the media supposed to try to be objective?  I know reality is most aren't.  They have their agendas for different reasons. 

You have completely missed the whole point.

I got it.  I just don't choose to remark on some things.

[HogSophist]

I was not comparing the records or football vs. basketball, by the way.  I just see mediocrity from both of them.  The media, particularly the radio call in shows at night, pander to nutt and don't give SH the same treatment.  Why?

If having a top 15 football team right now is mediocre then yes I guess we're mediocre.  We've blown out 2 top 15 teams and our only losses are to 3 top 7 teams.  Right now the media isn't going to get on Nutt that hard.  And if we were to fire a guy who just won the SEC West Division we would be a bigger laughing stock than Bama is right now

Houston Nutt's record at Arkansas over nine years is the classic definition of mediocrity.  I'm not surprised you think otherwise since apparently you are perfectly happy with Gomer as your coach.

How about you not assume I'm a Nutt fan because I'm not, but I am smart enough to know you don't fire a guy after a 7-1 record in the SEC's regular season.  I do think he's done a much better job than Heath though

I'm still seeing the same problem throughout this thread.

1)  There shouldn't be a comparison between the two (see earlier replies).
2)  You're not being a Nutt supporter because you say he had a good year.
3)  You don't fire a guy after going 7-1 and 10-3, no matter how bad the previous body of work.  Should have fired him last year while you had the opportunity. 

Noone wants to reply to anything we say Fresh Legs.  I'm done with this thread because 99% of the posters know that this isn't a racist situation.  This thread needs to go in the trash.

How would you know what is and what's not racist??  Let me guess....

First of all there hasn't been one thought laid out that could even be substantiated.  The guys argues that racism occurs because heat is being applied to a coach with a lower percentage.   First of all, he should never have compared the two.  Secondly, based on his logic Ford, Kines, and Crow should down at the Law Offices of Gary Green right now filing some papers. 

If you guys want to argue around here, you going to have to bring more than this.

Ahh because you say it is substantiated it must be so. I suppose, based on your very own logic that literacy tests in the south during the Jim Crowe era were truly just making sure that only people could read, could vote. Surely it wasnt about the color of their skin. But as long as you can say there is a way to substantiate it, then that reason is fine.

Having said that, i dont know if there is racism involved or not. It is a tough sell with Arkansas basketball having an african-american coach since 1985. I think the real issue is whether or not there is a double standard, race relate, hometownboy related, etc....

being a guy who shaves his head (not bald mind you), i think that there is a hair bias.

[fourthcrusade]

 about 18 % of Basketball teams go to the Big Dance,
about 55% of football teams go to bowls.

Basically, after year 1, you ought to fired ANY YEAR for missing a bowl.

AND STAN HAS ONLY BEEN HERE 4 YEARS - WE DON'T KNOW HIS 5TH SEASON'S SEC STATS, OR OVERALL STATS, EXCEPT THAT WE ARE 8-3, 3-3 AGAINST THE SIX NCAA SQUADS WE HAVE PLAYED SO FAR.

4 YEARS, NOT 5.

[HogSophist]

Let me pose one question here...........

Why should Nutt and Heath be held to the same standard?

Thank you Wilson.  I have been making this point the whole thread although you made it much more concisely than I did.    Also, as I have previously pointed out what is the basis for comparing these two and not comparing the Heath or Nutt with the tennis coach?  One seems as good as the other.

sarcasm aside, fresh and wilson, why should they not be held to the same standard? I have read the entire thread and dont get it. The track and tennis comparison themes dont make sense. These two sports (aside from a good baseball year) are THE money making sports on the UofA campus. Both coaches are paid very well to do their jobs. Perhaps the math of the original poster was a bit, uh.....non-supportive of their premise, but that just clouds the issue.

How about a hypothetical...Lets say it is not fair to compare them (stats, recruiting, etc...) and move past that for a moment. What would be the rationale to bash a guy who has improved his record every year here (i iunderstand that is an impossibility for both coaches at some point) and defend a guy who has not done the same?

No more sarcasm for the moment from me, would just like to get you guys perspective without the hair splitting and such.

[socalhogcaller]

Thirdly, since when is having a lower winning percentage than another program at your school grounds for a lawsuit?  If that were the case, Crowe, Kines, and Ford should have all sued the UofA for wrongful termination because they had a lower winning percentage than Nolan. 

Finally, why didn't you compare to Heath to another coach?  What makes Dale the basis of comparison?  Why not Robert Cox?

I'm not defending Nutt but it's totally ridiculous to make this comparison or any comparison amongst different sports.

Hogfan, new concept time. As PragmaticPig pointed out Nutt's been there twice as long.
People as thick as Fresh Legs shouldn't be allowed to post on here, as they are not capable of arguing fair. Winning percentage is not the basis for law suit, blatent discrimination against a black coach and blatant favoritism and protection of the white coach is.  
 I compared to Houston because he is the White coach at the University who they are bending over backwards to keep and protect, which they will not do for the black basketball coach.
I agree with Deep Shoat, that I too am beginning to believe Nolan is right. Nolan lost in the last years, but he built our program up and he didn't get the support. Houston with a 39-36 conference record(yes hogfan he didn't beat all powder puffs, he did beat the bottom half of the SEC) gets 100 times the support Nolan got with no where near Nolan's record.

You are acting like Stan has been fired already.  The University has shown no discrimination against Stan.  As for the media and the fans.  Arkansas has been mediocre or worse in football for over 15 years now, and hasn't won a national championship since 1964...and this year may finally break the top 10 in the final polls and next year "promises" to be better.  It looks to many that the AD stuck with Nutt through two tough years knowing things were on their way up.  Bottom line, expectations are fairly low for football, unfortunately, and Nutt looks like he may be close exceeding them. (I say all that, and still want Nutt to go.)

Basketball on the other hand is only 13 years removed from a National Championship.  It takes far fewer key players to turn a basketball team into a winner than it does football, and honestly nobody, fans, press, and probably the BOT and AD sees the program reaching its former heights any time soon which are what the expectations are for basketball.

As much as I am tired of Nutt, more pressure should be on Heath at the current time.  The press is right to be on his back.  And like it or not, Nutt probably deserves some slack right now.  As for Nolan, he would still be our coach now if he had never made the remarks he did about the buyout.

[Razorback8]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

In 9 yrs what has Nutt done?

I am not a big Nutt supporter...but that's a dumb question.

6 bowl games in 8 years.
2 bowl games in the 8 years before that.

WE WERE HORRIBLE THE WHOLE DECADE PRIOR TO NUTT.  That does not make him a good coach.  Better than what we had?  Yes.  A good coach.  No.  He's had a mediocre record here.  There is a huge difference.  I guess if you think mediocre is all we can ever be, that would explain your settling for nutt "success".

1) Never said he was a good coach,
2) Never said I like mediocre
3) Never said I had settle for this, or that it was "success"

You need to learn to read. 

I saw someone ask for one thing that HDN had done...just one...can't be done, right?  How about a 300% increase in bowl appearances.  That is one thing.  I'm not justifying it, not saying it makes things perfect and well, not saying it means that HDN is a great coach.  All it means is that HDN has done something while he has been here that hasn't been done since the 80s.

[yagsisalguod]

None of the coaches deserve any kind of raise.  They all make WAY too much, it's just a game...

[Razorback8]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

In 9 yrs what has Nutt done?

I am not a big Nutt supporter...but that's a dumb question.

6 bowl games in 8 years.
2 bowl games in the 8 years before that.

Is that your measuring stick?  Its that simple for you that you refuse to examine any circumstances surrounding Nutt's predecessors?  

Nutt has an extremely long list of things that he should be or should have been questioned on.  His failures, stupid decisions, mismanagement, etc has long gone unchecked by our media.  No way Heath, Nolan, a new beasketball or football coach white or black will enjoy that kind of treatment again.

Nope, someone asked for one thing HDN has done (I am assuming positive) and I gave it to him.  It stands on it's own and is what is.  It's up to you decide what it means.

[Razorback8]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

In 9 yrs what has Nutt done?

I am not a big Nutt supporter...but that's a dumb question.

6 bowl games in 8 years.
2 bowl games in the 8 years before that.

So, this makes him a good coach?? WOW.  You have got to be kidding.  Were those bowls big name bowls?

Wow, the 3rd nonsensical rebuttal to my post of the Hogs history of bowl appearances.  Let's see the first 2 bowls in the 8 preceding years were the Independence Bowl (lost) and the Carquest Bowl (lost)...neither of these were 01/01 bowls.

HDN's six bowls were the Citrus Bowl (lost), Cotton (won), Las Vegas (lost), Cotton (lost), Music City (lost), Independence (won), Capital One (TBD).

That's four 01/01 bowls out of the six.  I think I stand reaffirmed.  Of course the 3 of you lost sight of what I was affirming in the first place...HDN has done something worthy.  Not nearly as much as I would like, but at least I'm not in denial about it.

[JD Hogg]

I keep reading that nutt should be given a little slack now and that Heath's pressure is deserved.  While I can't argue that Heath's pressure and scrutiny in the media, I can say with the utmost certainty that one houston dale nutt has never, ever been as heavily scrutinized by the media the way Stan Heath has been.

Do I believe it's racially motivated?  Doubtful.  Could it be the "good ol boy" scenario?  Probable. 

However, there is no doubt that dale has never, ever been held accountable for his shortcomings while he's been here at Arkansas.  It's sickening the way the media machine coddles their nutts.

[Thearkfan]

Let's all tell the truth on this issue.  The only reason Heath got hired was people he was an African American.  I am one myself and never thought he should have been hired.  Let's look at the facts.  Under Nolan Arkansas was still an elite program even including the later years when there were some not so great years.  The community was in a uproar over the firing of Nolan.  Especially, if you ask the black community.  So, what does Frank do.  He makes that statement that he did not fired Nolan because he was black and hired another black coach.  Not the best coach but a black coach.  Frankly the best coach would have been Mike Anderson.  But since he was so close to Nolan he would not dare hire him.  Why does Nolan or any other coach at Arkansas get fired.  For the most part it has been because of Frank.  Nolan was very vocal about this and in my opinion too vocal but he should not have been fired for it.  Nutt has had a worse tenue but he does not rock the boat with Frank.  Everything is always positive even though the fans can see deferently.  With 10 wins this year he has just bought himself another free 4 years of mediocricy.  As long as he wins 6-7 games the next 2-3 years he will have a job.  That would have never been acceptable for Nolan.  He brought the state it's first National Championship and 3 final fours in one of the toughest conferences in the nation.  What have we gotten from Nutt.  He has been he for how long?  How many conference championships have we had?  Compare to Nolan.  Both coaches need to be gone.  We should only accept the standard that Nolan set.   Only great coaches can recruit and win championships.  Neither will ever happen with the mid major coaches we have now.

[Razorback8]

Coach Nutt is a good coach.  THere is not reason to call him out.

In 9 yrs what has Nutt done?

I am not a big Nutt supporter...but that's a dumb question.

6 bowl games in 8 years.
2 bowl games in the 8 years before that.

So, this makes him a good coach?? WOW.  You have got to be kidding.  Were those bowls big name bowls?

Wow, the 3rd nonsensical rebuttal to my post of the Hogs history of bowl appearances.  Let's see the first 2 bowls in the 8 preceding years were the Independence Bowl (lost) and the Carquest Bowl (lost)...neither of these were 01/01 bowls.

HDN's six bowls were the Citrus Bowl (lost), Cotton (won), Las Vegas (lost), Cotton (lost), Music City (lost), Independence (won), Capital One (TBD).

That's four 01/01 bowls out of the six.  I think I stand reaffirmed.  Of course the 3 of you lost sight of what I was affirming in the first place...HDN has done something worthy.  Not nearly as much as I would like, but at least I'm not in denial about it.

I guess 3 people not responding means 3 people in denial...making me think of the nickname Hit'N'Run Haters.

[SexyBeast77]

Arty-Not only did he start something just because he can, he quite possibly will qualify for the worst logic of the day award.  The man spends the whole thread crying foul when his whole premise is flawed.  One, he made the error of comparing football and basketball coaches.  Two, he picked the wrong ones to compare and says a guy should sue the university because he has a lower winning percentage than the football coach.  If not, then why did you even put their records up for everyone to see?

His argument has holes in it like swiss cheese.

Really Wally Hall in disguise , you shouldn't be so pleased with yourself because you're not that clever.  If you didn't selectively quote I said that the media's treatment of Heath compared to Nutt is what is discriminatory and grounds for claims of racism. I said the winning percentage is not not basis for firing. That was just there to point out that 54 or 60 percent, or 1/2  to 2/3 games won is mediocrity personified. The point is they are both in the category of medocre.
It's not the case that Nutt can point to wild success and a trophy case full of trophies.  He has very very average numbers, and gets defended like he is Osama and they(the media) are Islamo-fascists.   It is the case that they have very average records and Nutt gets preferential treatment. there could be some of the "good old boy factor" but I'm with Nolan, the black coach is getting battered despite improving his record every year. 
Look
FACT  Going to a bowl means nothing. It means you were .500 or above. Any coroporation can have a bowl. It's a meaningless exhibition game, besides the championship game. A few of the older ones, like the Rose do have a certain level of prestige for bragging rights. Getting to a bowl game shouldnt' be celebrated. Woo hoo we're .500

As I said Houston's record in SEC 39-36 or 52%, Stan's overall record 68-58 54%. Stan gets tons of heat despite improving his record every year and Nutt Gets none. 

Nutt is 39-36 in conference with no conference titles and people defend him. Why is that worth keeping? That's just the Status Quo.   Why are you fighting for that? why are you spinning for that? Why is that the guy? Why is that guy the best guy for the job? Why do you "know" that guy will win national championships? I keep hearing these things, it's like mass psychcosis

Finally Good on D. Williams for not buying what Houston Swaggert Pfife Nutt was selling.  He apparently told Damien things were gonna change. then tried to tell him again to get him to stay. It's the old AA phrase, "Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result, is the sure sign of insanity." I don't know why anyone expects anything at all out of Nutt after 9 years, one 3 loss season and two 4 loss seasons at his best.   No thanks I'm not buying Houston Stock, it's crashing .

[WindyCityHog]

The whole initial topic of this thread is simply ridiculous.

Arkansas hires a black coach....Wait....hires an African-American man as coach of the basketball program.  Said coach leads the Hogs to immortality....then strokes out and asks to be fired.  He is replaced by another African-American....who has done what?  Nothing.

At the same time, Arkansas football has a football coach....who happens to be Caucasian.  He has done what?
Nothing....at least to me.

FreshLegs nailed my sentiment....It's apples and oranges.  I don't see the "racism" angle....other than we are hanging on to a football coach (who happens to be white)...

Are we saying we can't get a new BB coach because of HDN?

A LONG stretch.....

As much as I disdain HDN, he at least can make an argument for his tenure.....I wasn't so sure of Heath....until this year.   It's obvious he gets outcoached and is employed beyond his level.

...and I could care less about perception or media scrutiny.

What is....is.

Heath needs to go...as does HDN....but the two issues are not one and ther same.....nor are they intertwined because of the color of their skin.

If Heath is fired, it has NOTHING to do with Houston Nutt.  The two are separate issues....although some would like to think differently.

[boarhog12]

Nutt come with a full team, Heath had to beat the bushes just to fill the bench. My problem with Heath is he shows no fire & for the most part neither does his players. I like Steven Hill's D and could put up with no O but he needs to avg 15 rebounds and to do this he needs a fire that he hasn't shown.

[SexyBeast77]

Two things to leave you guys with:

1. Someone show one real claim of racism and I'll listen.  Also, make sure that it comes from someone employed at the UofA.  It makes no different what the talking heads say.  They could call him racially degrading name in the book but it would not be grounds for the a lawsuit of the university because of couple of hacks on the radio are showing their ignorance.

Arkansas Football and basketball is on the Arkansas Radio Sports Network which is on the Buzz in Central Arkansas. The Radio network is I believe eminating from the University. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Care to expand on you're wrong and explain the exclusive rights to Football and Basketball broadcast?

[artyhog]

Two things to leave you guys with:

1. Someone show one real claim of racism and I'll listen.  Also, make sure that it comes from someone employed at the UofA.  It makes no different what the talking heads say.  They could call him racially degrading name in the book but it would not be grounds for the a lawsuit of the university because of couple of hacks on the radio are showing their ignorance.

Arkansas Football and basketball is on the Arkansas Radio Sports Network which is on the Buzz in Central Arkansas. The Radio network is I believe eminating from the University. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Your wrong.  They do not work for the UofA.  They just like the coaches mostly.

[Thearkfan]

Hey win is the last time Alabama was a power house team.  Auburn hasn't always been great either.  This is the only year that win meant anything.  Quality wins are wins against Tennessee, Florida, Georgia.  We have losing records against them.  Let's not kid ourselves.  Arkansas is not on a that level year in and year out.  We need to get there.  The program is too inconsistent.

[Jim Harris]

For Me,
  Stan Heath and Houston Nutt are both terrible coaches, neither good enough for the SEC, and both should be fired. What bothers me, and I'm a white guy, is the media and in particular Al Jazerra North, THE BUZZ, continue to shill for Houston Nutt and Heath gets hammered again and again.  Let me quote myself in my email to the Buzz that states the stats:

Houston Nutt getting a contract extension is a freaking joke and here's why.
Nutt is 39-36 in the SEC in 9 years, barely above .500.  Nutt's overall record is 67-43 or 60.9%. winning percentage. The only reason he has a winning record at all is 3 powder puff games a year x 8 years for the 24 game margin.  this is I believe Houston's 3rd raise and extension. It's absolutely a joke to want to retain a coach that's .500 in conference  because of wins against directional schools. What a disgrace.  Defend this Rick Shaeffer Jr(Acri)

Stan Heath is 26-40 in conference, and 68-58 overall for a 54.0% winning percentage. Nutt's been there 9 years compared to Heath's 5 with a 60.9 to 54.0%  winning percenntage. It's just not right that Nutt is getting extensions and praise from his Shills and Heath is getting hammered for an overall record about as equally mediocre.  We have got to get radio people that don't work for ARSN that are free to tell the truth. Heath should sue their a*s like Nolan. They're bending over backwards for Nutt and he's only won more games because of his powder puffs. The more in trouble Nutt gets, the more powder puffs we're gonna get.

THE BUZZ IS A DISGRACE

Yes, he's 26-40 in the Southeastern Conference. Does that not strike you as pretty bad for a basketball school? It took four years for Heath to have a winning record in the SEC, in basketball, at a basketball school. In his fifth year -- and I'm willing to let this play out before completely running him down -- it appears that a winning record in SEC play will be quite an accomplishment. One winning record in five years should not be what we're striving for, in basketball or football.
Now, I will agree with you that anybody who says Nutt deserves a raise after this year is crazy. He did what he was hired to do. That should be enough, not a bonus, a raise and an extension. If he were to manage a 10-win season next year, then we can start talking raises and extensions. If he returns to the same ol' 7-5 (which would seem unlikely with that absolutely awful nonconference schedule they have), we'd be sitting here with a coach we just gave and extension and raise to and he had proven beyond doubt that it was unjustified. Nutt, however, has been able to convince the powers that be that 10 wins is rare indeed (even in 13-game schedules) for Arkansas and that we should be happy with the 7 or 8, with an occasional two-year dip such as 2004-05. And the PTB bought it. Somebody has been unable to convince those same PTB that being the dominant team in the SEC as we may have been 1992-95 is also rare indeed. But, truth is, we're more of a basketball school and expect numbers like we enjoyed in the first 11 years of Nolan than we're seeing with Heath. The cupboard may have been bare, I'll give him that, but I haven't seen him yet get these guys to lift their games to a level to win when maybe they shouldn't (on paper).

[Thearkfan]

Well, let me make this point.  Nolan did not get a raise with his first winning season with Arkansas.  He got it the next season when he had set a president for winning.  Nut has 1 - 10 game season and no one can see the problem with that.  The problem with racism is that most white  people never see it because they don't live it so there for it does not exist at the ALLMIGHTY Univ. of Arkansas.  It still exist today people. And yes even Arkansas.  Yes, Nolan ran his mouth too much.  He should have kept some of his comments to himself.   When Nolan was getting fired by the Arkansas faithful...many of you were praising Bobby Knight who sometimes hit players and cursed players consistenly out and throwing chairs ect....This coming on the radio with the so called Arkansas faithful.  If Nutt were at Michigan, Ohio State, Florida, he would have been fired 4 years ago.  That is the reason those program win and will keep winning.  If it has nothing to do with color explain why Nolan had to have 2 winning seasons before he got his raise?  Nutt, has 2 losing seasons in a row and the program is not consistent but you give him a raise for that.  Furthermore, we won the South and we still did not get a BCS birth.  I am sure we will lose this bowl but Nutt will get his raise.  By the way Arkansas fired Nolan.................for what?  they deserve what they get 2 coaches that are mediocre at best.

[Thearkfan]

by the way- I hope they give heath as much love as they gave Nutt the last couple of years.

[Razorback8]

Nolan did not get a raise with his first winning season with Arkansas.  He got it the next season when he had set a president for winning.  Nut has 1 - 10 game season and no one can see the problem with that. 

So a winning season in basketball = a 10-win season in football?
It's precedent by the way...Nolan didn't become the president for winning until several years later

When Nolan was getting fired by the Arkansas faithful...many of you were praising Bobby Knight who sometimes hit players and cursed players consistenly out and throwing chairs ect....

Knight did get fired...that's why he is at Texas Tech.  However, I don't think either should have been fired.  But there is still a difference.  Knight was punished for his coaching tactics.  Nolan was fired for his behavior outside of coaching (comments) and his comments about the program.  That difference being exposed...he still should not have been fired.  I just don't think it had to do with race.  It had to do with his being a distraction to the program and "asking" to get fired.

If Nutt were at Michigan, Ohio State, Florida, he would have been fired 4 years ago.  That is the reason those program win and will keep winning. 

You named 3 programs with far better history in football than the Hogs.  Especially Michigan and Ohio St.

I am sure we will lose this bowl but Nutt will get his raise. 

I sure hope he doesn't get the raise if we lose.  The extension was enough reward.

IMO I think you have raised many valid points.  I just get to a different conclusion.  I think it has more to do with FB vs BB than it does White vs Black.  If we want to explore race, let's look within the programs.  Has Rocker got the raises he deserves vs. Markuson?  I think you will see very fair treatment.  That's going off memory, so hopefully someone can bring some numbers to the table.

[Thearkfan]

hogfan064, how can you say that Nolan left no players at Arkansas.  See, that kind of statement proves my point.  Remember, 2 platers left Arkansas 1 being JJ sullinger, then Andre Igudala wanted out of his Scholarship.  Not to mention we might have gotten Okafor from UConn.  And 2 other players got out of their's.  So, it is not fair to say that Nolan left the school with no players....they did want to play if he was not there.

[Vidhog]

 Not to mention we might have gotten Okafor from UConn.    

I swear, do some people just not keep up that much with Razorback Athletics?

Emeka Okafor chose UCONN (he was drafted in the spring of '04) over the Nolan-coached Razorbacks. Losing Okafor assisted in the beginning of his departure in the eyes of the fans.

Nolan got fired in February of '02, Okafor's sophomore year at UCONN.

[Hogchick]

For Me,
  Stan Heath and Houston Nutt are both terrible coaches, neither good enough for the SEC, and both should be fired. What bothers me, and I'm a white guy, is the media and in particular Al Jazerra North, THE BUZZ, continue to shill for Houston Nutt and Heath gets hammered again and again.  Let me quote myself in my email to the Buzz that states the stats:

Houston Nutt getting a contract extension is a freaking joke and here's why.
Nutt is 39-36 in the SEC in 9 years, barely above .500.  Nutt's overall record is 67-43 or 60.9%. winning percentage. The only reason he has a winning record at all is 3 powder puff games a year x 8 years for the 24 game margin.  this is I believe Houston's 3rd raise and extension. It's absolutely a joke to want to retain a coach that's .500 in conference  because of wins against directional schools. What a disgrace.  Defend this Rick Shaeffer Jr(Acri)

Stan Heath is 26-40 in conference, and 68-58 overall for a 54.0% winning percentage. Nutt's been there 9 years compared to Heath's 5 with a 60.9 to 54.0%  winning percenntage. It's just not right that Nutt is getting extensions and praise from his Shills and Heath is getting hammered for an overall record about as equally mediocre.  We have got to get radio people that don't work for ARSN that are free to tell the truth. Heath should sue their a*s like Nolan. They're bending over backwards for Nutt and he's only won more games because of his powder puffs. The more in trouble Nutt gets, the more powder puffs we're gonna get.

THE BUZZ IS A DISGRACE

You may not like the Buzz, but to call them racist is WAY off base.