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Author Topic: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?  (Read 1270 times)

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Wildhog

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #50 on: July 12, 2017, 02:48:27 pm »

8-4 = 8-4 = 8-4 = 8-4

The only thing that matters is how many total wins you have.
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HF#1

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #51 on: July 12, 2017, 02:51:21 pm »

This topic is only relevant if you aren't winning. Thus the reason it is here.
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PorkSoda

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #52 on: July 12, 2017, 04:01:02 pm »

8-4 = 8-4 = 8-4 = 8-4

The only thing that matters is how many total wins you have.
not true.  you know they look at SoS and quality of wins
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PorkSoda

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #53 on: July 12, 2017, 04:03:12 pm »

So were good enough to go 8-0 in the SEC, but lost to an FCS school?
well, if we scheduled OSU,USC,OU,and FSU.  for OOC, it could happen.

either way, I'm have always been a firm believer that conference wins are the most important.  I'd take an SEC championship and first round play off loss over 2nd place and a playoff win every time.

for me, its 100% about the conference, and everything else is gravy on top.

8-4 = 8-4 = 8-4 = 8-4

The only thing that matters is how many total wins you have.

if all wins are equal in value, the conference wins are more important, because you can't win your conference with non conference wins
« Last Edit: July 12, 2017, 04:56:10 pm by PorkSoda »
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bennyl08

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #54 on: July 12, 2017, 06:21:07 pm »

So were good enough to go 8-0 in the SEC, but lost to an FCS school?

Aye, there's the rub, for in eternal hogness, what dreams may come?

From a fan standpoint, that would be utterly frustrating. However, we'd be guaranteed to be division champions if we went 8-0 in conference play, even if we lost to 4 FCS schools in the process.
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Augustus

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #55 on: July 12, 2017, 08:10:47 pm »

When questioning whether you keep or fire a coach? I don't see CBB finishing better than 4th in the West behind Bama, LSU, and Auburn until Saban retires, and by the looks of it that could be another 25 years........

But if he still wins 8-10 games (including the bowl game) a year is he safe? Do the fans get fed up (like LSU) and want him fired because we aren't competing for the division yearly? Seems if that's the case Bret might not want to settle into that nursery too much

To me... losing a game 56-3 (and setting a Conference record for most rushing yards allowed), or giving up consecutive halftime leads of 17 points (or more)... matters more.
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PonderinHog

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #56 on: July 12, 2017, 08:32:24 pm »

not true.  you know they look at SoS and quality of wins
If we lose our OOC games the SEC sucks.
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PorkSoda

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #57 on: July 12, 2017, 08:53:13 pm »

If we lose our OOC games the SEC sucks.
if SW Missouri Tech wins 8 games are they going to get the same tier bowl as if OSU wins 8 games?

8-4 =/= 8-4

it all depends.  wins are not created equal.  who you beat matters.  and conference wins matter most, because those are the ones that determine your conference ranking.

why is this even a debate?
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Wildhog

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #58 on: July 13, 2017, 10:23:55 am »

if SW Missouri Tech wins 8 games are they going to get the same tier bowl as if OSU wins 8 games?

8-4 =/= 8-4

it all depends.  wins are not created equal.  who you beat matters.  and conference wins matter most, because those are the ones that determine your conference ranking.

why is this even a debate?

Because you're wrong.

We play in the SEC.  Our SOS will NEVER be an issue, no matter who we play out of conference.  Literally the only thing that matters to the playoff committee is how many W's we have beside our name.
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GuvHog

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #59 on: July 13, 2017, 10:40:45 am »

Because you're wrong.

We play in the SEC.  Our SOS will NEVER be an issue, no matter who we play out of conference.  Literally the only thing that matters to the playoff committee is how many W's we have beside our name.

Exactly. For an SEC team. Overall record is more important than conference record or who the non conference opponents are.
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PorkSoda

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #60 on: July 13, 2017, 03:19:09 pm »

Because you're wrong.

We play in the SEC.  Our SOS will NEVER be an issue, no matter who we play out of conference.  Literally the only thing that matters to the playoff committee is how many W's we have beside our name.
I'm not wrong.  OOC wins count exactly zero in your conference standing.

goal number one is winning your conference.  do that and the rest will take care of itself.

dont win your conference and you'd be lucky if the the playoff committee even considers you in the first place.
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Wildhog

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #61 on: July 13, 2017, 03:28:13 pm »

I'm not wrong.  OOC wins count exactly zero in your conference standing.

goal number one is winning your conference.  do that and the rest will take care of itself.

dont win your conference and you'd be lucky if the the playoff committee even considers you in the first place.

If you're arguing non-conference games vs conference games, I'd agree with you.

You're arguing that a subset of our schedule is more important than the entire schedule.  Just doesn't make sense.
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PorkSoda

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #62 on: July 13, 2017, 05:07:51 pm »

If you're arguing non-conference games vs conference games, I'd agree with you.

You're arguing that a subset of our schedule is more important than the entire schedule.  Just doesn't make sense.
I'm just saying competing in our conference should be the number 1 goal, and everything else should be secondary. 

when I judge whether we had a good year or bad year I look at conference record first.

.500 is the line that I use.  if we win more than 50% of our conference games its a good year, less that 50% is disappointing. 

everything else is just dressing.

the conference record is the tell tale of how good the team is.
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bennyl08

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #63 on: July 13, 2017, 05:38:46 pm »

Because you're wrong.

We play in the SEC.  Our SOS will NEVER be an issue, no matter who we play out of conference.  Literally the only thing that matters to the playoff committee is how many W's we have beside our name.

This is not true. Conference prestige can and does change.

Part of that is ooc victories. If SEC teams start regularly losing to ooc teams,  our prestige goes down, recruits won't look at the conference the same, so talent goes down and so on.

But, we are just talking about Arkansas you say. Let's compare two situations. Hogs go 6-2 in conference but 2-2 out vs 4-4 in conf and 4-0 out.

Same overall record but different perceptions. Case 1, maybe the conference was weak that year. A team that was worse than a middle of the pack team in another major conference and couldn't beat a Sun belt level team but was able to beat all but the best teams in conference? Weak or at best top heavy conference.  Case 2, the team was middle pack in their conf but demonstrably better than middle pack of that other conf. Lost to the best teams, but those were probably all good teams.

In the short term, team 1 will at best be viewed as a Fluke to win the conf games, but over years, that scenario will eat away at the prestige and lower it. Case 2 gets the benefit of the doubt.

If both scenarios play out long term, scenario two results in a better bowl game than sc3nario one.
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PorkSoda

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #64 on: July 13, 2017, 06:07:23 pm »

This is not true. Conference prestige can and does change.

Part of that is ooc victories. If SEC teams start regularly losing to ooc teams,  our prestige goes down, recruits won't look at the conference the same, so talent goes down and so on.

But, we are just talking about Arkansas you say. Let's compare two situations. Hogs go 6-2 in conference but 2-2 out vs 4-4 in conf and 4-0 out.

Same overall record but different perceptions. Case 1, maybe the conference was weak that year. A team that was worse than a middle of the pack team in another major conference and couldn't beat a Sun belt level team but was able to beat all but the best teams in conference? Weak or at best top heavy conference.  Case 2, the team was middle pack in their conf but demonstrably better than middle pack of that other conf. Lost to the best teams, but those were probably all good teams.

In the short term, team 1 will at best be viewed as a Fluke to win the conf games, but over years, that scenario will eat away at the prestige and lower it. Case 2 gets the benefit of the doubt.

If both scenarios play out long term, scenario two results in a better bowl game than sc3nario one.
never thought of it that way, but I think you are correct in terms of conference prestige, that OOC games are important in maintaining that perception, even if from the individual team perspective, conference wins are more important.
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HiggiePiggy

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #65 on: July 13, 2017, 08:43:59 pm »

I'm not wrong.  OOC wins count exactly zero in your conference standing.

goal number one is winning your conference.  do that and the rest will take care of itself.

dont win your conference and you'd be lucky if the the playoff committee even considers you in the first place.

If we went 0-4 in ooc and 8-0 and even won the sec championship we would not have a chance at all to play in the playoff.  If we went 4-0 and 6-2 in conference and also somehow got into the sec championship game and won to make our record 11-2 we would have a great chance of getting into the playoff. There is no chance at all if we are 9-4. 
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GuvHog

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Re: Does overall record or SEC record matter more?
« Reply #66 on: July 14, 2017, 08:04:21 am »

I'm not wrong.  OOC wins count exactly zero in your conference standing.

goal number one is winning your conference.  do that and the rest will take care of itself.

dont win your conference and you'd be lucky if the the playoff committee even considers you in the first place.

Tell that to Ohio State. They didn't even make it to the Big 10 Championship game last year but they were in the national championship playoffs.
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