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Are you guys crazy? In defense of MA

Started by Fan701, March 17, 2018, 12:52:51 pm

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Fan701

Quote from: oldbooniehog on March 17, 2018, 05:44:26 pm
Pelphrey, who is hated for good reason, won 1 NCAA tourney game in 4 years.

Anderson has won 2 NCAA tourney games in 7 years...

TRUTH.
I don't know, but three of the past four years MA has put the best Arkansas teams since the 1990's on the court.  I have a hard time equating that with the Pelphrey disaster.  It's clear that, for most on here, what MA has done doesn't come close to good enough.  Anyway, I can see that I'm losing this argument, and the mob wants Anderson run out of town.  So be it.  I hope it all works out for you, but my guess is that it won't

Letsroll1200

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 05:56:45 pm
I don't know, but three of the past four years MA has put the best Arkansas teams since the 1990's on the court.  I have a hard time equating that with the Pelphrey disaster.  It's clear that, for most on here, what MA has done doesn't come close to good enough.  Anyway, I can see that I'm losing this argument, and the mob wants Anderson run out of town.  So be it.  I hope it all works out for you, but my guess is that it won't

They been gone for sometime but they're back again.

 

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: oldbooniehog on March 17, 2018, 05:44:26 pm
Pelphrey, who is hated for good reason, won 1 NCAA tourney game in 4 years.

Anderson has won 2 NCAA tourney games in 7 years...

TRUTH.

So he's only slightly better than Pel. That shouldn't lend itself to long term job stability.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

rude1

Quote from: Letsroll1200 on March 17, 2018, 06:03:46 pm
They been gone for sometime but they're back again.
Losing will do that. Winning silences the critics not excuses.

Atlhogfan1

Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

ChicoHog

Quote from: porkinsons disease on March 17, 2018, 03:42:27 pm
Mike has done a good job bringing us back to respectability. I think that is his ceiling. The huggers mantra is that " we could do worse". True, but it is the equivalent of playing the "bond market" and losing to inflation or "going for it" and investing in the stock market. Bigger risk, but much bigger reward. 7 years of minimal returns is enough.

We have the fanbase,facilities, enough local talent, and some tradition ( trailing only UK and possibly Florida). All we need is someone to lead us there. GO HOGS
Well said.  The in state talent has improved dramatically the last few years with more on the way.  Anderson needs to take a long hard look at his methods and systems defensively and offensively.  it's time to realize that switching on every screen is not solid basketball.  It's bad for now and bad for the player's future progress.  You don't need to double team every pass inside.  Scout the  opponent and determine when it's appropriate.  Develop some under the basket out of bounds plays instead of just throwing deep into the back court every time.  Demand the players block out on the defensive boards.  Teach guys to keep their feet and not go for the fake every time.  You don't need to guard the opponent tightly when he's 35 feet from the basket.  That allows him to drive right by and find the open man with all your switching. 

I like Mike and think he's a good guy, mentor and example for our players.  He's just not a high level coach. 

Großer Kriegschwein

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 12:52:51 pm
The mob with its pitchforks is out again.  Anderson is a very good coach.  Even though he doesn't cheat, he still wins most of the time.  He is the best Arkansas is likely to get.  Fire him and the most likely result is that we get worse.  I'd say we'd have about an 80% chance of getting worse and a 20% chance of getting better, were we to fire him.  It's a dumb bet to make.  In addition, Anderson is a clean coach.  He hasn't found round-about ways of paying players like many of his adversaries.  You are foolish not to factor that in.  If the FBI investigation results in a more level playing field for clean coaches like Anderson, then the handicaps he faces in getting five star talent will be gone. Let's see how that works out.

A very good coach doesn't have the postseason record that he does.

Start the conversation with the proper frame. Mike Anderson is A COACH. His team's performance is who he is as a coach in both recruiting, scouting, game plan and performance.

The question then becomes, is that who we want to be as a program?

Proper framing makes it a discussion instead of an argument, which is what it should be now that the season is over.
This is my non-signature signature.

Fan701

Quote from: Letsroll1200 on March 17, 2018, 06:03:46 pm
They been gone for sometime but they're back again.
Yep.  The Arkansas version of the mob that ran Rick Barnes out of Texas.  He was good but not up to Texas standards apparently.  How's that worked out?

PonderinHog

Quote from: oldbooniehog on March 17, 2018, 05:44:26 pm
Pelphrey, who is hated for good reason, won 1 NCAA tourney game in 4 years.

Anderson has won 2 NCAA tourney games in 7 years...

HALF TRUTH.
Pelphrey, who I no longer despise, won 1 NCAA tourney game in his first season, with Heath's players, and never sniffed the NCAAT again and never won a SECT game again.

Anderson has been to the NCAAT three of the last four years and won two games, as well as finishing 2nd in the SECT twice, as well as a finishing in the top four in conference in three of the last four years.

MORE TRUTH

code red

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 12:52:51 pm
The mob with its pitchforks is out again.  Anderson is a very good coach.  Even though he doesn't cheat, he still wins most of the time.  He is the best Arkansas is likely to get.  Fire him and the most likely result is that we get worse.  I'd say we'd have about an 80% chance of getting worse and a 20% chance of getting better, were we to fire him.  It's a dumb bet to make.  In addition, Anderson is a clean coach.  He hasn't found round-about ways of paying players like many of his adversaries.  You are foolish not to factor that in.  If the FBI investigation results in a more level playing field for clean coaches like Anderson, then the handicaps he faces in getting five star talent will be gone. Let's see how that works out.
Do you seriously think Mike will ever go deep in the tourny?  Mike's teams don't play defense. Don't rebound. And her somewhat undisciplined. I'd say he's got one more year to clean it up and then he's gone.
"If what you did yesterday seems big, you haven't done anything today."  Dr. Lou

oldbooniehog

More truth.

Stan Heath, who is widely considered a lousy Arkansas coach, got the Hogs to 2 NCAA tournaments.

It can be easily argued that Pelphrey's NCAA team would have been Heath's 3rd NCAA team.

Mike Anderson, who has been here longer than Heath, has only one more trip to the NCAA tournament than Heath.

code red

Quote from: oldbooniehog on March 17, 2018, 06:31:05 pm
More truth.

Stan Heath, who is widely considered a lousy Arkansas coach, got the Hogs to 2 NCAA tournaments.

It can be easily argued that Pelphrey's NCAA team would have been Heath's 3rd NCAA team.

Mike Anderson, who has been here longer than Heath, has only one more trip to the NCAA tournament than Heath.
Mike drop.....no pun intended lol
"If what you did yesterday seems big, you haven't done anything today."  Dr. Lou

PonderinHog

Quote from: oldbooniehog on March 17, 2018, 06:31:05 pm
More truth.

Stan Heath, who is widely considered a lousy Arkansas coach, got the Hogs to 2 NCAA tournaments.

It can be easily argued that Pelphrey's NCAA team would have been Heath's 3rd NCAA team.

Mike Anderson, who has been here longer than Heath, has only one more trip to the NCAA tournament than Heath.
Even more truth.

Heath never won a NCAAT game at Arkansas. 

 

ChicoHog

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 06:22:13 pm
Yep.  The Arkansas version of the mob that ran Rick Barnes out of Texas.  He was good but not up to Texas standards apparently.  How's that worked out?
Great for Tennessee.  Barnes is a good coach and I would take him in a heartbeat.  Definitely over Shaka Smart. 

daprospecta

Quote from: rude1 on March 17, 2018, 05:47:03 pm
I guess the pay has trickled down to the 3* players because we haven't loaded up on those either. Lots of quality kids that are 3* players yet we hardly get any, and the ones we get are projects. Trying to build and sustain a program off of Juco players, and low level transfers has it ceiling.
Oh? According to ESPN we have 4 4* players and 2 3* recruits arriving this summer. Not only that but the lowest graded recruit is 78 out 100.  Mike may have started that way but he has his roots in the program now and it's starting to show with bringing better players.

http://www.espn.com/colleges/basketball/recruiting/school/_/id/8/class/2018

Fan701

Quote from: ChicoHog on March 17, 2018, 06:38:35 pm
Great for Tennessee.  Barnes is a good coach and I would take him in a heartbeat.  Definitely over Shaka Smart.
I agree that Rick Barnes is a good coach.  I'd take him in a heartbeat, too.  Yet many, maybe you, too, want to fire MA, whose lifetime record against Barnes is 7-3.  How is that reconciled?

rude1

Quote from: daprospecta on March 17, 2018, 06:43:13 pm
Oh? According to ESPN we have 4 4* players and 2 3* recruits arriving this summer. Not only that but the lowest graded recruit is 78 out 100.  Mike may have started that way but he has his roots in the program now and it's starting to show with bringing better players.

http://www.espn.com/colleges/basketball/recruiting/school/_/id/8/class/2018
Look I know the game. ESPN is the only one that has those guys rated that high, that is why you are sourcing them. Still only ONE of those players are found in the ESPN top 100 and he comes in at NO. 87. The other services have only two of those guys as 4* the other 4 are rated as 3*....................But spin it however makes you feel better on how good they are.

Mr. Porkleone

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 02:47:05 pm
First, even excellent teams lose in the first round every year.  It doesn't happen just to us.

Hard to lose in NCAA first round when we only go ever now and then

daprospecta

Quote from: rude1 on March 17, 2018, 06:47:35 pm
Look I know the game. ESPN is the only one that has those guys rated that high, that is why you are sourcing them. Still only ONE of those players are found in the ESPN top 100 and he comes in at NO. 87. The other services have only two of those guys as 4* the other 4 are rated as 3*....................But spin it however makes you feel better on how good they are.
You are full of bull****.  You are trying to spin an agenda.  The mecca for sports entertainment at the moment says we have a very good class and I'm supposed to believe you that the high rated players are not good.  I wonder if I go digging through your posts on what you had to say about Darious Hall and Big Dan.  Probably said they weren't good either huh? GTFOH.

rude1

Quote from: daprospecta on March 17, 2018, 07:01:23 pm
You are full of bull****.  You are trying to spin an agenda.  The mecca for sports entertainment at the moment says we have a very good class and I'm supposed to believe you that the high rated players are not good.  I wonder if I go digging through your posts on what you had to say about Darious Hall and Big Dan.  Probably said they weren't good either huh? GTFOH.
Can't handle the truth can you. You were the one trying to spin how good this class is, when it's NOT. I see you didn't counter with any information that supports your case for how good this class is???????????

31to6

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 12:52:51 pm
If the FBI investigation results in a more level playing field for clean coaches like Anderson, then the handicaps he faces in getting five star talent will be gone. Let's see how that works out. 
Nothing meaningful will come of the FBI investigation.

Poor, naive Mike thinks the NCAA is going to punish the wicked and raise up the righteous but it just doesn't work that way.

UNC and Auburn have basically shown that if you stonewall the NCAA, there is nothing they will do. If the worst happens and a program is caught red-handed they may vacate some wins--but NOBODY CARES. They still won the games. Their players still got drafted. Heck, Pitino ran a bordello on campus and doesn't even have a show cause.

Nothing will happen that changes college basketball for the better.

daprospecta

Quote from: rude1 on March 17, 2018, 08:37:54 pm
Can't handle the truth can you. You were the one trying to spin how good this class is, when it's NOT. I see you didn't counter with any information that supports your case for how good this class is???????????
So ESPN has said we have a good class coming in and you want me to back it up? I bet you sit around criticizing McDonald's AA's too huh? I don't have to prove to you why they aren't good.  ESPN is very reputable. Until they get in and disappoint, we have a good class coming in.  Go kick rocks.

LZH

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 04:59:17 pm
I acknowledge that some will win at any cost, lie, cheat, or steal, and do it gladly.  I'm just not one of them.  Dry counties?


Just because a kid's mother suddenly gets a cushy new job that enables her to buy a new car for herself and her son, and maybe remodel the kitchen, do I care? No. It isn't illegal. It happens everywhere.

LumberBacks

Quote from: rude1 on March 17, 2018, 01:29:12 pm
You guys can stop with the X & Os stuff. If you can't recruit talent I don't care what your chalk board ability is you are going to lose. Now recruiting doesn't mean you have to get the 5* elite talent, it means you have to have an eye for guys who can play the way you want. MA problem is he basically whiffed on everyone, just look at his roster, jucos and low level transfers, because he couldn't even land 3* talent that could play.
You must not be watching the NCAA tourney.  Plenty of teams with 3* and superior coaching are winning.  Sure, the teams with 5* talent can win many based on skill alone.  But why are the UNCs and KYs being taken to the wire?  Why are the Loyolas, UMBCs and  Marshalls winning?  X's and O's, player development, team discipline, eye for talent and assembling complimentary players, conditioning, etc. that a coaching staff is responsible for can be a talent neutralizer, especially when the talent level between two teams is close.

For the current players on the Butler and Arkansas rosters, the average Rivals ranking for Butler is 0.875 and Arkansas is 0.895.  Relatively close, except Arkansas has five 4* to Butler's one 4*.  If games are won on talent alone, then Arkansas should have won that game.  But they were BLOWN OUT at the beginning and end of the game with heavy Sr. team and a 1st round NBA player in the making.  If you want to argue that Rivals rankings mean nothing, then maybe CMA is pursuing players that are over rated (see Cook).  Coaching makes a huge difference. 

There. Information to support my case.  Sorry if your bracket has UVA winning it all.

 

rude1

Quote from: daprospecta on March 17, 2018, 08:52:40 pm
So ESPN has said we have a good class coming in and you want me to back it up? I bet you sit around criticizing McDonald's AA's too huh? I don't have to prove to you why they aren't good.  ESPN is very reputable. Until they get in and disappoint, we have a good class coming in.  Go kick rocks.
NO ESPN makes no such claim that our class is good coming in, you are saying that.  They say matter of fact that only ONE player is good enough to be in their top 100 and he is 87, that's not good. They also say that it is the 22nd ranked class nationally with 6 players in it, everyone above us has less players signed but one and they are ranked no. 2. ESPN also says this is the 6th ranked class in the conference with more players signed than everyone ranked ahead of us. YOU took all that and is trying to paint a picture of some stellar class that's coming in and that simply isn't the truth.

Großer Kriegschwein

Quote from: rude1 on March 17, 2018, 10:05:47 pm
NO ESPN makes no such claim that our class is good coming in, you are saying that.  They say matter of fact that only ONE player is good enough to be in their top 100 and he is 87, that's not good. They also say that it is the 22nd ranked class nationally with 6 players in it, everyone above us has less players signed but one and they are ranked no. 2. ESPN also says this is the 6th ranked class in the conference with more players signed than everyone ranked ahead of us. YOU took all that and is trying to paint a picture of some stellar class that's coming in and that simply isn't the truth.

That's a pretty good assessment of our current situation.
This is my non-signature signature.

Kevin

How many five star guys does Loyola Chicago have. This year they have beat Florida, Miami, Tennessee.

Coaching still means something in college basketball
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.<br />James 4:7
Reject Every Kind Of Evil 1 Thessalonians 5:22

Letsroll1200


Kevin

Quote from: Letsroll1200 on March 17, 2018, 10:19:28 pm
Just Keep Watching. I'm so excited about the newcomers.

Watch them play the same basketball we have been watching for 7 years.

Not excited at all
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.<br />James 4:7
Reject Every Kind Of Evil 1 Thessalonians 5:22

Großer Kriegschwein

Quote from: Kevin on March 17, 2018, 10:22:30 pm
Watch them play the same basketball we have been watching for 7 years.

Not excited at all

Well there is the excitement of us actually playing defense for a half or so every 4-5 games.
This is my non-signature signature.

GoHogs1091

Porter Moser and Chris Beard are 2 former UALR Head Coaches who are now in the Sweet 16.

Meanwhile, we are stuck in a time warp waiting for a replication of 1994 and 1995 while some are defending Anderson.

GA reddiehog

Quote from: RazorPiggie on March 17, 2018, 03:44:58 pm
If he wasn't associated with Nolan he'd already be gone.

You are so correct!!!

GA reddiehog

Quote from: daprospecta on March 17, 2018, 08:52:40 pm
So ESPN has said we have a good class coming in and you want me to back it up? I bet you sit around criticizing McDonald's AA's too huh? I don't have to prove to you why they aren't good.  ESPN is very reputable. Until they get in and disappoint, we have a good class coming in.  Go kick rocks.
General is that you? If not you must be related the way you stand up for MA.

Breems

Quote from: Kevin on March 17, 2018, 10:22:30 pm
Watch them play the same basketball we have been watching for 7 years.

We'd have to wait 2-3 years to even get that.
Proud member of the "Left Before Halftime" football club.

Quote from: Breems on January 27, 2011, 08:42:29 pm<br />SCREW VANDERBILT<br />

orvillesghost

I have never understood and still dont how people can defend a guy who in seven years has never won the league championship or made it past the round of 32 in the NCAA.

Just once I wish a MA supporter would honestly say how they can defend that record.

It is true we might do worse than Mike but is it not worth taking the chance?

Jek Tono Porkins

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 12:52:51 pm
The mob with its pitchforks is out again.  Anderson is a very good coach.  Even though he doesn't cheat, he still wins most of the time.  He is the best Arkansas is likely to get.  Fire him and the most likely result is that we get worse.  I'd say we'd have about an 80% chance of getting worse and a 20% chance of getting better, were we to fire him.  It's a dumb bet to make.  In addition, Anderson is a clean coach.  He hasn't found round-about ways of paying players like many of his adversaries.  You are foolish not to factor that in.  If the FBI investigation results in a more level playing field for clean coaches like Anderson, then the handicaps he faces in getting five star talent will be gone. Let's see how that works out.
Yeah and if my aunt had stones she'd be my uncle.
I have known the troubles I was born to know
I have wanted things a poor man's born to want
And in all my dreams and memories I go running
Through the fields of Arkansas from which I sprung

99toLife

Quote from: orvillesghost on March 17, 2018, 11:52:02 pm
I have never understood and still dont how people can defend a guy who in seven years has never won the league championship or made it past the round of 32 in the NCAA.

Just once I wish a MA supporter would honestly say how they can defend that record.

It is true we might do worse than Mike but is it not worth taking the chance?

He only makes $49,000.00 a week. You get what you pay for.  ;)

Letsroll1200

Quote from: 99toLife on March 17, 2018, 11:59:28 pm
He only makes $49,000.00 a week. You get what you pay for.  ;)

And they're off... Here they come. I really missed you guys during the winning streak. You should visit after victories

99toLife

Quote from: Letsroll1200 on March 18, 2018, 12:08:31 am
And they're off... Here they come. I really missed you guys during the winning streak. You should visit after victories

I have never dissed Mike on Hogville. I do laugh at the CMA crowd that thought he was the Messiah.

Letsroll1200

Quote from: Kevin on March 17, 2018, 10:22:30 pm
Watch them play the same basketball we have been watching for 7 years.

Not excited at all

This was not MA's best coaching job. Some guys just wasn't clicking and chemistry on this team was not there. It did get better but early in league play guys were playing for self.
MA and his staff spent too much time trying to fix off the court stuff. This was suppose to be a senior team but they didn't work like it. I love the players but as a fan it's refreshing to see this group leave. Did enough to get by but never enough to be great.
This program and Mike need this new energy and change. I tweeted that you can't coach effort after the game. The first person to like the tweet was Daniel Gafford. Playing hard should be in the DNA of all Razorbacks.

Letsroll1200

Quote from: 99toLife on March 18, 2018, 12:11:14 am
I have never dissed Mike on Hogville. I do laugh at the CMA crowd that thought he was the Messiah.

Three words for you.. Just Keep Watching

orvillesghost

No program that takes itself seriously would stand for this kind of record after seven years. But Arkansas seems content anymore to not demand excellence.


I shouldn't gripe really and I admit that for I rarely even watch a game  these days for I have learned to expect little from the major programs save baseball.

But growing up in the 1977-1995 era, it still gets to me at times.

BenDial

Boils down to this: high floor, low ceiling. That's what you get with CMA.

Sivad

Quote from: RazorPiggie on March 17, 2018, 03:44:58 pm
If he wasn't associated with Nolan he'd already be gone.
He never would have been here.

Fan701

Quote from: 31to6 on March 17, 2018, 08:42:29 pm
Nothing meaningful will come of the FBI investigation.

Poor, naive Mike thinks the NCAA is going to punish the wicked and raise up the righteous but it just doesn't work that way.

UNC and Auburn have basically shown that if you stonewall the NCAA, there is nothing they will do. If the worst happens and a program is caught red-handed they may vacate some wins--but NOBODY CARES. They still won the games. Their players still got drafted. Heck, Pitino ran a bordello on campus and doesn't even have a show cause.

Nothing will happen that changes college basketball for the better.
You may well be right.  We'll see.  "Some rise by sin, and some by virtue fall."

BannerMountainMan

It's going to be refreshing to see a new wave come in that will pride theirself on defense
"Michael Qualls with the dunk at the buzzer, it goes and Arkansas wins, it goes and Arkansas wins"

GuvHog

Quote from: Fan701 on March 17, 2018, 02:54:29 pm
I don't think you've been following the story of the FBI investigation very closely.  Many if not most of the top teams are implicated in the investigation.  College basketball is hugely corrupt, while the chances that MA is involved in the corruption are zero.  As it stands right now, unless it is someone like Bobby Portis who always wanted to be a hog, there is little chance that Anderson will ever get a five star recruit, even in-state.  Players of that caliber almost always go to teams that figure out a way to funnel money to their families.  If the Perry and Monk fiascos didn't open your eyes, I guess nothing will.

Not correct. The ONLY SEC team under FBI investigation is Kentucky and Calipari.
Bleeding Razorback Red Since Birth!!!

BannerMountainMan

Quote from: GuvHog on March 18, 2018, 08:16:39 am
Not correct. The ONLY SEC team under FBI investigation is Kentucky and Calipari.
and Auburn, Alabama, and LSU
"Michael Qualls with the dunk at the buzzer, it goes and Arkansas wins, it goes and Arkansas wins"

lc480

Mike is a good guy but  he isn't gonna win the National Championship at Arkansas!!!!!!!!

rude1

Quote from: lc480 on March 18, 2018, 09:28:32 am
Mike is a good guy but  he isn't gonna win the National Championship at Arkansas!!!!!!!!
He could be forgiven for that. Let's start just by winning a couple of games in the tourney!!!!