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Was this our ceiling under CMA?

Started by discombobulationist, March 16, 2018, 04:33:38 pm

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discombobulationist

A guard-heavy, senior-heavy team just got their azz handed to them by a mid-major. This is about as good as it's going to get under Mike Anderson, isn't it? We have no savior in sight, this is it. Is this good enough for our fanbase? Is there any evidence that we'll be any better than this team in the next few years? Maybe he just can't get the job done here?
Quote from: Dwight_K_Shrute on September 05, 2014, 02:17:08 pm
ISIS could be overrunning your city and Rick would talk about how nice it is to have new neighbors.

root_hawg


 

kp72204

(Sad Voice) Florida got our 6 seed.

runich

I honestly believe it is.

I love MA, I do...but his teams play extremely undisciplined and lack key fundamentals to be more successful.

I do hope that I am wrong...because he'll be coaching us for a good while to come.

RagingHawgOn


Boardon Hamsay

Very tellng that this question is being posed.
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hawganatic

Quote from: discombobulationist on March 16, 2018, 04:33:38 pm
A guard-heavy, senior-heavy team just got their azz handed to them by a mid-major.

Butler is in the Big East right?  How is that a mid-major?

rude1

Unfortunately I expect we will continue to trot MA out there at least another couple of seasons and continue to achieve these results or less, and nothing more.

orvillesghost


Beaverfever

Yes.  The proof is in the pudding.  I think mike got us out of a dark place but you've gotta know when it's time to say "thanks but we've gotta take it to the next level and you're not the guy."

Atlhogfan1

He might still hang around long enough where everything comes together for a season like it did for Nutt in that one season finally.  Well almost (3-19 passing vs LSU, like a Hog basketball effort on the big stage).

But if you are expecting a consistently relevant program on a national level, ...  Plenty of offseason to talk about this now.  Did not think it would start today and not after a spanking like that. 
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

Muleriderhog

Yes. Next year is going to be bad, really bad. It's time for him to go and I hate saying that because I hoped it was going to work out. It's time though to go a different route, he's never going to get us anything better than a first weekend exit.

McKdaddy

Quote from: Beaverfever on March 16, 2018, 04:45:58 pm
Yes.  The proof is in the pudding.  I think mike got us out of a dark place but you've gotta know when it's time to say "thanks but we've gotta take it to the next level and you're not the guy."
Don't buy upgrades, ride up grades.

"You are everything that is wrong with this place . . . Ban me"

"CPI, ex-food and energy, is only good for an anorexic pedestrian"--Art Cashin

 

yraciv

That's a stupid comment.  We won 26 games last year, and almost beat the number 1 seed in the 2nd round.  We also won 27 and lost in 2nd round, 3 years ago. So shouldn't either of those be the proposed ceiling?

McKdaddy

Quote from: rude1 on March 16, 2018, 04:43:42 pm
Unfortunately I expect we will continue to trot MA out there at least another couple of seasons and continue to achieve these results or less, and nothing more.


Agreed.
Don't buy upgrades, ride up grades.

"You are everything that is wrong with this place . . . Ban me"

"CPI, ex-food and energy, is only good for an anorexic pedestrian"--Art Cashin

WorfHog

I think so, I've been a staunch CMA supporter,but we've been unprepared and come out flat too many times this season. I don't have any faith in the future and feel like we wasted on of the most talented teams I've ever seen at Arkansas.

MemphisBossHog

Quote from: runich on March 16, 2018, 04:42:04 pm
I honestly believe it is.

I love MA, I do...but his teams play extremely undisciplined and lack key fundamentals to be more successful.

I do hope that I am wrong...because he'll be coaching us for a good while to come.
you are spot on.  I want Mike to succeed but this is what 6 ? 7? Years now ?  Mike needs a TON of talent cause he will NEVER "outcoach" anyone on the NCAA tourney level. So unless Mike can get some 5 star kids who he can actually keep in the recruiting class, yes today is about the ceiling for MA

Marshfieldhog

Looking that way. Even Stan Heath( and Pel with heath's players) was making it to the NCAA first weekend. Not much difference.

Atlhogfan1

Quote from: yraciv on March 16, 2018, 04:46:31 pm
That's a stupid comment.  We won 26 games last year, and almost beat the number 1 seed in the 2nd round.  We also won 27 and lost in 2nd round, 3 years ago. So shouldn't either of those be the proposed ceiling?

Sure.  Pick one of those.  Does it matter much? 

I'm still waiting to see him put a team on the court who can play "Hawg Ball 40 minutes of whatever" well.

Time to focus on our Dookies now yr!
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

rzrbackramsfan

I don't think so, but I'm going to start drinking now.

pigture perfect

The 2 biggest fools in the world: He who has an answer for everything and he who argues with him.  - original.<br /> <br />The first thing I'm going to ask a lawyer (when I might need one) is, "You don't post on Hogville do you?"

AirWarren

Quote from: discombobulationist on March 16, 2018, 04:33:38 pm
A guard-heavy, senior-heavy team just got their azz handed to them by a mid-major. This is about as good as it's going to get under Mike Anderson, isn't it? We have no savior in sight, this is it. Is this good enough for our fanbase? Is there any evidence that we'll be any better than this team in the next few years? Maybe he just can't get the job done here?

This is the ceiling of Arkansas athletics.

Average at best.

yraciv

Quote from: MemphisBossHog on March 16, 2018, 04:48:33 pm
you are spot on.  I want Mike to succeed but this is what 6 ? 7? Years now ?  Mike needs a TON of talent cause he will NEVER "outcoach" anyone on the NCAA tourney level. So unless Mike can get some 5 star kids who he can actually keep in the recruiting class, yes today is about the ceiling for MA

Mike Anderson led UAB to a sweet 16, and Mizzou to an elite 8. So yes he has actually overachieved in the ncaa tournament in at least 2 situations where he had inferior talent. His round of 32 losses at other schools are up for debate.

Kevin

this is what he does. the elite 8 And sweet 16 year are outliers
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.<br />James 4:7
Reject Every Kind Of Evil 1 Thessalonians 5:22

 

respirback


razorbackchamps94


PygmalionEffect2

What is so bad is the opportunity cost.

Unlike football, Arkansas has solid basketball talent in state and at first Mike couldn't even recruit successfully here, but now that he's done better at least recruiting his home state where there are talented players that will commit to Arkansas no matter who is on staff, Mike has been unable to get hardly any talent from outside our borders.

To me, his recruiting performance is every bit as bad as his coaching performance on and off the court, and man that's really saying something.
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TeufelHog

YES, and you must be blind if you can't see it.  This was his BIG SENIOR LADEN CLASS and he drew the easier of the brackets to navigate.

Barring a minor miracle, it will be at least 3 more seasons before CMA "sniffs" another NCAA tourney at Arkansas.  If he couldn't develop his current talent, I don't see him being capable of developing his future talent.  Year after year it's the same story . . . players with low basketball IQ.  That is a direct reflection on your head coach and staff.

ifghog

Quote from: PygmalionEffect2 on March 16, 2018, 05:06:13 pm
What is so bad is the opportunity cost.

Unlike football, Arkansas has solid basketball talent in state and at first Mike couldn't even recruit successfully here, but now that he's done better at least recruiting his home state where there are talented players that will commit to Arkansas no matter who is on staff, Mike has been unable to get hardly any talent from outside our borders.

To me, his recruiting performance is every bit as bad as his coaching performance on and off the court, and man that's really saying something.
You sir are right on the money!

oldbooniehog

Give him another six or seven years, and who knows?

Maybe Arkansas will reach the Sweet Sixteen?

nwahogfan1

Quote from: discombobulationist on March 16, 2018, 04:33:38 pm
A guard-heavy, senior-heavy team just got their azz handed to them by a mid-major. This is about as good as it's going to get under Mike Anderson, isn't it? We have no savior in sight, this is it. Is this good enough for our fanbase? Is there any evidence that we'll be any better than this team in the next few years? Maybe he just can't get the job done here?

I agree we got our butt kicked and it was not even close.  Mike's guard heavy team with not much inside game will not win very often in the NCAAT.  But Butler who competes well in the Big East is no Mid Major.  Also,  this is the first year for this Coach who is like 33 years old and he kicked Mike's run and gun guard heavy team badly. 

discombobulationist

Quote from: yraciv on March 16, 2018, 04:46:31 pm
That's a stupid comment.  We won 26 games last year, and almost beat the number 1 seed in the 2nd round.  We also won 27 and lost in 2nd round, 3 years ago. So shouldn't either of those be the proposed ceiling?
So, 1 win in the tournament every couple of years is the ceiling? Is that good enough?
Quote from: Dwight_K_Shrute on September 05, 2014, 02:17:08 pm
ISIS could be overrunning your city and Rick would talk about how nice it is to have new neighbors.

lynbug

Quote from: runich on March 16, 2018, 04:42:04 pm
I honestly believe it is.

I love MA, I do...but his teams play extremely undisciplined and lack key fundamentals to be more successful.

I do hope that I am wrong...because he'll be coaching us for a good while to come.
[/quote
This, this, and this.   Next year I'm gonna be hoping for a NIT bid...a higher chance of playing more than one game.  And...we might even get to play at home.

LRHawg


lynbug

Quote from: Marshfieldhog on March 16, 2018, 04:49:00 pm
Looking that way. Even Stan Heath( and Pel with heath's players) was making it to the NCAA first weekend. Not much difference.
I'm sure many have forgotten this fact.  A five or six-year program rebuild was too long back then.  Now we're looking at...what...10-12 year rebuild?  Yeah, I know, we're not on probation and I'm glad but I'm getting old...waiting for "the year".

Breems

I waited 6-7 years for an Arkansas team with great, experienced guards - the signature recipe for a great Mike Anderson team.

This was it. Barford and Macon are rare talents. Beard was a 4-year senior. Hall is a tough-as-nails slasher, defender, and rebounder. We had a decent set of athletic forwards with an NBA big man anchoring the paint. You'll never convince me Mike didn't have everything he needed.

If Mike couldn't get it done with this roster, I'm not sure how anyone could have any hope left.
Proud member of the "Left Before Halftime" football club.

Quote from: Breems on January 27, 2011, 08:42:29 pm<br />SCREW VANDERBILT<br />

King Kong

Considering he has already taken higher than this no.

Now is a 5th seed bumped in the second round his ceiling here?

Maybe

code red

"If what you did yesterday seems big, you haven't done anything today."  Dr. Lou

12247

I don't believe most of you are getting it.  Mike's teams are as good as they want to be on any given day, and not as good a Mike wants them to be.  His 2 best teams were better at giving more, however, even then, they usually only gave about 70 percent and Mike wouldn't demand more.  Every so often, you get a player who can and will motivate himself and then maybe another or 2 that says hell, lets get it.  Has nothing to do with Mike.  He couldn't motivate a frog to jump.     
Today the boys weren't ready, never got ready and couldn't motivate themselves and you see the results.

The_Iceman

Mediocre Mike will never make a SWEET 16 at Arkansas.

golfinpig

Quote from: yraciv on March 16, 2018, 04:46:31 pm
That's a stupid comment.  We won 26 games last year, and almost beat the number 1 seed in the 2nd round.  We also won 27 and lost in 2nd round, 3 years ago. So shouldn't either of those be the proposed ceiling?
We "ALMOST" beat a really good team last year. It sure doesn't take much to make you happy.

roothawg


golfinpig

Quote from: Breems on March 16, 2018, 06:16:35 pm
I waited 6-7 years for an Arkansas team with great, experienced guards - the signature recipe for a great Mike Anderson team.

This was it. Barford and Macon are rare talents. Beard was a 4-year senior. Hall is a tough-as-nails slasher, defender, and rebounder. We had a decent set of athletic forwards with an NBA big man anchoring the paint. You'll never convince me Mike didn't have everything he needed.

If Mike couldn't get it done with this roster, I'm not sure how anyone could have any hope left.
Amen brother!

Oliver

Obviously not since we've made the second round but the second round is his ceiling here

roothawg

Butler is a good team and has had more success than we have for several years. We are getting better as a program. Better kids coming in so still trending up. Still need the floor general that all great teams have.

Locutus_of_Boar

Quote from: yraciv on March 16, 2018, 04:46:31 pm
That's a stupid comment.  We won 26 games last year, and almost beat the number 1 seed in the 2nd round.  We also won 27 and lost in 2nd round, 3 years ago. So shouldn't either of those be the proposed ceiling?

1996 end of 20 year run of tournament competitive Arkansas Basketball:  9 Sweet 16+ in 20 years

Since then:
1997 DNP
1998 2nd Round lost by 6
1999 2nd Round lost by 10
2000 1st Round lost by 4
2001 1st Round lost by 2
2002 DNP
2003 DNP
2004 DNP
2005 DNP
2006 1st Round lost by 4
2007 1st Round lost by 17
2008 2nd Round lost by 31
2009 DNP
2010 DNP
2011 DNP
2012 DNP
2013 DNP
2014 DNP
2015 2nd Round, lost by 9pts.
2016 DNP
2017 2nd Round, lost by 7pts.
2018 1st Round, lost by 17 pts.


Lets see:  22 years, 15 games played. averages out to 2/3rds of an NCAA game per year overall, 5/7th of a game per year under MA with 2/7th of an NCAA win per year.  Fractionally better than the pathetic period between NR and MA.  MA loses by 11PPG

Probably most consistently poor tourney performance by any power conference team over that same timespan.

old_school_hawg

"I tried being reasonable. I didn't like it."-Clint Eastwood

"Life is hard. It's harder if you're stupid." -John Wayne

jvanhorn

Quote from: The_Iceman on March 16, 2018, 06:32:54 pm
Mediocre Mike will never make a SWEET 16 at Arkansas.

Typical Mike Anderson team.  He will always win more than her loses, but he will never win when it counts for something major.  Once in every 15 or 20 years he might get to the elite eight like he did with Missouri.  15 years is more than enough track record to see what he is.  I am more of a football, baseball guy to, to be honest, I don't really care that much.  He better be careful  the woman's basketball coach might really be good and start winning some big games.

scogs

Trap and switch defense.  Won't get us very far. Ever

rzrbackramsfan

You never know what kind of chemistry a team will have and if they can get hot, get a good draw and make a run in the tournament.  Making the tournament should be the standard.  Also, our recruiting is still trending up.