Matt Jones on Arkansas Recruiting

[bphi11ips]

I think he was getting heat for saying it was the best article he'd ever read on the subject.

Getting flamed here has never bothered me.  What Matt Jones did there, in my opinion, was lay out a concise road map for Arkansas recruiting, one that has proven itself over time.   There is nothing new under the sun.

[razorbackfaninar]

Getting flamed here has never bothered me.  What Matt Jones did there, in my opinion, was lay out a concise road map for Arkansas recruiting, one that has proven itself over time.   There is nothing new under the sun.

I mean, it was a fine article, but I think people were giving you a hard time about it being the best one you'd ever read and it was basically pointing out stuff that has been talked about for years.

[hawgon]

I liked the article from the standpoint that there is something to be said about recruiting a 3 star that is more than 500 miles from campus, versus a 3 star that is less than 200 miles from campus.

We've always thought of it in terms of in-state recruits doing better than their ranking because they have razorback blood in their veins but recruits just over the border might tend to perform as good or better than advertised as well simply due to logistics and proximity to their home base.

Precisely.  And recruiting far away is much more dependent on relationships and coaches than recruiting in your backyard.  For instance, our recruiting in Florida took a hit when Partridge left.  We are much less susceptible to that in East Texas. 

[razorbackfaninar]

Precisely.  And recruiting far away is much more dependent on relationships and coaches than recruiting in your backyard.  For instance, our recruiting in Florida took a hit when Partridge left.  We are much less susceptible to that in East Texas.

Recruiting far away is also hard to maintain.  For example if you get a kid from south Florida to commit, maybe he's a diamond in the rough with not a lot of offers then he blows up now you are fighting not just all of the Florida schools which is a considerable number, but all the schools between South Florida and Arkansas that might want him and keep him a little closer to home.  There's not really less competition for kids from Texas as all major schools recruit there heavily, but there is less competition between us and Texas.

[nwahogfan1]

Bielema's problem wasn't recruiting. It was coaching, or lack thereof. He is lazy and his teams were lazy.

I agree.  We had good recruiting classes under Beliema but he could never assemble great assistant coaches and keep them. Always changes which lead to uncertainty of style and continuity. I am certain the players felt it.  With so many assistants coming from SMU especially on offense let's hope players feel a unity they have not felt in a while.

[nwahogfan1]

Recruiting far away is also hard to maintain.  For example if you get a kid from south Florida to commit, maybe he's a diamond in the rough with not a lot of offers then he blows up now you are fighting not just all of the Florida schools which is a considerable number, but all the schools between South Florida and Arkansas that might want him and keep him a little closer to home.  There's not really less competition for kids from Texas as all major schools recruit there heavily, but there is less competition between us and Texas.

I agree. If Beliema had not damaged relationships with Texas HS coaches so bad we should have been getting 10+ from there yearly and then cherry picking nationally when we need to. I also love recruiting those  bordering major cities surrounding our state

[Atlhogfan1]

May not have recruited Texas as hard under our last couple of staffs in terms of numbers due to the spread offense disease that overtook the HS football there.  When you try and recruit an OT who says he wants to play somewhere that has a system where he will have as little contact as possible, not really conducive to building a pro style offensive team.  If I had to choose a region from which we could recruit, it would be the gulf coast/deep south and Florida.  But due to our location, it makes it more difficult plus you tend to run into discipline problems with Florida recruits.  Texas HS football has shown to lead to soft college programs.  But this is the route we've chosen.  I'm relieved so far Morris appeared to have learned something from his experience at Clemson and is not focusing on Texas as much as I feared he would but rather is still making efforts in the deep south.  Also don't think he is going to take as many hometown hero reaches from Arkansas as some speculate/dream.

[Atlhogfan1]

I agree. If Beliema had not damaged relationships with Texas HS coaches so bad we should have been getting 10+ from there yearly

From a finesse spread offense state?

[mevskithog]

I agree.  We had good recruiting classes under Beliema but he could never assemble great assistant coaches and keep them. Always changes which lead to uncertainty of style and continuity. I am certain the players felt it.  With so many assistants coming from SMU especially on offense let's hope players feel a unity they have not felt in a while.

This

[JimmyJohnsonsBoat]

Getting flamed here has never bothered me.  What Matt Jones did there, in my opinion, was lay out a concise road map for Arkansas recruiting, one that has proven itself over time.   There is nothing new under the sun.

You posting that article on HV and acting like it is an amazing revelation is equivalent to posting an article that states "cars run on gasoline" in a sports car forum.

Nothing wrong with the article, just completely unnecessary seeing everyone already knew it's contents.

[#1 STUNNA]

there are 2 things that control recruiting..... Winning and the cheaters... no other way around it. if your not doing one or the other... you have zero chance..

[Al Boarland]

I am saying that is a lazy narrative.  There is no way specifically to recruit "for Arkansas".  Football is football, you should be recruiting to your needs based on the style of competition you are going to play. If a kid can play football it doesn't matter whether he is from Texas or Missouri or Florida, or Canada or wherever. Bielema recruited exactly what our historical average has been and it is likely that Morris will too or will stay close to it.  It isn't likely that he will bring in a top 5 or even top 10 recruiting class any time in the foreseeable future, whether he recruits Texas kids or Arkansas kids or kids from Maine or Timbuktu. I agree that Bielema did not have a style that was conducive to scheming for an advantage over teams with more talent.  I think that is why he failed.  He recruited well enough to be competitive at Arkansas, but he wasn't able to adapt to the weaknesses that he had.  In other words I think he stubbornly stuck to trying to do things the way he had done them at Wisconsin and that wasn't going to work here. I think what you are trying to say is that a coach like Petrino, or hopefully Morris can adapt and plan a scheme to overcome inherent weaknesses in recruiting when you are a program that recruits in the top 25 playing against mostly teams that recruit in the top 10.

You know we slung the ball around quite a bit with Enos. The line of thinking that we were some smash mouth football team is inaccurate, IMO. That was mostly because we were playing from behind most of the time, but that goes back to lack of talent on defense. That hasn't changed. 

Morris will use formations and shifts for eye candy, but that's not a new thing in this league anymore. Malzahn has been doing it for years and LSU tried their hand at it for a couple seasons without much success.

CCM's success or failure is going to fall on his ability to upgrade talent and get execution from his players.  If he does that and can win some games he will be able to call the UofA his home for as long as he wants.

This isn't the Petrino era SEC. There is significantly more talent in the conference now than when he was on the sidelines. If we can recruit quality depth we can be competitive. If the classes are in the 20's we will just be middle of the pack in the division.

[JimmyJohnsonsBoat]

there are 2 things that control recruiting..... Winning and the cheaters... no other way around it. if your not doing one or the other... you have zero chance..

You're*

[Busta_Nutt]

there are 2 things that control recruiting..... Winning and the cheaters... no other way around it. if your not doing one or the other... you have zero chance..

If you aren't cheating then you're only cheating yourself.

[Al Boarland]

If you aren't cheating then you're only cheating yourself.

If we are going to successfully recruit Texas HS football you better believe the game will be played. If not, you won't see quality players signing with the UofA.

[bphi11ips]

You posting that article on HV and acting like it is an amazing revelation is equivalent to posting an article that states "cars run on gasoline" in a sports car forum.

Nothing wrong with the article, just completely unnecessary seeing everyone already knew it's contents.

First, I didn't get the sense that "people gave me a hard time".  Also, as sooiegeneris suggested, I considered the source.

Second, I didn't even come close to saying the article is "an amazing revelation" or "groundbreaking".  It is a very thorough summary of facts and theories concerning Razorbacks recruiting, many of which have been poo pooed by regulars here for years. I disagree with you that "everyone already knew its contents".

As inhogswetrust pointed out, Matt Jones is a professional journalist. In my opinion he is a very good young journalist. His articles are always on point. This is Hogville, so if some one says the sky is blue, someone else will say it's purple. No big deal. 

[steveaustin69]

First, I didn't get the sense that "people gave me a hard time".  Also, as sooiegeneris suggested, I considered the source.

Second, I didn't even come close to saying the article is "an amazing revelation" or "groundbreaking".  It is a very thorough summary of facts and theories concerning Razorbacks recruiting, many of which have been poo pooed by regulars here for years. I disagree with you that "everyone already knew its contents".

As inhogswetrust pointed out, Matt Jones is a professional journalist. In my opinion he is a very good young journalist. His articles are always on point. This is Hogville, so if some one says the sky is blue, someone else will say it's purple. No big deal.

It's a whopping 788 word fluff piece.

[JimmyJohnsonsBoat]

First, I didn't get the sense that "people gave me a hard time".  Also, as sooiegeneris suggested, I considered the source.

Second, I didn't even come close to saying the article is "an amazing revelation" or "groundbreaking".  It is a very thorough summary of facts and theories concerning Razorbacks recruiting, many of which have been poo pooed by regulars here for years. I disagree with you that "everyone already knew its contents".

As inhogswetrust pointed out, Matt Jones is a professional journalist. In my opinion he is a very good young journalist. His articles are always on point. This is Hogville, so if some one says the sky is blue, someone else will say it's purple. No big deal.

No need to get upset. I was just pointing out the obvious, which is your favorite pastime.

[bphi11ips]

I agree.  We had good recruiting classes under Beliema but he could never assemble great assistant coaches and keep them. Always changes which lead to uncertainty of style and continuity. I am certain the players felt it.  With so many assistants coming from SMU especially on offense let's hope players feel a unity they have not felt in a while.

This article by Clay Henry may make you feel better about continuity and also about the O-line. Dustin Fry not only has a great resume, he's been with Chad Morris for a long time:

http://www.wholehogsports.com/news/2018/mar/23/state-hogs-dustin-frys-tutorial-watch-spread-teams/

[bphi11ips]

No need to get upset. I was just pointing out the obvious, which is your favorite pastime.

Why do I get the sense you've posted in this thread under three screennames? 

I really couldn't care less what you think, so don't flatter yourself.

[bphi11ips]

It's a whopping 788 word fluff piece.

First alias.

May I suggest "pusillanimous jackwagon" as your next screenname?

[JimmyJohnsonsBoat]

Why do I get the sense you've posted in this thread under three screennames? 

I really couldn't care less what you think, so don't flatter yourself.

You caught me, my other account is bphi11ips.

[Busta_Nutt]

First alias.

May I suggest "pusillanimous jackwagon" as your next screenname?

That's a good one. I think I'll do that.

[oldhawg]

As inhogswetrust pointed out, Matt Jones is a professional journalist. In my opinion he is a very good young journalist. His articles are always on point. This is Hogville, so if some one says the sky is blue, someone else will say it's purple. No big deal. 

Hey, the sky here was a mobile green a few nights ago.  Admittedly, I am on Alaska's North Slope for a while, and sights like this are not entirely  uncommon.

I'll read just about anything I can about the Razorbacks, and take away from it whatever I decide is relevant ---- breaking news, updates, summaries and reviews, personal interest stories, recruiting news, historical narratives, fluff, and outright BS ---- just keep the Razorbacks in the news.

ps. I have yet to have any major complaints about Matt Jones's articles.  Up and comers need to replace the Wally Hall's on the circuit (although I have to admit that I also read Wally from time to time, and occasionally like one of his articles).

[bphi11ips]

That's a good one. I think I'll do that.

+1 for sense of humor. Busta nutt only.

[#1 STUNNA]

You're*

thank you!

[#1 STUNNA]

Our coaches can hustle and grind all they want.. but until we start winning games... the odds will always be against us beating out the powers for the elite talent unless they are in state. I think Morris can definitely get us going in the right direction. But im not holding my breath thinking hes just gonna kill it for recruits until we are winning games. or until we start delivering money filled envelopes to their parents.

[bphi11ips]

Our coaches can hustle and grind all they want.. but until we start winning games... the odds will always be against us beating out the powers for the elite talent unless they are in state. I think Morris can definitely get us going in the right direction. But im not holding my breath thinking hes just gonna kill it for recruits until we are winning games. or until we start delivering money filled envelopes to their parents.

All I expect is a return to being a team that every other team in the SEC respects as one who will fight you to the finish and who will beat you if you don't bring your A-game.  We've been that team most of the time since we joined the conference.

I don't want any part of bagmen. The FBI probe may be a signal that under the table payments to players are about to be under the microscope of law enforcement in much the same way that payola was almost 15 years ago under New York District Attorney Eliot Spitzer.  Even a short-term reduction in bagmen should help Arkansas.

[#1 STUNNA]

All I expect is a return to being a team that every other team in the SEC respects as one who will fight you to the finish and who will beat you if you don't bring your A-game.  We've been that team most of the time since we joined the conference.

I don't want any part of bagmen. The FBI probe may be a signal that under the table payments to players are about to be under the microscope of law enforcement in much the same way that payola was almost 15 years ago under New York District Attorney Eliot Spitzer.  Even a short-term reduction in bagmen should help Arkansas.

I agree. But unless the bagman comes to town. Wei will have to beat and compete other teams with lesser talent. Hopefully Morris develops our talent more than Bert.

[liljo]

It's a whopping 788 word fluff piece.

You...counted the words...

BaHaHaHaHa!

[steveaustin69]

You...counted the words...

BaHaHaHaHa!

I don't know how you've made it this far in life if you don't know Microsoft Word shows a word count. Lord be with you; you need it.

[HogPharmer]

"99% of all putts that are short don't go in the hole."

Lee Trevino

Lee Trevino never saw Caddyshack.


Or Happy Gilmore....

[bphi11ips]

Lee Trevino never saw Caddyshack.


Or Happy Gilmore....

Bill Murray was not even a gleam in Lorne Michaels' eye when Trevino said that.

[liljo]

I don't know how you've made it this far in life if you don't know Microsoft Word shows a word count. Lord be with you; you need it.

As a matter of fact, I DO know that. So you copied the article into Word, this article of precious little significance, so that you could see how many words it contained!
BA HA HA HA HA HA

[steveaustin69]

As a matter of fact, I DO know that. So you copied the article into Word, this article of precious little significance, so that you could see how many words it contained!
BA HA HA HA HA HA

Then you should know that takes maybe 5 seconds to do. Most would say 5 seconds is an insignificant amount of time.

[Busta_Nutt]

Can we get a cage match between Steve Austin and Lil Jon & the Eastside Boyz?

[liljo]

Then you should know that takes maybe 5 seconds to do. Most would say 5 seconds is an insignificant amount of time.

Actually, I should be pretty impressed, come to think of it. You went All Out to be CERTAIN your post was Exactly Correct. 

I take it all back. The laughter. The fun. The kidding around.

You, sir, are One Serious Hog Village People....PERSON....Hog Village PERSON.

[jbigs77]

Did you know that 99% of the time Arkansas scores more points in a game than their opposition,  they win?

Its that 1% that really pisses me off.

[liljo]

Can we get a cage match between Steve Austin and Lil Jon & the Eastside Boyz?

Sears Parking Lot, Little Rock Arkansas, 10AM. April 7.

We don't need no stinking cage.

What's left of us can then limp on over to the stadium and watch the R-W game. 

[HogPharmer]

Sears Parking Lot, Little Rock Arkansas, 10AM. April 7.

We don't need no stinking cage.

What's left of us can then limp on over to the stadium and watch the R-W game. 

Not the Alma Sonic?

[bphi11ips]

Not the Alma Sonic?

Long limp to WMS.

[urkillnmesmalls]

It's not a good article.

And you're not a good poster. 

[urkillnmesmalls]

"99% of all putts that are short don't go in the hole."

Lee Trevino

100% of all putts that roll past the hole don't go in either.   - Jack Nicklaus   

[liljo]

And you're not a good poster.

Maybe he's better in person. He'll dang sure need to be. Promise.

[ChitownHawg]

The point being made was that Bielema didn't recruit well to Arkansas.  If you want to argue that he didn't develop them well, didn't utilize them right didn't keep them on campus etc then that is a different argument.  By any objective measure he recruited as well to Arkansas as anyone has. This argument that he didn't "understand" Arkansas or how to recruit here, is a lazy argument and doesn't really look at the reality of why he failed as the coach here.

Exactly. CBP had the fortune of becoming our coach at a time our state had a bumper crop of great recruits. Our sports teams do very well when our in state kids are top athletes. We fall off in down years.

[Cinco de Hogo]

Getting flamed here has never bothered me.  What Matt Jones did there, in my opinion, was lay out a concise road map for Arkansas recruiting, one that has proven itself over time.   There is nothing new under the sun.

I just got one question for you, do you still think i'm an idiot? LOL! 😎

[hogsanity]

They can recruit Arkansas all they want, but if there is not LEGIT SEC TALENT here to recruit it is not going to change the results. If you continually get the 8th-10th best class, you will continually be 8th or so in the SEC. It does not matter where the players come from, it matters if they are better than what the opponent has on any given Saturday. If the top 10 players in AR are all Rb's and WR's, does it really help to sign all of them?

[Busta_Nutt]

I just got one question for you, do you still think i'm An idiot? LOL! 😎

Your signature line suggests so.

[bphi11ips]

They can recruit Arkansas all they want, but if there is not LEGIT SEC TALENT here to recruit it is not going to change the results. If you continually get the 8th-10th best class, you will continually be 8th or so in the SEC. It does not matter where the players come from, it matters if they are better than what the opponent has on any given Saturday. If the top 10 players in AR are all Rb's and WR's, does it really help to sign all of them?

Did you read the article?

[hogsanity]

Did you read the article?

Yes I did. My reply was more to those talking about recruiting the state itself.

The article was nothing new. Hogs have to get most of their best players from out of state. And they used to get them from places like Memphis and Dallas.