Guys should I(we) be worried about Arkansas athletics?

[hogfan064]

Here's my problem.  I live in South Carolina and I am surrounded by Gamecock fans.  For years they were a joke of a program in about every sport and it was a program Arkansas fans could laugh at.  It was always a program that Arkansas could point to and say we're better than them.  When both schools entered the SEC Arkansas was the main attraction. USC was added due to its fan base and it being a new market. Arkansas by far was the better program, but look what's happened and some of us are blind by it

Since 2000

Football

USC-40-31 with 4 winning seasons and tons of national exposure with Spurrier and Holtz

Arkansas 40-33 with 4 winning seasons and no national exposure other than a SEC Championship blowout and HDN flirting with Nebraska

The Series is even a 3-3 since 2000.  Look at the recruits USC is now in the running for, look at the ones we're looking at.  USC is far ahead of us in this. 

Basketball

Under Odom- USC has 4 postseason appearances in 5 years.  2 NIT Championships, 1 NIT runner up, and 1 NCAA appearance.  Odom is 100-69 at USC.  Odom is 20-7 in the postseason

Under Heath-Hogs have 1 postseason appearances and have done awful in the SEC tourney

Baseball

This isn't even close.  While DVH is a great coach, Tanner has done more with USC since 2000 than any other SEC coach.

My point is this.  While we're worrying about try to catch Auburn, Florida, UGA, LSU, and UT the Gamecocks are slowly passing us.   Joining the SEC has helped USC and hurt Arkansas. 

Am I way off on this?   THis is especially true in football.

[Macgyver Hawg]

All good points.  I can see where Arkansas is dropping while other schools are climbing.

[hogfan064]

All good points.  I can see where Arkansas is dropping while other schools are climbing.

This is truly the only school that has really passed us.  MSU, Ole Miss, Vandy, and UK are the only schools currently trailing us.  At one time South Carolina would go into that slot, but not any longer. Hard to catch Florida when you're getting passed by USC.

And what does it come back to?  Coaching.   USC has probably the best group of coaches combined in the 3 biggest sports(football, basketball, baseball)  In football they've gone from one legend to another.   

[TorsinAHog]

USC has top facilities, good recruiting base, top staff and a strong fan base.  I cant see why they were so bad for so long.

[Macgyver Hawg]

Ole Miss took in a top 15 recruiting class in Football.

We are the only SEC West team that's not won 10 games in a season since the BCS started.

[hogfan064]

USC has top facilities, good recruiting base, top staff and a strong fan base.  I cant see why they were so bad for so long.

Their facilities are nothing compared to Arkansas  The stadium is off campus and that hurts alot.  They have awesome fan support.  The reason they were down so long in football is because Clemson was so great.  In Basketball they were at one time a national power under Frank Mcguire, but they decided to leave the ACC and it really hurt the program.  They've always been great at baseball.

[hogfan064]

Ole Miss took in a top 15 recruiting class in Football.

We are the only SEC West team that's not won 10 games in a season since the BCS started.

I'm not worried about a class of JUCOs.  I still consider us above Ole Miss in all sports

[Donald Miller]

This is sobering. 

[sportscrazy]

Basketball was turned into a mess in the late 90's and early 00's with the Nolan situation.  That was an extraordinary situation and one that I think is being taken care of.  I am not sold on Stan Heath but he certaintly turning the recruiting around.

Football has been coaching.
Baseball is getting better however I do give the nod to USC.

Let's face the facts though football and men's basketball are the main measuring stick for most programs.  In some cases women's basketball and baseball can be added and in a very few certain cases softball is well known but nationally these two are the one's most point to.

USC has definitely become stronger in football.  That is easy to see.  Basketball is different.  I would say right now we are neck and neck in basketball.  First we still have a basketball tradition that USC does not.  Second Arkansas is getting back to nationally competitve status the last two years and I do not think Stan Heath will be given much longer if he doesn't continue to improve on this.  I thought AR was one player away this year from being a sweet 16 or elite 8 team.  A POINT GUARD.  That is why we had the chemistry problems.  Playing without a point guard is ALMOST like playing without a QB in football and McCurdy was not good enough yet.  He was too unpredictable and was not strong enough defensively.  You can not honestly blame Heath b/c he started with NOTHING 4 years ago.  Most coaches have at least some talent remaining when the last head coach left but he had absolutely nothing.  I do believe this next year he should no longer get a free pass.  This should be the year he gets the players he needs and puts together the team we can all be proud of.  If he can't then a change is needed and we will definitely have to say that USC has surpassed us in all the major sports.

[hogfan064]

Basketball was turned into a mess in the late 90's and early 00's with the Nolan situation.  That was an extraordinary situation and one that I think is being taken care of.  I am not sold on Stan Heath but he certaintly turning the recruiting around.

Football has been coaching.
Baseball is getting better however I do give the nod to USC.

Let's face the facts though football and men's basketball are the main measuring stick for most programs.  In some cases women's basketball and baseball can be added and in a very few certain cases softball is well known but nationally these two are the one's most point to.

USC has definitely become stronger in football.  That is easy to see.  Basketball is different.  I would say right now we are neck and neck in basketball.  First we still have a basketball tradition that USC does not.  Second Arkansas is getting back to nationally competitve status the last two years and I do not think Stan Heath will be given much longer if he doesn't continue to improve on this.  I thought AR was one player away this year from being a sweet 16 or elite 8 team.  A POINT GUARD.  That is why we had the chemistry problems.  Playing without a point guard is ALMOST like playing without a QB in football and McCurdy was not good enough yet.  He was too unpredictable and was not strong enough defensively.  You can not honestly blame Heath b/c he started with NOTHING 4 years ago.  Most coaches have at least some talent remaining when the last head coach left but he had absolutely nothing.  I do believe this next year he should no longer get a free pass.  This should be the year he gets the players he needs and puts together the team we can all be proud of.  If he can't then a change is needed and we will definitely have to say that USC has surpassed us in all the major sports.

I agree with you in basketball, but I do believe Odom is the better coach.  I mean the guy won ACC Championships at Wake.  USC's basketball facility is almost an exact replica of BWA.  Arkansas has better basketball fans, but give USC a winner and they'll have 18,000 in the stands for ever game instead of 10,000.  The fact that this is even a conversation is sad

[Ben Steiger]

I don't believe USC is stronger than Arkansas in football. We were a few wins away from some major stuff. They have only recently become good - I do recall several 5-6 seasons in Spurrierville. And you know the media loves Spurrier... and with probably good reason, the man's (much as I hate him) has won a NC.

As for basketball, I believe we out-class USC. Stan Heath, as an earlier poster said, had NOTHING from Nolan. Nolan was not even bothering to recruit. We have a much better tradition, facilites, and etc, and we did whip USC by 20+ this year - they won the NIT, we lost in the first round of the NCAA tourney. Take your choice.

I might be ready to concede it's neck and neck in football with USC, and baseball, but not basketball.

[hogfan064]

I don't believe USC is stronger than Arkansas in football. We were a few wins away from some major stuff. They have only recently become good - I do recall several 5-6 seasons in Spurrierville. And you know the media loves Spurrier... and with probably good reason, the man's (much as I hate him) has won a NC.

As for basketball, I believe we out-class USC. Stan Heath, as an earlier poster said, had NOTHING from Nolan. Nolan was not even bothering to recruit. We have a much better tradition, facilites, and etc, and we did whip USC by 20+ this year - they won the NIT, we lost in the first round of the NCAA tourney. Take your choice.

I might be ready to concede it's neck and neck in football with USC, and baseball, but not basketball.

Yes, in 2002 and 2003 USC did have 5 win seasons, but the past 2 years we only have 9 wins to their 13.   USC was a missed extra point away from winning the SEC East in Spurrier's first year.  This was with a group of players accustomed to running an entirely different offense under Holtz.  They beat Florida and Tennessee in the same year and lost to Clemson by 4 and Georgia by 3.   USC is currently in on about every top QB in the nation and is on Jimmy Clausen's top 3 list.  They just got a commitment from the nation's top CB.  If 2 teams are even in talent you go to coaching.  Well, you might hate the guy but are you going to take HDN over Spurrier?

Yeah we beat USC in Fayetteville, but keep in mind Balkman wasn't playing, he's the team's best player.  Play the game in Columbia without Brewer and how do you think we do?  True the Hogs went to the NCAA tourney, but they went 1-2 in the postseason.  USC went 8-1.  I don't know which is better, but I know USC doesn't lose its top 2 scorers next year like the Hogs do. 

[Ben Steiger]

Spurrier is a great coach. Much as I can't stand him, he wins, and I'd love to see him in Fayetteville for that reason. He has star power... that's why those kids are signing. A NC, and a NFL head coach stint does wonders for recruiting...

[hogfan064]

Spurrier is a great coach. Much as I can't stand him, he wins, and I'd love to see him in Fayetteville for that reason. He has star power... that's why those kids are signing. A NC, and a NFL head coach stint does wonders for recruiting...

I actually like the guy now that I get to hear him on a daily basis.  He speaks nothing but the truth.  He doesn't BS around like some coaches do.  You ask him a question and he answers it honestly.  You gotta like that.

[Ben Steiger]

Well, yea. I haven't heard him enough, but I can respect that. As a person, however, he's an arrogant, cocky so-and-so.

[neblon]

Here's my problem.  I live in South Carolina and I am surrounded by Gamecock fans.  For years they were a joke of a program in about every sport and it was a program Arkansas fans could laugh at.  It was always a program that Arkansas could point to and say we're better than them.  When both schools entered the SEC Arkansas was the main attraction. USC was added due to its fan base and it being a new market. Arkansas by far was the better program, but look what's happened and some of us are blind by it

Since 2000

Football

USC-40-31 with 4 winning seasons and tons of national exposure with Spurrier and Holtz

Arkansas 40-33 with 4 winning seasons and no national exposure other than a SEC Championship blowout and HDN flirting with Nebraska

The Series is even a 3-3 since 2000.  Look at the recruits USC is now in the running for, look at the ones we're looking at.  USC is far ahead of us in this. 

Basketball

Under Odom- USC has 4 postseason appearances in 5 years.  2 NIT Championships, 1 NIT runner up, and 1 NCAA appearance.  Odom is 100-69 at USC.  Odom is 20-7 in the postseason

Under Heath-Hogs have 1 postseason appearances and have done awful in the SEC tourney

Baseball

This isn't even close.  While DVH is a great coach, Tanner has done more with USC since 2000 than any other SEC coach.

My point is this.  While we're worrying about try to catch Auburn, Florida, UGA, LSU, and UT the Gamecocks are slowly passing us.   Joining the SEC has helped USC and hurt Arkansas. 

Am I way off on this?   THis is especially true in football.

While i pretty much agree with you except for basketball.On paper USC basketball seasons look decent but, NIT seasons are failed seasons period. They may be good for team continuity for the next year but a trip to the NIT says you didn't get it done.Of course I'm speaking of the post season NIT not pre season.

[hogfan064]

Well, yea. I haven't heard him enough, but I can respect that. As a person, however, he's an arrogant, cocky so-and-so.

Don't you have to be arrogant to be a coach.  All the good ones are.  Only non cocky coach I can really think of that's any good is Marc Richt

[Ben Steiger]

Pete Carroll isn't cocky, at least not IHMO. Nor is the Ohio State coach, Jim Tressell, and much as I don't like Texas, Mac Brown.

[PennHOG]

You have to be cocky to be a ***(OK, the short version of gamecock).  

South Carolina hasn't passed us up yet.  We both entered the SEC and the same time and have been better them.

BUT, yeah, I think we should be worried.  I would hate to see another year of getting out coached by the ole ball coach.

[hogfan064]

You have to be cocky to be a ***.  

South Carolina hasn't passed us up yet.  We both entered the SEC and the same time and have been better them.

BUT, yeah, I think we should be worried.  I would hate to see another year of getting out coached by the ole ball coach.

They aren't far behind.  Some more stats since 1992(when we both entered the league in football)

Winning Seasons
Arkansas-7
USC-6

Bowl wins
Arkansas-2
USC-3

Overall series record
Hogs lead 8-6

Times on ESPN Gameday
USC-3
Arkansas-0

Ok I know Gameday really means nothing, but they are getting more exposure than us.

[RedSatinHog]

Didn't ESPN gameday show up for the UNLV game in LR a few years ago?  I seem to remember how the crew was commenting on how cluelessly unimaginative the offense was that night.

[hogfan064]

Didn't ESPN gameday show up for the UNLV game in LR a few years ago?  I seem to remember how the crew was commenting on how cluelessly unimaginative the offense was that night.

That wasn't Gameday.  Corso and Herbstreet were the announcers, but it wasn't Gameday. That was a Thursday Night game in 2001 against UNLV.  And yes it was an ugly game to watch.

[hogfan064]

Arkansas 40-33 with 4 winning seasons and no national exposure other than a SEC Championship blowout and HDN flirting with Nebraska

We got national exposure when we beat Texas.  That's all they were talking about on College Gamenight.  Cobbs in the Heisman race, etc.  Then it blew up and that's the last we've been heard from.  You forgot one more flirtation with LSU in there too. 

Actually we got alot of exposure after the Alabama win also.  That's about it though.  Nothing to be that proud of

[HognotinMemphis]

Here's my problem.  I live in South Carolina and I am surrounded by Gamecock fans.  For years they were a joke of a program in about every sport and it was a program Arkansas fans could laugh at.  It was always a program that Arkansas could point to and say we're better than them.  When both schools entered the SEC Arkansas was the main attraction. USC was added due to its fan base and it being a new market. Arkansas by far was the better program, but look what's happened and some of us are blind by it

Since 2000

Football

USC-40-31 with 4 winning seasons and tons of national exposure with Spurrier and Holtz

Arkansas 40-33 with 4 winning seasons and no national exposure other than a SEC Championship blowout and HDN flirting with Nebraska

The Series is even a 3-3 since 2000.  Look at the recruits USC is now in the running for, look at the ones we're looking at.  USC is far ahead of us in this. 

Basketball

Under Odom- USC has 4 postseason appearances in 5 years.  2 NIT Championships, 1 NIT runner up, and 1 NCAA appearance.  Odom is 100-69 at USC.  Odom is 20-7 in the postseason

Under Heath-Hogs have 1 postseason appearances and have done awful in the SEC tourney

Baseball

This isn't even close.  While DVH is a great coach, Tanner has done more with USC since 2000 than any other SEC coach.

My point is this.  While we're worrying about try to catch Auburn, Florida, UGA, LSU, and UT the Gamecocks are slowly passing us.   Joining the SEC has helped USC and hurt Arkansas. 

Am I way off on this?   THis is especially true in football.

SC isn't the only SEC school that all the above can be said about when compared to Arkansas athletics over the past 10 years, especially over the past 5 or 6. Football is going down hill fast, basketball is mediocre now and was horrible for past 5 years, baseball is okay but 1-4 start in SEC this year leaves you in doubt regarding their chances of doing well in conference play rest of the season.

[benswinesmoney]

USC has top facilities, good recruiting base, top staff and a strong fan base.  I cant see why they were so bad for so long.

UMMM, I don't think you've been there.  Their football stadium is a dump and does not compare to RRS.  Their basketball season was modeled after Bud Walton, but on a smaller scale.  Their baseball facility is a dump and they're looking to copy Baum for that.

[hogfan064]

USC has top facilities, good recruiting base, top staff and a strong fan base.  I cant see why they were so bad for so long.

UMMM, I don't think you've been there.  Their football stadium is a dump and does not compare to RRS.  Their basketball season was modeled after Bud Walton, but on a smaller scale.  Their baseball facility is a dump and they're looking to copy Baum for that.

I wouldn't call Sarge Frye Field a dump, compared to Baum maybe, but every ballpark in the NCAA is a dump compared to Baum.   The new stadium will be located by a river, so it will create a nice atmosphere.  It will be similar to Baum. 

The football stadium wouldn't be bad if it was located on campus.  Of course USC doesn't really have a campus. 

[pork and mindy]

SC's new baseball stadium is copy of Baum and will be great. (unfortunately.)

[NATEHOGG216]

Damn right you should be worried.  But not because USC is getting better, because we are getting worse by the minute.  Until JFB, Lindsey, NUtt, and Heath are gone it WILL not change.  Just TOO happy with being mediocre(if we still are that good)

[hoggystyle78]

It's pretty damn sad when we get tot the point that we're comparing our FB program to a SC program who's had like 3-4 winning seasons in the last 30 years! As long as the huggers continue to suck nutt our FB program will sink a little deeper into the abyss, but I'm sure everything is ok with the kool-aid drinkers out there, at least we haven't slipped to the same stature as Prarie View A&M, but if all the huggers have their way dale will get us there, just give him time. The only thing is, that chicken schitt of a HC we have now will waste no time bailing on the "helmet he loves" and leaving a phreaking car wreck of a FB program to fix.

[UAfan]

Yeah we have slipped into mediocrity here at the UA, but imo every sport is on the rise.  Baseball has made leaps and bounds toward being a feared program in the toughest league in college sports.  Basketball made it back to the tourney for the first time since we won the SEC champ.  Football, although struggled the past two years, seems to me to be on the rise.  We will slip back into the elite of the SEC in a couple of years.