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Something is about to change the CFB Landscape in our favor.

Started by HamSammich, July 21, 2017, 12:14:26 pm

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HamSammich

https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/lsu-football/not-crazy-suggest-arden-key-doesnt-return-lsu-prepares-2018-nfl-draft/

Quote.......
Some advocated for his former teammate, Leonard Fournette, to sit out his junior season entirely. It already looks like Key might not be ready for the opener Sept. 2.
"I don't think it's going to be that long," Orgeron said. "I don't think we can hold Arden that long. If he's ready for the first game, he'll be ready. But if he's not, he's not. I think it'll be week by week."
At this point, I don't think it's reckless to wonder if Key has already played his last game for LSU. The fact that we still have no idea why he was absent from spring ball forces us to speculate much more wildly.
.............


From what I hear Key isn't going to play at LSU again and instead is going to sit out and prepare for the NFL for a year.
This was inevitable but there really was always going to be a "first" and we may have it imo.

I believe this is going to let the genie out of the bag. To take it further-- if LSU, Bama, and Auburns top players sit out their junior years each year this is going to greatly level the playing field. I think having a 3 and 4* player 3 and four years is better than a 5* for two years. It levels recruiting out for teams like ours I believe.

As a CFB fan I hate this... as a Razorback fan this is a win win.


mizzouman

As an NFL exec, I would not draft a kid who sat a year, if healthy, to get 'ready' for the NFL.  Playing is getting ready.

Ā 

OneTuskOverTheLineā„¢

Quote from: mizzouman on July 21, 2017, 12:17:42 pm
As an NFL exec, I would not draft a kid who sat a year, if healthy, to get 'ready' for the NFL.  Playing is getting ready.

I'm certain the big factor that will impact this issue is "The Wallet"; and I don't see too many teams paying big signing bonuses to guys who have sat out a year...
Quote from: capehog on March 12, 2010...
My ex wife had a pet monkey I used to play with. That was one of the few things I liked about her

quote from: golf2day on June 19, 2014....
I'm disgusted, but kinda excited. Now I'm disgusted that I'm excited.

HamSammich

I hear you guys but if Gurley and Fournette would have sat out they definitely would have been drafted higher.

Also I think signing bonuses on rookie contracts are pretty inflexible. Not sure on that though.

Youngsta71701

Quote from: HamSammich on July 21, 2017, 12:14:26 pm
https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/lsu-football/not-crazy-suggest-arden-key-doesnt-return-lsu-prepares-2018-nfl-draft/


From what I hear Key isn't going to play at LSU again and instead is going to sit out and prepare for the NFL for a year.
This was inevitable but there really was always going to be a "first" and we may have it imo.

I believe this is going to let the genie out of the bag. To take it further-- if LSU, Bama, and Auburns top players sit out their junior years each year this is going to greatly level the playing field. I think having a 3 and 4* player 3 and four years is better than a 5* for two years. It levels recruiting out for teams like ours I believe.

As a CFB fan I hate this... as a Razorback fan this is a win win.
If he does this character issues or concerns will kill his draft stock. He may even go undrafted just so the NFL can make an example out of him.
"The more things change the more they stay the same"

theFlyingHog

Quote from: Youngsta71701 on July 21, 2017, 12:28:01 pm
If he does this character issues or concerns will kill his draft stock. He may even go undrafted just so the NFL can make an example out of him.
I don't think the NFL gives a crap as long as the kid can play. If you have a chance to get a good player who will help your team, you take em. Unless he's been beating women which is the no-no of the month

HamSammich

I don't think you guys understand the NFL...

If a guy can help a team win they don't care too darn much. I don't see 32 GMs getting together and setting an "example". But hell I could be wrong.

RME

Lotta reasons in here showing why you guys aren't NFL execs.

Youngsta71701

Quote from: theFlyingHog on July 21, 2017, 12:31:22 pm
I don't think the NFL gives a crap as long as the kid can play. If you have a chance to get a good player who will help your team, you take em. Unless he's been beating women which is the no-no of the month
Dorial Green-Beckham could play also but you see how far he slipped in the draft.
"The more things change the more they stay the same"

311Hog

Man some of yall are crazy.  If a player already shows what he can do, and is available a NFL team is going to draft him period.

Teams know you have to rush the passer in the NFL, Key can rush the passer.  As long as he isn't sitting out for a "bad" reason i would bet you money that they will draft him with no questions asked.

NFL and NBA don't care about impacts on the college game.

I am surprised this hasn't happened sooner.  3 years is a long time to play college ball for "free", for some of these players the ones that could arguably go straight to the league.  Fournette is a good example he was an NFL back on day one, and after his freshman year he shoulda been able to go to the draft and probably would have been smarter to sit a year and then go in fully rested and healthy.

Youngsta71701

"The more things change the more they stay the same"

RME

Quote from: Youngsta71701 on July 21, 2017, 12:40:08 pm
Are you? ;D

I'm not. But I also wouldn't write off a first-round talent that could help my team just because he sat out a year in college.

RME

Quote from: Youngsta71701 on July 21, 2017, 12:37:57 pm
Dorial Green-Beckham could play also but you see how far he slipped in the draft.

DGB had one good college year and has had two mediocre, if not sub par, NFL years. Just because he was God's greatest gift to earth coming out of high school doesn't mean he can play.

Ā 

Hog Fan...DOH!

Quote from: Youngsta71701 on July 21, 2017, 12:37:57 pm
Dorial Green-Beckham could play also but you see how far he slipped in the draft.

He was actually not that awesome.

311Hog

Quote from: Hog Fan...DOH! on July 21, 2017, 12:47:22 pm
He was actually not that awesome.

not to mention a head case.  We are talking perfectly good off the field players who are 1st and 2nd round talents on it, deciding after a year or two of great production in college deciding to sit and "work out" for a year and heal up before being able to enter the draft due to the age restriction.

IMHO that would be smart, unless you felt like you could finish or come very close to finishing your degree in that 3rd/4th year, but for kids that have no intention of ever graduating? why not leave

hogsanity

The NFL will find talent, and draft talent. They spend millions per team on scouting, analyzing, and investigating players. If they do this and are convinced a guy can help them win, they will draft him. The least of their worries are whether he made a business decision to sit out a year of college. Actually, that shows some critical thinking ability.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Gonzo

IMO the question isn't whether the NFL would completely pass on top talent because they make this move, that's just not realistic. As others have opined, if a player can help them they will take them. However, we've seen tons of time there is more than just physical talent taken into consideration on that level. Attitudes and locker room compatibility are considered too. I think the question is whether a move like this would influence those evaluations of the player. Sitting out doesn't exactly scream "team first" to me and I wouldn't be surprised if some NFL teams took a similar view of it. I think something like could keep a marginal player from being drafted, and while it wouldn't keep a top talent on the outside, I do think it could influence how highly they're evaluated and selected. I don't fault the player for making such a decision, but I think it's possible to have an impact, but so could playing that season and not playing as well as expected.



Go Hogs!

RME

Quote from: hogsanity on July 21, 2017, 01:02:54 pm
The NFL will find talent, and draft talent. They spend millions per team on scouting, analyzing, and investigating players. If they do this and are convinced a guy can help them win, they will draft him. The least of their worries are whether he made a business decision to sit out a year of college. Actually, that shows some critical thinking ability.

I agree.

If someone sits out training camp or OTAs due to a contract dispute or ongoing negotiations, does that mean they have "character issues?" Is the team going to just move on from them? Nah.

HamSammich

Quote from: Gonzo on July 21, 2017, 01:04:19 pm
IMO the question isn't whether the NFL would completely pass on top talent because they make this move, that's just not realistic. As others have opined, if a player can help them they will take them. However, we've seen tons of time there is more than just physical talent taken into consideration on that level. Attitudes and locker room compatibility are considered too. I think the question is whether a move like this would influence those evaluations of the player. Sitting out doesn't exactly scream "team first" to me and I wouldn't be surprised if some NFL teams took a similar view of it. I think something like could keep a marginal player from being drafted, and while it wouldn't keep a top talent on the outside, I do think it could influence how highly they're evaluated and selected. I don't fault the player for making such a decision, but I think it's possible to have an impact, but so could playing that season and not playing as well as expected.



Go Hogs!

Also we should consider that NFL coaches are already shouting to the moon that they don't have enough practice time for new players. They also complain a lot about how unready for the NFL offensive linemen usually are because of spread systems. So maybe sitting a year hurts some position groups in the draft.

I'm not sure.

I just saw this article and thought it might be one of those small innocuous tidbits we miss then years later say "wow that really started the change".


311Hog

Quote from: HamSammich on July 21, 2017, 01:08:25 pm
Also we should consider that NFL coaches are already shouting to the moon that they don't have enough practice time for new players. They also complain a lot about how unready for the NFL offensive linemen usually are because of spread systems. So maybe sitting a year hurts some position groups in the draft.

I'm not sure.

I just saw this article and thought it might be one of those small innocuous tidbits we miss then years later say "wow that really started the change".



Oh i think you are right it could be a trend, i mean we saw "star" players sit out "lesser" bowl games in the name of health and protecting the assets.  Those guys did not suffer when the draft came.  It is not that far a walk from sitting out meaningless bowl games to sitting out meaningless years when your eye and belief is to be playing on sundays.

jneal56

Maybe all the professional sports should require degrees before a person can become a "Professional" athlete. What I mean is, in order to be considered a professional in most areas of the working world, you generally have to had earned a college degree. All our Doctors, Lawyers and such had to earn their doctorates. Is it really too much to ask to become a "Professional Athlete" that one should attain a degree from the college/university they attended and played NCAA ball for?

For all of you grumbling about the players playing for "free". Get over it. They may not be earning a pay check so to speak but they're being compensated quite nicely. Especially compared to what I am paying for my undergrad and doctorate degrees.

No matter what line of business you're in, the owner and higher ups make millions while the little people make pennies. Such as with NCAA Football. The players are making pennies but they have the potential to move up and make millions. That is still better than most of us who make pennies and have the potential to move up and make thousands.
"At least we are moral"

hogsanity

Quote from: jneal56 on July 21, 2017, 01:45:27 pm
Maybe all the professional sports should require degrees before a person can become a "Professional" athlete. What I mean is, in order to be considered a professional in most areas of the working world, you generally have to had earned a college degree. All our Doctors, Lawyers and such had to earn their doctorates. Is it really too much to ask to become a "Professional Athlete" that one should attain a degree from the college/university they attended and played NCAA ball for?

For all of you grumbling about the players playing for "free". Get over it. They may not be earning a pay check so to speak but they're being compensated quite nicely. Especially compared to what I am paying for my undergrad and doctorate degrees.

No matter what line of business you're in, the owner and higher ups make millions while the little people make pennies. Such as with NCAA Football. The players are making pennies but they have the potential to move up and make millions. That is still better than most of us who make pennies and have the potential to move up and make thousands.

Why? My son is a HS grad, going to college in a month. He is able to go get a job right now with whoever will hire him. Are there some jobs that require degrees, sure, but there are man that do not. What would be gained BY THE NFL by requiring this. 
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

jneal56

Quote from: hogsanity on July 21, 2017, 01:47:51 pm
Why? My son is a HS grad, going to college in a month. He is able to go get a job right now with whoever will hire him. Are there some jobs that require degrees, sure, but there are man that do not. What would be gained BY THE NFL by requiring this. 

You missed the point. Anyone can go get a job, but to become a professional and have a career so to speak, one usually has to earn a degree first in order to put themselves in that position. I didn't say that everyone who is a professional has earned a degree. I'm asking why not have them earn a degree to become a professional athlete? Otherwise, they should have the right to join a pro team at any time. Including before they graduate high school. Don't you think Lebron would have still been pretty good if he was a rookie in the NBA instead of a Sr in high school? I do. Food for thought is all I was throwing out there. If you require a degree in all professional sports then maybe it cuts out some of the sitting out. I don't blame a player either way, sitting or playing, when it comes to what they should do in protecting their interests. Personally I would like the pros to require degrees just so the college game would be better. Wouldn't you have liked to have DMAC and Felix one more season?????? Or hell 2 more seasons if they'd extend the playing years to 5 as long as they're in first year of grad school!!! How awesome would that have been??
"At least we are moral"

RME

Quote from: jneal56 on July 21, 2017, 01:45:27 pm
Maybe all the professional sports should require degrees before a person can become a "Professional" athlete. What I mean is, in order to be considered a professional in most areas of the working world, you generally have to had earned a college degree. All our Doctors, Lawyers and such had to earn their doctorates. Is it really too much to ask to become a "Professional Athlete" that one should attain a degree from the college/university they attended and played NCAA ball for?


Not sure about you, but I'd hope my doctor and attorney have their doctorates and licenses. I don't need Dez Bryant to have a communications degree or a doctorate in psychology to go out and catch footballs.

Ā 

RME

Quote from: jneal56 on July 21, 2017, 01:58:50 pm
You missed the point. Anyone can go get a job, but to become a professional and have a career so to speak, one usually has to earn a degree first in order to put themselves in that position. I didn't say that everyone who is a professional has earned a degree. I'm asking why not have them earn a degree to become a professional athlete? Otherwise, they should have the right to join a pro team at any time. Including before they graduate high school. Don't you think Lebron would have still been pretty good if he was a rookie in the NBA instead of a Sr in high school? I do. Food for thought is all I was throwing out there. If you require a degree in all professional sports then maybe it cuts out some of the sitting out. I don't blame a player either way, sitting or playing, when it comes to what they should do in protecting their interests. Personally I would like the pros to require degrees just so the college game would be better. Wouldn't you have liked to have DMAC and Felix one more season?????? Or hell 2 more seasons if they'd extend the playing years to 5 as long as they're in first year of grad school!!! How awesome would that have been??

What major or field of study is an athlete supposed to complete then? Is Darren McFadden supposed to major in Football? How would having a marketing degree help Darren McFadden in the NFL?

jneal56

Quote from: RyanMallettsEgo on July 21, 2017, 02:01:09 pm
What major or field of study is an athlete supposed to complete then? Is Darren McFadden supposed to major in Football? How would having a marketing degree help Darren McFadden in the NFL?

Evidently you haven't seen his lawsuit alleging someone misused his money and he lost millions. Maybe had he learned what to do himself with a marketing degree, he wouldn't have had to file that lawsuit!!

Now you made that too easy by using McFadden and a Marketing degree, but I get your point and I don't think it would make him a better athlete. But it could help him possibly manage money a little better or at least give him the tools to market himself more efficiently to earn more money.
"At least we are moral"

jneal56

Quote from: RyanMallettsEgo on July 21, 2017, 02:00:02 pm
Not sure about you, but I'd hope my doctor and attorney have their doctorates and licenses. I don't need Dez Bryant to have a communications degree or a doctorate in psychology to go out and catch footballs.

No you don't, which leads to the question as to why do they have to wait 3 years in football? Baseball guys if they choose college they have to wait 3 years I believe and basketball it's 1 if they choose college. How many of you with degrees out there can do your job without have ever taken a single class?? Most our education happens on the job. Food for thought is all that is.

Can you imagine Dez with a doctorate in psychology???? Maybe he'd catch more? Haha!
"At least we are moral"

jneal56

For the record, and my own personal selfishness, I would rather see all our athletes play 4-5 years and earn their degrees just so we have the great ones for 1 or 2 more seasons. Call me crazy, I don't care.

Now for the athletes sake, I believe they should be able to go if they're ready any time.
"At least we are moral"

bennyl08

Quote from: jneal56 on July 21, 2017, 01:45:27 pm
Maybe all the professional sports should require degrees before a person can become a "Professional" athlete. What I mean is, in order to be considered a professional in most areas of the working world, you generally have to had earned a college degree. All our Doctors, Lawyers and such had to earn their doctorates. Is it really too much to ask to become a "Professional Athlete" that one should attain a degree from the college/university they attended and played NCAA ball for?

For all of you grumbling about the players playing for "free". Get over it. They may not be earning a pay check so to speak but they're being compensated quite nicely. Especially compared to what I am paying for my undergrad and doctorate degrees.

No matter what line of business you're in, the owner and higher ups make millions while the little people make pennies. Such as with NCAA Football. The players are making pennies but they have the potential to move up and make millions. That is still better than most of us who make pennies and have the potential to move up and make thousands.

Bolded is not actually true and is in fact quite rare. While we call somebody with an MD and somebody with a PhD both doctor, they are not the same thing. To get an MD is to be able to regurgitate a bunch of memorized knowledge and you are good to go. A medical doctor with a doctorate has had to do brand new research and go a lot further in schooling than a typical MD.

Similarly, with law. While it is called a JD, you don't have to do anything original. You have to study what already exists, take tests and write some short papers about what already exists, and voila.

Contrast that to a PhD where you have to expand the field you are getting a PhD in to earn one. You have to do something that nobody has ever done before and expand human knowledge. JD and MD are basically like the first half of a PhD where you have to take the advanced classes, pass some hard tests and that's typically done by the end of the 2nd or third year, with the later 3+ years devoted to research and thesis writing.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

jneal56

Quote from: bennyl08 on July 21, 2017, 02:13:40 pm
Bolded is not actually true and is in fact quite rare. While we call somebody with an MD and somebody with a PhD both doctor, they are not the same thing. To get an MD is to be able to regurgitate a bunch of memorized knowledge and you are good to go. A medical doctor with a doctorate has had to do brand new research and go a lot further in schooling than a typical MD.

Similarly, with law. While it is called a JD, you don't have to do anything original. You have to study what already exists, take tests and write some short papers about what already exists, and voila.

Contrast that to a PhD where you have to expand the field you are getting a PhD in to earn one. You have to do something that nobody has ever done before and expand human knowledge. JD and MD are basically like the first half of a PhD where you have to take the advanced classes, pass some hard tests and that's typically done by the end of the 2nd or third year, with the later 3+ years devoted to research and thesis writing.

Medical DOCTORATE
Judiciary DOCTORATE
Philosophical DOCTORATE
Chiropractic DOCTORATE
Education DOCTORATE

The list goes on and on. Yes MD, JD, DC, DO, PhD, EdD are all different doctoral degrees, but they're still Doctoral degrees. You can attempt to down play each and every one of them you want but the fact is they're all doctoral degrees. The only people who tend to make that argument are the PhD's. Go figure. Do you know what the word Doctor means?
"At least we are moral"

bennyl08

Quote from: jneal56 on July 21, 2017, 02:18:46 pm
Medical DOCTORATE
Judiciary DOCTORATE
Philosophical DOCTORATE
Chiropractic DOCTORATE
Education DOCTORATE

The list goes on and on. Yes MD, JD, DC, DO, PhD, EdD are all different doctoral degrees, but they're still Doctoral degrees. You can attempt to down play each and every one of them you want but the fact is they're all doctoral degrees. The only people who tend to make that argument are the PhD's. Go figure. Do you know what the word Doctor means?

Pretty sure ED stands for something else.  ;)

Doctor at it's roots goes down to a learned person/teacher. If somebody says they are a doctor, it is common usage to assume they are in the medical field. If somebody says they have a doctorate, it is common usage to assume they have a PhD.
Quote from: PorkSoda on May 05, 2016, 09:24:05 pm
damn I thought it was only a color, didn't realize it was named after a liqueur. leave it to benny to make me research the history of chartreuse

hobhog

Back to the OP's point, it will be interesting to see what happens going forward. Its a bad trend but inevitable in this money driven TV sports world that has been created.

hawganatic

Quote from: HamSammich on July 21, 2017, 12:31:54 pm
I don't think you guys understand the NFL...

If a guy can help a team win they don't care too darn much. I don't see 32 GMs getting together and setting an "example". But hell I could be wrong.

Think people are looking at the NFL as one organization.  It's really 32 organizations trying to outdo each other.  They aren't going to collude against a single player just to make an example out of him. 

If he's can help a team win, that team is going to take him regardless of what he did his junior year in college.

311Hog

Quote from: jneal56 on July 21, 2017, 02:10:27 pm
For the record, and my own personal selfishness, I would rather see all our athletes play 4-5 years and earn their degrees just so we have the great ones for 1 or 2 more seasons. Call me crazy, I don't care.

Now for the athletes sake, I believe they should be able to go if they're ready any time.

I think this is the OP's point we do not get the "great ones" teams like Bama, USC, etc. the blue blood programs get the 5 star elite players and they have to stay for 3 years.  But what if these same players decided to leave or sit out after 1 or 2 years that would mean they would sink back to the pack a bit, and thus create more parity and thus the possibility for greater success for the Razorbacks.

Youngsta71701

Quote from: RyanMallettsEgo on July 21, 2017, 12:42:02 pm
I'm not. But I also wouldn't write off a first-round talent that could help my team just because he sat out a year in college.
So that doesn't raise a red flag to you? After all football is the ULTIMATE TEAM sport.
"The more things change the more they stay the same"

Youngsta71701

Quote from: Hog Fan...DOH! on July 21, 2017, 12:47:22 pm
He was actually not that awesome.
No he was just the number one overall recruit. His off the field issues derailed him not his talent.
"The more things change the more they stay the same"

311Hog

Quote from: Youngsta71701 on July 21, 2017, 02:42:45 pm
So that doesn't raise a red flag to you? After all football is the ULTIMATE TEAM sport.

This idea of team is a fallacy.  when it comes to professional sports.  These players do not begrudge other players from getting theirs as long as it doesn't show up between the white lines.

The starting DE for the Panthers could care less if the other rookie DE from LSU sat out last year working in Florida for some pro camp as long as he plays well and holds up his end.

And as far as ownership/fan base goes as long as the reason the player sat out isn't drugs, or some other law related issue then no i don't think anyone will think twice about it.  The idea of "team loyalty" died almost 3 decades ago.  que free agency killed the game, RIP Billy Cole.

hobhog

Quote from: 311Hog on July 21, 2017, 02:38:29 pm
I think this is the OP's point we do not get the "great ones" teams like Bama, USC, etc. the blue blood programs get the 5 star elite players and they have to stay for 3 years.  But what if these same players decided to leave or sit out after 1 or 2 years that would mean they would sink back to the pack a bit, and thus create more parity and thus the possibility for greater success for the Razorbacks.

wouldn't they just play the next 5 star they signed?

ThisTeetsTaken

So why not kick these kids off the team and out of the program so they can use the scholly money on someone that wants to play? 
***"He must increase, but I must decrease"***

311Hog

Quote from: hobhog on July 21, 2017, 02:47:10 pm
wouldn't they just play the next 5 star they signed?

there isn't  a infinite source of 5 stars.  There are what 20 to 30 per recruiting class as a whole?

And we aren't necessarily talking about recruits sitting out because they can't because you have to be 3 years removed from HS so a HS recruit sitting out is foolish.

But yeah a legit 5 star player is rare, very rare even more rare is the 5 star player that proved their ability on the field in the SEC for a year maybe even 2.  But at this point the player has nothing more to prove only risk to their future career.

Talking heads love to go on and on about miles on legs right? what if you could spare some miles and get a fresher player?  NFL would choose that for known commodities.  IHO


311Hog

Quote from: ThisTeetsTaken on July 21, 2017, 02:49:18 pm
So why not kick these kids off the team and out of the program so they can use the scholly money on someone that wants to play? 

Umm maybe because other players would frown upon such actions?  Big time college football is a marriage of school getting paid and the implied result of the player eventually getting paid.  school gets indignant other players will take notice

jneal56

Quote from: bennyl08 on July 21, 2017, 02:29:32 pm
Pretty sure ED stands for something else.  ;)

Doctor at it's roots goes down to a learned person/teacher. If somebody says they are a doctor, it is common usage to assume they are in the medical field. If somebody says they have a doctorate, it is common usage to assume they have a PhD.

Correct! Doctor was from a Latin word I can't recall exactly but it meant "to teach"
"At least we are moral"

ThisTeetsTaken

Quote from: 311Hog on July 21, 2017, 02:52:16 pm
Umm maybe because other players would frown upon such actions?  Big time college football is a marriage of school getting paid and the implied result of the player eventually getting paid.  school gets indignant other players will take notice
No way college programs turn into 3 year NFL farm camps without getting 3 years of playing out of their investments instead of just two. 
***"He must increase, but I must decrease"***

311Hog

Quote from: ThisTeetsTaken on July 21, 2017, 02:57:40 pm
No way college programs turn into 3 year NFL farm camps without getting 3 years of playing out of their investments instead of just two. 

says who?  there are very few elite football players on a year to year basis.  Do you really think that colleges will coordinate with each other? lol if Bama all of the sudden starts kicking players off the team with NFL aspirations after 2 years or making it known that if you leave or consider leaving for the NFL you are not welcome do you think other colleges will follow suit or welcome the players to their schools with open arms?

Im going with the latter.  EDIT la

theFlyingHog

Quote from: Youngsta71701 on July 21, 2017, 02:43:28 pm
No he was just the number one overall recruit. His off the field issues derailed him not his talent.
And you just explained how DGB is not a good case study for Arden Key's situation. One liked drugs and partying and one apparently works hard and has his future at heart. DGB got kicked off his team, for Pete's sake!

hawganatic

Quote from: Youngsta71701 on July 21, 2017, 12:37:57 pm
Dorial Green-Beckham could play also but you see how far he slipped in the draft.

DGB fell because of legal issues.  Not the same as what we are talking about here.

ThisTeetsTaken

Quote from: 311Hog on July 21, 2017, 03:03:31 pm
says who?  there are very few elite football players on a year to year basis.  Do you really think that colleges will coordinate with each other? lol if Bama all of the sudden starts kicking players off the team with NFL aspirations after 2 years or making it known that if you leave or consider leaving for the NFL you are not welcome do you think other colleges will follow suit or welcome the players to their schools with open arms?

Im going with the ladder.
You're assuming your average players won't do the same thing.  Who says a 2 star at Arkansas won't play two years and then decide to get ready for the NFL instead of competing in college a 3rd year?   Theses guys think they are preserving their bodies for pro ball.  The trend starting here is not caring about playing college ball for 3-4 years but just playing enough for an audition for the NFL then waiting for the legal right to play for money all the while on the school's dime. 
***"He must increase, but I must decrease"***

hogsanity

Quote from: jneal56 on July 21, 2017, 02:07:37 pm
No you don't, which leads to the question as to why do they have to wait 3 years in football? Baseball guys if they choose college they have to wait 3 years I believe and basketball it's 1 if they choose college. How many of you with degrees out there can do your job without have ever taken a single class?? Most our education happens on the job. Food for thought is all that is.

Can you imagine Dez with a doctorate in psychology???? Maybe he'd catch more? Haha!

The rules about when they can enter the draft are rules of the respective professional league, and are usually part of the CBA in each league. The rule exists in the NBA because the NBAPA pushed it because for every HS kid drafted, thats a position a veteran loses. Baseball is like it is to keep a HS kid from getting drafted by a team they do not want to play for, and going back in the draft the next year. Not sure if the nfl rule is a cba stipulation or not.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

hogsanity

People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

311Hog

Quote from: ThisTeetsTaken on July 21, 2017, 03:18:49 pm
You're assuming your average players won't do the same thing.  Who says a 2 star at Arkansas won't play two years and then decide to get ready for the NFL instead of competing in college a 3rd year?   Theses guys think they are preserving their bodies for pro ball.  The trend starting here is not caring about playing college ball for 3-4 years but just playing enough for an audition for the NFL then waiting for the legal right to play for money all the while on the school's dime. 

actually no i am not assuming they won't do that.  If a 2 star at Arkansas plays two years and is regarded as a "lock" 1st or 2nd" round draft pick and decides to sit for their last required year, working out and practicing outside of the college facility then while that maybe a risk to the player the NFL is not going to purposefully "black ball " them.  That is the point.

Every year there are hundreds of players that finish their college careers, do not get drafted, do not get their degrees and they have to go on with their lives like anyone else does.

The difference here is that in this world of big time college football it is all driven by the players.  College is the only game in town historically, that is different now.  There are 24 7 football factories that exist now where a player like Arden Key who is known to scouts and the NFL could stay in shape and improve as a player and not have to deal with the NCAA, the school, classes, etc.