Naismith Hall Of Fame

[chiefhawg]

Eddie Sutton did not make it again.
http://www.hoophall.com/news/2016/4/4/naismith-memorial-basketball-hall-of-fame-class-of-2016-anno.html

He must have really upset someone.

[rwspear]

He had stiff competition. Izzo and McLendon were obviously better choices, IMO.

[King Kong]

How Cal got in before Izzo I will never understand

[chiefhawg]

How Cal got in before Izzo I will never understand

It is probably the Kentucky "Blue Blood" connection that got Cal in and is holding Eddie out. They probably have not forgiven him for leaving them on probation. Just my guess.

[ChicoHog]

Eddie deserves it and will get in at some point. I just hope he is still living when that happens.

[intelligence]

dadgumit

[Inhogswetrust]

I think only one thing is keeping him out and that's not having a NC. However other coaches in don't have one. Travesty.

[TomBigBeeHog]

He's a great coach. He will be nominated again in the next class.

[bigredone]

He was a good coach that failed at KY. Not sure that is the credentials of a Naismith HOF inductee.

[TomBigBeeHog]

He was a good coach that failed at KY. Not sure that is the credentials of a Naismith HOF inductee.

That's a fair point, I guess I mainly go off of what he did here.

[alaback]

That's a fair point, I guess I mainly go off of what he did here.

He also went to 2 Final Fours at Okie St.

[Atlhogfan1]

800+ wins
First coach to take 4 different programs to NCAAT
3 F4's

This is the easiest of the sports HOF's to get in so he should make it in.  Coaches with much fewer wins and even 0 F4's are in.  If this HOF were more selective, then I could see the debate. 

[TomBigBeeHog]

800+ wins
First coach to take 4 different programs to NCAAT
3 F4's

This is the easiest of the sports HOF's to get in so he should make it in.  Coaches with much fewer wins and even 0 F4's are in.  If this HOF were more selective, then I could see the debate.

If what you say is true, why isn't he already in?

[alaback]

If what you say is true, why isn't he already in?

This probably has something to do with it...

The NCAA uncovered violations so egregious that it seriously considered hitting the Wildcats with the "death penalty", which would have shut down the entire basketball program (as opposed to simply being banned from postseason play) for up to two years.

Kentucky was eligible for this severe penalty because it was already on probation for failing to cooperate with an investigation into an extensive scheme of payments to recruits. However, after school president David Roselle told Sutton that he had enough support from UK's board of trustees to fire him, Sutton resigned shortly before the final report came out. Athletic director Cliff Hagan resigned as well. The Wildcats were slapped with three years' probation, a two-year ban from postseason play and a ban from live television in 1989–90. Manuel was also banned from ever playing again for any NCAA member school.

[Atlhogfan1]

If what you say is true, why isn't he already in?

Don't know.  Not a voter.  Could guess.  Perhaps his personal issues which given some who are in still shouldn't matter. 

Klein has his opinion:(not that I'm saying he is right or wrong)

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/osusportsextra/john-klein-voters-again-ignore-eddie-sutton-s-hall-of/article_9f0ecab9-9088-5649-91e2-103d024abc04.html

[Atlhogfan1]

This probably has something to do with it...

The NCAA uncovered violations so egregious that it seriously considered hitting the Wildcats with the "death penalty", which would have shut down the entire basketball program (as opposed to simply being banned from postseason play) for up to two years.

Kentucky was eligible for this severe penalty because it was already on probation for failing to cooperate with an investigation into an extensive scheme of payments to recruits. However, after school president David Roselle told Sutton that he had enough support from UK's board of trustees to fire him, Sutton resigned shortly before the final report came out. Athletic director Cliff Hagan resigned as well. The Wildcats were slapped with three years' probation, a two-year ban from postseason play and a ban from live television in 1989–90. Manuel was also banned from ever playing again for any NCAA member school.

Hasn't prevented the inclusion of others. 

[Dr. Starcs]

If cheating didnt keep calipari out, it shouldn't be the thing that keeps Eddie out.

[alaback]

I don't disagree and think it's a no brainier. Just providing some rationale for what the voters are thinking.

[bigredone]

That's a fair point, I guess I mainly go off of what he did here.

Being the 2nd best coach at AR is not a qualifier for the Naismith. Was he the best coach at any of the schools he coached at? Maybe Creighton.

He was great for the AR program. We are not the world.

[Atlhogfan1]

Being the 2nd best coach at AR is not a qualifier for the Naismith. Was he the best coach at any of the schools he coached at? Maybe Creighton.

He was great for the AR program. We are not the world.

Not relevant or necessary.  Programs have had multiple HOF coaches.  Only one could be the "best" at any one of them. 

[King Kong]

Being the 2nd best coach at AR is not a qualifier for the Naismith. Was he the best coach at any of the schools he coached at? Maybe Creighton.

He was great for the AR program. We are not the world.

Eddie Sutton wasn't just great here. His numbers are HOF worthy

[ShadowHawg]

He was a good coach that failed at KY. Not sure that is the credentials of a Naismith HOF inductee.

He was also a cheater. If you win a lot, you can cheat and get in. It's another strike against him.

Is Lon Kruger a HOF coach? I only ask because that is pretty much Sutton's equivalent in today's game.

[HogBreath]

In his 5th year at Arkansas, Coach Sutton's team went 25-5 and made the elite 8.  The year before that we went 32-4 and made the final 4.  The year before that we went 26-2. 

I liked Coach Sutton.

[ChicoHog]

He was also a cheater. If you win a lot, you can cheat and get in. It's another strike against him.

Is Lon Kruger a HOF coach? I only ask because that is pretty much Sutton's equivalent in today's game.

No he was not.  He was a phenomenal coach.  He belongs in the HOF for sure.  Kruger may be there someday but not yet.   And Kruger is a very good coach. 

[HogBreath]

No he was not.  He was a phenomenal coach.  He belongs in the HOF for sure.  Kruger may be there someday but not yet.   And Kruger is a very good coach. 

He won over 800 games in his career, how many have done that?

And he won most of those games in a time when college basketball was something special.

[hoglady]

Being the 2nd best coach at AR is not a qualifier for the Naismith. Was he the best coach at any of the schools he coached at? Maybe Creighton.

He was great for the AR program. We are not the world.

Nolan was handed a program that had great University and fan support.
Sutton had won multiple SWC titles, with multiple NCAA appearances and 1 Final Four.
When Sutton arrived basketball was played in an arena with a dirt floor and you couldn't give away the tickets for free.

They both are great coaches and both were wonderful for Arkansas.
But Nolan would have never ever taken this job if Sutton had not built the program.

[TomBigBeeHog]

Nolan was handed a program that had great University and fan support.
Sutton had won multiple SWC titles, with multiple NCAA appearances and 1 Final Four.
When Sutton arrived basketball was played in an arena with a dirt floor and you couldn't give away the tickets for free.

They both are great coaches and both were wonderful for Arkansas.
But Nolan would have never ever taken this job if Sutton had not built the program.

Sutton really built something great here. He deserves to be in the HOF based on his body of work, IMO.

[hoglady]

Sutton really built something great here. He deserves to be in the HOF based on his body of work, IMO.

Sutton built Creighton and he also rebuilt Okie St.
He's worthy.

[HogBreath]

Sutton built Creighton and he also rebuilt Okie St.
He's worthy.

Exactly, I'm sure he made some mistakes along the way, but he should be in the hall.  Probably one thing that might hold him back is he never won the Championship, but he had some great teams here and also at Ok. State.  I had to look at his record to realize it, but he had pretty lofty accomplishments as the head Cowpoke.

[SuperSid4Ever]

Sutton left measurable success behind at Creighton to come here and build us into a nationally respected program.  He restored Okie State from an absolute dump of a program,  Him not being selected for the HOF is a travesty, IMHO.

[chiefhawg]

Nolan was handed a program that had great University and fan support.
Sutton had won multiple SWC titles, with multiple NCAA appearances and 1 Final Four.
When Sutton arrived basketball was played in an arena with a dirt floor and you couldn't give away the tickets for free.

They both are great coaches and both were wonderful for Arkansas.
But Nolan would have never ever taken this job if Sutton had not built the program.

Did Nolan say that or you just guessing?

[hoglady]

Did Nolan say that or you just guessing?

Nolan had great success at Tulsa and he would have been way too good for this program - he had accomplished enough to move up not move down. If Sutton had not built Arkansas, it would have been a step down for Nolan no doubt.

[ShadowHawg]

Sutton built Creighton and he also rebuilt Okie St.
He's worthy.

Creighton ended up on probation almost immediately after Sutton left. Some say it was his fault. OSU has just fired it's last two coaches.

If this is the standard for a HOF coach, then MA is just about there. He rebuilt UAB, rebuilt Mizzou, and if he can pull it out next season, will have rebuilt this job.

HOF?

[Sivad]

If this is the standard for a HOF coach, then MA is just about there. He rebuilt UAB, rebuilt Mizzou, and if he can pull it out next season, will have rebuilt this job.

Who knew?

[PonderinHog]

Just testing to see if this thread automatically goes to Vent and Rumors when I post in it. 


This place is dead!

[ShadowHawg]

Who knew?

LOL. I mean I like MA, but never realized he was HOF material until this thread!

[maxhog5]

Creighton ended up on probation almost immediately after Sutton left. Some say it was his fault. OSU has just fired it's last two coaches.

If this is the standard for a HOF coach, then MA is just about there. He rebuilt UAB, rebuilt Mizzou, and if he can pull it out next season, will have rebuilt this job.

HOF?

Over ten years later is almost immediately after?  http://www.nytimes.com/1985/07/03/sports/sports-people-creighton-on-probation.html  Sutton took two different schools to the final four a total of 3 times so I would say by Sutton standards then MA hasn't built or rebuilt anything.  Sutton is also one of only 8 coaches with over 800 wins.  You also ridicule Travis Ford for being fired despite taking OSU to the NCAA in 5 of 8 years.  Sounds like OSU has higher standards and expectations than we have at Arkansas.

[maxhog5]

Two things I always appreciated about Sutton were first of all, he was the master tactician at the end of games.  With the score tied or the Hogs trailing by one, Arkansas was going to have the ball and the play he called was going to result in the winning basket, time and time and time again.  Secondly was his ability to adapt.  He won before and after the shot clock and he won with teams built around guards, built around forwards and on two different occasions with teams built around a center.  By the same token, the two things I appreciate Richardson for was first off his fire and drive.  His passion and his will to succeed were unparalleled.  And his Hogs fed off him.  The second thing was his ability to assemble a team who could do exactly what he needed them to do.  He was a master recruiter, not because he could get great players, although he did get his share, but because he had such an understanding of his system and what he wanted to do, he got the players he needed to run it.   

[hog.goblin]

He was a good coach that failed at KY. Not sure that is the credentials of a Naismith HOF inductee.

I'm not sure I would call 75 - 20 and two 1st place conference finishes in the first 3 seasons a failure, not even by Kentucky standards.

The 4th year was a disaster, but it seems that was mainly due to losing 3 starters t graduation, 1 early to the NBA, and 2 big recruits because of possible sanctions.

[ChicoHog]

I think just about all of us agree he was a great coach and should be in the HOF except Shadow Hog who for some reason thinks Mike Anderson is in the same class as Sutton.  Anderson is still in Kindergarten and Sutton received a PHD in basketball.   The only think they have in common is they both have coached at Arkansas. 

[HogBreath]

I think just about all of us agree he was a great coach and should be in the HOF except Shadow Hog who for some reason thinks Mike Anderson is in the same class as Sutton.  Anderson is still in Kindergarten and Sutton received a PHD in basketball.   The only think they have in common is they both have coached at Arkansas. 

Exactly right Chico.  +1

[ShadowHawg]

I think just about all of us agree he was a great coach and should be in the HOF except Shadow Hog who for some reason thinks Mike Anderson is in the same class as Sutton.  Anderson is still in Kindergarten and Sutton received a PHD in basketball.   The only think they have in common is they both have coached at Arkansas.

LOL

I was being facetious about MA. Good grief but Sutton isn't a first ballot guy either and evidently I am not the only one who believes it. 

[k.c.hawg]

Don't ever sell short what pretentious voters will do when they look down the resume of someone that seriously injured someone while driving under the influence of alcohol and drugs. I loved Eddie, traveled all around the country to watch his teams pay. There is no doubt in my mind that he often gets punished for some personal demons.

[maxhog5]

Don't ever sell short what pretentious voters will do when they look down the resume of someone that seriously injured someone while driving under the influence of alcohol and drugs. I loved Eddie, traveled all around the country to watch his teams pay. There is no doubt in my mind that he often gets punished for some personal demons.

Who did Sutton seriously injure?  The other driver received minor injuries and was released from the scene.  He was extremely lucky no one was seriously hurt or killed, but fortunately no one was.  http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/news/story?id=2329109

[k.c.hawg]

Who did Sutton seriously injure?  The other driver received minor injuries and was released from the scene.  He was extremely lucky no one was seriously hurt or killed, but fortunately no one was.  http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/news/story?id=2329109

"He hit me once," said Barnard. "He hit me in the rear end. He went up the embankment and he came back down the embankment and hit me again."

Barnard's back was broken in several places and her chest was severely bruised. Barnard sued OSU and won a $175,000 judgement, but says the money is now gone."

"I never seen a penny of the check. Never seen anything. My medical bills are sitting at $400,000. When it stops will be the day that I die," said Barnard.


I suppose she could just be cashing in. However anytime someone suffers injuries in a car accident as a result of someone driving under the influence of alcohol and pain pills it is egregious. Eddie was charged with aggravated DUI.

I personally think this is why he is not in. I don't know that is the reason he has been passed over but I'm having trouble coming up with any other reason because all most every coach with notable NCAA violations are already in......Tarkanian, Calipari, Boeheim, Calhoun.

[TomBigBeeHog]

"He hit me once," said Barnard. "He hit me in the rear end. He went up the embankment and he came back down the embankment and hit me again."

Barnard's back was broken in several places and her chest was severely bruised. Barnard sued OSU and won a $175,000 judgement, but says the money is now gone. I personally think this is why he isn't in. Every coach of note with 800+ wins is in.

"I never seen a penny of the check. Never seen anything. My medical bills are sitting at $400,000. When it stops will be the day that I die," said Barnard.


I suppose she could just be cashing in. However anytime someone suffers injuries in a car accident as a result of someone driving under the influence of alcohol and pain pills it is egregious. Eddie was charged with aggravated DUI.

I don't know that is the reason he has been passed over but I'm having trouble coming up with any other reason because all most every coach with notable NCAA violations are already in......Tarkanian, Calipari, Boeheim, Calhoun.

If this is what happened, along with the KY shenanigans, he will never get in. Too bad. He is a great coach.

[DeltaBoy]

Neither did the Winninest HS Basketball Coach in Texas or the Boys Winninest HS Coach.

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/high-school/article69829477.html

Coach Hughes for the Boys from FW Dunbar HS
Over all Leta Andrews from Granbury HS who won more games a ladys Coach and any coach

Former Fort Worth Dunbar boys coach Robert Hughes and former Granbury girls coach Leta Andrews are the nation's winningest boys and girls basketball coaches. Richard W. Rodriguez rrodriguez@star-telegram.com

Read more here: http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/high-school/article69829477.html#storylink=cpy

[TomBigBeeHog]

Neither did the Winninest HS Basketball Coach in Texas or the Boys Winninest HS Coach.

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/high-school/article69829477.html

Coach Hughes for the Boys from FW Dunbar HS
Over all Leta Andrews from Granbury HS who won more games a ladys Coach and any coach

Former Fort Worth Dunbar boys coach Robert Hughes and former Granbury girls coach Leta Andrews are the nation's winningest boys and girls basketball coaches. Richard W. Rodriguez rrodriguez@star-telegram.com

Read more here: http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/high-school/article69829477.html#storylink=cpy

Andrews won almost 1500 games but only 1 state championship. Not much controversy there IMO. Hughes has the better case.

[bigredone]

I'm not sure I would call 75 - 20 and two 1st place conference finishes in the first 3 seasons a failure, not even by Kentucky standards.

The 4th year was a disaster, but it seems that was mainly due to losing 3 starters t graduation, 1 early to the NBA, and 2 big recruits because of possible sanctions.

Remember the saying 'they remember November'? No matter how it started, he is remembered for how he left KY and that was a burning wreck.

He is a good coach that hung around for a long time to get his 800. He didn't get there in the fewest seasons. He wasn't the first. That is not a knock on him but to argue he is one of the greatest coaches of all time is pretty funny. He was what he was, a good coach.

[ChicoHog]

Remember the saying 'they remember November'? No matter how it started, he is remembered for how he left KY and that was a burning wreck.

He is a good coach that hung around for a long time to get his 800. He didn't get there in the fewest seasons. He wasn't the first. That is not a knock on him but to argue he is one of the greatest coaches of all time is pretty funny. He was what he was, a good coach.

He left UK with the core of 4 guys who lost the famous game to Duke in '92.  He left them with the sanctions thanks to Dwayne Casey but he did leave them some talent.