What's the huge difference between us and Wisc?

[TX HOG]

I know. I know, another thread.

Seriously though, Bret was successful at Wisconsin. They are still good. It's not recruiting. Conference??

[Tusks]

Whisky has a better record since BB left and that's with an extra coaching change.  That should tell you all you need.

[longpig]

I know. I know, another thread.

Seriously though, Bret was successful at Wisconsin. They are still good. It's not recruiting. Conference??

probably

[TX HOG]

He had some dang good years there. Much better than here. I don't get it...

[ThisTeetsTaken]

probably

Yep.  Beliema said so. Said in the B10 you only had to worry about a couple games a year and the rest were cupcakes. Also, remember him crying about Urban Meyer recruiting his committed recruits?  Yea, he's in over his head here at Arkansas.

[Dr. Starcs]

Alvarez is their ad

[longpig]

Yep.  Beliema said so. Said in the B10 you only had to worry about a couple games a year and the rest were cupcakes. Also, remember him crying about Urban Meyer recruiting his committed recruits?  Yea, he's in over his head here at Arkansas.

He's having a tough time adjusting and counter adjusting here.  Wasn't much of a dynamic with that in the Big 10. 

[jmark]

topic of the new year

[HamSammich]

I know. I know, another thread.

Seriously though, Bret was successful at Wisconsin. They are still good. It's not recruiting. Conference??

You want the hard core truth or an excuse?


Brett had a darn good AD and offensive and defensive assistants that his AD hired that are top notch coaches.

[Razor Ramon]

Also, Ohio St and Michigan were not the powerhouses that they are right now.

[AirWarren]

I know. I know, another thread.

Seriously though, Bret was successful at Wisconsin. They are still good. It's not recruiting. Conference??

More black folks near Madison.

Minorities are looked down upon in northwest Arkansas.

[HamSammich]

Also, Ohio St and Michigan were not the powerhouses that they are right now.

See that's excuses.... I watch damn near every college game every year that matters... usually more than once.. CBBs Wisconsin teams were damn legit.

[thefisher]

What's the huge difference between us and Wisc?

They have cheese curds and better beer?

[HamIAm]

I think you all need to go back and look at some records.  I'm not sure how you are coming up with Wisconsin being better than they were under Bielema.

It takes time to build a program.  Alvarez was there 16 years and finished first 3 times. His last six seasons before Bielema took over his teams finished 5th, 8th, 8th, 7th, 3rd, 3rd.

It took Bielema until his fifth year to finish first but then he did it three times in a row to wrap up his seven seasons there.

Since Bielema left they have had two coaches, both of whom finished 2nd their first year then 1st in their Division.

Bielema's last three teams were 7th, 10th and unranked in the AP Poll.  Since then they have been 22nd, 13th, 21st and unranked.

[3kgthog]

We have no Purdues to beat up on. Even UK and Vandy have their strengths.

Bret thought he could roll in and win with his system. I think his bowl win against Nutt played a factor, too. He underestimated the quality of the SEC d-lines and his bewildered look on the sidelines says he still just doesn't get it. Bigger ain't gonna get it done against 300 lb athletic freaks that are lighter than our o-line and just as strong.

[Oklahawg]

See that's excuses.... I watch damn near every college game every year that matters... usually more than once.. CBBs Wisconsin teams were damn legit.

Agreed.

[AirWarren]

See that's excuses.... I watch damn near every college game every year that matters... usually more than once.. CBBs Wisconsin teams were damn legit.

Sure were.

[Oklahawg]

Curious how we will look back on the next couple of years. I am wondering if the playoff era isn't going to usher in a return to supremacy by the handful of programs that are traditional powers, and we won't see the "upstarts" fade: Oregon, Baylor, TCU, Boise, Utah, Houston, Louisville.... Maybe looking at the SEC we have to ask about MS State.

I will concede any additional names (or subtractions) to the lists, but I think the point is valid. Programs able to be consistently mentioned late in the year and in the playoff hype will continue to distinguish themselves and reap the benefits of the PR. The playoff chatter puts a great deal of pressure on "up and comers" or "mid-majors" to sustain success when they are now mentioned every day of the year (especially from mid-October on).

[Oklahawg]

Consider - if the SEC hadn't expanded to 14 teams: we'd be seeing three East teams, including a South Carolina team that hasn't been so much the last few years. We'd have seen KY or Vanderbilt twice in CBB's time. Note that we've beaten Florida and Tennessee the last two years, so our East record could be even better.

[Razorbackers]

He inherited a program that was already solid, and from 2006-2010 they did pretty good. Then in 2010 when he had a system in place and his recruits they took advantage of a down Big 10 and won 3 straight Big 10 titles, and were very, very good.

So what's the difference?

When he got to Arkansas it was a tire fire inside of a dumpster fire. He's extinguished the flames, but he's still dealing with the rebuild, whether you people want to see it or not. If we fired him right now, we'd be on our 5th head coach in 10 years.

There's no coming back from that, guys. No one would take the job. No one would want the task of rebuilding again. The program couldn't handle it.

That's why Jeff gave him the guaranteed time. Not just because his players get good grades or he's mr. integrity or whatever other reason you want to project out there. But the program NEEDS stability. And if Bielema isn't the guy to get us to the wins and losses levels that we, and our AD, would like us to be, fine. But firing him now would murder the Arkansas Razorback football program.

[TX HOG]

Maybe in Big10 you can get away with 20-30 ranked recruiting classes.

[Atlhogfan1]

I know. I know, another thread.

Seriously though, Bret was successful at Wisconsin. They are still good. It's not recruiting. Conference??

Alvarez had built that program for years and most specifically oline. 

Competition after oline.

[jneal56]

More black folks near Madison.

Minorities are looked down upon in northwest Arkansas.

You've never been to Madison.

[colbs]

I think maybe a big difference is at Arkansas it was a rebuild and Wisconsin he had a really good foundation and pretty much just had to sustain it.  He had some really good teams.  The 2010 won the B1G title and beat an Ohio State team that beat Arkansaa in the Sugar Bowl.

[longpig]

They have cheese curds and better beer?

a tavern on every corner of every town

[tampahog]

Level of competition and fewer spread teams on the b10 menu

[longpig]

He inherited a program that was already solid, and from 2006-2010 they did pretty good. Then in 2010 when he had a system in place and his recruits they took advantage of a down Big 10 and won 3 straight Big 10 titles, and were very, very good.

So what's the difference?

When he got to Arkansas it was a tire fire inside of a dumpster fire. He's extinguished the flames, but he's still dealing with the rebuild, whether you people want to see it or not. If we fired him right now, we'd be on our 5th head coach in 10 years.

There's no coming back from that, guys. No one would take the job. No one would want the task of rebuilding again. The program couldn't handle it.

That's why Jeff gave him the guaranteed time. Not just because his players get good grades or he's mr. integrity or whatever other reason you want to project out there. But the program NEEDS stability. And if Bielema isn't the guy to get us to the wins and losses levels that we, and our AD, would like us to be, fine. But firing him now would murder the Arkansas Razorback football program.

Then why did he stop rebuilding at Mizzou last month?

[ErieHog]

Two major differences;  conditions of the program at the time they were inherited, and the relative competition.

People really don't grasp just how bad things were, when the turnover happened.   That's something that should have taken 2 or 3 years just to stabilize, to begin competing;  Bielema, to that degree, was a victim of his own early success- people kept expecting more, rather than understanding there was a fair amount of winning on the back of about 7 guys, and hiding the other 70.

Now, when that front 7 guy rotation isn't as strong, and has injury issues,  the other 70 become a much greater focus-- and while they're nowhere near as bad as they were 4 years ago, they're certainly not ready for prime time by any measure.

That said, we put ourselves in positions to win several games, but fell apart late-- that's a hallmark of a shallow team, and one that is not mentally strong.

That's the only real criticism I have of BB this year;  his teams should be mentally stronger than they are, but there's only so much of that you can do-- the kids are who the kids are.

[RazorPiggie]

You've never been to Madison.

He's being a smartarse I'm hoping.

[Oklahawg]

Two major differences;  conditions of the program at the time they were inherited, and the relative competition.

People really don't grasp just how bad things were, when the turnover happened.   That's something that should have taken 2 or 3 years just to stabilize, to begin competing;  Bielema, to that degree, was a victim of his own early success- people kept expecting more, rather than understanding there was a fair amount of winning on the back of about 7 guys, and hiding the other 70.

Now, when that front 7 guy rotation isn't as strong, and has injury issues,  the other 70 become a much greater focus-- and while they're nowhere near as bad as they were 4 years ago, they're certainly not ready for prime time by any measure.

That said, we put ourselves in positions to win several games, but fell apart late-- that's a hallmark of a shallow team, and one that is not mentally strong.

That's the only real criticism I have of BB this year;  his teams should be mentally stronger than they are, but there's only so much of that you can do-- the kids are who the kids are.

Good post.

[Oklahawg]

He inherited a program that was already solid, and from 2006-2010 they did pretty good. Then in 2010 when he had a system in place and his recruits they took advantage of a down Big 10 and won 3 straight Big 10 titles, and were very, very good.

So what's the difference?

When he got to Arkansas it was a tire fire inside of a dumpster fire. He's extinguished the flames, but he's still dealing with the rebuild, whether you people want to see it or not. If we fired him right now, we'd be on our 5th head coach in 10 years.

There's no coming back from that, guys. No one would take the job. No one would want the task of rebuilding again. The program couldn't handle it.

That's why Jeff gave him the guaranteed time. Not just because his players get good grades or he's mr. integrity or whatever other reason you want to project out there. But the program NEEDS stability. And if Bielema isn't the guy to get us to the wins and losses levels that we, and our AD, would like us to be, fine. But firing him now would murder the Arkansas Razorback football program.

I like this.

[d1nonlyhogfan]

He inherited a program that was already solid, and from 2006-2010 they did pretty good. Then in 2010 when he had a system in place and his recruits they took advantage of a down Big 10 and won 3 straight Big 10 titles, and were very, very good.

So what's the difference?

When he got to Arkansas it was a tire fire inside of a dumpster fire. He's extinguished the flames, but he's still dealing with the rebuild, whether you people want to see it or not. If we fired him right now, we'd be on our 5th head coach in 10 years.

There's no coming back from that, guys. No one would take the job. No one would want the task of rebuilding again. The program couldn't handle it.

That's why Jeff gave him the guaranteed time. Not just because his players get good grades or he's mr. integrity or whatever other reason you want to project out there. But the program NEEDS stability. And if Bielema isn't the guy to get us to the wins and losses levels that we, and our AD, would like us to be, fine. But firing him now would murder the Arkansas Razorback football program.

He has done very little to move this program forward in 4 years. I was willing to give him the 2 year pass after Smile, but a 4 year pass is pretty ridiculous to ask of any fan base, especially one who had recently experience a high level of success under its most recent permanent HC.

[Poker_hog]

Better AD and easier schedule

[jgphillips3]

They play in the equivalent of the SEC East. Here are the divisions and standings this year:

East Division

Penn State 8-1
Ohio State 8-1
Michigan 7-2
Indiana 4-5
Maryland 3-6
Michigan State 1-8
Rutgers 0-9

West Division

Wisconsin 7-2
Iowa 6-3
Nebraska 6-3
Minnesota 5-4
Northwestern 5-4
Illinois 2-7
Purdue 1-8

Then, add to that the fact that both Ohio State and Michigan were way, way down during Bielema's tenure and you have the answer for how he won three straight Big 10 titles and lost all three Rose Bowls.  It's basically what used to happen to us in the SWC when we would win the conference having to beat only one or two tough teams and then get beat in the bowl.  It's not that Wisconsin or Arkansas in the SWC was not good, we both were, but we appeared better than we actually were due to a record inflated by beating hardly anyone of note.

[tophawg19]

the Wisky team ran everything the same way when he took over so no culture change was needed . he took over a pass first offense from BP . with players suited for that offense . He has had to change the whole philosophy and find players to fit his style . Also team speed in the SEC and south for that matter is far greater . See both Bama and Clemson games . Bama destroyed washington with speed on defense and Clemson is doing the same to OSU .

[longpig]

More black folks near Madison.

Minorities are looked down upon in northwest Arkansas.

bless your heart

[Nashville Fan]

Wisconsin plays 3-4 ranked teams a year and this year AR played 8 in a row.

[Hogfan1660]

Whisky has a better record since BB left and that's with an extra coaching change.  That should tell you all you need.

^^^This^^^ x 1000.....😠😠😠😠😠

[Atlhogfan1]

Whisky has a better record since BB left and that's with an extra coaching change.  That should tell you all you need.

Yes it is a solidly built consistent program.   

[hoglady]

Well - Penn St was on probation and recovering from the Sandusky disaster, Ohio St was on probation and recovering from the Tressel ordeal and Michigan had made a bad coaching hire before bringing Harbaugh home.
I guess we could compete for the SEC West if Bama, Auburn and LSU were on probation and/or recovering from scandal.

[razorsharptusk]

He seems to not be able to get the players to buy in. So much Coach speak in all those post game interviews.  We need a coach the will fire up the players. This is a game of emotion. We had none.

[Jackrabbit Hog]

About 25 degrees hotter here on the average.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

the Wisky team ran everything the same way when he took over so no culture change was needed . he took over a pass first offense from BP . with players suited for that offense . He has had to change the whole philosophy and find players to fit his style . Also team speed in the SEC and south for that matter is far greater . See both Bama and Clemson games . Bama destroyed washington with speed on defense and Clemson is doing the same to OSU .

Not sure what his style is.  I mean the OL and RB's are his guys, and they can't run the ball.  Like last year, we had to open up the passing game to have any success running.  The passing game has been good the last 2 season, yet teams still line up to stop the run.  Every good team we play seems to make us one dimensional on offense with ease. 

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Wisconsin plays 3-4 ranked teams a year and this year AR played 8 in a row.

True, but I bet they'd roll us if we played.

[longpig]

Well - Penn St was on probation and recovering from the Sandusky disaster, Ohio St was on probation and recovering from the Tressel ordeal and Michigan had made a bad coaching hire before bringing Harbaugh home.
I guess we could compete for the SEC West if Bama, Auburn and LSU were on probation and/or recovering from scandal.

Sandusky scandal started late Nov. 2011.  For a long while previouslyPenn. St. was down because they were clinging on hopelessly to Joe Pa (probably so he could beat Bowden at being the most wins king).  He went from smooth sailing in the Big 10 to the perfect storm here.

[hoglady]

Not sure what his style is.  I mean the OL and RB's are his guys, and they can't run the ball.  Like last year, we had to open up the passing game to have any success running.  The passing game has been good the last 2 season, yet teams still line up to stop the run.  Every good team we play seems to make us one dimensional on offense with ease. 

We are good in the areas of Bielema's perceived weaknesses - passing the ball, great receiving corps.
And pretty darn bad in the areas of what most think are Bielema's strengths - Oline, being able to run when we have to and defense.
It's all pretty confusing, actually.

[Atlhogfan1]

Not sure what his style is.  I mean the OL and RB's are his guys, and they can't run the ball.  Like last year, we had to open up the passing game to have any success running.  The passing game has been good the last 2 season, yet teams still line up to stop the run.  Every good team we play seems to make us one dimensional on offense with ease.

Only 3 full classes on campus is too few to reload on oline.   That was going to take a little time. 

[jcharkansas]

Well - Penn St was on probation and recovering from the Sandusky disaster, Ohio St was on probation and recovering from the Tressel ordeal and Michigan had made a bad coaching hire before bringing Harbaugh home.
I guess we could compete for the SEC West if Bama, Auburn and LSU were on probation and/or recovering from scandal.

Don't forget about atm, ole miss

[longpig]

Only 3 full classes on campus is too few to reload on oline.   That was going to take a little time.

How was our O line 13,14 and 15?

[Atlhogfan1]

How was our O line 13,14 and 15?

How does that relate to my earlier post?