2016 vs 2017 roster

[RazorRed26]

Hey everyone, I got bored this morning and decided to do a 16 vs 17 roster comparison.  I went ahead a listed everyone that was on the 16 roster that isn't on the current 17 roster. This includes seniors.   The one person that stuck out to me was D'Vone McClure.  Does anyone know what happened to him?

48   Adam McFain   K
19   Anthony Antwine   TE
99   Brandon Lewis   DL
51   Brooks Ellis   LB
81   Cody Hollister   WR
7   Damon Mitchell   RB
70   Dan Skipper   OL
48   Deatrich Wise Jr.   DL
2   DJ Dean   DB
3   Dominique Reed   WR
80   Drew Morgan   WR
84   D'Vone McClure   WR
6   JaMichael Winston   DL
29   Jared Collins   DB
55   Jeremiah Ledbetter   DL
83   Jeremy Sprinkle   TE
21   Josh Williams   LB
4   Keon Hatcher   WR
27   Khalia Hackett   LB
24   Kody Walker   RB
26   Matt Dodson   DB
56   Matt Emrich   LS/H
47   Matt Reynolds   LB
9   Ricky Town   QB
94   Taiwan Johnson   DL
97   Tevin Beanum   DL
37   Toby Baker   P

[factchecker]

Hey everyone, I got bored this morning and decided to do a 16 vs 17 roster comparison.  I went ahead a listed everyone that was on the 16 roster that isn't on the current 17 roster. This includes seniors.   The one person that stuck out to me was D'Vone McClure.  Does anyone know what happened to him?

McClure was a walk-on receiver who had previously played pro baseball.  He is older so he might be focusing on getting his degree vs. running around with the young bucks.  I think he is working with Perfect Timing baseball academy here in Fayetteville. I have no real idea though.

Another person that sticks out is Antwine.  He has played heavily on special teams throughout the past few seasons.

[FANONTHEHILL]

D'Vone came in one day this spring and told the staff that he just didn't want to keep playing.  He is working as a coach at Perfect Timing and is still enrolled in school.

[ricepig]

D'Vone came in one day this spring and told the staff that he just didn't want to keep playing.  He is working as a coach at Perfect Timing and is still enrolled in school.

As BB told them in January, if you're not 100% committed to the program, then move on.

[FANONTHEHILL]

As BB told them in January, if you're not 100% committed to the program, then move on.

He has had a minor league baseball career.  Gave D-1 football a try and I think he was ready to move on to the next chapter of his life.  Baseball is paying for his education and he can get his degree without 15hr days.  I'm happy for him and so are his friends on the team.

[ricepig]

He has had a minor league baseball career.  Gave D-1 football a try and I think he was ready to move on to the next chapter of his life.  Baseball is paying for his education and he can get his degree without 15hr days.  I'm happy for him and so are his friends on the team.

As I said, he wasn't 100% committed to football.

[bennyl08]

Antwine was also a pretty big part of our offense in 2014.

[bennyl08]

When I saw that the roster was updated, i was excited to add the new weights to my roster comparison threat that tracks the changes in weights of players over time. However, as of Friday, the new players had been added, but not a single weight had been changed since the fall roster of last year.

[FANONTHEHILL]

When I saw that the roster was updated, i was excited to add the new weights to my roster comparison threat that tracks the changes in weights of players over time. However, as of Friday, the new players had been added, but not a single weight had been changed since the fall roster of last year.

If they do it like last year, heights and weights won't be updated until after the second 8 week off season  session.  Just finished the first, then spring ball, then two weeks off right after finals to let players go home and see family, then summer school and the second 8 weeks of weights, then measure as fall camp begins and post those.  The majority of weight gain and strength increase is in that summer weight session.

[RazorRed26]

Jamario Bell is a interesting case.  If I remember correctly CBB said he doesn't have the right mentality to play defense.  I am not sold that he is a tight end either.  I thought since we are switching to a 3-4 look they could try him at OLB.  For some reason I pictured him like Aldon Smith of the 49ers his first year, without all the trouble.   He has those long arms that could set the edge.   

[RebelW]

I really like this years roster. It is all of CBB recruits now. I can see what he's building.

[bennyl08]

If they do it like last year, heights and weights won't be updated until after the second 8 week off season  session.  Just finished the first, then spring ball, then two weeks off right after finals to let players go home and see family, then summer school and the second 8 weeks of weights, then measure as fall camp begins and post those.  The majority of weight gain and strength increase is in that summer weight session.

Last year they updated the weights right before spring ball started, and then again right before fall camp started. That is what they have done ever since I've closely followed the hogs.

Granted, you are much more intimately familiar with what actually goes on than I am. I have no idea if the players were actually weighed or not, only that they did indeed change the weights listed on the online official roster.

[FANONTHEHILL]

Last year they updated the weights right before spring ball started, and then again right before fall camp started. That is what they have done ever since I've closely followed the hogs.

Granted, you are much more intimately familiar with what actually goes on than I am. I have no idea if the players were actually weighed or not, only that they did indeed change the weights listed on the online official roster.

I wasn't clear in my previous post.  The updated numbers on the roster, at least from the guys I know and have talked to, are from the start the 8 week offseason period that just ended.  The weight that they take at the end if camp will be the "official" weight.  As for the accuracy of those weights, they're correct the day that they're taken, but the lineman (290+) usually end the season 15-20 lbs lighter than where they were when camp ended.

[bennyl08]

I wasn't clear in my previous post.  The updated numbers on the roster, at least from the guys I know and have talked to, are from the start the 8 week offseason period that just ended.  The weight that they take at the end if camp will be the "official" weight.  As for the accuracy of those weights, they're correct the day that they're taken, but the lineman (290+) usually end the season 15-20 lbs lighter than where they were when camp ended.

Gotcha. I know pretty much every spring, there's a bit of controversy of coach saying some player is x many pounds which will be 10+ different from what was listed. Similarly, I remember with JWill CBB bragging about how he was up to 220-225. Which confused me because he was listed at that weight the spring before and fall camp. Figured he likely lost some weight during the season, but he seemingly was always back up to that weight after the winter.

Also, you say the spring weights are from before any off-season weight lifting happens? I've always assumed they were done right after the winter offseason program ended.

[FANONTHEHILL]

Gotcha. I know pretty much every spring, there's a bit of controversy of coach saying some player is x many pounds which will be 10+ different from what was listed. Similarly, I remember with JWill CBB bragging about how he was up to 220-225. Which confused me because he was listed at that weight the spring before and fall camp. Figured he likely lost some weight during the season, but he seemingly was always back up to that weight after the winter.

Also, you say the spring weights are from before any off-season weight lifting happens? I've always assumed they were done right after the winter offseason program ended.

I actually had my son look at the list this afternoon and he told me his weight wasn't even the 2016 post season weight. It was still his weight from camp last fall. Then he asked me, "people know our weights go up and down all the time and those are never right don't they?"  It told him, "be quiet and let us us fans continue to speculate!" 😀

[Biggus Piggus]

The only heights/weights of interest are those of newcomers. Nothing else is updated.

CB Korey Hernandez 5-10, 170
LB Kyrei Fisher 6-2, 235
OL Kirby Adcock 6-5, 300
OL Shane Clenin 6-6, 295
OL Dalton Wagner 6-9, 330
QB Daulton Hyatt 6-4, 180
RB Maleek Williams 6-0, 230

And those numbers might not even be current.

[Razorbackers]

The only heights/weights of interest are those of newcomers. Nothing else is updated.

RB Maleek Williams 6-0, 230

What a hoss. That is a big RB.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

The only heights/weights of interest are those of newcomers. Nothing else is updated.

CB Korey Hernandez 5-10, 170
LB Kyrei Fisher 6-2, 235
OL Kirby Adcock 6-5, 300
OL Shane Clenin 6-6, 295
OL Dalton Wagner 6-9, 330
QB Daulton Hyatt 6-4, 180
RB Maleek Williams 6-0, 230

And those numbers might not even be current.

Seems like I read or heard a presser where Bielema said that Maleek Williams had already trimmed down some?

[OnTheHillHogFan]

Seems like I read or heard a presser where Bielema said that Maleek Williams had already trimmed down some?

He was around 245 when he got on campus

[factchecker]

There were four new walk ons listed on the 2017 spring roster, including a pair of former Fayetteville High stars in sophomore wide receiver Tyson Morris (6-1, 201) and redshirt freshman kicker Jon Fagg.

Morris, whose father is former Razorback basketball star Isaiah "Butch" Morris, transferred in from Division II Central Oklahoma.

Fagg, whose father is UA senior associate athletic director Jon Fagg, was 58-of-63 on PATs and 9 of 10 field goals as a senior in 2015.

The other two are sophomore linebackers in Terrell Collins (6-0, 235) of St. Louis, Mo., Hazelwood Central by way of Iowa Western Community College and former Bryant player Brenden Young (6-1, 202), who was at Ouachita. (OBU)

http://www.wholehogsports.com/news/2017/mar/27/bielema-excited-about-new-staffs-recruiting-prowes/

[Pork Twain]

Tell me where I am wrong, because I am sure I am, and I will fix it.

[Biggus Piggus]

Jake Hall has been moved to defensive end.

Dalton Wagner is probably a backup right tackle, and Paul Ramirez could be in the mix at left tackle or guard.

Jake Raulerson is going to begin spring as second-team right tackle.

The first freshman to put on the Oline depth chart is Shane Clenin. What position, unclear.

Hayden Johnson might be the starting fullback and also a top reserve at tight end.

Deon Stewart probably is the backup behind Cornelius, but that's a guess. T.J. Hammonds also will contend with Stewart for the starting job in the slot, when Arkansas goes three WRs.

Jordan Jones and Brandon Martin might be the top contenders for the starting "big" WR position.

Karl Roesler will be tried at DE and "Hog" outside linebacker. He is not a shoo-in to start anywhere. Michael Taylor is ahead of Roesler at OLB.

Briston Guidry will start out as first-team DE opposite Sosa Agim. Jonathan Marshall and T.J. Smith are their backups for now. Jake Hall and Daytreion Dean are there too.

Dre Greenlaw will start at WLB, inside. His backup is Dwayne Eugene.

Khalia Hackett is gone.

The MLBs are De'Jon Harris and Giovanni La'France.

The starting CBs entering spring are Ryan Pulley and Kevin Richardson. Henre' Toliver is the nickel back for now. Britto Tutt will play field corner behind Richardson. Toliver will back up Pulley.

Micahh Smith and Deon Edwards are strong safeties.

[Pork Twain]

I changed most of it but the stuff that was up in the air, I kept the same.

[Biggus Piggus]

Looks like Roesler's staying at DE.

[bennyl08]

The story that isn't getting the attention it deserves is NumberGate. Brandon Martin comes in and steals Ty Storey's #5!

Controversy! Intrigue! Subversion!

[FANONTHEHILL]

The story that isn't getting the attention it deserves is NumberGate. Brandon Martin comes in and steals Ty Storey's #5!

Controversy! Intrigue! Subversion!

I like the controversy scenario, but it may just be that Ty's glad Keon is gone! 😁

[lakecityhog]

Biggus,
Why on earth would we burn a redshirt on Clenin? O'Line is my #1 concern and it is stuff like this that keeps me wondering what is going on up there. We have what, 15 other O'Linemen on the roster and we can't find 5 guys capable of playing back-up without wasting a year on a true freshman?

Sometimes I think that BB is like a kid with a new toy when it comes to O'Linemen. What happened to Heinrich? Did he just turn to crap during his redshirt year? This is the stuff that has to be dis-heartening to players! Spend a couple of years busting your hump and in walks a kid that hasn't even seen Razorback field and boom, he is being talked about as a back-up??? What could this kid have possibly done to deserve any such accolades? Motivation??? Hardly!!

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Biggus,
Why on earth would we burn a redshirt on Clenin? O'Line is my #1 concern and it is stuff like this that keeps me wondering what is going on up there. We have what, 15 other O'Linemen on the roster and we can't find 5 guys capable of playing back-up without wasting a year on a true freshman?

Sometimes I think that BB is like a kid with a new toy when it comes to O'Linemen. What happened to Heinrich? Did he just turn to crap during his redshirt year? This is the stuff that has to be dis-heartening to players! Spend a couple of years busting your hump and in walks a kid that hasn't even seen Razorback field and boom, he is being talked about as a back-up??? What could this kid have possibly done to deserve any such accolades? Motivation??? Hardly!!

I'm not Biggus but I would suggest that Clenin has obviously done something in these first few months on campus to set himself apart from the competition. If the kid is THAT good, then yeah, he needs to be getting reps and everyone else who has been there busting their hump, maybe need to bust their humps a little more. If a true freshman is good enough to play immediately that could mean that he is one of those "3 and gone" guys. If he can help at a level that is above others on the depth chart and he can help, do you really want him riding the pine?

I'm all about the R/S Program and believe in the value of that, but there are always exceptions to the rule. Now all of that being said, we aren't into August camp yet, so I wouldn't be too concerned. There is still a lot of competition ahead.

[southeasthog]

Biggus,
Why on earth would we burn a redshirt on Clenin? O'Line is my #1 concern and it is stuff like this that keeps me wondering what is going on up there. We have what, 15 other O'Linemen on the roster and we can't find 5 guys capable of playing back-up without wasting a year on a true freshman?

Sometimes I think that BB is like a kid with a new toy when it comes to O'Linemen. What happened to Heinrich? Did he just turn to crap during his redshirt year? This is the stuff that has to be dis-heartening to players! Spend a couple of years busting your hump and in walks a kid that hasn't even seen Razorback field and boom, he is being talked about as a back-up??? What could this kid have possibly done to deserve any such accolades? Motivation??? Hardly!!

He said the first freshman. He didn't say he would be in the two deep. Where else have you seen that Clenin is in the two deep already?

[MuskogeeHogFan]

He said the first freshman. He didn't say he would be in the two deep. Where else have you seen that Clenin is in the two deep already?

I think I also remember hearing that he was running with the 2's at a Tackle. RT maybe?

[hawginbigd1]

Tell me where I am wrong, because I am sure I am, and I will fix it.

According to the coaches you need to put Dre and Eugene at WILB, my hunch is Dre ends up at the Razor OLB spot, and Taylor/Ramsey man the Hog spot. That will leave Eugene and Maybe LaFrance at WILB, Harris is no doubt starting MLB.

Raulerson beats out Gibson at RG, all the Freshman end up red shirting IMO.

Tolliver or Tutt beat out Richardson at CB, Richardson ends up playing in Nickel and Dime packages at S or Nickel.

TE will have a lot of or's Patton or Cantrell, or CJ, or Gragg, or Kraus I think they all play a lot.

I think Roesler ends up starting opposite Agim, but Guidry plays as much or more.

Hopefully someone beats out at least one of the 2 safeties, just not sure either one can develop into an SEC caliber starter.

[a0ashle]

Here is an honest question that I don't know the answer to. How many blown red shirts has Bielema actually had? I specifically looking at players who stayed until they couldn't and they could have used another year?

2 years ago I would have said Kirkland and Skipper, but Kirkland left early and Skip honestly is leaving at probably the best time for him. I know there is at least one other name that Bielema has stated he regrets not having redshirted but the name escapes me.

P.S. I know this isn't an exact science, lot factors at play. Kirkland might not leave if he was able to RS. I'm just curious for the board's thoughts.

[HogHomer]

Here is an honest question that I don't know the answer to. How many blown red shirts has Bielema actually had? I specifically looking at players who stayed until they couldn't and they could have used another year?

2 years ago I would have said Kirkland and Skipper, but Kirkland left early and Skip honestly is leaving at probably the best time for him. I know there is at least one other name that Bielema has stated he regrets not having redshirted but the name escapes me.

P.S. I know this isn't an exact science, lot factors at play. Kirkland might not leave if he was able to RS. I'm just curious for the board's thoughts.

The only player I can really say he made an egregious mistake not redshirting is Spaight.

[a0ashle]

The only player I can really say he made an egregious mistake not redshirting is Spaight.

That's the one I couldn't recall. That is a great example of a blown redshirt.

[RebelW]

We had more experience last year, but have more talent this year

[jgphillips3]

The only player I can really say he made an egregious mistake not redshirting is Spaight.

Spaight was a JUCO kid.  He was being recruited by Ohio State and others to play.  I doubt very seriously that he would have redshirted unless he was injured.

[ricepig]

Spaight was a JUCO kid.  He was being recruited by Ohio State and others to play.  I doubt very seriously that he would have redshirted unless he was injured.

He was committed to K-State until we offered. He had to do some school work instead of enrolling early, if I remember correctly.

[HogHomer]

Spaight was a JUCO kid.  He was being recruited by Ohio State and others to play.  I doubt very seriously that he would have redshirted unless he was injured.

I know who Spaight is. He also barely played any his first year and Coach B said he blames himself for not redshirting him so he could spend a year getting up to speed instead of wasting a year of eligibility on special teams. Imagine if we could've had Spaight senior production for two years. I'm not saying Coach B can't evaluate it's just the only big redshirting mistake I have seen so far. Which isnt a bad thing tbh.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Spaight was a JUCO kid.  He was being recruited by Ohio State and others to play.  I doubt very seriously that he would have redshirted unless he was injured.

And you know the thing about talking a kid into agreeing to a R/S, if they happen to wind up being pretty doggone good, they can still opt to go early to the draft. See Philon, ran scout team as a Freshman, R/S after his Freshman year and the next year as a R/S Sophomore....gone to the NFL and still there with the Chargers, I think.

[lakecityhog]

I truly wish that we had 3 and gone type talent on the O'Line. Other Than Ragnow, who I think made the right choice, who have we had of that caliber?

BB made a comment in his Pre-Spring PC that all 3 of the freshmen could play and really hyped Clenin.
Now, don't get me wrong, I hope Clenin is 1st team All-SEC. I hope that Frank, Jackson, Wallace and ALL of them are highly rated.

Just because a player left early doesn't make him ready. I think that nearly everyone on this board would agree that Philon and Kirkland would have benefitted greatly from another year in school. Philon did RS, nothing BB could have done, and Kirkland let someone get in his ear and it probably cost him a ton on his first contract.

The only way that we will ever build real depth on the O'Line is by redshirting. At least, that is my opinion.

[a0ashle]

I truly wish that we had 3 and gone type talent on the O'Line. Other Than Ragnow, who I think made the right choice, who have we had of that caliber?

BB made a comment in his Pre-Spring PC that all 3 of the freshmen could play and really hyped Clenin.
Now, don't get me wrong, I hope Clenin is 1st team All-SEC. I hope that Frank, Jackson, Wallace and ALL of them are highly rated.

Just because a player left early doesn't make him ready. I think that nearly everyone on this board would agree that Philon and Kirkland would have benefitted greatly from another year in school. Philon did RS, nothing BB could have done, and Kirkland let someone get in his ear and it probably cost him a ton on his first contract.

The only way that we will ever build real depth on the O'Line is by redshirting. At least, that is my opinion.

I think specifically regarding a blown redshirts, leaving early means not red shirting didn't end up mattering.

We here a lot of pent up anger centered around redshirts, and reality is we have only had one instance where not redshirting was a mistake. That's pretty damn good.

Philon is the other side of the coin. Redshirted and probably shouldn't have. I can't think of any others on that side (feel free to add any I am overlooking)

TL;DR - So far it seems Bielema is doing a really good job in the redshirt/no redshirt department.

[rzrbk4life]

Here is an honest question that I don't know the answer to. How many blown red shirts has Bielema actually had? I specifically looking at players who stayed until they couldn't and they could have used another year?

2 years ago I would have said Kirkland and Skipper, but Kirkland left early and Skip honestly is leaving at probably the best time for him. I know there is at least one other name that Bielema has stated he regrets not having redshirted but the name escapes me.

P.S. I know this isn't an exact science, lot factors at play. Kirkland might not leave if he was able to RS. I'm just curious for the board's thoughts.

I wouldn't say this was a blown redshirt but I don't understand why tj hammonds wasn't redshirted last year. He had what maybe 10 touches last year +\- . We had rw3 and devwah last year to handle rb. I know tj is an explosive player but felt we didn't really 'need' him or use him like we should have last year. But that's why I'm not a coach to make those decisions

[a0ashle]

I wouldn't say this was a blown redshirt but I don't understand why tj hammonds wasn't redshirted last year. He had what maybe 10 touches last year +\- . We had rw3 and devwah last year to handle rb. I know tj is an explosive player but felt we didn't really 'need' him or use him like we should have last year. But that's why I'm not a coach to make those decisions

It's hard to say if it was right or wrong at this point. I personally will let that play out.

[lakecityhog]

Philon redshirted due to his injury.

[HogHomer]

It's hard to say if it was right or wrong at this point. I personally will let that play out.

+1 that's almost all we can do because like you said you can't for sure say if it was a right or wrong decision. However if TJ redshirted he would have been on the practice squad playing with other Practice squad players. But because he didn't redshirt he got reps with the Starters and Backups and that experience will hopefully prove to be extremely helpful.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I truly wish that we had 3 and gone type talent on the O'Line. Other Than Ragnow, who I think made the right choice, who have we had of that caliber?

BB made a comment in his Pre-Spring PC that all 3 of the freshmen could play and really hyped Clenin.
Now, don't get me wrong, I hope Clenin is 1st team All-SEC. I hope that Frank, Jackson, Wallace and ALL of them are highly rated.

Just because a player left early doesn't make him ready. I think that nearly everyone on this board would agree that Philon and Kirkland would have benefitted greatly from another year in school. Philon did RS, nothing BB could have done, and Kirkland let someone get in his ear and it probably cost him a ton on his first contract.

The only way that we will ever build real depth on the O'Line is by redshirting. At least, that is my opinion.

It is absolutely true that we see few O-Linemen that are of the "3 and done" variety. Ragnow could have left after last season, but those guys are rare. Even more rare are the guys who the NFL says are good enough that they could leave for the Draft after 3 years, but who choose to come back for their 4th season. Kirkland made a mistake. As we may remember, Bielema was within days of meeting with he and his family to talk about this and instead of waiting, they made a decision with an Agent that he was leaving for the draft. Big mistake, IMO.

I believe strongly in a solid R/S program and once it gets going it is invaluable to a program as long as you keep the pipeline of players filled with talent and the number of players you need to not only provide depth but that also allows you to have 3-4 guys redshirting every year.

Every so often you are going to have those 3rd year guys that are so talented that they need to be utilized from the very first year. You see it a lot more often at the skill positions on both sides of the ball, but when you have those guys, regardless of which position they play, you need to play them.

Is Shane Clenin one of those guys? I don't think that any of us know enough to have an informed opinion of that, but the staff knows. There is still a lot of competition ahead, so we will see.

Here's another one that might see action. Did you notice what was said about Maleek Williams in the pressers? What are some of the major things that tend to keep our younger RB's off the field longer? Not being able to pick up blocking assignments, not getting the calls right, not being able to have the developed judgement of knowing where a hole is going to develop and then getting through that hole with a burst? If I heard correctly they were impressed with the maturity of Williams (in terms of football knowledge) in picking up all of these responsibilities so quickly. He may be another guy that they don't R/S.

[lakecityhog]

Muskee,
In terms of redshirting I believe that the position as well as the player should be a consideration. I don't think that you can coach on the basis of what might happen. Coach them on the basis of what should happen. If they leave early, they leave early. I would rather lose a redshirt junior than a true junior.

1st, O'Linemen should almost always be redshirted. Give them that year to grow and mature because in the SEC they will be going up against MEN!
2nd, QB's should always redshirt.

Now, with today's landscape of "I want mine now" maybe kids are telling the coach that they will not stay 5 years or even 4 years. Maybe Dad is looking towards the big payday. I guess that doesn't leave you much choice, play them early, lose them to transfer or lose them to early departure.

I guess that the other side of the coin could be that a kid can contribute, but the coaches see early that the kid will never be All-SEC quality and could be replaced by another recruiting cycle. As long as the entire staff realizes that poor redshirting forces them to have fewer misses each recruiting cycle then I guess things can work out.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Muskee,
In terms of redshirting I believe that the position as well as the player should be a consideration. I don't think that you can coach on the basis of what might happen. Coach them on the basis of what should happen. If they leave early, they leave early. I would rather lose a redshirt junior than a true junior.

1st, O'Linemen should almost always be redshirted. Give them that year to grow and mature because in the SEC they will be going up against MEN!
2nd, QB's should always redshirt.

Now, with today's landscape of "I want mine now" maybe kids are telling the coach that they will not stay 5 years or even 4 years. Maybe Dad is looking towards the big payday. I guess that doesn't leave you much choice, play them early, lose them to transfer or lose them to early departure.

I guess that the other side of the coin could be that a kid can contribute, but the coaches see early that the kid will never be All-SEC quality and could be replaced by another recruiting cycle. As long as the entire staff realizes that poor redshirting forces them to have fewer misses each recruiting cycle then I guess things can work out.

Another factor is retention (and the quality of who you recruit) and not as it relates to going early to the NFL. One thing that Bielema has accomplished in the philosophy that they utilize to recruit players, is to decrease the attrition rate (or miss rate) of the players that we sign. Under BP, that was a huge negative factor.

From 2008 through 2012 we lost (or didn't pan out) 66 of the 140 players that we signed. A 47.1% attrition/miss rate.

For Bielema, by class starting with 2013:

2013: 8 of 23 for 34.8%
2014: 5 of 25 for 20%
2015: 2 of 23 for 8.7%
2016: 0 of 23 for 0.0%

Those numbers may go up after spring ball but they are nonetheless far below what we were experiencing and that certainly allows you to build and develop talent for the future whether using a R/S program or not.

[bennyl08]

Muskee,
In terms of redshirting I believe that the position as well as the player should be a consideration. I don't think that you can coach on the basis of what might happen. Coach them on the basis of what should happen. If they leave early, they leave early. I would rather lose a redshirt junior than a true junior.

1st, O'Linemen should almost always be redshirted. Give them that year to grow and mature because in the SEC they will be going up against MEN!
2nd, QB's should always redshirt.

Now, with today's landscape of "I want mine now" maybe kids are telling the coach that they will not stay 5 years or even 4 years. Maybe Dad is looking towards the big payday. I guess that doesn't leave you much choice, play them early, lose them to transfer or lose them to early departure.

I guess that the other side of the coin could be that a kid can contribute, but the coaches see early that the kid will never be All-SEC quality and could be replaced by another recruiting cycle. As long as the entire staff realizes that poor redshirting forces them to have fewer misses each recruiting cycle then I guess things can work out.

Do you mean that you would rather lose a redshirt sophomore than lose a true junior? If they are a 3 and done kind of player, they won't make it to a RsJr year. It would be lose them after 2 years of play or lose them after 3 years of play.

The question you have to ask yourself is does playing this player benefit the program? Does playing him now give us a better chance of winning games this season? Is the probability of him improving this season greater than or less than the probability of him improving our team in his 5th season? Will this player see more improvement from playing earlier and practicing with the big boys earlier, or will he be best served by changing his body in the weightroom and spending more time learning about the schemes?

If Clenin has a body that can compete with our defensive players already, if he has a mind that will not be a liability out on the field, and he is so talented that he offers a significant improvement to this team by being on the two deep now in front of other players, then yeah, you don't redshirt  him.

[bennyl08]

Another factor is retention (and the quality of who you recruit) and not as it relates to going early to the NFL. One thing that Bielema has accomplished in the philosophy that they utilize to recruit players, is to decrease the attrition rate (or miss rate) of the players that we sign. Under BP, that was a huge negative factor.

From 2008 through 2012 we lost (or didn't pan out) 66 of the 140 players that we signed. A 47.1% attrition/miss rate.

For Bielema, by class starting with 2013:

2013: 8 of 23 for 34.8%
2014: 5 of 25 for 20%
2015: 2 of 23 for 8.7%
2016: 0 of 23 for 0.0%

Those numbers may go up after spring ball but they are nonetheless far below what we were experiencing and that certainly allows you to build and develop talent for the future whether using a R/S program or not.

Yeah, but how many of those players lost from the previous regime transferred as a result of the coaching change. Further, we typically takes 2-3 years to really see attrition of a class happen. So, the class of 2014 will probably see a few more leave this summer and '15 and '16 haven't had time to have any attrition yet.