Frank Broyles said Expect Arkansas to be 8 or 9th in the SEC

[B Ray]

The man knew more than most wanted to agree with!!

Under CBP, he improved that expectation and had us #3 in the country!!

If we want dominance, we have to hire a Top 10 style coach, a coach that has a name that draws recruits, hiring an up and comer, it will take 5 years for recruits to see the product on the field!! We all want to win and win now, We are in the SEC, with all the money we get each year, all the high dollar boosters we have, my question is what is the bottom dollar to be successful, we have it , let's use it !!!

[DoctorSusscrofa]

Posted by the chief contract negotiator himself.

[B Ray]

Posted by the chief contract negotiator himself.

I'm stating the obvious, you are late for class !!!

[Vantage 8 dude]

The man knew more than most wanted to agree with!!

Under CBP, he improved that expectation and had us #3 in the country!!

If we want dominance, we have to hire a Top 10 style coach, a coach that has a name that draws recruits, hiring an up and comer, it will take 5 years for recruits to see the product on the field!! We all want to win and win now, We are in the SEC, with all the money we get each year, all the high dollar boosters we have, my question is what is the bottom dollar to be successful, we have it , let's use it !!!

Not sure whether or not he actually meant that to be in the SEC WEST though.

[Wildhog]

8th in the SEC sounds pretty darn good right now.

[Tusks]

I don't think the 'expectation' for fans is 'dominance'.  I think it's 'competence' with flashes of greatness.

[KennyForAD]

Frank was glorifying himself by saying that BS, you fools.   How do you not understand?  The worse Frank could make Arkansas look, then the more of a genius Frank appeared to be by having such success in the sixties, and for (supposedly) building first rate facilities for a ninth rate program.

Wake up.  IT WAS A LIE THEN AND A LIE NOW.

[KennyForAD]

So much stupid on here today...   ltr

[LRHawg]

Kenny, that axe sharp enough yet?

[DeltaBoy]

Frank was glorifying himself by saying that BS, you fools.   How do you not understand?  The worse Frank could make Arkansas look, then the more of a genius Frank appeared to be by having such success in the sixties, and for (supposedly) building first rate facilities for a ninth rate program.

Wake up.  IT WAS A LIE THEN AND A LIE NOW.

I agree cause Nutt won the West 2 times and Bobby got us in the top 5.

[Sweet Feet]

Frank was glorifying himself by saying that BS, you fools.   How do you not understand?  The worse Frank could make Arkansas look, then the more of a genius Frank appeared to be by having such success in the sixties, and for (supposedly) building first rate facilities for a ninth rate program.

Wake up.  IT WAS A LIE THEN AND A LIE NOW.

Ive been said this.....this is why he ran off holtz and hatfield. then when nutt got successful with Malzahn, ran both of them off. Petrino had turned Arkansas into shades of the 70s teams and he gets questionably fired.

[DeltaBoy]

YIKES....

Frank ran off Ken Hatfield cause Ken had a higher winning percentage than Frank did.

[KennyForAD]

YIKES....

This is nothing new.  If you're over 50 and a Hog fan, you are very likely to know this.

[NaturalStateReb]

The man knew more than most wanted to agree with!!

Under CBP, he improved that expectation and had us #3 in the country!!

If we want dominance, we have to hire a Top 10 style coach, a coach that has a name that draws recruits, hiring an up and comer, it will take 5 years for recruits to see the product on the field!! We all want to win and win now, We are in the SEC, with all the money we get each year, all the high dollar boosters we have, my question is what is the bottom dollar to be successful, we have it , let's use it !!!

Not only will Arkansas not attract a "top 10" coach, there's an excellent chance it won't be able to attract a Power 5 coach.  LSU recently found it that attracting this kind of coach was a lot easier said than done.  Texas hired a guy from Houston.  USC hired a coordinator from within.  Notre Dame's coach came from Cincinnati.  Georgia's coach was a former coordinator.

There's isn't much of a ladder anymore inside FBS jobs--there's just way too much money everywhere now.

[EastexHawg]

Coach Broyles slipped in his later years, as many in their 80s and beyond do.  He said those things in an attempt to deflect criticism and soothe the fan base during the latter Houston Nutt years.  Many of us knew, and said over and over, that Nutt was a fraud and a millstone around the neck of the program.  Petrino proved that was correct and that Arkansas football could be a force with the right coach at the helm.

The same is correct now.  Bielema is a terrible fit at Arkansas and many of us have known it from the beginning.  Among those who didn't is our athletic director, which isn't surprising because speaking of 80 year olds he knows about as much about Arkansas and SEC football as one of the octogenarian ladies living down at the local nursing home.  Probably less if she has always lived in Arkansas...

[Hogwild]

Arkansas State is 4-2 and ranked as the 60th best program in nation, and they are still ranked 25 spots higher than us.

https://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/rankings/cbs/130

13th spot in the SEC, we are below Vandy and Ole Miss.


and out of the 65 Power 5 teams, we are ranked 59th.

[hogsanity]

Has anyone ever posted the ENTIRE text of what JFB said when that particular sentence was uttered ( if that was what he actually said at all ). Or is it like when he supposedly said a certain offense would not work, when what he actually said was it would not work without a particular type of QB - which has proven to be right on the mark.

[Atlhogfan1]

The man knew more than most wanted to agree with!!

Under CBP, he improved that expectation and had us #3 in the country!!

If we want dominance, we have to hire a Top 10 style coach, a coach that has a name that draws recruits, hiring an up and comer, it will take 5 years for recruits to see the product on the field!! We all want to win and win now, We are in the SEC, with all the money we get each year, all the high dollar boosters we have, my question is what is the bottom dollar to be successful, we have it , let's use it !!!

Not what he said nor was that the context. He had poor timing in making the comment and was misguided in his defense of Nutt.  But he was right in what he said referencing where the Arkansas job fell within the SEC at the time due to resources.  Couldn't expect many of our fans to understand what he was saying obviously. 

Bama
Florida
UGA
LSU
A&M
AU
Tennessee

No debating these are better coaching jobs.  Pressure at a particular job, rivals, expectations, etc.  Doesn't matter.  These jobs are better when it comes to having an opportunity to consistently compete for championships. 

[NorthDallas40]

Has anyone ever posted the ENTIRE text of what JFB said when that particular sentence was uttered ( if that was what he actually said at all ). Or is it like when he supposedly said a certain offense would not work, when what he actually said was it would not work without a particular type of QB - which has proven to be right on the mark.

I actually broke that story right here on Hogville the night when he made that comment at the Dallas Alumni Association Gala (I was posting under a different handle then before several bannings for not being a homer).  He most certainly meant that we couldn't be any better than that. He also passed out a colored handout to everyone in attendance showing as much. It didn't go over well to the crowd to say the least. Arguably started the downfall of his tenure. Was contacted for interviews about it at the time.

[Boog41]

Has anyone ever posted the ENTIRE text of what JFB said when that particular sentence was uttered ( if that was what he actually said at all ). Or is it like when he supposedly said a certain offense would not work, when what he actually said was it would not work without a particular type of QB - which has proven to be right on the mark.

Doing it now:

I will tell you that Arkansas is the 8th ranked team in our conference for potential. So he's got work.... I'm talking about potential....if you talk to the experts we're 8th in conference in potential, in potential. What is potential? The old recruiting base and the old financial base. And so they take your recruiting base and your financial base and they say you're 7th or 8th. Some of'em ranked us as 8th in the league. As far as potential... as far as potential. I I would tell you this....that....my friends have told me...and I'll quote... I want to protect myself.... my friends have told me that you will never be able to hire a top coach at Arkansas because of that ranking way down here.

[Atlhogfan1]

Doing it now:

I will tell you that Arkansas is the 8th ranked team in our conference for potential. So he's got work.... I'm talking about potential....if you talk to the experts we're 8th in conference in potential, in potential. What is potential? The old recruiting base and the old financial base. And so they take your recruiting base and your financial base and they say you're 7th or 8th. Some of'em ranked us as 8th in the league. As far as potential... as far as potential. I I would tell you this....that....my friends have told me...and I'll quote... I want to protect myself.... my friends have told me that you will never be able to hire a top coach at Arkansas because of that ranking way down here.

Lots of truth in it.  But not what your supporters want to hear especially when many wanted a coaching change. 

[hogsanity]

I actually broke that story right here on Hogville the night when he made that comment at the Dallas Alumni Association Gala (I was posting under a different handle then before several bannings for not being a homer).  He most certainly meant that we couldn't be any better than that. He also passed out a colored handout to everyone in attendance showing as much. It didn't go over well to the crowd to say the least. Arguably started the downfall of his tenure. Was contacted for interviews about it at the time.

Well, based on what we spend on football, what we make on football, where we recruit in football he was pretty spot on.

Someone started a thread last week showing cost per win, and the question was asked if we spent like Bama would we win like Bama? Oddly enough the thread got almost no play ( well actually not surprising since it had actual numbers and facts in stead of supposition, conjecture and subjectivness ).

[hogsanity]

Doing it now:

I will tell you that Arkansas is the 8th ranked team in our conference for potential. So he's got work.... I'm talking about potential....if you talk to the experts we're 8th in conference in potential, in potential. What is potential? The old recruiting base and the old financial base. And so they take your recruiting base and your financial base and they say you're 7th or 8th. Some of'em ranked us as 8th in the league. As far as potential... as far as potential. I I would tell you this....that....my friends have told me...and I'll quote... I want to protect myself.... my friends have told me that you will never be able to hire a top coach at Arkansas because of that ranking way down here.

So JFB was telling people what some analysts had told him. That when they looked at recruiting and spending they came up with AR being 8th in potential. JFB did not, based on what he said, come up with this on his own out of the blue.

[Atlhogfan1]

So JFB was telling people what some analysts had told him. That when they looked at recruiting and spending they came up with AR being 8th in potential. JFB did not, based on what he said, come up with this on his own out of the blue.

He tried to make that clear.  Again, much correct in what he said.  It was when, where and to whom he said it. 

[hogsanity]

He tried to make that clear.  Again, much correct in what he said.  It was when, where and to whom he said it. 

Oh yea, bad place to say that unless it was going to be part of a reason to ask for more money so they could spend more on recruiting, etc. Even if that was the end goal, not presented very well.

BUT, as I thought I remembered, this was not JFB coming up with this and just dropping it one a crowd one night.

[HoggyCat]

Frank was glorifying himself by saying that BS, you fools.   How do you not understand?  The worse Frank could make Arkansas look, then the more of a genius Frank appeared to be by having such success in the sixties, and for (supposedly) building first rate facilities for a ninth rate program.

Wake up.  IT WAS A LIE THEN AND A LIE NOW.

You're right.  We're 9th in the west!!!!

[NorthDallas40]

JFB wasn't saying this as if we are 8th, but... kind of thing. He was saying it as we are 8th so get used to it. I want to say it was around Van Horn's first year or so and he referred a few times to him as Norm DeBryan. He also focused his speech on beating Texas. By that time the crowd had openly revolted and said what about beating Bama and other SEC teams.

[Boog41]

So JFB was telling people what some analysts had told him. That when they looked at recruiting and spending they came up with AR being 8th in potential. JFB did not, based on what he said, come up with this on his own out of the blue.

Absolutely correct, but it isn't nearly as sexy, and doesn't fit in with the rest of the mob's attacks if you use anything past the first sentence.

[hogsanity]

JFB wasn't saying this as if we are 8th, but... kind of thing. He was saying it as we are 8th so get used to it. I want to say it was around Van Horn's first year or so and he referred a few times to him as Norm DeBryan. He also focused his speech on beating Texas. By that time the crowd had openly revolted and said what about beating Bama and other SEC teams.

Look, there is no question JFB stayed on too long as AD. He could have spent those last few years as an ambassador for the UofA, but not had to deal with the day to day stuff. That said, it was only JFB repeating what some analysts had told him, and I do not think they were wrong. When you look at recruiting base, and financials, the Hogs then and now land at about 8th.

I go back to the talent question, if we are constantly getting out recruited by Bama, Aub, A&M, LSU just in the SECW why does anyone expect the Hogs to do much better than 8th ( talking over the long haul not one or 2 season snap shots ).

Same in basketball. When have the Hogs done well under Mike Anderson? The two years they had better players. One with the SECPOTY and one with the pre season SECPOTY. The other 4 seasons not so good.

Baseball, when DVH has had pitching talent they have done well. Years the pitching has broken down, not so good.

Good coaching can only do so much.

[Boog41]

Oh yea, bad place to say that unless it was going to be part of a reason to ask for more money so they could spend more on recruiting, etc. Even if that was the end goal, not presented very well.

BUT, as I thought I remembered, this was not JFB coming up with this and just dropping it one a crowd one night.

Agree with you on this also.

[hogsanity]

Absolutely correct, but it isn't nearly as sexy, and doesn't fit in with the rest of the mob's attacks if you use anything past the first sentence.

Even the 1st sentence says ".....8th ranked....." indicating there is a ranking for such things, which means someone else came up with it.

But you are right, facts are a needless pest to many posters here.

[Boog41]

Even the 1st sentence says ".....8th ranked....." indicating there is a ranking for such things, which means someone else came up with it.

But you are right, facts are a needless pest to many posters here.

The actual audio of what he said is still out there on the internet. I found it and transcribed it, so I know it is exactly what he said.

[bphi11ips]

Has anyone ever posted the ENTIRE text of what JFB said when that particular sentence was uttered ( if that was what he actually said at all ). Or is it like when he supposedly said a certain offense would not work, when what he actually said was it would not work without a particular type of QB - which has proven to be right on the mark.

Listen to it yourself:

You should enjoy it.

Highlights:

1.  It wasn't Arkansas "to be" 8th or 9th.  It was Arkansas has the 7th or 8th best "POTENTIAL" in the SEC based upon its recruiting base and financial base.  Broyles after the fact cited a newspaper article as his source for the statement. 

2.  Based upon this "potential", friends told Broyles he would never be able to attract a Top 10 coach to Fayetteville.

3.  The Springdale parents wanted a meeting with him because their football tickets were on the 40 yard line. 

My thoughts:

Would anyone have seriously argued with that in 2007?    With A&M, "potential" is now 8th or 9th.  Who gives a rat's rear about potential?  It is what it is. Why whine about it?  Don't like it?  Follow another team. 

Broyles himself was certainly no "Top 10" coach when he took the position, but he definitely turned out to be one.  Bobby Petrino and Bret Bielema were both arguably Top 10 hires when they took the job. 

The team with the 7th or 8th or 9th best potential in the SEC is going to generally be around one of the top 25 teams in the country.  That's who we have been and who we are likely to continue to be at least for the forseeable future.  That's enough for me. 

[B Ray]

Coach Broyles slipped in his later years, as many in their 80s and beyond do.  He said those things in an attempt to deflect criticism and soothe the fan base during the latter Houston Nutt years.  Many of us knew, and said over and over, that Nutt was a fraud and a millstone around the neck of the program.  Petrino proved that was correct and that Arkansas football could be a force with the right coach at the helm.

The same is correct now.  Bielema is a terrible fit at Arkansas and many of us have known it from the beginning.  Among those who didn't is our athletic director, which isn't surprising because speaking of 80 year olds he knows about as much about Arkansas and SEC football as one of the octogenarian ladies living down at the local nursing home.  Probably less if she has always lived in Arkansas...

my thoughts exactly, with the checkbook open .. we can get us a better coach than what we have and not hire an up,and comer ..

[B Ray]

Not what he said nor was that the context. He had poor timing in making the comment and was misguided in his defense of Nutt.  But he was right in what he said referencing where the Arkansas job fell within the SEC at the time due to resources.  Couldn't expect many of our fans to understand what he was saying obviously. 

Bama
Florida
UGA
LSU
A&M
AU
Tennessee

No debating these are better coaching jobs.  Pressure at a particular job, rivals, expectations, etc.  Doesn't matter.  These jobs are better when it comes to having an opportunity to consistently compete for championships. 

I understood what he was trying to say, but my point is .. by making a new hire, we can stay in that pecking order or hire us a TOP coach that recruits, just by his name.. It can be done, we done it with CBP , we can do it again

[B Ray]

I actually broke that story right here on Hogville the night when he made that comment at the Dallas Alumni Association Gala (I was posting under a different handle then before several bannings for not being a homer).  He most certainly meant that we couldn't be any better than that. He also passed out a colored handout to everyone in attendance showing as much. It didn't go over well to the crowd to say the least. Arguably started the downfall of his tenure. Was contacted for interviews about it at the time.

I can remember when you posted that, we have an uphill battle , but we can move up if we hire the correct coach !!

[KennyForAD]

Has anyone ever posted the ENTIRE text of what JFB said when that particular sentence was uttered ( if that was what he actually said at all ). Or is it like when he supposedly said a certain offense would not work, when what he actually said was it would not work without a particular type of QB - which has proven to be right on the mark.

Frank used to carry the study with him which ranked our facilities no. 1 in the SEC.   He would wave it around and say, "Isn't that something, Little Ol Arkansas has the best facilities in the SEC."   He would follow that up with, "We can't ever expect to be better than 7th or 8th in the SEC because we can't attract a top coach."

I asked him TO HIS FACE, "How is it that we can afford to pay for the finest facilities in the land, but can't afford to pay a top coach?"   His answer:  "That's a good question, I'll have to think about it."    HAHA.   Fact.

[KennyForAD]

Frank was about Frank's glory.  He got it and we paid for it.  We will keep paying for it for a long time.  For at least as long as so many keep believing that we are just "Little Ol Arkansas."

[NorthDallas40]

I can remember when you posted that, we have an uphill battle , but we can move up if we hire the correct coach !!

I'm glad you remember! I'm actually one of the longest tenured posters on this board, was part of the original DarkSide on Booth Rand's board and  IIRC had the first post on the political board here.  Also had back when the poster's handles were creative the best handle of all time by any objective, reasonable person standard.

[B Ray]

I'm glad you remember! I'm actually one of the longest tenured posters on this board, was part of the original DarkSide on Booth Rand's board and  IIRC had the first post on the political board here.  Also had back when the poster's handles were creative the best handle of all time by any objective, reasonable person standard.

I was on that site as well .. I lurk more than I post ..

[HogTide2]

CFB was a wise man.  He miscalculated this fiasco the Hogs are in.  He opted for the SEC and MONEY over staying and being very competitive in a conference that recruiting would have been 10 fold better.  25 years don't and can't lie about success in said period.

[depressed_fan]

the sad thing is he probably turned over in his grave early watching this