Spark Plugs Champion or Tempest ?

[bvillepig]

I have been doing a lot of reading lately on spark plugs and have stumbled into so many opinions it has my head swimming.

At my last oil change I had them check my plugs. I wanted them to change them but they did not have enough so they gapped them. Now after taxi when I do my mag check during run up I have to lean the mixture to get plugs clean.

I flew to Rogers Friday and after landing found a mechanic and asked him to pull the plugs and check them. He found that my number four cylinder was getting a little oil on the plug. He cleaned them and gapped them and the engine ran smooth as silk from KROG to KJBR.  After the always fun hot start I had to lean it to get a plug unfouled.

I have stumbled on this article and it has confused the heck out of me.  My normal mechanic, who used to do a very through job, has hired a couple new people and I have noticed a couple of shortcuts. Another story but he swears by Champion.

I am now looking for input on what problems you guys are seeing in plugs.
Read the article and see what you guys think.

http://www.flyplatinum.com/blog/?p=690

[GusMcRae]

I really don't have a great deal to offer in regard to plugs, but here is what little I do have:  When we first bought the C-182 in early December 2011, the engine ran pretty rough on both mag checks.  The previous owner emphasized the importance of leaning it out while taxiing or it would foul the plugs, and he was confident that the mags were good.  Of course, he was trying to sell the plane too.  He also said we could run the engine up to high RPM and hold the brakes to clean them up. 
Upon returning, my CFI suggested that I just go ahead and change out the plugs. Replaced plugs around Christmas with Champions, which were what was in there.  They were in pretty bad shape, (I wish I had pictures to post of them) and the mag checks cleared up after replacing.  Ends lose their round shape and look more like a football shape.  Outside of most all of them were extremely rusty.  I saved a few of the better ones for spares. 
The mag checks now are beginning to show a little more drop in RPM, or roughness. So, even though I have been pretty disciplined about leaning out while taxiing, they may be getting a little fouled. 
Fast forward to the annual that I'm still in, mx saying that one of the mags is showing more drop in RPM/roughness during run-up, and tells me not to be surprised if it goes out in the not too distant future.

Sounds like a good idea to have plugs tested the way this article suggests.

[bvillepig]

I have been leaning at taxi and have had 0 problems with mag checks since 2008.  I did replace a mag at annual about 2 years ago as it was getting weak. 

In the last month however things are not quite as  smooth.

2008 was a different story. I went through 3 starters in 1 month,a couple of mags. 2 sets of plugs, a battery, lost confidence in the shop I was having the work done at and switched fields.  Everything finally got worked out but I want to get ahead of it this time.

When I replace the plugs in a couple of days I am going to save the old ones and run them through some resistance checks. I will let you know what I find.

[gotyacovered]

I have been leaning at taxi and have had 0 problems with mag checks since 2008.  I did replace a mag at annual about 2 years ago as it was getting weak. 

In the last month however things are not quite as  smooth.

2008 was a different story. I went through 3 starters in 1 month,a couple of mags. 2 sets of plugs, a battery, lost confidence in the shop I was having the work done at and switched fields.  Everything finally got worked out but I want to get ahead of it this time.

When I replace the plugs in a couple of days I am going to save the old ones and run them through some resistance checks. I will let you know what I find.

Have you looked at the wiring harness (not sure the technical name)? That made a huge difference in mine.

I never lean when taxi, (except when i was in NM) almost never have fouled plugs either, not sure why that is. Not sure what kind of plugs either... I'll find out.

Bvillepig... Headed to KJKA 5:30-6am tomorrow... Will let you know how it goes in a full PIREP upon my return, hope you have a safe trip as well.

[bvillepig]

Have you looked at the wiring harness (not sure the technical name)? That made a huge difference in mine.

I never lean when taxi, (except when i was in NM) almost never have fouled plugs either, not sure why that is. Not sure what kind of plugs either... I'll find out.

Bvillepig... Headed to KJKA 5:30-6am tomorrow... Will let you know how it goes in a full PIREP upon my return, hope you have a safe trip as well.

Thanks and have a great time.  Don't forget LU LU's right by the airport on the waterway.  Tropical Caribean type restaurant Jimmy Buffet style. His sister owns it.

I think my harness was replaced with the magneto's . I will check.

This plug thing is getting interesting . After reading through all the stuff this weekend and watching a video last night on the technology of plugs I am having them put Tempest in my engine Thursday.

I am saving my old ones and bringing them back to check the resistance at our factory.  I am anxious to see what I find. If the gurus on the internet are right I would say the resistance value of the plugs on my #4 cylinder are way out of spec.

Have a safe one. My trip to Panama City might have fell through.
 

[gotyacovered]

Thanks and have a great time.  Don't forget LU LU's right by the airport on the waterway.  Tropical Caribean type restaurant Jimmy Buffet style. His sister owns it.

I think my harness was replaced with the magneto's . I will check.

This plug thing is getting interesting . After reading through all the stuff this weekend and watching a video last night on the technology of plugs I am having them put Tempest in my engine Thursday.

I am saving my old ones and bringing them back to check the resistance at our factory.  I am anxious to see what I find. If the gurus on the internet are right I would say the resistance value of the plugs on my #4 cylinder are way out of spec.

Have a safe one. My trip to Panama City might have fell through.
 

Will not bvillepig, think we are going to hit it sat night.

Let us know on the spark plug deal.

[bvillepig]

Here is what I found with the Champion Plugs I had pulled. I did decide to go with the Tempest(Autolite) after doing some research on the mfg processes  that the factory uses. I will continue to monitor and am anxious to see if my mag checks improve.  The first one was great engine smooth as silk. I did not lean on the taxi out either.

Listed are the resistance values in thousands of Ohms of the plugs I pulled. Good values would be 1.0 to 3.0.   Any plug over 5 should be pulled according to the article.

T1       T2      T3     T4    T5   T6
15.93 1.838 1.31 1.122 1.57 2.04

B1     B2   B3   B4       B5    B6
1.78 1.54 5.74 25.86 10.5 1.539


Top plug in Cylinder 1 was bad
Bottom in 3 was marginal
Bottom in 4 was bad
Bottom in 5 was bad

This data sample supports what Tempest is saying. Its probably to small a sample to come to a definite conclusion but over time I will continue to monitor.

My spark plugs no matter how much I leaned at taxi were loading up.  I have noticed this getting progressively worst since last annual and am beginning to understand why. The worst plug, Bottom Cyl 4. actually looked good and had just been gapped and cleaned last week.  It is ironic that cyl 4 is the one that the shop thinks might need some work at annual.

It will probably be awhile but I think the next time I need plugs I am going to measure the resistance before we put them in.

[gotyacovered]

Here is what I found with the Champion Plugs I had pulled. I did decide to go with the Tempest(Autolite) after doing some research on the mfg processes  that the factory uses. I will continue to monitor and am anxious to see if my mag checks improve.  The first one was great engine smooth as silk. I did not lean on the taxi out either.

Listed are the resistance values in thousands of Ohms of the plugs I pulled. Good values would be 1.0 to 3.0.   Any plug over 5 should be pulled according to the article.

T1       T2      T3     T4    T5   T6
15.93 1.838 1.31 1.122 1.57 2.04

B1     B2   B3   B4       B5    B6
1.78 1.54 5.74 25.86 10.5 1.539


Top plug in Cylinder 1 was bad
Bottom in 3 was marginal
Bottom in 4 was bad
Bottom in 5 was bad

This data sample supports what Tempest is saying. Its probably to small a sample to come to a definite conclusion but over time I will continue to monitor.

My spark plugs no matter how much I leaned at taxi were loading up.  I have noticed this getting progressively worst since last annual and am beginning to understand why. The worst plug, Bottom Cyl 4. actually looked good and had just been gapped and cleaned last week.  It is ironic that cyl 4 is the one that the shop thinks might need some work at annual.

It will probably be awhile but I think the next time I need plugs I am going to measure the resistance before we put them in.

good stuff.

bvillepig... is there much of a price diff in the two?

[bvillepig]

Tempest massive are about 3-4 dollars less than the Champions. I would have no problem using the champions but I will check them ahead of time

I did notice some continuous noise (static) in the headset on the trip back from the maint shop. I am not sure where it was coming from but I did isolate it to the headphone jack and not the mic jack.  I am not sure if the noise is creeping in because Tempest does not use carbon pile resistors. It was not loud but just like the squelch does not work.

I am going to try to ask around on that.

[gotyacovered]

i found this article and found it good, especially about ground leaning, something i have confessed i dont do. on top of that there is some really good, verifiable data. i haven't even had a chance to read the 2nd half of it yet, but thought i would share...

http://bit.ly/ODInAO

[GusMcRae]

Hi guys,,,, I'm back.
The "fly it often" makes a lot of sense to me.  That must be about the only reason that the old POS trainer I started in "takes a licking and keeps on ticking".  I know they go way longer than needed on oil changes and such. 

I talked to the owner/CFI today and found out that they just recently found a 150 for sale that had blown over upside down, which they bought, mainly for the engine, but will have one for other parts now too. 

[gotyacovered]

Tempest massive are about 3-4 dollars less than the Champions. I would have no problem using the champions but I will check them ahead of time

I did notice some continuous noise (static) in the headset on the trip back from the maint shop. I am not sure where it was coming from but I did isolate it to the headphone jack and not the mic jack.  I am not sure if the noise is creeping in because Tempest does not use carbon pile resistors. It was not loud but just like the squelch does not work.

I am going to try to ask around on that.

bville... did anything ever come of this?

[Pistol Pete]

We put new Champion REM40's in the first week of this month during the annual. I could tell an immediate difference in performance. For whatever reason, it had mis-matched plugs in it and some looked to be very, very old.
Hot starts, cold starts, it starts very easily every time now... big difference.

[bvillepig]

bville... did anything ever come of this?

Everything has been good with the tempest. No more leaning on taxi no fouled plugs hot starts are easier. I have to go to bran son tomorrow for a mrrting and after I get back I am going to have the annual done.  I will let you know on the plugs