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ITS OFFICIAL: Mitch Mustain Documentary being narrated by Nolan Richardson....

Started by Est. 1981, April 18, 2013, 09:53:46 am

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Wildhog

Quote from: sir-pigs-a-lot on April 18, 2013, 04:38:13 pm
Well alright...a self proclaimed message board hero.

So as it stands you are.....

Good for an overused roddy piper quote
Self proclaimed hero who kept this board going with said overused quotes and posts that "bring it."

God, you shoulda quit when you were just a moron.


I want you to realize that there's literally nothing you can say that will get a rise out of me.  Life is good.  I'm a message board hero.  Somebody get me a cape.
Arkansas Razorbacks Football National Championships:
1909/1964/1965/1977

dacskc

As for people questioning why would Nolan lend his voice, or what is Mitch's relevance, Nolan is still highly identifiable with Arkansas athletics. His voice is very strong and recognizable; it lends credibility. I think he was an excellent choice, but if some people still want to be mad at him, that's their business I guess.

As for Mitch, I think he's a very interesting topic. If people could put aside their preconceived notions that he was a pampered kid who was catered to, this might be easier to see. I think it could be interesting to outsiders on a couple of levels. First of all, people outside the state aren't as familiar with it as we are. There are films made all the time about athletes from one school or another that might not have seemed to have had broad appeal at the time they were made, but they ended up being widely seen because they told good stories. Secondly, I think Mitch's story is unique. How many D1 coaches out there benched the Gatorade player of the year and out of spite never gave him another chance? How many D1 coaches ever enlisted a booster to harass a highly sought after player and his family into leaving? I'll bet that's never happened. If this film goes there, I think it could get a lot of outside attention. IDK much about Gus's role in the soap opera, and I doubt that this documentary covers that, but I do know that Hootie and his band of yes men were just about the most childish, vindictive set of people to ever successfully pass themselves off as coaches. I think this story would make for excellent viewing. I also don't see that it reflects badly on the university. It reflects badly on Nutt. I also think the fact that Nolan is embracing/being embraced by the fan base again reflects well nationally.

 

KlubhouseKonnected

^^ Common. It is a common story. Nobody outside of Arkansas cares.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

Hogfly

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on April 18, 2013, 05:12:40 pm
^^ Common. It is a common story. Nobody outside of Arkansas cares.

If the movie is well made, then it will play plenty of festivals outside the state.

That being said, we're talking relative measure of "success" here. Is this going to be some blockbuster that makes them millions? Absolutely not.

Is it going to spark some interest in the small, independent film circuit and play some festivals outside the state? My money would be on, yes.




KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: Hogfly on April 18, 2013, 05:17:42 pm
If the movie is well made, then it will play plenty of festivals outside the state.

That being said, we're talking relative measure of "success" here. Is this going to be some blockbuster that makes them millions? Absolutely not.

Is it going to spark some interest in the small, independent film circuit and play some festivals outside the state? My money would be on, yes.





If its REALLY well made then the sky is the limit. I am just stating that world has not been breathlessly waiting for someone to tell them the Mitch Mustain story.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

Hogfly

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on April 18, 2013, 05:22:32 pm
If its REALLY well made then the sky is the limit. I am just stating that world has not been breathlessly waiting for someone to tell them the Mitch Mustain story.

Yeah, I agree completely with that. I'm honestly curious to see it. I have my ideas about the nature of the film, but I could be way off base.




SPAL

Quote from: Wildhog on April 18, 2013, 04:39:55 pm
I want you to realize that there's literally nothing you can say that will get a rise out of me.  Life is good.  I'm a message board hero.  Somebody get me a cape.

Sweet. Now you are a self proclaimed message board hero with a motto....

You remind me of a 6 year old who says..."I'm rubber you're glue...."

Dude, u bring nothing of value. You aren't funny. You have no take. You just take shots at people who do have a take. People like shields, guv, and even weresoclose get picked apart on the reg because they have takes that people don't agree with, but at least they have something. The fact that you have such a high level of self worth and simplemindedness to think I'm "trying to get a rise out of you" proves my point. You are what has become the downfall of this board. You and your ilk are the problem, not the solution. Ever wonder what appended to guys like Wilson or Whatsshakinbacon, fresh legs, or uncle ivan? Good, no great , poster left because if the idiocy that you display.

You are correct...I can't get a rise out of you. But by all means, let the deterioration continue.

Mike Irwin

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on April 18, 2013, 04:28:14 pm
Mike has stuck to his guns from the beginning and makes no bones about his allegiances. He states as "fact" that Mitch got screwed. How do you figure?
I have never stated that as fact. It's my opinion based on facts I was able to uncover.

Frankly, whether or not Mustain got screwed is not an issue for me anymore. That's ancient history. I'm much more interested in how a lot of that stuff affected him.

It's my opinion that while there are dozens of extremely talented athletes entering the college ranks every year some them are not prepared emotionally for what they are about to walk into.

Being a so called "can't miss" prospect puts a kid in the crosshairs of public opinion. There are fans ready to jump on them and tear them down from the outset. I don't know why this happens but it does.

One day you are big fish in a little pond. That pond is populated by people you know. People you've grown up around. You understand them.

The next day your life is placed under a microscope and you are being defined on the Internet by people who don't know you but are convinced that they do.

Some athletes deal with this without thinking. Some get crushed under the weight of it.

In Mustain's case he knew Arkansas was not the right place for a passing quarterback. He wrestled with making a decision of the mind vs a decision from the heart.

Once he picked Arkansas and once he found himself starting as a true freshman he was totally stunned by the antagonism directed at him by his head coach. This was quickly followed by the same attitude from several of his teammates on the defensive side of the ball.

Then he got benched and the Internet exploded. He became a crybaby who got benched because he was was overrated and not up to the job.

He left Arkansas and no matter where he went people seemed to know all about him. Oh yeah, you're that kid who tried to run the team.

Did he picked the wrong school when he transferred? I think he did. Like most schools, at USC quarterbacks are the big guys on campus. They throw parties for their teammates. They are the life of the party. Mitch is not a party guy. He tends to hang out with people who don't even play football.

Just because a person has athletic talent doesn't mean they want to be an athlete. I have a nephew who s 6-7. His whole life people have told him he should be a basketball player. He'd rather play the piano.

I'm not sure Mitch was ever cut out to play football. He could throw the football. He's never been comfortable with strangers analyzing his every move.

He's tried minor league baseball and now he's playing arena league football. Mitch Mustain, I believe, is kind of lost right now trying to figure out his future. He's smart and he has a USC education. He'll figure it out sooner or later.

Unless you know him maybe all this is boring. After all he is just another 25 year old ex college football player. Those guys are everywhere. But not many of them have had his experiences.

Frankly if I had been in his shoes I would have busted out Houston Nutt and Gus Malzahn a long time ago.

I would also avoid the Internet like the plague.

KlubhouseKonnected

If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

dacskc

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on April 18, 2013, 05:22:32 pm
If its REALLY well made then the sky is the limit. I am just stating that world has not been breathlessly waiting for someone to tell them the Mitch Mustain story.

That doesn't matter though. Nobody ever knows if something will be good or something they'll care about until they see it. I've seen films about people I'd never heard of or thought I'd want to know about that I ended up liking. I think it's because we've had Mitch/Nutt overload to some degree that it seems this way to some people.

IDK that the story is common at all. Is it? Is the way Nutt did business and treated certain players a common thing? I was never a college athlete. Maybe it is. If so, I'd be disappointed to learn that.

ZERO

I understand that this is a boring subject for this outside of Arkansas, but it's quite obvious this is really a documentary for Arkansans. I'm not sure how you guys could not find this super interesting. It's such a weird story that obvious has a mine of unknown facts and information buried in it, and this could open the gates.

People like Mitch Mustain and Gus Malzahn were vital catalysts in the events that would eventually lead to two awesome coaches being hired at Arkansas. How can this not fascinate a Hog football fan? I certainly want to know everything I can about what happened in 2006.
Quote from: Squealers on December 30, 2014, 05:14:49 pmCharlie Strong and I have something in common... yesterday we both got colonoscopies.

Quote"These fans hate Texas more than they like themselves."

nonoffensiveposter

Quote from: Wildhog on April 18, 2013, 01:52:29 pm
I do have a friend that's showing a film at the LR Film Festival.  It's called December 1982, and about an american boy with an Iranian pen pal during the revolution over there

December 1982. I was hoping it would be about all the tornadoes that hammered Little Rock. Christmas Eve was a pain in the ass.

NWASooner

Mike, that's a fair synopsis.  He just wasn't ready to be a big time player, either emotionally or athletically.

Despite what a lot of people in Arkansas think, he was just an average college QB.  He barely cracked the 2nd team at USC.

I always felt bad for the kid but part of me is wondering why the 3rd team QB from USC is getting a documentary made about him?  What not the QB was 2nd team ahead of him?

 

ZERO

Quote from: NWASooner on April 18, 2013, 06:28:49 pmI always felt bad for the kid but part of me is wondering why the 3rd team QB from USC is getting a documentary made about him?  What not the QB was 2nd team ahead of him?

I think, again, it's more about the role that group played in loosening Nutt's grip. Ten whole years of that Dark Ages football began to unravel in 2006. Whether he was more skilled than the first or second string QB at USC isn't relevant; he's way more interesting. That's all you need for a film.
Quote from: Squealers on December 30, 2014, 05:14:49 pmCharlie Strong and I have something in common... yesterday we both got colonoscopies.

Quote"These fans hate Texas more than they like themselves."

Wildhog

Quote from: sir-pigs-a-lot on April 18, 2013, 05:31:40 pm
Sweet. Now you are a self proclaimed message board hero with a motto....

You remind me of a 6 year old who says..."I'm rubber you're glue...."

Dude, u bring nothing of value. You aren't funny. You have no take. You just take shots at people who do have a take. People like shields, guv, and even weresoclose get picked apart on the reg because they have takes that people don't agree with, but at least they have something. The fact that you have such a high level of self worth and simplemindedness to think I'm "trying to get a rise out of you" proves my point. You are what has become the downfall of this board. You and your ilk are the problem, not the solution. Ever wonder what appended to guys like Wilson or Whatsshakinbacon, fresh legs, or uncle ivan? Good, no great , poster left because if the idiocy that you display.

You are correct...I can't get a rise out of you. But by all means, let the deterioration continue.

I wish I could say something describing the way you post.  I've just never really noticed you.  Best I can tell from this thread, you're a man that takes himself way too seriously. 
Arkansas Razorbacks Football National Championships:
1909/1964/1965/1977

Steef

Quote from: NWASooner on April 18, 2013, 06:28:49 pm
Mike, that's a fair synopsis.  He just wasn't ready to be a big time player, either emotionally or athletically.

Despite what a lot of people in Arkansas think, he was just an average college QB.  He barely cracked the 2nd team at USC.

I always felt bad for the kid but part of me is wondering why the 3rd team QB from USC is getting a documentary made about him?  What not the QB was 2nd team ahead of him?

Very few 18 yr holds ARE ready for the scrutiny that Mitch got. They are supposed to be helped...by their coaches and institution...grow into the role.

Instead, Mitch was routinely betrayed.

He has never once uttered a public word of complaint.

So, since there's nothing else negative to say about him, people ignore the real villains...and continue to belittle his athletic ability.

Mike Irwin

Quote from: NWASooner on April 18, 2013, 06:28:49 pm
Mike, that's a fair synopsis.  He just wasn't ready to be a big time player, either emotionally or athletically.

Despite what a lot of people in Arkansas think, he was just an average college QB.  He barely cracked the 2nd team at USC.

I always felt bad for the kid but part of me is wondering why the 3rd team QB from USC is getting a documentary made about him?  What not the QB was 2nd team ahead of him?

It's just my opinion but I think he had the potential to be an outstanding college quarterback. But he had to be coached by the right people.

I would have loved to see him play for a QB coach like Jim Chaney.

BTW Mitch was the backup QB behind Matt Barkley his senior year. He and Aaron Corp went back and forth as the # 2 Mitch's Jr. year.

The guy who made the documentary explained why he did it. Mitch was a former national high school player of the year who vanished in college. How did it happen? That's the basis of the story.

Porked Tongue


dacskc

Quote from: Mike Irwin on April 18, 2013, 08:37:36 pm


The guy who made the documentary explained why he did it. Mitch was a former national high school player of the year who vanished in college. How did it happen? That's the basis of the story.



Exactly. That in itself is an interesting story. The biggest problem some people seem to have is that it's Mitch they're talking about.

NWASooner

Quote from: Mike Irwin on April 18, 2013, 08:37:36 pm
It's just my opinion but I think he had the potential to be an outstanding college quarterback. But he had to be coached by the right people.

I would have loved to see him play for a QB coach like Jim Chaney.

BTW Mitch was the backup QB behind Matt Barkley his senior year. He and Aaron Corp went back and forth as the # 2 Mitch's Jr. year.

The guy who made the documentary explained why he did it. Mitch was a former national high school player of the year who vanished in college. How did it happen? That's the basis of the story.

That's my point.  Mustain and Corp went back and forth on who would back up Barkley who is a 2nd round NFL pick at best. 

Corp was not big time.  Neither was Mustain.  If they were, they would have started over Barkley.  Mustain is only famous in Arkansas because of the off the field drama he brought.

Let's compare this to the 30 for 30 that featured Marcus Dupree.  He was big time.  He was "The Best That Never Was." 

Hoggish1

Quote from: razorcash2 on April 18, 2013, 12:46:45 pm
Can't wait to see what is said about Nutt's involvement.

That's the 'what happened' part that the trailer ends on...

LZH

Quote from: NWASooner on April 18, 2013, 09:58:34 pm
That's my point.  Mustain and Corp went back and forth on who would back up Barkley who is a 2nd round NFL pick at best. 

Corp was not big time.  Neither was Mustain.  If they were, they would have started over Barkley.  Mustain is only famous in Arkansas because of the off the field drama he brought.
Let's compare this to the 30 for 30 that featured Marcus Dupree.  He was big time.  He was "The Best That Never Was." 

Yeah, I never saw the all-world talent in him that others did.  But you can't argue with 8-0 as a freshman starter.  MM, like many other high-profile amateur athletes, got used by every adult in his life as long as he was a hot commodity.

OneTuskOverTheLine™

Quote from: Mike Irwin on April 18, 2013, 02:04:52 pm
You are completely off base about that. Nolan's interest has nothing to do with the U. of A. In fact he was never mad at the U. of A. He had issues with Frank, John White and at least one BOT member. None of those people are decision makers at the U of A and these days he has no issues whatsoever with the athletic department, school administration or any BOT members.

As far his his interest in Mitch's situation that goes all the way back to 2006 when it had become obvious that Mitch had been benched by Nutt and would stay benched.

I ran into Nolan before the SEC championship game and he asked me what was going on with Mitch. I told him what I knew. He said to me (paraphrasing because it's been a while), I didn't think anything about the kid getting benched at first because I did that all the time with rookies. Sometimes they just need to sit a while and watch. But at some point you have to put them back in. If you don't you'll destroy whatever confidence they have left.

Nolan went on to say that when Mitch stayed on the bench he knew that it was not a football issue but something personal with Nutt toward Mustain.

Bottom line, he thinks the kid got screwed because of Nutt's massive ego.

My own view, based on conversations I've had in the last few months with some of Frank's closest supporters, is that there was a belief by them that Frank needed to retire. White was after him and they knew it was only a matter of time until he got Frank.
The man was in his early 80's. He did not wield the power he once had and his decision making had dropped off.

The plan was to hire Gus, win the SEC two or three years down the road, convince Nutt to take Frank's job for the good of the program, and make Gus the head coach.

Nutt was well aware of this plan. He hated the idea. His goal in 2006 was to win enough games to avoid getting fired and then figure out a way to demote Gus and either take over the play calling again or hire somebody for that job that he could control.

Guess what? His plan worked perfectly.

My issue with Nutt is, he should have told the boosters pushing Gus to buzz off. If you don't like my staff fire me but you're not telling me who to hire.

Instead he did what they asked and in the process of getting rid of Malzahn he and his supporters blamed the whole mess on Mustain and his mother.

They were both easy targets.

Mitch is an introvert who doesn't live, eat and breathe football. Off the field he tends to go his own way. It was easy to turn that into, he's a self centered jerk who wants his own way.

Beck Campbell is actually a fairly low key person but if she thinks you're trying to mess with her or her kids she will get nasty in a heartbeat. She had that reputation in Springdale. Those that know her will tell you that raising her kids as a divorced mom she felt she had to be the mom and the dad of the family. At times the "dad" had to get into people's faces.

Stories were being spread about her when Mitch was a junior in high school. I know. I heard these stories from Nutt's supporters.

The main rumor was very clear. Wherever Mitch played his mom was going to be there controlling things.

Really?

Then how is it that he went to USC and she continued to live in Arkansas? How is it that the entire time he was a USC she had one conversation with Pete Carroll?

Ask any of them if Beck Campbell tried to run the team?

In a nutshell (pardon the pun) Nutt and Gus were involved in a power struggle. Mitch Mustain and Ben Cleveland (who also got caught up in this mess) paid the price for that struggle.

Seven years after the fact that stuff is still outrageous.

This is da troof...
Quote from: capehog on March 12, 2010...
My ex wife had a pet monkey I used to play with. That was one of the few things I liked about her

quote from: golf2day on June 19, 2014....
I'm disgusted, but kinda excited. Now I'm disgusted that I'm excited.

Mike Irwin

Quote from: NWASooner on April 18, 2013, 09:58:34 pm
That's my point.  Mustain and Corp went back and forth on who would back up Barkley who is a 2nd round NFL pick at best. 

Corp was not big time.  Neither was Mustain.  If they were, they would have started over Barkley.  Mustain is only famous in Arkansas because of the off the field drama he brought.

Let's compare this to the 30 for 30 that featured Marcus Dupree.  He was big time.  He was "The Best That Never Was."
I have talked to people who cover USC football. Matt Barkley was the LA version of Mustain in high school. Only he was local. The minute he signed he was going to start.

He had the right personality to play for Pete Carroll. Mustain didn't. Corp was more of a running QB than a passer. Mitch's problems at USC mostly stemmed from the fact that he had a girlfriend out there whose dad was a big USC booster. He spent a lot of time with that family. Time he probably should have spent hanging out with his teammates.

But it didn't matter. Matt Barkley was going to have that job from the minute he stepped on campus. If Pete Carroll had been coaching Arkansas in 2006 the same path would have been cleared for Mitch.

 

The Marmot

Quote from: sir-pigs-a-lot on April 18, 2013, 05:31:40 pm
Sweet. Now you are a self proclaimed message board hero with a motto....

You remind me of a 6 year old who says..."I'm rubber you're glue...."

Dude, u bring nothing of value. You aren't funny. You have no take. You just take shots at people who do have a take. People like shields, guv, and even weresoclose get picked apart on the reg because they have takes that people don't agree with, but at least they have something. The fact that you have such a high level of self worth and simplemindedness to think I'm "trying to get a rise out of you" proves my point. You are what has become the downfall of this board. You and your ilk are the problem, not the solution. Ever wonder what appended to guys like Wilson or Whatsshakinbacon, fresh legs, or uncle ivan? Good, no great , poster left because if the idiocy that you display.

You are correct...I can't get a rise out of you. But by all means, let the deterioration continue.

The fact that you think that Uncle Ivan was a great poster nullifies your opinion.
I was booooorn to love you... I was booooorn to lick your face... I was booooorn to rub you... but you were born to rub me first - Ty Webb

Quote from: WilsonHog on October 28, 2014, 06:59:50 pm
The fact that you can type the words doesn't stop the thought behind those words from being horseshit.

GO HOGS!!!!!!!

OldPoop

Quote from: hogsanity on April 18, 2013, 04:24:27 pm
The day CBB was hired, people started comparing him to HDN.  Most people, when you get to the heart of it, do not like coaches who have the philosophy of run the ball 1st.  IF in the 1st few games this year we have a game where the Hogs run the ball 40+ times, just watch for all the " Yep CBB is just another HDN " posts to come out.

+1, You are so right.
Like most people, when CBB was hired, I was thinking "Who?".   But as soon as I found out about his character I knew he was exactly what we needed.   I also knew that it wouldn't take long for the ADHD fans to turn on him.

The first time we play a team with superior athletes, and the run gets stuffed, it will be "boring, Nutt all over again" and other such ignorance.  The fact that we lost by 50 points to the same team the previous season with an NFL caliber passing qb won't matter. 

Hopefully, since Long was smart enough to find him, he will also be smart enough to ignore the lame brains and give CBB the 5 or 6 years it will take him to turn this program into one of the top 3 or 4 in the SEC.  The people that you see now posting that CBB will have us doing great in 1 or 2 years will most likely be the ones turning on him first, because they are so clueless and have such short attention spans.
We are fast approaching the stage of the ultimate inversion: the stage where the government is free to do anything it pleases, while the citizens my act only by permission.   Ayn Rand

You get what you pay for.   You pay for zombies, you get all you want – and then some. 
Milton Friedman
"To say the government is the source of prosperity is like saying that the ticks are keeping the dog alive."  Jeff Tucker
Government attracts sociopaths the way an open bar attracts alcoholics.      Doug Casey
War - the government tells you who the bad guy is . . . . . Revolution - you figure it out for yourself.

Hawg Balling

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on April 18, 2013, 05:37:21 pm
Gus Malzahn used the hell out of Mitch

Funny how people forget that, and it's almost sad to think of how much Malzahn was worshipped on here before 2010 made (most of) that go away.

Est. 1981

Quote from: hobhog on April 18, 2013, 04:26:15 pm
Everone knows the egos involved on all sides, but I have a hard time believing it was the reason MM was benched. If I recall, he was benched by MALZAHN after the horrible INT at USCe. Gus took the responsibility, did he not?

Water under bridge, and I have zero interest in the film (unless it gets great acclaim), but I always felt Gus was fully on board with him getting benched. His TD to INT ratio was not great....

This is 100% wrong...During warm ups for the SC game Nutt came up to Dick and told him be ready to play the 1st mistake MM makes he's getting pulled and you're going in. Now yes Gus did take credit for pulling him but look who his boss was HDN you think HDN was gonna take credit for pulling the prodigal son who had gone 8-0 and who everyone in the state loved at that time. Hell no HDN told Gus to take credit for pulling him. It was a bad int early in the game but it was a freshman mistake. Then he never got a chance to play again? Now you tell me HDN ego didn't have anything to do with benching MM for the rest of the season. All MM had done up until that point was win ball games 8-0. Sure coaches bench freshman QBs for mistakes all the time but you get them right back in there the next half or a few series later to build their confidence back up. You don't bench a freshman who has done nothing but win and bench him for the REST of the season in favor of JR. Casey Dick. MM was the future QB so why in the hell would you bench him for the rest of the season. It's easy to see it was Nutt's ego that killed MM career here. What a selfish @sshole for ruining that kid's career.
UofA Alumni 2007

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: dacskc on April 18, 2013, 09:11:59 pm
Exactly. That in itself is an interesting story. The biggest problem some people seem to have is that it's Mitch they're talking about.

The reason I said "common" because I don't think that it is "uncommon" for a highly regarded prep athlete to not develope into a star at the next level. I'm thinking that it happens quite a bit.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: LedZepHog on April 18, 2013, 10:20:32 pm
Yeah, I never saw the all-world talent in him that others did.  But you can't argue with 8-0 as a freshman starter.  MM, like many other high-profile amateur athletes, got used by every adult in his life as long as he was a hot commodity.

8-0. It could just as easily be argued that record was achieved IN SPITE of Mitch's play as BECAUSE of Mitch's contributions.

People throw that out there like Mitch was setting the world on fire rather than he was playing on a team that had the best defense we have fielded in recent memory along with the best backfield we have EVER had.

He and Casey had nearly identical numbers. The only difference is that Casey couldn't blame his mediocre play on inexperience and he played against better teams.

If Mitch was as outstanding as some people make out based on 8-0 he would have had some ki d of success in the sport at some later time.

Simple truth, Mitch didn't suck, but he wasn't a special player at the college level. It just happens.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

arkjay19

Quote from: Hawg Balling on April 19, 2013, 12:51:29 pmFunny how people forget that, and it's almost sad to think of how much Malzahn was worshipped on here before 2010 made (most of) that go away.

I don't think people have ever really forgotten it as much as they have never either thought about it or accepted it.  I know I've never thought much about it, but why doesn't it get brought up more?

What was Malzahn thinking when he took the job at Arkansas that he thought it would be a good place for MM?  Malzahn would have known his personality better than anyone.  Why would he not tell him to go to Florida instead of dragging him into the situation at Arkansas?

I never understood the extremists on either side.  I'm sorry, but it's hard to accept that Houston Nutt, a relatively decent college football coach, was the bumbling fool and maniacal movie-character-worthy villain that wanted t screw over everyone in the Springdale 5.  It was always hard to imagine that Malzahn was the angelic do-gooder who never did anything that wasn't perfect.

There were a lot of people that contributed to that negative situation.

arkjay19

Quote from: dacskc on April 18, 2013, 05:01:53 pmSecondly, I think Mitch's story is unique. How many D1 coaches out there benched the Gatorade player of the year and out of spite never gave him another chance?

I won't address the rest of your post because it sounds like a plotline from Blue Mountain State.

But I am tired of this notion that Nutt benched MM and it was over from there.  Honestly I don't know and I don't ever remember hearing if Malzahn was involved in benching MM, but the interception against SC was the last straw.  As many have argued, you could say that Arkansas went 8-0 in his first games very much in spite of him, definitely not because of him.  And that eighth game was Casey's win.  Nobody brings that up, do they?

MM had practices and bowl preparations to prove that he was better.  It's not like SC was the last time he played that season.  And then he bailed, whether rightfully or wrongfully so, but he left.  If MM was truly a better quarterback than Casey Dick, there is no way that a Houston Nutt who is trying to keep his job and with the power struggle pretty much behind him doesn't start MM the next season.

I never hated them and I never loved them, but MM and Malzahn bailed.  Norman did too.  And I don't blame any of them for it.  I don't understand anyone bashing or praising their decisions to leave.  I'm pretty sure Ben stayed because of his girlfriend (for good reason).  I don't know why someone would say Ben was caught up in the power struggle other than his parents being involved in the meeting.  The guy started as a freshman and injuries derailed his career.  Nothing dramatic there.  The one that gets me is Damian Williams.

DW made a worse decision than MM to come to Arkansas.  But then, he starts as a freshman, plays bad and bails because Arkansas doesn't throw enough.  If DW doesn't average a drop a game, that's at least a dozen more catches and then he gets targeted more.  After a while, it became a joke that he dropped so many passes, including numerous possible touchdowns.

I remember a few years back I got absolutely attacked, probably more than ever, and had the post deleted in which I simply said DW was not a "great" wide receiver.  I said he was good, and he is and he was, but he's never been great at anything.  He's never been overly fast or had great hands.  He was a good college wide receiver that was a really good route runner who benefitted from having a great relationship with his quarterback.  And that post was deleted!  Please tell me what about those statements is inciteful or flaming.  And look, now he's in the NFL and showing off more averageness.  Congratulations to him, but once again I've just never understood the illogical worship like he was some savior on or off the field.

I guess this story is gonna get told, but I doubt it will show much more than what most of us already know.  I think it could be interesting to watch, but I think its end result is just going to be more debate on Hogville.

Steef

In all that diatribe, the only person for whom you have no criticism...is HDN.

Telling.

Everyone keeps trying to "prove" that these young men weren't "great" athletes, as if in so doing, you may also"prove" that Nut wasn't the total monster in that story. The kids must deserve SOME scorn, because you still resent the adoration heaped on them.

You know what the Spring dale kids DID deserve? They deserved decent coaching. Never got it. They deserved to be able to trust the grownups not to persecute them. Nope, never got that either. They deserved to not have a lunatic fan protected instead.

Blame them for bailing? I don't think so.

Always and forever blame Nutt AND Broyles for soiling our history? There's the real truth.

Mike Irwin

Quote from: arkjay19 on April 20, 2013, 02:58:25 am
What was Malzahn thinking when he took the job at Arkansas that he thought it would be a good place for MM?  Malzahn would have known his personality better than anyone.  Why would he not tell him to go to Florida instead of dragging him into the situation at Arkansas?

I never understood the extremists on either side.  I'm sorry, but it's hard to accept that Houston Nutt, a relatively decent college football coach, was the bumbling fool and maniacal movie-character-worthy villain that wanted t screw over everyone in the Springdale 5.  It was always hard to imagine that Malzahn was the angelic do-gooder who never did anything that wasn't perfect.

There were a lot of people that contributed to that negative situation.

1. Florida was never an option for Mitch Mustain. Nor was any other SEC school.
He was either going to go to Arkansas or a school that almost never played Arkansas.

2. Mitch Mustain did not come to Arkansas because of Gus Malzahn. Alex Wood was the man who eventually convinced him to sign with Arkansas.

3. If Houston Nutt is a relatively decent football coach why can't he get a job? Don't think he hasn't been trying. The word is finally out on him and nobody wants to mess with him.

I'm not saying that he didn't have a right to oppose the move to force Malzahn on him. But the fact is he didn't oppose it. He passively accepted it and then, in an effort to rid himself of Malzahn, he threw up Mitch Mustain as a smokescreen. It was a sleight of hand card trick. Spread the word that the kid is a prima donna and his mother is trying to run the team. Get fans ticked off about that and you can take Malzahn down.

In fact that's exactly what Nutt did. He convinced Frank Broyles that Malzahn brought with him some power hungry people and the only way to rid the program of these so called "haters to the north" (Diana Nutt's own words) was to run Gus off or take his power away.

It was a scam worthy of some of the great power brokers of all time.

4. The only thing you are correct about is Malzahn. He was/is extremely ambitious and  he totally let down not just the Springdale kids but all of the players he recruited in his one year at Arkansas. But guess what? Many coaches do that. That's why kids and parents should always understand that they're signing with a school, not a coach who can ditch them at any point.

cubsfan5150

Eh, why are you fellas arguing over MM?  He was a bust that will go down in Arkansas high school football lore.  We could tell he was a bust pretty early, and it never got better.  The guy was a system QB.  In the long run, really no different than Daniel Lunney (not a knock on Lunney).
QuoteWest Side Rooter wrote:

Always best to talk [expletive] about a team when you don't have to face them again.

I'd do the same. LaRussa's a nutjob and would probably throw at his head.
ETA: A bottle of wine, not a baseball.
ETA: Empty bottle, obviously.

SouthSide Johnny

Quote from: cubsfan5150 on April 20, 2013, 07:52:46 am
Eh, why are you fellas arguing over MM?  He was a bust that will go down in Arkansas high school football lore.  We could tell he was a bust pretty early, and it never got better.  The guy was a system QB.  In the long run, really no different than Daniel Lunney (not a knock on Lunney).

Daniel was never the USA today Player of the year or even a D1 scholie player, the comparison is absurd!
Some Say it's Raining Elephants but They Go Outside Anyway..

Steef

Quote from: cubsfan5150 on April 20, 2013, 07:52:46 am
Eh, why are you fellas arguing over MM?  He was a bust that will go down in Arkansas high school football lore.  We could tell he was a bust pretty early, and it never got better.  The guy was a system QB.  In the long run, really no different than Daniel Lunney (not a knock on Lunney).


Quote from: steefhog on April 20, 2013, 06:21:18 am

Everyone keeps trying to "prove" that these young men weren't "great" athletes, as if in so doing, you may also"prove" that Nut wasn't the total monster in that story. The kids must deserve SOME scorn, because you still resent the adoration heaped on them.



Thank you for proving my point.

As for MM's ability...we'll never really know. But when looking at the games he did start for us, there ARE moments of talent and moments of mistakes.

He was a true freshman.

Driskell at Florida was a true freshman last year. His season was a lot like MM's. Good and bad. Instead of benching him and telling him he'd never play another down HIS coach is gonna start him again this year, understanding that newbies need experience and make mistakes.

Obviously, we still have Hog fans who don't understand that yet, still wanting to hate on a 19 year old kid for doing far better than the fan ever could.

After all this time, the poison from the BAC still lingers.

PonderinHog

Quote from: steefhog on April 20, 2013, 08:29:36 am


Thank you for proving my point.

As for MM's ability...we'll never really know. But when looking at the games he did start for us, there ARE moments of talent and moments of mistakes.

He was a true freshman.

Driskell at Florida was a true freshman last year. His season was a lot like MM's. Good and bad. Instead of benching him and telling him he'd never play another down HIS coach is gonna start him again this year, understanding that newbies need experience and make mistakes.

Obviously, we still have Hog fans who don't understand that yet, still wanting to hate on a 19 year old kid for doing far better than the fan ever could.

After all this time, the poison from the BAC still lingers.
Kinda makes you long for the days when freshmen weren't allowed to play, huh?

cubsfan5150

Quote from: steefhog on April 20, 2013, 08:29:36 am


Thank you for proving my point.

As for MM's ability...we'll never really know. But when looking at the games he did start for us, there ARE moments of talent and moments of mistakes.

He was a true freshman.

Driskell at Florida was a true freshman last year. His season was a lot like MM's. Good and bad. Instead of benching him and telling him he'd never play another down HIS coach is gonna start him again this year, understanding that newbies need experience and make mistakes.

Obviously, we still have Hog fans who don't understand that yet, still wanting to hate on a 19 year old kid for doing far better than the fan ever could.

After all this time, the poison from the BAC still lingers.

If the guy had as much talent as most thought, I don't think he'd be sitting bench in the arena league at the moment.  I wish he could have panned out here without Nutt at the helm, but it is what it is.

BTW, Driskell was a sophomore and had much better numbers than MM, without the great running game.  (Florida's running game averaged a lot of yards, but the YPC wasn't even close to 2006 Arkansas.)

It's all good though.  Arkansas is in a MUCH better spot now thanks to MM, and some rich Arkansas fan should make sure MM has a nice job when he quits trying to make it in sports.
QuoteWest Side Rooter wrote:

Always best to talk [expletive] about a team when you don't have to face them again.

I'd do the same. LaRussa's a nutjob and would probably throw at his head.
ETA: A bottle of wine, not a baseball.
ETA: Empty bottle, obviously.

HoopS

Nothing "common" about this situation.   Nutt's behavior is as common as the idiot basketball coach Rutgers just fired.  Too bad some kids get the blame for an out of control adult. 

As for Gus being forced on Nutt - I agree BUT, Nutt was first given an opportunity to hire someone to come in and inject life into a wreck of an offense yet was going to hire someone who would not change things if his hand wasn't forced. He should have gone all in for Norm Chow or someone similar and none of this crap ever happens.

Steef

Quote from: cubsfan5150 on April 20, 2013, 08:48:27 am
If the guy had as much talent as most thought, I don't think he'd be sitting bench in the arena league at the moment.  I wish he could have panned out here without Nutt at the helm, but it is what it is.

BTW, Driskell was a sophomore and had much better numbers than MM, without the great running game.  (Florida's running game averaged a lot of yards, but the YPC wasn't even close to 2006 Arkansas.)

It's all good though.  Arkansas is in a MUCH better spot now thanks to MM, and some rich Arkansas fan should make sure MM has a nice job when he quits trying to make it in sports.

If Driskell was a soph, I stand corrected on that point. But it doesn't alter the point that newbies are given time to improve.

It also doesn't alter the fact that MM was being coached by Nutt, who conclusively proved how good he was at developing QBs when he got to Ole  Miss. How's their 5 star doing these days?


ZERO

You don't earn the moniker "QB Killa" for no reason. Is Mitch still doing the arena league thing? I thought he quit that and got a minor league baseball contract. Did that not pan out, either?

I hope he can find a way to succeed in the arena league - that's still pretty good. It's just too bad he graduated in 2006 instead of 2008.
Quote from: Squealers on December 30, 2014, 05:14:49 pmCharlie Strong and I have something in common... yesterday we both got colonoscopies.

Quote"These fans hate Texas more than they like themselves."


mikeindallas

Quote from: younghog on April 18, 2013, 12:42:15 pm
Wonder if the film will touch on MM drug sells.  i.e. prescription narcotics

just asking

yep here's a still shot on that subject from the documentary, got to warn ya mitch looks pretty rough

[attachment deleted by admin]

PORKULATOR

Its a film about who? Mitch who? What a waste of time and effort.
Is it titled, " A Mommas Boy takes the Snaps "?

How much longer til we get a Casey Dick story? He won more games and showed a helluva lot more loyalty to the Hogs. And he's from Texas. Also highlighted his last pass being a game winner over LSEwww.
Everytime I reach a goal or achieve something new in life, someone's beat me there and wrote f♡€% you all over it - JD Salinger
I've got a fever and the only perscription...  is more cowbell.- THE Bruce Dickenson.

PORKULATOR

Quote from: mikeindallas on April 20, 2013, 12:29:53 pm
yep here's a still shot on that subject from the documentary, got to warn ya mitch looks pretty rough
that's freakin hilarious. I applaud you.
+1
Everytime I reach a goal or achieve something new in life, someone's beat me there and wrote f♡€% you all over it - JD Salinger
I've got a fever and the only perscription...  is more cowbell.- THE Bruce Dickenson.

RazorWorld

Quote from: Mike Irwin on April 18, 2013, 02:04:52 pm
You are completely off base about that. Nolan's interest has nothing to do with the U. of A. In fact he was never mad at the U. of A. He had issues with Frank, John White and at least one BOT member. None of those people are decision makers at the U of A and these days he has no issues whatsoever with the athletic department, school administration or any BOT members.

As far his his interest in Mitch's situation that goes all the way back to 2006 when it had become obvious that Mitch had been benched by Nutt and would stay benched.

I ran into Nolan before the SEC championship game and he asked me what was going on with Mitch. I told him what I knew. He said to me (paraphrasing because it's been a while), I didn't think anything about the kid getting benched at first because I did that all the time with rookies. Sometimes they just need to sit a while and watch. But at some point you have to put them back in. If you don't you'll destroy whatever confidence they have left.

Nolan went on to say that when Mitch stayed on the bench he knew that it was not a football issue but something personal with Nutt toward Mustain.

Bottom line, he thinks the kid got screwed because of Nutt's massive ego.

My own view, based on conversations I've had in the last few months with some of Frank's closest supporters, is that there was a belief by them that Frank needed to retire. White was after him and they knew it was only a matter of time until he got Frank.
The man was in his early 80's. He did not wield the power he once had and his decision making had dropped off.

The plan was to hire Gus, win the SEC two or three years down the road, convince Nutt to take Frank's job for the good of the program, and make Gus the head coach.

Nutt was well aware of this plan. He hated the idea. His goal in 2006 was to win enough games to avoid getting fired and then figure out a way to demote Gus and either take over the play calling again or hire somebody for that job that he could control.

Guess what? His plan worked perfectly.

My issue with Nutt is, he should have told the boosters pushing Gus to buzz off. If you don't like my staff fire me but you're not telling me who to hire.

Instead he did what they asked and in the process of getting rid of Malzahn he and his supporters blamed the whole mess on Mustain and his mother.

They were both easy targets.

Mitch is an introvert who doesn't live, eat and breathe football. Off the field he tends to go his own way. It was easy to turn that into, he's a self centered jerk who wants his own way.

Beck Campbell is actually a fairly low key person but if she thinks you're trying to mess with her or her kids she will get nasty in a heartbeat. She had that reputation in Springdale. Those that know her will tell you that raising her kids as a divorced mom she felt she had to be the mom and the dad of the family. At times the "dad" had to get into people's faces.

Stories were being spread about her when Mitch was a junior in high school. I know. I heard these stories from Nutt's supporters.

The main rumor was very clear. Wherever Mitch played his mom was going to be there controlling things.

Really?

Then how is it that he went to USC and she continued to live in Arkansas? How is it that the entire time he was a USC she had one conversation with Pete Carroll?

Ask any of them if Beck Campbell tried to run the team?

In a nutshell (pardon the pun) Nutt and Gus were involved in a power struggle. Mitch Mustain and Ben Cleveland (who also got caught up in this mess) paid the price for that struggle.

Seven years after the fact that stuff is still outrageous.


This whole thing was like a soap opera. You should be the one doing the voice on the doc

Sivad

Quote from: Mike Irwin on April 20, 2013, 07:23:12 am

If Houston Nutt is a relatively decent football coach why can't he get a job? Don't think he hasn't been trying. The word is finally out on him and nobody wants to mess with him.


Finally.

RebelAt

I definitely can't wait for this film to be available to rent or purchase.  A belated thanks to Mike for the great summary of what happened.  Enjoyed the trailer, eager for the movie.

NWASooner

Don't credit Mustain for Nutt's downfall.  Remember, he had just finished his second losing season in a row.  He had a moderately acceptable record to that point but that's when the SEC West wasn't nearly what it is today.  Had Mustain not come along, Nutt would have had some average teams that still got pushed around by Bama, LSU, and the like.  His record would have done him in.

Maybe what Mustain did was bring light to what a miserable person Nutt was.....