When Hogan and Cena were in the ring together...

[Hogwop]

I threw up in my mouth a little.

[Richard_white]

The guy that the WWE has pushed down our throats for 9 years cant even get over rubbing off of Hulk.

The Cena pajama wearing era should be over. 

[Big Papa Satan]

Two icons....about seven moves combined.

[Eddie Goodson]

Cena is and will be the face of the WWE for several more years. It will not change. I firmly believe Roman Reigns will take his place eventually.

[kingofdequeen]

Hulk is the man.

Two icons....about seven moves combined.

and ideas like this killed wrestling.  no one wants to see juventud guerrero or chris benoit.  they want to see Diesel vs. Undertaker - two huge cartoon characters. 

smh. 

[porkulus]

Two icons....about seven moves combined.

So, which one learned a new move?

[Hogwop]

Hulk is the man.

I'll give the Hulkster this: He certainly knows how to work a crowd and he has a ton of charisma.

[kingofdequeen]

I'll give the Hulkster this: He certainly knows how to work a crowd and he has a ton of charisma.

and if fans were interested in pure sport, rulan gardner would have his posters on kids' walls.

the mic is where it's at...it's a show...fans dont wanna see normal sized dudes showing their ring prowess.  they want the male equivalent of tits and fire.

[Hogwop]

and if fans were interested in pure sport, rulan gardner would have his posters on kids' walls.

the mic is where it's at...it's a show...fans dont wanna see normal sized dudes showing their ring prowess.  they want the male equivalent of tits and fire.

If you're talking the average viewer, then yeah, but if this were really the case how do you explain the Yes Movement? Or the Summer of Punk?

[hvsupastar]

Look people can hate on Hogan but putting him in the same category as Cena is crazy. Hogan can take credit for two of the biggest eras in wrestling, the original wrestlemania Era and the nwo would not have happened without the hulkster. Cena has been on top in what has been the longest down Era of wrestling in my lifetime.

[kingofdequeen]

If you're talking the average viewer, then yeah, but if this were really the case how do you explain the Yes Movement? Or the Summer of Punk?

who?

i quit paying attention right about the time Benoit was a world heavyweight champion.

[Richard_white]

Cena is more of a Lex Luger than Hulk. 

[husker71]

just listen and watch the crowd when eithers music first start   The crowd goes nuts    not Austin or Rock crazy  but still crazy

[Eddie Goodson]

Austin, Rock, and Hulk stand alone as the top three alltime. Cena is in the group alongside Flair, Taker, Michaels, et al.

[kingofdequeen]

Austin, Rock, and Hulk stand alone as the top three alltime. Cena is in the group alongside Flair, Taker, Michaels, et al.

flair and michaels are so much better than those other chumps its laughable.

no way in hell are either austin or rock better than flair.  ZEEE ROW.

[kingofdequeen]

austin became stone cold b/c he couldn't cut it as a ric flair wannabe.

nature boy.  WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

[hvsupastar]

We are talking in terms of being a superstar not just a talent. Shawn Michaels is in a league of his own in terms of talent. Flair is probably 2nd or 3rd. But Stone Cold Steve Austin sold more PPVs and Merchandise in one year than Flair did his entire career

[TomasPistola]

If there was a Wrestling Mount Rushmore, it would contain: Andre, Hulk, Austin, and The Rock - Not based on talent necessarily, but in tickets sold.

[kingofdequeen]

We are talking in terms of being a superstar not just a talent. Shawn Michaels is in a league of his own in terms of talent. Flair is probably 2nd or 3rd. But Stone Cold Steve Austin sold more PPVs and Merchandise in one year than Flair did his entire career

nsync sold way more albums than pearl jam or nirvana.

[Hogwop]

If there was a Wrestling Mount Rushmore, it would contain: Andre, Hulk, Austin, and The Rock - Not based on talent necessarily, but in tickets sold.

Definitely

[TomasPistola]

nsync sold way more albums than pearl jam or nirvana.

I blame women for that.

[hvsupastar]

nsync sold way more albums than pearl jam or nirvana.

Yep. And Justin Timberlake transcended music

[Eddie Goodson]

If there was a Wrestling Mount Rushmore, it would contain: Andre, Hulk, Austin, and The Rock - Not based on talent necessarily, but in tickets sold.

Yes. Absolutely right.

[Richard_white]

If there was a Wrestling Mount Rushmore, it would contain: Andre, Hulk, Austin, and The Rock - Not based on talent necessarily, but in tickets sold.

True. I believe Austin has sold more than any other WWE superstar. 

Austin as far as tickets, merchandise and revolutionized wrestling is in a league of his own. 

Cena?  Good heavens.  He belongs in the Ultimate Warrior and Lex Luger school of wrestling.

[Big Papa Satan]

Cena is more of a Lex Luger than Hulk. 

Luger with mic skills.

Who pops with Cena comes out?  Mostly kids.  He'd be mid-carder at best fifteen years ago.

[Hogwop]

Luger with mic skills.

Who pops with Cena comes out?  Mostly kids.  He'd be mid-carder at best fifteen years ago.

Half of the "pop" Cena gets is people booing or screaming "Cena sucks!"

[Eddie Goodson]

Report I read a couple days ago supposedly leaked from WWE says that the top stars for the next year are
1. Cena
2. Bryan
3. Orton
4. Sheamus
5. Reigns

Cena is the top draw in the company and no amount of our whining about it will change it. Whether I like him or not is immaterial. A huge section of the WWE audience does and until that changes, he will be the top guy and he is absolutely the top guy for the last 5 to 7 years. It is what it is. I will not let my dislike for him cloud sound judgment. He is rock solid on a mic and he does a good job building anticipation for PPVS. We cannot forget that match results are on Vince and less on Cena. It is Vince who has him kicking out of everyone's finishers. He is doing what Vince tells him to do. Vince is convinced Cena is the guy and he will be the guy until Vince changes his mind.

[Big Papa Satan]

Until Cena is de-emphasized, the business will never experience a resurgence.

[PorkRinds]

My only knowledge of Cena is seeing that pic of his elbow blown up like a soccer ball.

[Eddie Goodson]

I disagree Ivan. Had it not been for Cena, the PG era would have been a disaster for WWE. Those millions of kids he has drawn has saved their bacon.

[hvsupastar]

Cena has had a lot better matches than Luger or Warrior.

[Richard_white]

Until Cena is de-emphasized, the business will never experience a resurgence.

WWE or for any matter, "entertainment bizzness" will never flourish again.  1997-2000 monday night war was once in a lifetime. 

As far as Cena, he's the best and worst thing to happen for WWE and wrestling.

[Hogwop]

Cena has had a lot better matches than Luger or Warrior.

That's the thing, the guy can put on a decent match, and he isn't that bad on the mic, but he isn't great at either. At least Hogan can talk circles around people. All this talk on RAW about DB being a B+ player...if there ever was a B+ player it's Cena. He would have been wrasslin' Al Snow and Gangrel if he was around in the 90s.

[DeltaBoy]

It will never be a good as it was in the 1980's when it was all regional.

[Eddie Goodson]

Watching the vintage shows has reminded me of just how bad the wrestling itself was in the ring. We reminisce about how good it was but the truth is the wrestling part consisted of a few arm bars and a bunch of head locks so fat out of shape guys wouldn't drop dead of a heart attack. We were feed doses of Dino Bravo, Don Muraco, Greg Valentine, and several others who were out of shape for the pro bowling tour. You'll never make me believe it was better then than it has been the last 15 years. The in ring ability of wrestlers today is not even on the same planet with the wrestlers of the 80s.

There were great characters then, I'll agree with that. For the most part, our fascination for that time is linked to the innocence of youth and the belief of what we were seeing was real. The internet killed that for us all forever. Getting to see them in small towns made them personal for us and we were more emotionally invested. Going to the big arenas killed that.

When Vince made the deliberate move toward wrestlers who were in shape, it changed the business forever. Heck, the managers these days are in better shape than many of the wrestlers back then.

[fantana]

Watching the vintage shows has reminded me of just how bad the wrestling itself was in the ring. We reminisce about how good it was but the truth is the wrestling part consisted of a few arm bars and a bunch of head locks so fat out of shape guys wouldn't drop dead of a heart attack. We were feed doses of Dino Bravo, Don Muraco, Greg Valentine, and several others who were out of shape for the pro bowling tour. You'll never make me believe it was better then than it has been the last 15 years. The in ring ability of wrestlers today is not even on the same planet with the wrestlers of the 80s.

There were great characters then, I'll agree with that. For the most part, our fascination for that time is linked to the innocence of youth and the belief of what we were seeing was real. The internet killed that for us all forever. Getting to see them in small towns made them personal for us and we were more emotionally invested. Going to the big arenas killed that.

When Vince made the deliberate move toward wrestlers who were in shape, it changed the business forever. Heck, the managers these days are in better shape than many of the wrestlers back then.

Watching the vintage shows has reminded me of just how bad the wrestling itself was in the ring. We reminisce about how good it was but the truth is the wrestling part consisted of a few arm bars and a bunch of head locks so fat out of shape guys wouldn't drop dead of a heart attack. We were feed doses of Dino Bravo, Don Muraco, Greg Valentine, and several others who were out of shape for the pro bowling tour. You'll never make me believe it was better then than it has been the last 15 years. The in ring ability of wrestlers today is not even on the same planet with the wrestlers of the 80s.

There were great characters then, I'll agree with that. For the most part, our fascination for that time is linked to the innocence of youth and the belief of what we were seeing was real. The internet killed that for us all forever. Getting to see them in small towns made them personal for us and we were more emotionally invested. Going to the big arenas killed that.

When Vince made the deliberate move toward wrestlers who were in shape, it changed the business forever. Heck, the managers these days are in better shape than many of the wrestlers back then.

Watching the vintage shows has reminded me of just how bad the wrestling itself was in the ring. We reminisce about how good it was but the truth is the wrestling part consisted of a few arm bars and a bunch of head locks so fat out of shape guys wouldn't drop dead of a heart attack. We were feed doses of Dino Bravo, Don Muraco, Greg Valentine, and several others who were out of shape for the pro bowling tour. You'll never make me believe it was better then than it has been the last 15 years. The in ring ability of wrestlers today is not even on the same planet with the wrestlers of the 80s.

There were great characters then, I'll agree with that. For the most part, our fascination for that time is linked to the innocence of youth and the belief of what we were seeing was real. The internet killed that for us all forever. Getting to see them in small towns made them personal for us and we were more emotionally invested. Going to the big arenas killed that.

When Vince made the deliberate move toward wrestlers who were in shape, it changed the business forever. Heck, the managers these days are in better shape than many of the wrestlers back then.

[DeltaBoy]

What we had Lawyer with the Pile Driver , the figure 4 leg lock by Dory Funk,  the Oklahoma Stamped by Bill Watts, The Thump by JYD,  The DDT by Jack the Snake Roberts.  And the Brain Buster by Killer Karl Kox. and we had Barb wire and Strap matches.

[Hogwop]

Watching the vintage shows has reminded me of just how bad the wrestling itself was in the ring. We reminisce about how good it was but the truth is the wrestling part consisted of a few arm bars and a bunch of head locks so fat out of shape guys wouldn't drop dead of a heart attack. We were feed doses of Dino Bravo, Don Muraco, Greg Valentine, and several others who were out of shape for the pro bowling tour. You'll never make me believe it was better then than it has been the last 15 years. The in ring ability of wrestlers today is not even on the same planet with the wrestlers of the 80s.

There were great characters then, I'll agree with that. For the most part, our fascination for that time is linked to the innocence of youth and the belief of what we were seeing was real. The internet killed that for us all forever. Getting to see them in small towns made them personal for us and we were more emotionally invested. Going to the big arenas killed that.

When Vince made the deliberate move toward wrestlers who were in shape, it changed the business forever. Heck, the managers these days are in better shape than many of the wrestlers back then.

Good post Eddie, I think you hit the nail on the head. I definitely get where DB is coming from though. The wrasslin' territories let more than one guy be on top and the cross promotions were huge.

[kingofdequeen]

can't get with people talking bad about the Hammer.

[BigSexyHog]

Cena sucks

[hvsupastar]

I think Vince turning to better wrestlers was the Era of Michaels-Hart with role players like Goldust, Owen, Scott Hall etc. Who are all great workers in their own right. But the interesting thing was I'm not sure that was so much planned. I think the plan was for the Warrior to be the next 10 years of champion like Hulk was but when he started skipping town and Hogan retired there wasn't really anyone to turn to but Brett Hart. And the rest is history.

[Big Papa Satan]

I think Vince turning to better wrestlers was the Era of Michaels-Hart with role players like Goldust, Owen, Scott Hall etc. Who are all great workers in their own right. But the interesting thing was I'm not sure that was so much planned. I think the plan was for the Warrior to be the next 10 years of champion like Hulk was but when he started skipping town and Hogan retired there wasn't really anyone to turn to but Brett Hart. And the rest is history.

A big part of the shift to smaller guys was the steroid trial.  Afterwards, Vince did start to emphasize smaller guys like Bret, Shawn, Owen, etc.

After all, it wouldn't have been good coming off that and your top guy in the company looks like this