Man to Man under the baskett and get picked for a dunk. Unbelievable!!!

[oscardelahoga]

Something has to change. I could see that coming!!!

[Lard]

i told my wife during the timeout that they would beat us on a wide-open dunk if we come out in M2M.  I was almost right....he didn't dunk it.

[Porkem]

Mike Davis is a lot smarter coach than Pel.  He took Indiana to the NCAA Championship game against Maryland a few years ago.

[HAM ELLIOT]

Absolutely pathetic. 

[Lanny]

Only an idiot will go to a man to man defense defending their basket. 

[alaback]

Mike Davis is a lot smarter coach than Pel.  He took Indiana to the NCAA Championship game against Maryland a few years ago.

And then he ran that program into the ground.  Even IU is recovering now while we sink to the levels of a mid-level Sun Belt team.

[Quite Frankly]

Only an idiot will go to a man to man defense defending their basket. 

Well, I do disagree with that a little.  A well coached man to man can communicate, rotate and switch.

Of course the key there is well coached.

Screw this.  Pregame festivities are about to begin as I head to the local establish for a carry out of my favorite.

[ComeonHogs!!!]

 
A fifth grade basketball team knows to guard the basket. I really hurts to watch this basketball team.

[Snoop Hoggy Hog]

 
A fifth grade basketball team knows to guard the basket. I really hurts to watch this basketball team.

This is hilarious!! I was just telling my buddy that I learned to switch on screens and guard the basket in the 5th grade!

[Kevin]

Only an idiot will go to a man to man defense defending their basket. 

so all the coaches who do this are idiots.

it is a philosophy, they need to execute.  coaches job is to get them to execute, they didn't.

[stronguard]

so all the coaches who do this are idiots.

it is a philosophy, they need to execute.  coaches job is to get them to execute, they didn't.

When a team doesn't execute repeatedly, then yes its the coach's fault.

We have demonstrated an inability to defend off a screen.  We should have been in a zone.  At least make them shoot from more than 2 feet.

[sshawg]

If anyone remembers, we got beat up at MSU, two years ago just like that. An easy layup under their basket in the last few seconds

[WhenPigsFly]

Can't defend a screen, don't know how to set one on the offensive end.

I'm seeing a pattern.

[Breems]

i told my wife during the timeout that they would beat us on a wide-open dunk if we come out in M2M.  I was almost right....he didn't dunk it.

I knew it as well.  When they had the ball under the goal, I absolutely KNEW they would get a wide open layup.  It's perhaps the most frustrating ending in all of college basketball.  Worse than the opposing team making a contested full court shot.

[Iwastherein1969]

Well, I do disagree with that a little.  A well coached man to man can communicate, rotate and switch.

Of course the key there is well coached.

Screw this.  Pregame festivities are about to begin as I head to the local establish for a carry out of my favorite.

only teams that have a bona-fide eraser of a center play Man to Man in that situation....we don't have one....maybe with Jarvis Varnardo....put it this way...95 times out of 100 you play a 2-3 zone in order to force the pass deep into backcourt or outside the arc in the corners or the wings....get real

[Quite Frankly]

Any strategy is good as long as you can execute.  I understand the arguments for the zone, but it's not automatic to go zone an end bounds.

Especially with players that age.

I again qualify that they had to have been coached better for it to work.  But I'm about to decide we'd be better off with two 6 foot ladders and 3 desk chairs out there in the final moments.

[Lanny]

Answer is simple.

Fire Pelphrey

[V B Porkers]

I think it falls on coach and players. Having said that who brings the players in? We have dummies galore in all areas on this team

[aristotle]

I played basketball for a coach that ran M2M on every defensive possession. Didn't even practice zone defense for first team. But the only exception was under opponents basket during out of bounds play for the very reason we saw yesterday.

Always go zone on out of bounds plays under basket.

Even if Farmer hedged that screen, the screener had Washington pinned and was rolling open to hoop also. We were doomed coming out of the huddle on that one. Coach's error.

[DoubleJ]

And then he ran that program into the ground.  Even IU is recovering now while we sink to the levels of a mid-level Sun Belt team.

Indiana is recovering from Kelvin Sampson, not Mike Davis.

[GuvHog]

I played basketball for a coach that ran M2M on every defensive possession. Didn't even practice zone defense for first team. But the only exception was under opponents basket during out of bounds play for the very reason we saw yesterday.

Always go zone on out of bounds plays under basket.

Even if Farmer hedged that screen, the screener had Washington pinned and was rolling open to hoop also. We were doomed coming out of the huddle on that one. Coach's error.

Your last line is incorrect. Had they executed the defense properly, there would have been no layup.

[stronguard]

Your last line is incorrect. Had they executed the defense properly, there would have been no layup.

No GUV, you're mistaken.  In a man to man defense a properly executed screen and roll will ALWAYS have an open window for a player to make a play against a man to man.  Karl Malone and John Stockton made the HOF exploiting this fact.  In an under the basket situation, a moment is all you need to make a layup, dunk etc.  If it had been further out, say at the time line, then the half-second that the player would have been open wouldn't have mattered as much.  But the fact that we were beside our own basket, made even a small gap unacceptable.  And lets face it, if Pel hasn't figured out that we don't play M2M defense well by now, when IS he going to figure that out.

Anyone who has coached BB knows that a zone is the proper D in a situation like that one.  In the end, our players failed to execute a poorly designed strategy.  Our only real hope was a 5 second call on the inbounds.  Pel screwed the pooch on this one.

[thirtythree]

No GUV, you're mistaken.  In a man to man defense a properly executed screen and roll will ALWAYS have an open window for a player to make a play against a man to man.  Karl Malone and John Stockton made the HOF exploiting this fact.  In an under the basket situation, a moment is all you need to make a layup, dunk etc.  If it had been further out, say at the time line, then the half-second that the player would have been open wouldn't have mattered as much.  But the fact that we were beside our own basket, made even a small gap unacceptable.  And lets face it, if Pel hasn't figured out that we don't play M2M defense well by now, when IS he going to figure that out.

Anyone who has coached BB knows that a zone is the proper D in a situation like that one.  In the end, our players failed to execute a poorly designed strategy.  Our only real hope was a 5 second call on the inbounds.  Pel screwed the pooch on this one.

Show me where it is said that is the proper defense to be played. Any defense that is "executed" properly would have been fine. There are hole in a zone as well. Execution is the key to stopping anything. THE PLAYERS DIDN'T EXECUTE. 

[heathtits]

Show me where it is said that is the proper defense to be played. Any defense that is "executed" properly would have been fine. There are hole in a zone as well. Execution is the key to stopping anything. THE PLAYERS DIDN'T EXECUTE. 

The only holes in the zone would have been for a jump shot, which is a MUCH lower percentage shot than a freaking layup.

Seriously, do you think anyone on here would be this up in arms if we had been beaten on a buzzer beater 10-15 foot jump shot?

No. It's on the coach. Even if you like the guy, you look crazy and ignorant for not being critical of him for this error.

[stronguard]

Show me where it is said that is the proper defense to be played. Any defense that is "executed" properly would have been fine. There are hole in a zone as well. Execution is the key to stopping anything. THE PLAYERS DIDN'T EXECUTE. 

http://www.coachawinningteam.com/articles/defending-inbounds-basketball-plays/

http://www.coachesclipboard.net/BasketballDefenses.html    (Check under the heading "defending out of bounds play"

There are also a few others that talk about the weakness of the zone on an inbounds is leaving an OUTSIDE shot open.  I would have much rather UAB taken a shot from 15 feet rather than 1 foot.  How about you?

[thirtythree]

The only holes in the zone would have been for a jump shot, which is a MUCH lower percentage shot than a freaking layup.

Seriously, do you think anyone on here would be this up in arms if we had been beaten on a buzzer beater 10-15 foot jump shot?

No. It's on the coach. Even if you like the guy, you look crazy and ignorant for not being critical of him for this error.

Come on Heath. You have been around here longer than I have. I think you can really answer that question yourself.

I don't disagree with giving a jump shot vs. a dunk or layup. My issue is playing M2M isn't necessarily the wrong play if it's executed properly. In CJP's post game he mentioned that MW probably should have come under the screen (which if you look at the coaches clipboard link above) that is exactly what it says.

The whole thing I am trying to get at is people want to blame the coach because it fits the agenda. Nevermind that there was a lack of execution. The players even say they have prepped for that. MP said in his presser he tried to tell his team mates what was happening and they either didn't hear him or whatever. Farmer didn't switch. Are you going to tell me that CJP really has to tell college kids to switch on a screen in a M@M? I bet they have worked on it. RC even said it. Pat Bradley mentioned this morning that he "knows" they have prepped for it. It is being coached. Now, there's a question of whether the knowledge being passed is being accepted. We can debate that, but the kids are being coached to do the right things. They are just not executing the right things.

[thirtythree]

http://www.coachawinningteam.com/articles/defending-inbounds-basketball-plays/

http://www.coachesclipboard.net/BasketballDefenses.html    (Check under the heading "defending out of bounds play"

There are also a few others that talk about the weakness of the zone on an inbounds is leaving an OUTSIDE shot open.  I would have much rather UAB taken a shot from 15 feet rather than 1 foot.  How about you?

I agree. My thing is people say it's 101 that you have to run a screen and that's not true. It may be more recommended but it doesn't make it wrong to run M2M. There just has to be better communication and execution; Bottom line.

[thirtythree]

What defense did Roy Williams run under the basket when they gave up a dunk last night?

[akahogfan]

http://www.coachawinningteam.com/articles/defending-inbounds-basketball-plays/

http://www.coachesclipboard.net/BasketballDefenses.html    (Check under the heading "defending out of bounds play"

There are also a few others that talk about the weakness of the zone on an inbounds is leaving an OUTSIDE shot open.  I would have much rather UAB taken a shot from 15 feet rather than 1 foot.  How about you?

While I understand what you are getting at, it still stands that no matter how well the 2-3 is run, the offense can get an open shot if it executes correctly. Because of the way that the 2-3 is shaped, all the offense has to do is overload the ball side and there will be one man open. If the defense runs a M2M the right way, any shot will be contested. By running M2M, you control what happens, not the other team.
It obviously did not work, but that is on the players. Perhaps the players were not coached well enough, but the X's & O's I cannot fault.

[RedSatinHog]

While I understand what you are getting at, it still stands that no matter how well the 2-3 is run, the offense can get an open shot if it executes correctly. Because of the way that the 2-3 is shaped, all the offense has to do is overload the ball side and there will be one man open. If the defense runs a M2M the right way, any shot will be contested. By running M2M, you control what happens, not the other team.
It obviously did not work, but that is on the players. Perhaps the players were not coached well enough, but the X's & O's I cannot fault.

An open shot is one thing.  A dunk at the buzzer on an inbounds pass with 2 seconds left is quite another.  The worst part is that it's the second time in 3 games that it cost us.  The first time around it caused us to have to play an additional 5 minutes without a true presence in the low post, and we barely won.  This time around, it cost us the win.

[HognotinMemphis]

Does anyone think that when Pel called for man to man d on the last play, any of the players or assistants questioned that call? I can't believe they'd just sit there and say, "Yeah, good call. We're a great team, so that should prevent a score."

[thirtythree]

Does anyone think that when Pel called for man to man d on the last play, any of the players or assistants questioned that call? I can't believe they'd just sit there and say, "Yeah, good call. We're a great team, so that should prevent a score."

I wonder the same thing about Roy Williams last night.

[12247]

This is the first time I have turned against Pel.  With this team as bad as they are, that was a terrible call to end the game.  We can't play any defense very well and expecting us to defend M2M in that situation was just dumb.  Make them attempt a long outside shot and take your chances.  Normally M2M in that situation creates a missed shot but a foul is called which gives a real team with foul shooters an execellent opportunity to win.  We couldn't even accomplish the foul to put them at the line.

[RedSatinHog]

I wonder the same thing about Roy Williams last night.

They're ranked #9 in the country, playing on the road at College of Charleston.  Sure, UNC fans are probably not thrilled about losing a game like that, but when you're won 2 national titles and been to 4 final fours in the last 6-7 years, few fans are going to question your coaching.

When you're fresh off a 2-14 conference campaign and have a team on the floor which is playing as grabasstic and disorganized at this team is, criticism is the norm.

[thirtythree]

They're ranked #9 in the country, playing on the road at College of Charleston.  Sure, UNC fans are probably not thrilled about losing a game like that, but when you're won 2 national titles and been to 4 final fours in the last 6-7 years, few fans are going to question your coaching.

When you're fresh off a 2-14 conference campaign and have a team on the floor which is playing as grabasstic and disorganized at this team is, criticism is the norm.

Wait a minute now. What makes it okay for a coach of that caliber to run the same defense, but our was stupid for doing it? If it's "basketball 101" that you don't run a M2M defense under the goal then wouldn't that make it worse for the "tenured coach" than it would for an "up and comer"?

Bottom line and this is the deal. It was because it fit the agenda of the people who want him fired and gave people the ammo to bitch and that's it. It would have been the same thing if they came out in zone and they still hit the winning shot. No matter what he does he can't do anything right on the eyes of the agenda driven crowd.

[Breems]

Seriously, do you think anyone on here would be this up in arms if we had been beaten on a buzzer beater 10-15 foot jump shot?

Ummm.... YES!

[RedSatinHog]

Wait a minute now. What makes it okay for a coach of that caliber to run the same defense, but our was stupid for doing it? If it's "basketball 101" that you don't run a M2M defense under the goal then wouldn't that make it worse for the "tenured coach" than it would for an "up and comer"?

Bottom line and this is the deal. It was because it fit the agenda of the people who want him fired and gave people the ammo to bitch and that's it. It would have been the same thing if they came out in zone and they still hit the winning shot. No matter what he does he can't do anything right on the eyes of the agenda driven crowd.

The point being that, yeah, it sucks to lose to a team on the road like that when you're that highly ranked, but when your team is literally trying to build some resemblance of positive momentum headed into an SEC schedule and you lose a game in your home arena in that manner AFTER you nearly lost the same way just a little over a week earlier, all it shows is that you have real issues.  Those issues start and end with John Pelphrey, because all it showed everyone on here is that he learned absolutely nothing from it the first time around and failed to make any adjustments whatsoever.

We very easily could be sitting here with about 3 more losses on our record.  At least 2 of them were wins versus inferior opponents who never should have been on the same floor with us late in the game.

UNC's fans have every reason in the world to believe their team will recover in rather short order.  We don't.  Therein lies the real difference.

[Breems]

I wonder the same thing about Roy Williams last night.

I watched the ending of the game as well.  CoC also got a wide open dunk because of similar play-calling by Williams, but hey, whatever. 

[thirtythree]

The point being that, yeah, it sucks to lose to a team on the road like that when you're that highly ranked, but when your team is literally trying to build some resemblance of positive momentum headed into an SEC schedule and you lose a game in your home arena in that manner AFTER you nearly lost the same way just a little over a week earlier, all it shows is that you have real issues.  Those issues start and end with John Pelphrey, because all it showed everyone on here is that he learned absolutely nothing from it the first time around and failed to make any adjustments whatsoever.

We very easily could be sitting here with about 3 more losses on our record.  At least 2 of them were wins versus inferior opponents who never should have been on the same floor with us late in the game.

UNC's fans have every reason in the world to believe their team will recover in rather short order.  We don't.  Therein lies the real difference.

I don't disagree with you. The only thing I am saying is that people just want to bash CJP just because. It could be for walking across the street the wrong way. s long as there are losses there will be nothing that he does right no matter what it is. We just watched a highly touted coach make the same call and get beat by a much lower tier team the same way we did and nobody has ripped him and said it was a stupid decision. The fact is there is not a "right defense" that you "have" to play. You just have to execute whatever your doing. We didn't execute and that's all. Are people going to say that Roy Williams didn't coach his team on that play?