The pro's and con's of HDN

[VoR]

Oklahawg and WilsonHog's posts in http://www.hogville.net/yabbse/index.php/topic,63279.0.html made me think, what are HDN's strong suits, and what are his weak suits? Don't just give the lame arguments "He loves the helmet" or "He's bitten his fingernails all the way to his elbow".

On the pro side.
At least to this point he has been above reproach, that meaning if by some chance we do manage to win a NC, 3 years afterwards no ones going to be throwing in our face, "Well the only reason you won the NC was because you cheated", I know several on here have suggested, yes they would be willing to sacrifice a couple years probation for a NC, I'm not 1 of those, to any that ever tell me UCLA won the 95 championship in BB you can kiss my rosy red cheeks, UCLA may have the championship in name, but that is only because Jim Herrick was too afraid or too lazy to play with a level playing field.
HDN is a great motivator.
HDN is very concerned with the welfare of his wards.

On the con side.
HDN micromanages, he is a jack of all trades, master at none.
HDN has problems stepping back and looking at the big picture, it's hard to see the forest for the trees whenyou are right in the middle of forest---see micromanage.
HDN has lost much of his credibility---folks, you can say whatever you want till the cows come home, about how much HDN loves the helmet, but the fact still remains, he was going to get on that airplane to Lincoln, Ne. then less then a year later he allowed his agent to flirt with LSU and at the same time rub our noses in it.

Traits that can go either way, depending upon which side of the fence you view them through.

HDN is fiercely loyal.
HDN is egotistical and prideful (it's great when you are winning, and detestable when you are losing).

I'll hang up now and listen.

[rlamb]

Birdman, the detestible traits are still ringing in my craw and I can't even bring myself to acknowledge what you said were his positive traits.
I would guess that he will never be in danger of being accused of cheating but he will never, ever win a NT either.  Frank chose not to hire the guy that would have brought us a NT or 2 in 76' & 84'. He just since then won 3 World Titles.

The negatives I have seen time and time and time again over the last 8 long suffering years are,

1.  Nutt not being able to stand prosperity. See 1998 & 2003.
2.  Nutt never, ever being a MAN and accepting responsibility for his
     many negatives as a Coach.  Rick Schaffer says, "well, Houston
     just chooses to stay positive. Huh?
3.  Seems to repeat time after time of not getting his team ready to
     play & win many games we should. See Miss State in 98. And Ole
     Miss in 99 and Minnesota in 02 and UNLV in 00 and Auburn in 03'
     and Kentucky in 02' and Kentucky in 99' and Vandy in 05' and South
     Carolina in 05' and on and on.
4.  Doesn't "develop" players. See Cedric Cobbs, DeArrius Howard, and
     Brandon Holmes who were all better as freshmen than their other 3-4
     years. Also see Tavarius Jackson
5.  Nutt cannot get a grasp on managing the clock
6.  Or keeping penalties from happening at very inopportune times
7.  Many missteps in recruiting through the years
8.  Previous problems with the handling of discipline evenly

[idochog]

I think the biggest negative is he is too much of a players coach.  He tries to hard to be their buddy rather than their coach and that tends to lead into alot of on the field problems b/c our lack of discipline.

HDN trying to be their buddy doesnt demand the attention to detail and discipline required to be on the field.  Therefore we dont look prepared alot of the time.

Their are many other traits that I detest about HDN but I hate how he is over the top as a players coach.

[dishhog10]

HDN is Arkansas coach therefore gets my respect.

[HatfieldHog]

I agree with the last poster, that HDN is a "Players Coach."  I think that the  guys that play for him become life long HDN fans. 

The one thing that has killed HDN's success is his lack of ability to recruit on a consistent basis.  Those who call him a "great recruiter," are basing that on what?  Consistently be middle of the pack, or lower in recruiting classes in our own conference?

The other thing that hurts Nutt, is how he understands loyalty.  His loyalty has extended to the place of being a fault to his own success.  He needs to become "fiercly loyal to the Razorback Football Program's Success, not his home grown staff."

Just my thoughts,    See ya

[Wooisme]

POSITIVE....

I realize that 7th in the "SEC" recruiting is not "world-class" but I give HDN and his assistants credit for improving recruiting on a CONSISTENT basis (even in the midst of an NCAA investigation, sanctions & the inevitable DAMAGING rumors that accompany "those things"). 

Seventh in the SEC is still good enough to rank in the Top 35 or above nationwide and (IMHO) there is NOT that great a difference between in talent between # 35 and #20.  One or two players (who often don't pan out) can dramatically change your recruiting ranking for the better IF you sign 'em...or worse if you don't.   

NEGATIVE...

The above being said, IF you can watch a replay of the SECCG against Georgia and NOT be embarassed by Houston Nutt, it is (imho) IMPOSSIBLE for you to be embarassed by any head coach. 

Notice:

Poor Game Plan

Poor Play Calling

Poor Adjustments to Opposition tactics

Poor use of available talent

Inability to recognize, commit to, and make best use of "special" talent  available

Lack of control over team members ON the field of play

(Coaches cannot watch players 24/7 BUT they sure better be able to control their "antics" on the field of play.)

We saw all of the above in the SECCG.

You can see one or more of the above in ALMOST every game during HDN's tenure anytime the HOGS play a talented opponent with a coach who has a football I.Q. above single digits.

[wishyjoshy]

POSITIVE....

I realize that 7th in the "SEC" recruiting is not "world-class" but I give HDN and his assistants credit for improving recruiting on a CONSISTENT basis (even in the midst of an NCAA investigation, sanctions & the inevitable DAMAGING rumors that accompany "those things"). 

Seventh in the SEC is still good enough to rank in the Top 35 or above nationwide and (IMHO) there is NOT that great a difference between in talent between # 35 and #20.  One or two players (who often don't pan out) can dramatically change your recruiting ranking for the better IF you sign 'em...or worse if you don't.   

NEGATIVE...

The above being said, IF you can watch a replay of the SECCG against Georgia and NOT be embarassed by Houston Nutt, it is (imho) IMPOSSIBLE for you to be embarassed by any head coach. 

Notice:

Poor Game Plan

Poor Play Calling

Poor Adjustments to Opposition tactics

Poor use of available talent

Inability to recognize, commit to, and make best use of "special" talent  available

Lack of control over team members ON the field of play

(Coaches cannot watch players 24/7 BUT they sure better be able to control their "antics" on the field of play.)

We saw all of the above in the SECCG.

You can see one or more of the above in ALMOST every game during HDN's tenure anytime the HOGS play a talented opponent with a coach who has a football I.Q. above single digits.

While I might slightly disagree with you about the consistent progression of HDN's recruiting (see this year's class - minus Gus Malzahn taking a job on the Hill), The negatives you listed were exactly the same things I have seen. 
Great Post.

[rzrbaxfan]

Pro: Aside from the flirting with Nebraska and LSU, he has been pretty loyal to the program.  Some coaches may have left with the NCAA cloud that we had.

Con: He cannot compete with the elite of the SEC.

[GorillaJMonsoon]

HDN is fiercely loyal.

To whom?  Himself?  Is that why he left Arkansas as a player?
To what?  The almighty dollar?  Is that why he pretended like he was going to Nebraska, so he could get a fat pay raise and 2 year pass?

I might agree that he is fiercely loyal to his assistants, but that isn't always a positive trait, especially when it obscures any objective judgement of their performance and capabilities.

[Swynler Durden]

HDN is fiercely loyal.

To whom?  Himself?  Is that why he left Arkansas as a player?
To what?  The almighty dollar?  Is that why he pretended like he was going to Nebraska, so he could get a fat pay raise and 2 year pass?

I might agree that he is fiercely loyal to his assistants, but that isn't always a positive trait, especially when it obscures any objective judgement of their performance and capabilities.

My thoughts exactly.

[PAHog]

Pros: the players seem to like him, he gave the Horns down sign after the victory over TX, he's made Arkansas a place where RBs like to play, he has to know that the success of this season will determine his future here at the UofA

Cons: he seems to be a little lax when it comes to discipline (but he is consistent), he's made Arkansas a place where QBs and WRs don't want to play, consistent poor performance on special teams during his tenure, poor game management

[Dwight_K_Shrute]

Man I was hoping from the title this was a list of players who played under Nutt, and went on to the Pros, and then comparing that to a list of players who played under Nutt and did time.

That would be entertaining.   I'm sure  a few would be on both.

[hogsanity]

Pros: the players seem to like him, he gave the Horns down sign after the victory over TX, he's made Arkansas a place where RBs like to play, he has to know that the success of this season will determine his future here at the UofA

Cons: he seems to be a little lax when it comes to discipline (but he is consistent), he's made Arkansas a place where QBs and WRs don't want to play, consistent poor performance on special teams during his tenure, poor game management

When he first came he was a hrd a$%.  The whole Todd Latourette thing changed him.  You remember, he suspended him for the 98 MSu game because he got pooped for DUI, only thing, he was later found not guilty or innocent or something that showed he probably did not do it.  It very well may have cost us the MSU game.  After that, HDN has erred on the side of laxity with many discipline problems.

We had trouble getting Qbs's and WR long before HDN got here.

[SultanofSwine]

I have come to the conclusion that he lacks selfconfidence. Why else would he stay stuck in the micromanaging rut for so long, why else would he not cut the dead weight on the staff that he surely knows is there.

I don't think he has any trust in those he has surrounded himself with to do thier jobs at an optimal level thus the micromanagement.

I also think he has lowered his expectations of success too and bunkered in to a self preservation mode of operation.

[John Futrall]

Oklahawg and WilsonHog's posts in http://www.hogville.net/yabbse/index.php/topic,63279.0.html made me think, what are HDN's strong suits, and what are his weak suits? Don't just give the lame arguments "He loves the helmet" or "He's bitten his fingernails all the way to his elbow".

On the pro side.
At least to this point he has been above reproach, that meaning if by some chance we do manage to win a NC, 3 years afterwards no ones going to be throwing in our face, "Well the only reason you won the NC was because you cheated", I know several on here have suggested, yes they would be willing to sacrifice a couple years probation for a NC, I'm not 1 of those, to any that ever tell me UCLA won the 95 championship in BB you can kiss my rosy red cheeks, UCLA may have the championship in name, but that is only because Jim Herrick was too afraid or too lazy to play with a level playing field.
HDN is a great motivator.
HDN is very concerned with the welfare of his wards.

On the con side.
HDN micromanages, he is a jack of all trades, master at none.
HDN has problems stepping back and looking at the big picture, it's hard to see the forest for the trees whenyou are right in the middle of forest---see micromanage.
HDN has lost much of his credibility---folks, you can say whatever you want till the cows come home, about how much HDN loves the helmet, but the fact still remains, he was going to get on that airplane to Lincoln, Ne. then less then a year later he allowed his agent to flirt with LSU and at the same time rub our noses in it.

Traits that can go either way, depending upon which side of the fence you view them through.

HDN is fiercely loyal.
HDN is egotistical and prideful (it's great when you are winning, and detestable when you are losing).

I'll hang up now and listen.

Let me ask a hypothetical about the whole LSU/Nebraska ordeals.  For the people who disapprove of HDN (I'm getting tired of the term darksider), if it is a big deal that he did flirt with Nebraska (which he handled fairly well, imho) and LSU (which he handled less than well, imho), AND if he is such a terrible coach, why is  he dogged for supposedly looking at those schools when you want him to leave, anyway?  Is it because he stayed, or is it because he looked at those schools which somehow disproves his loyalty.

Although I consider myself a supporter of HDN and his staff (although that support is basically hanging by a thread), I enjoy reading well-thought and logical arguments on both sides of the fence.....

[TulsaHogFan]

I don't have a problem with him leaving, nor do I complain he is not loyal.

Loyalty is a quality I could care less about.

I simply bring up Nebraksa and LSU when the supporters state how loyal he is.  He is not loyal, by any means.

[rzrbaxfan]

Let me ask a hypothetical about the whole LSU/Nebraska ordeals.  For the people who disapprove of HDN (I'm getting tired of the term darksider), if it is a big deal that he did flirt with Nebraska (which he handled fairly well, imho) and LSU (which he handled less than well, imho), AND if he is such a terrible coach, why is  he dogged for supposedly looking at those schools when you want him to leave, anyway?  Is it because he stayed, or is it because he looked at those schools which somehow disproves his loyalty.

I was never upset at the Nebraska deal.  We were coming off a decent 9 win season and a rare bowl win.  I was happy that another BCS school wanted him & at that time, I didn't want to see him leave.  I was having my doubts about him, but still thought once the cloud went away, he could get us to an elite level.

After that, we were told to get ready for a couple of bad seasons.  I really felt like that was a bad move.  It showed no confidence in the staff, current players, or incoming players.  While it turned out to be an accurate prediction, I still think it made the program look bad.  However, he told us all how dedicated he was to the program and things would get better.

The LSU deal...I was mad about what Frank was mad about...he took his time.  After all the talk of how loyal he was and he was going to stick with us despite the NCAA cloud, he took his sweet time "turning LSU down", when it was never officially offered to him.

I guess the aftermath of Nebraska and the whole LSU deal was handled poorly...thats my beef with it.

[hogsNbeer]

Pro:   I really don't see any, as far as football or the knowledge of, is concerned...

Con:  You name it...... Poor Time Mgmt
         George of the Jungle on the Sidelines.
         Couldn't call the right play to get himself out of a paper sack..
         Consistenlty recruits mid to lower pack of SEC, therefore finishes in about the same place .
         Doesn't seem to be able to hire good coaches on HIS OWN..or when the need arrives.
         Didn't go to Nebraska or LSU, dangit
         3rd and long DRAW PLAY when everybody knows it's coming.....
         I could go on, but dont' want to do it.....makes me 

[idochog]

I think it is safe to say HDNs cons outweigh his pros.

I see no pro's in his on-field coaching.

[John Futrall]

Let me ask a hypothetical about the whole LSU/Nebraska ordeals.  For the people who disapprove of HDN (I'm getting tired of the term darksider), if it is a big deal that he did flirt with Nebraska (which he handled fairly well, imho) and LSU (which he handled less than well, imho), AND if he is such a terrible coach, why is  he dogged for supposedly looking at those schools when you want him to leave, anyway?  Is it because he stayed, or is it because he looked at those schools which somehow disproves his loyalty.

I was never upset at the Nebraska deal.  We were coming off a decent 9 win season and a rare bowl win.  I was happy that another BCS school wanted him & at that time, I didn't want to see him leave.  I was having my doubts about him, but still thought once the cloud went away, he could get us to an elite level.

After that, we were told to get ready for a couple of bad seasons.  I really felt like that was a bad move.  It showed no confidence in the staff, current players, or incoming players.  While it turned out to be an accurate prediction, I still think it made the program look bad.  However, he told us all how dedicated he was to the program and things would get better.

The LSU deal...I was mad about what Frank was mad about...he took his time.  After all the talk of how loyal he was and he was going to stick with us despite the NCAA cloud, he took his sweet time "turning LSU down", when it was never officially offered to him.

I guess the aftermath of Nebraska and the whole LSU deal was handled poorly...thats my beef with it.

This may be for another topic, but who "looked at who" during the LSU situation?  Was LSU really looking at Nutt, or was Nutt seeking this out on his own? And if LSU never officially offered anything to him, what was there to "turn down". I don't remember HDN having any sort of press conference or anything like that with the LSU situation, but rather watched as it got sorted out through the media....

For someone who remembers the specifics, please enlighten me....

[VoR]

Let me ask a hypothetical about the whole LSU/Nebraska ordeals.  For the people who disapprove of HDN (I'm getting tired of the term darksider), if it is a big deal that he did flirt with Nebraska (which he handled fairly well, imho) and LSU (which he handled less than well, imho), AND if he is such a terrible coach, why is  he dogged for supposedly looking at those schools when you want him to leave, anyway?  Is it because he stayed, or is it because he looked at those schools which somehow disproves his loyalty.

Although I consider myself a supporter of HDN and his staff (although that support is basically hanging by a thread), I enjoy reading well-thought and logical arguments on both sides of the fence.....

To me, the best way I can say it, is it reminds me of the spouse you catch hugging someone, and while maybe not a passionate hug, still a hug that is a little more then innocent. When you say something to them about it, they tell you not to be silly, they love you more then ever, they could never have eyes for anyone else. That night as you are getting ready to shower you hear the phone ring and you overhear your spouse say "No, now's not a good time to talk, I've got to go, yes dear, I miss you too."

[bro.coach]

Pros: none

Cons:  he does not accept responsibility for his own failures (I'm not sure if he even recognizes his own failures)

[Wooisme]

Let me ask a hypothetical about the whole LSU/Nebraska ordeals.  For the people who disapprove of HDN (I'm getting tired of the term darksider), if it is a big deal that he did flirt with Nebraska (which he handled fairly well, imho) and LSU (which he handled less than well, imho), AND if he is such a terrible coach, why is  he dogged for supposedly looking at those schools when you want him to leave, anyway?  Is it because he stayed, or is it because he looked at those schools which somehow disproves his loyalty.

I was never upset at the Nebraska deal.  We were coming off a decent 9 win season and a rare bowl win.  I was happy that another BCS school wanted him & at that time, I didn't want to see him leave.  I was having my doubts about him, but still thought once the cloud went away, he could get us to an elite level.

After that, we were told to get ready for a couple of bad seasons.  I really felt like that was a bad move.  It showed no confidence in the staff, current players, or incoming players.  While it turned out to be an accurate prediction, I still think it made the program look bad.  However, he told us all how dedicated he was to the program and things would get better.

The LSU deal...I was mad about what Frank was mad about...he took his time.  After all the talk of how loyal he was and he was going to stick with us despite the NCAA cloud, he took his sweet time "turning LSU down", when it was never officially offered to him.

I guess the aftermath of Nebraska and the whole LSU deal was handled poorly...thats my beef with it.

This may be for another topic, but who "looked at who" during the LSU situation?  Was LSU really looking at Nutt, or was Nutt seeking this out on his own? And if LSU never officially offered anything to him, what was there to "turn down". I don't remember HDN having any sort of press conference or anything like that with the LSU situation, but rather watched as it got sorted out through the media....

For someone who remembers the specifics, please enlighten me....

It appeared (at least to me) that he hesitated or failed to act quickly enough "publicly" in removing his name from consideration.

Did HDN ask/approve Jimmy "TwoYearPass" Sexton to inquire about Nebraska, LSU and Colorado (after this past season)? 

I don't know BUT after the assurances HDN got from JFB and Jim Lindsey (after MJ's junior season), the LSU "rumor" should have been squelched quickly and loudly by HDN. 

It wasn't....(not quickly and loudly enough for me, anyway)

[John Futrall]

Let me ask a hypothetical about the whole LSU/Nebraska ordeals.  For the people who disapprove of HDN (I'm getting tired of the term darksider), if it is a big deal that he did flirt with Nebraska (which he handled fairly well, imho) and LSU (which he handled less than well, imho), AND if he is such a terrible coach, why is  he dogged for supposedly looking at those schools when you want him to leave, anyway?  Is it because he stayed, or is it because he looked at those schools which somehow disproves his loyalty.

I was never upset at the Nebraska deal.  We were coming off a decent 9 win season and a rare bowl win.  I was happy that another BCS school wanted him & at that time, I didn't want to see him leave.  I was having my doubts about him, but still thought once the cloud went away, he could get us to an elite level.

After that, we were told to get ready for a couple of bad seasons.  I really felt like that was a bad move.  It showed no confidence in the staff, current players, or incoming players.  While it turned out to be an accurate prediction, I still think it made the program look bad.  However, he told us all how dedicated he was to the program and things would get better.

The LSU deal...I was mad about what Frank was mad about...he took his time.  After all the talk of how loyal he was and he was going to stick with us despite the NCAA cloud, he took his sweet time "turning LSU down", when it was never officially offered to him.

I guess the aftermath of Nebraska and the whole LSU deal was handled poorly...thats my beef with it.

This may be for another topic, but who "looked at who" during the LSU situation?  Was LSU really looking at Nutt, or was Nutt seeking this out on his own? And if LSU never officially offered anything to him, what was there to "turn down". I don't remember HDN having any sort of press conference or anything like that with the LSU situation, but rather watched as it got sorted out through the media....

For someone who remembers the specifics, please enlighten me....

It appeared (at least to me) that he hesitated or failed to act quickly enough "publicly" in removing his name from consideration.

Did HDN ask/approve Jimmy "TwoYearPass" Sexton to inquire about Nebraska, LSU and Colorado (after this past season)? 

I don't know BUT after the assurances HDN got from JFB and Jim Lindsey (after MJ's junior season), the LSU "rumor" should have been squelched quickly and loudly by HDN. 

It wasn't....(not quickly and loudly enough for me, anyway)

Thanks for the post.